rob D2 Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 I don't mind cliches, or the odd cameo. I would think model railways are like books - only a few basic themes repeated. what always gets me is the road vehicle stuck somewhere that would have been utterly impossible without a 'chinook' to get in or out. Less is more. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bike2steam Posted November 7, 2011 Share Posted November 7, 2011 Not you Larry, it's the spat slightly higher in the thread which has attracted our attention. Ok guilty for 'stoking' - now resolved by pm. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave777 Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 ...I long since gave up mentally picking fault with other folk's wagons because they had an incorrect number for the brakegear or whatnot; left unchecked, it would just have ended up spoiling my own enjoyment. Not far off my approach to the whole hobby really. I consider myself an 'about right' or 'near enough' modeller - if I get to 80% of where I want to be then I'm happy. I appreciate that for many that's not good enough and they want to go further (and I'm appreciative of their efforts too), it's just that for me it's that last 20% where 'enjoyment' goes into 'punishment'. I may have scratchbuilt my N gauge girder bridge sides from plasticard, but I didn't add the individual rivets. Near enough I think... near enough. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackRat Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 (edited) I suppose we can all claim to be an 'expert in something', even if its only navel gazing! You can look on any model with a critical eye if you notice something perhaps with which you are familiar but not the builder, after all, no one can know everything about everything, no matter how hard they try. What to one is an every day occurrence (or perhaps more frequently) to another is a chance encounter or a fleeting glimpse through the window into someone elses work. Its easy then to find fault or pick holes, but if you make allowances, then that shouldn't spoil the overall effect should it? Unless of course you allow it to, but perhaps thats a personality trait which sometimes is all to common in this 'hobby' of ours. Edited November 8, 2011 by BlackRat Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 Not so much cliches on layouts but defensive cliches like...... "It's my layout and......." "Yes I know I've done the research and gone in for a lot of fine detail, but its only a trainset..." Railway modelling isn't a guilty pleasure and I wonder why folk feel they have to belittle their own efforts in this manner? Personally I'd prefer to hear..."Yes I've done the research and gone in for a lot of fine detail, and I tell you what....I'm bloody proud of it! 13 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluebottle Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 One thing I have noticed on many layouts, mine included, is the use of oversize ballast. Is this a cliche? The ground around sidings often looks very smooth, as it does at some large stations too and it occurs to me painting the cork or baseboard ballast colour would be an adequate representation. I mentioned to one chap demonstrating track making at an exhibition that I'd thought of using my computer and printer to produce a ballast strip; I thought that this might be OK for a shunting plank. He gave me an old-fashioned look and proceeded to ignore me... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 He gave me an old-fashioned look and proceeded to ignore me... They do. Was he drinking the last of the summer wine? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jim s-w Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 (edited) Personally I'd prefer to hear..."Yes I've done the research and gone in for a lot of fine detail, and I tell you what....I'm bloody proud of it! Because, Larry, if you spend years to be good at something and take some pride in it then you are deemed to be elitist and and maybe have an attitude problem. For many people its not worth the arguement to say ' you know what, I am good at this' but then people will inwardly know anyway so does it really matter? We all know the quality of your coaches and many aspire to get near, It wouldnt be wrong to say there are few if any better at what you do but then If I was to turn round and say my track is better than 90% of the stuff on here (not because of the gauge - lets not go there but because of the care and effort involved in getting it all to flow properly.) I would look like a snob. It might be, and who knows If i had built it the same way, with the same care and attention but to 00 it still might be but it wouldnt have been good enough for me. I know how much time and effort it has taken to learn to do it, research it and then tweak it to get it right (thats still ongoing by the way) that I AM proud of it. Although when I am complimented at a show I still find it awkward. Thats just a national psyche problem I think. Cheers Jim Edited November 8, 2011 by jim s-w 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
iL Dottore Posted November 10, 2011 Share Posted November 10, 2011 One cliché (if only by its absence) is the lack of striking >insert name here< or skinhead aggro or football supporter punch-ups on those layouts set in the 1970s F 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennine MC Posted November 10, 2011 Share Posted November 10, 2011 (edited) Not far off my approach to the whole hobby really. I consider myself an 'about right' or 'near enough' modeller - if I get to 80% of where I want to be then I'm happy. I appreciate that for many that's not good enough and they want to go further (and I'm appreciative of their efforts too), it's just that for me it's that last 20% where 'enjoyment' goes into 'punishment'. Meh, sort of what I meant I'd aim for nigh on 100% of where I want to be, because if I dont, I'm not doing my best. But where I *want* to be is a target that's set by a realisation of what I can realistically achieve, and what (as you say) is either going to be significantly unenjoyable or is going to swallow up more resource than I can justify. As for the rolling stock thing, what I'm meaning is that I dont expect others to necessarily work to the standards of anorak-authenticity that I set myself. Lest that sounds elitist, I'd add that by the same token, there will be areas of my overall modelling in which I'm not so interested, and will therefore be content with lower standards (of authenticity, if not actual finish) than someone whose specialism it is. Edited November 10, 2011 by Pennine MC Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave777 Posted November 10, 2011 Share Posted November 10, 2011 Yes, I think we're broadly saying the same thing here My ' if I get to 80% of where I want to be' comment I can see wasn't the perfect choice of words - what I meant was 100% would be my perfect layout, so if I get 80% of the way there then I'm happy. My 'N gauge girder bridge sides' example I think is a fair representation - I want a perfect looking plate girder bridge, so I'll build it. But it needs rivets, and in N gauge I think 'that is going to be one fiddly job and likely to muck up the work I've done'. So at that point - when I'm 80% of the way there - I think 'good enough', especially when I consider that I'm going to have to get my eyes pretty close to see the error (and at which point a train clatters into my conk). 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jim s-w Posted November 10, 2011 Share Posted November 10, 2011 Hi All I aim for perfection in every element. I know I'll never reach it and hope that I never do either (after that what would be the point?). Despite that I still aim for it every time. Cheers Jim 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will Vale Posted November 10, 2011 Share Posted November 10, 2011 I want a perfect looking plate girder bridge, so I'll build it. But it needs rivets, and in N gauge I think 'that is going to be one fiddly job and likely to muck up the work I've done' That resonates for me. I want to do the best I can, but not do the things which will spoil what's already been done. I really dislike (for example) inappropriately bent or wobbly things on models which should be straight - much like your lines of rivets, I might stop short of doing them. Or do them, dislike them, and remove them again. Or do them, get lucky, and keep them It's all about consistency of finish. Which reminds me - I'm looking at a photo of my bridge pillar, which has rather soft irregular stone courses (done in a hurry for a show deadline) and thinking I might need to replace it Will 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluebottle Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 Hi All I aim for perfection in every element. I know I'll never reach it and hope that I never do either (after that what would be the point?). Despite that I still aim for it every time. Cheers Jim Ah, Jim, but a man's reach should exceed his grasp, Or what's a heaven for? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mod3 Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 Ladies and Gentlemen, we seem to be drifting into the realms of accuracy as opposed to cliche again Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Happy Hippo Posted November 11, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 11, 2011 Hasn't this thread become rather cliched? Regards Richard 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
'CHARD Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 (edited) Although when I am complimented at a show I still find it awkward. That's just a national psyche problem I think. If I may bring an anecdote from the music world - an acquaintance was once asked in amazement why his group was still performing to healthy audiences, and recording new material when their last chart hits were in the mid-eighties. His reply: 'You wouldn't say to your plumber, thanks for doing a great job with my boiler, you'll never better that so you may as well retire. So what makes you think as a musician of working age, wanting to write even better tracks is any different?' There can be a sense that courting praise is somehow vulgar, but there's another element within our national psyche which loves to knock success, flaunted or not. EDIT: note to self, don't stray further O/T when a distress flare was sent up while you were typing !!!!! Sorry Mod3! Edited November 11, 2011 by 'CHARD Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PLD Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 Of course, the cliche on any forum is that whatever the starting point for a thread, within no more than three pages it will become a 'P4' vs 'OO' or 'DCC' vs 'DC' argument 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMal Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 Hi All I aim for perfection in every element. I know I'll never reach it and hope that I never do either (after that what would be the point?). Despite that I still aim for it every time. Cheers Jim Doesn't the universe collapse - or something! - if we ever reach 100% perfection? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackRat Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 (edited) Going for gold is admirable, I dont know why we get so bent out of shape if someone sets their standards high and tries to achieve them. BAck OT....I suppose my layouts full of them, but there again there's lots of bits that I have incorporated that reminds me of something...... The Scouts (and trek cart) as I was a Cub, Scout then Venture before joining up. We had an old cart we used to use to unload our tentage etc from summer camp and trundle it up into the store. The mechanical horse (my Uncle used to drive one, sometimes with me on his knee!) The chap greeting the lady of the night/day, doffing his hat, had a regular like him in Plymouth, doff his hat, very polite and would then ask for a freebie and flash! The stop/check........ The Motorcyclist (moi), the Panda outside the box (moi again), The plod watching the trains (yawnn..... yes moi) My first car is in there, etc etc etc.................. Still plenty of scope tho such as the orange tent in a corner of a field where I 'lost i't etc etc etc. Cliched, perhaps but they do make me smile (now and again!). I also aim for perfection, but as a Police Marksman its just as well that I do Edited November 11, 2011 by BlackRat 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catkins Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 Going for gold is admirable, I dont know why we get so bent out of shape if someone sets their standards high and tries to achieve them. BAck OT....I suppose my layouts full of them, but there again there's lots of bits that I have incorporated that reminds me of something...... The Scouts (and trek cart) as I was a Cub, Scout then Venture before joining up. We had an old cart we used to use to unload our tentage etc from summer camp and trundle it up into the store. The mechanical horse (my Uncle used to drive one, sometimes with me on his knee!) The chap greeting the lady of the night/day, doffing his hat, had a regular like him in Plymouth, doff his hat, very polite and would then ask for a freebie and flash! The stop/check........ The Motorcyclist (moi), the Panda outside the box (moi again), The plod watching the trains (yawnn..... yes moi) My first car is in there, etc etc etc.................. Still plenty of scope tho such as the orange tent in a corner of a field where I 'lost i't etc etc etc. Cliched, perhaps but they do make me smile (now and again!). I also aim for perfection, but as a Police Marksman its just as well that I do Thank you BlackRat - you have reminded me why I'm interested in model railways, and everything I seem to remember could be a cliche to someone else, but to me they are memories and personal memorials. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave777 Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 Has anyone avoided a cliché since reading this thread? I confess I've decided to leave off a rather smart London double decker from my bridge... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baby Deltic Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 Eccles, in Greater Manchester, has three churches near the line side and it is in a cutting (along with the M602), one on the opposite side of the M602 (which was rebuilt after the railway was built), one near where Patricroft shed was and one in Eccles Town centre, where William Huskisson MP died (after being hit by 'Rocket' near Newton-Le-Willows) on the day the line opened in 1830. Urmston station has this, with a new ticket office between the road and the station and the old building turned into a pub, no footbridge either, passengers for Liverpool have to walk round the station on the public road to access the platform! Back to Eccles, and Wellington Road runs along the side of the M602 on top of a retaining wall with buildings on only one side and aswell as the church, has a petrol station, a patch of ground where a petrol station used to be and residential housing. Speaking of Eccles and the M602 I remember 45147 getting written off in a fireball in 1984 next to the M602. Sadly two people were killed. The driver's brake handle was found on the carriageway having been thrown from the locomotive. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baby Deltic Posted November 11, 2011 Share Posted November 11, 2011 Anyway, back to cliches, and I haven't had time to read the whole thread yet, so if I miss any invisible ink, I apologise. One thing that I find too cliche nowadays, and I know its been mentioned, are the low relief corrogated steel industrial retail units along the backscene of nearly all the ultra modern layouts I see nowadays. I see them as something of a scenic cop-out, I'm afraid. The diesel maintenance depot with the single line entry under a bridge at an angle (as has been mentioned) sometimes with a small platform for a sprinter or a 'skateboard' to come and go. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pacific231G Posted November 12, 2011 Share Posted November 12, 2011 Doesn't the universe collapse - or something! - if we ever reach 100% perfection? No, according to Lexx, that happens when we discover the Higg's Boson !!! I believe that Turkish and Persian carpet weavers deliberately weave at least one imperfection into their incredibly finely made carpets as trying to achieve complete perfection was seen as competing with the Almighty. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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