5050 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 The requirement to get machining again has risen - so today I have been mainly making Coupling Rods! The kit provides for a rigid pair of nickel silver rods fabricated from two soldered laminated layers. These could be made as a jointed articulated set using the centre hole as the pivot but I, in my infinite wisdom decided that, as I was going to use an 'Illusodrive' method to rotate the fly-crank axle, I wouldn't need to articulate the rods and soldered them up as a rigid set. However, whilst making the fly-cranks I rather belatedly decided that I would prefer the rods to be articulated and attempted to unsolder one rod into its parts to adapt it to being articulated. This was the rather sorry result! Despite holding it in the gas cooker as well as using a gas blow lamp the two parts just would not come apart and ended up twisting themselves into a rather Dali-ish rendition of metallic modern art and rendering this rod completely unusable. So, another solution was required and a trawl through my stash of chassis parts and etches yielded two packs of Alan Gibson rods, a set of 'Universal' and some 7'3 x 8'3 (allegedly LNWR) ones. The Universal type can be adapted for any wheelbase chassis by soldering front and back layers to the correct spacing - but one needs a jig to ensure the chassis wheelbase is duplicated. The other set of rods was merely butchered to fit (!). As the chassis is already erected this is not so easy but luckily I still had the one remaining rigid kit rod and this was used to make a correctly spaced jig. The crank pin holes were already drilled out to 1.5mm to fit Alan Gibson crank pin bushes so a piece of half inch square wood was pulled out of the scrap timber box and mounted into the vice on the lathe. A 1.5mm hole was drilled into this. The rigid kit rod was mounted onto the wood using the drilled 1.5mm hole and a spare Alan Gibson crank pin bush. The vice was traversed so that the drill lined up with the next hole in the rod and another hole was drilled. This hole in the rod was supported by a further crank pin bush and the third hole drilled after lining up the drill with the rod hole. The wood was removed from the vice and transferred to the work bench where the various elements and layers of the Gibson rods were soldered up using spare 1.5mm drills and crank bushes to locate them over the jig holes whilst soldering. Now this is done I am rapidly approaching the point of no return with the chassis - I will have to mount the wheels onto the axles!! That will no doubt be an interesting exercise in maintaining mental equilibrium during the process....................... (Note - do you mind me highjacking your thread with all these posts Adam? I could start another thread somewhere else on the forum?) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted February 18, 2015 Author Share Posted February 18, 2015 Carry on - these posts demonstrate that there's more than one way to do these things and I think they complement the earlier ones nicely. Adam Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5050 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Carry on - these posts demonstrate that there's more than one way to do these things and I think they complement the earlier ones nicely. Adam Okey dokey. I just hope it actually ends up working after all this effort! And thanks for all the 'likes' etc. everyone. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5050 Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 Last evening I grasped the bull by the pointy bits on its head and decided to fit the wheels. These are sold brass and the axle holes reamed to be a force fit on the split axles. I use a GW wheel press for this, hand pressure to start and get the wheels located and then the vice to squeeze it all together. A P4 back-to-back gauge is used to check spacing. The trailing wheels went on relatively straightforward but the driving pair on the gearbox axle had a lot of 'gubbins' mounted between and everything was a bit tight as can be seen. However, I must have measured accurately because it all fitted with just a trace of sideplay and there is full insulation between both sides of the chassis. Prior to fitting the wheels on the gearbox axle I removed the motor and used Loctite 601 (very carefully!) to attach the driving gear to the axle. The GW wheel press in the vice with the gearbox axle wheelset. The wheels mounted on the axles prior to test fitting. The front wheel axle central pivot for the 3-point suspension can be seen. It has a plastic sleeve (biro refill) to ensure insulation which can readily be rotated should any wear occur. Wheels and axles test fit into chassis. The axle box retaining wires can be see, one partly slid out. The bits of wire sticking out from the chassis sides are for mounting the brake shoes. Coupling rods test fitted and the 'Illusodrive' gears also test fitted to see if it all works - and it does! The rods are held in place with short lengths of wire insulation screwed onto the ends of the crankpins which will ultimately be cut to length in final fitting. The length of grey tubing is the insulation for the idler gear axle which is 2mm diameter. This plastic tubing is 1/8" external and 2mm internal so perfect for the job. Thankfully the wheels rotate very smoothly with no trace of binding. The next job is to fit the fly cranks to the rear axle and then get them and the driving wheels to rotate in sync. Wish me luck.......................... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted February 20, 2015 Author Share Posted February 20, 2015 Very nice indeed. It's fair to say that you should have a better chance of getting the flycranks to work than I did. I got there eventually but it took some doing... Adam Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5050 Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 After a family weekend 'darn sarf' it was back to civilisation 'oop norf' and back to the workbench again yesterday and today. I steeled myself and decided it was time to fit the fly cranks which had to be done through the chassis as the bearings are soldered in place. As usual, there is always something to make the job just a tiny bit more difficult and this was no exception. The GW wheelpress was again used but due to the bits of wire for the brakes protruding, the press wouldn't quite fully close so I had to finish off pressing them on with the lathe. As there is no strict b-2-b necessary this was no problem. The faces of the cranks only needed to line up flush with the axle ends. Prior to fitting I soldered a shortened (to ensure it didn't bridge the gap on the split-axle and cause a short) top-hat bush to the fly crank 'Illusodrive' gear. I had drilled this .45mm on the side with the intention of drilling through this and the axle to fit a piece of wire to locate the gear on the axle once everything was meshed etc. As it happens, I don't think this is needed - along with the 'Illusodrive' itself - as the quartering of the wheels and the cranks is pretty well perfect first time. Here are the cranks after fitting. You can also see that I have shortened the motor shaft at the rear. I am still not sure how to ultimately locate the motor onto the chassis whilst in use. I may solder some rigid wire leads direct from the chassis side frames to the motor brush contacts. I have also soldered the cab back in place. This is carefully fabricated from wire using the etched original as a pattern. This shows the fly cranks, the axle and the Illusodrive gearing in-situ. The .45mm hole on the soldered gear 'bush' can be seen, just clearing the insulation gap in the axle. The 'crank pin nuts' are short lengths of wire insulation which just 'screw' onto the protruding crank pins for use whilst testing. The crank pins will be shortened in due course. This also shows the idler gear on its shaft along with the insulating/locating 'bushes'. I now need to consider painting the chassis and wheels and the method of insulating it from the body. This will probably just be a couple of pieces of tape stuck to the underside of the footplate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norton961 Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 This thread has got me interested in these John Fowler diesels and because I dont know much about them I am posting another picture. This one is Burnley Gas Works 1953a Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5050 Posted March 19, 2015 Share Posted March 19, 2015 Nearly there!! This last week I've painted the chassis and assembled it and nearly finished the body. Here's the chassis which (more or less) worked first time. I reamed the coupling rod holes slightly and it is basically fine BUT - when moving with the gear box leading, the torque of the motor lifts the gearbox and motor up and forward and in so doing, tightens the crankpins slightly. I don't want to 'stick' the motor to the chassis so I have placed a large lump of dense foam inside the bonnet to hold the motor down. Plenty of running in will hopefully ease all the (few) tight spots and its already a lot sweeter. Crank pins have now been cut short and nuts secured with a spot of nail varnish. I never really tighten them down and leave a touch of play. The fly crank nuts are really close to the inside of the rear steps - a touch of grease may be necessary! The body is virtually complete. I made a new cab roof as the kit one was to short for some reason. It still needs rain strips fitting and a decision made on how to keep it attached in use. Coupling hooks also need fitting and the hole in the bonnet is for a 'mushroom' shaped exhaust which I have now turned from brass bar. The 'headlamp' is a wagon axle bearing which still needs a spot of epoxy adding to form the lens. I now need to decide on a colour sceme. It may be the 'corporate blue' of 'Baldrick' and 'Rum' - or even a fetching two-tone scheme with the raised moulding strip along the top side of the bonnet picked out in 'chrome'. Decisions, decisions etc.! A further decision now raises its head - what will be the next project? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catweasel Posted March 19, 2015 Share Posted March 19, 2015 Interesting project. I'm building mine slightly differently. OO gauge, with good old Romfords and a High Level Loadhauler + gearbox, with 108:1 gearing.Mashima 1020 under the bonnet. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5050 Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Completion has been achieved! All is now painted and glazed and a regular driver installed. My usual 'corporate blue' Humbrol old-style acrylic was brush painted on with wasp stripes from a sheet of Impetus water-slide transfers dating back over 20 years from when I built my Class 14. Weathering/dirtying is thin washes of acrylic matt black and brown shades. I have also added an exhaust pipe to the bonnet for a bit more 'interest'. Performance when running is fine but there seems to be an intermittent habit of stopping almost as if the gear train has seized up momentarily. I can't seem to trace the cause which I initially wondered might be a short circuit through the split frames etc. I hope it isn't actually this as I don't fancy stripping everything down to cure it! Hopefully extended running will help. The headlamp has a Langley white jewel inside the 'lens hole' to add a bit of bling. A quick query for Adam - where did you obtain the 'Fowler' works plate and headlamp plates? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted April 27, 2015 Author Share Posted April 27, 2015 A quick query for Adam - where did you obtain the 'Fowler' works plate and headlamp plates? 5 thou plastic sheet! The headlamp surrounds, I think, were pieces of tube while the marker (tail) lights are brass lace pins painted silver with a dot of BR maroon to represent the lens. Nice work - the one thing I might suggest is to polish the machining marks off the buffer heads and to blacken them which would - to my mind at least - make a hugely positive difference. Adam Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catweasel Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 I've got some doors for mine as I want to fit a closed cab. The wimps on Pots Lane insist on it! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5050 Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 5 thou plastic sheet! The headlamp surrounds, I think, were pieces of tube while the marker (tail) lights are brass lace pins painted silver with a dot of BR maroon to represent the lens. Nice work - the one thing I might suggest is to polish the machining marks off the buffer heads and to blacken them which would - to my mind at least - make a hugely positive difference. Adam Ah, I wondered if that might be the case and you had made them yourself. Might try myself. Never thought about tail marker lamps, I suppose I can still fit them with a bit of careful drilling. The cab does have a rear door from the 'balcony' so the wimps could get in out of the cold if they want to. I did wonder at one time about making the variant with the small 'cupboard' extension at the rear of the cab but I think this was a 421 style model. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
d600 Posted October 16, 2015 Share Posted October 16, 2015 Hi I have just picked up a 7mm version of this diesel some bits are missing did impetus make this version has well. cheers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted October 16, 2015 Author Share Posted October 16, 2015 Hi I have just picked up a 7mm version of this diesel some bits are missing did impetus make this version has well. cheers Yep, there was a 7mm version. No idea how many were made/sold though. Adam Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
d600 Posted October 16, 2015 Share Posted October 16, 2015 Hi Adam thanxs for that I've just opened a thread in the 7mm section has until I saw this thread I didn't know what the kit was I'm missing the cabs. Cheers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5050 Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 I discovered why it was stopping etc. (with additional smoke effects!). I thought it was a dodgy motor but turned out to be the rear split axle was somehow shorting across the joint, sparking, and so causing the smoke. I tried several things to sort it (including considering re-wheeling with Gibson wheels) but eventually found that if I 'pulled' on the wheels then the centre gap opened a fraction and the short disappeared. The b-2-b measurement didn't seem to be affected. More running will tell me if this is a permanent fix or not! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruston Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 I have dug out and repainted my own Fowler, which I posted a photo of on page 1 of this thread. It has been put back together (this time with more solder and less superglue!), repainted and the cab has been glazed. But it doesn't run very well, which I put down to the rubbish motor and gearbox. So... Question for Adam and Paul - I can see you have used High Level gearboxes in your builds but what type are they? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted June 12, 2017 Author Share Posted June 12, 2017 Hi Dave, If I remember correctly, I used the LoLoader (108:1). Paul has clearly used a different one with the more sophisticated option of transmitting drive to the jackshaft. Adam Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5050 Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 I have dug out and repainted my own Fowler, which I posted a photo of on page 1 of this thread. It has been put back together (this time with more solder and less superglue!), repainted and the cab has been glazed. But it doesn't run very well, which I put down to the rubbish motor and gearbox. So... Question for Adam and Paul - I can see you have used High Level gearboxes in your builds but what type are they? Post 13 says 'Hauler Compact'. Hadn't got a clue what it was until I read this! It was a loonnng time ago! Good to see you've had another go at it Dave. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruston Posted August 10, 2017 Share Posted August 10, 2017 Here's my attempt at the rebuild of my Fowler. Even more of it was held together with superglue than I remembered! At least that meant it came apart easily enough. Before dismantling I identified that one wheelset was wonky, so a replacement was sourced from the spares box. I have kept the original gearbox but by chopping some metal out of the frame spacers and by driving the rear axle, instead of the front, which is how it was powered, I could bin the silly little open-frame motor and squeeze a 99p Chinese Mitsumi motor between the frames - just! Running. Next to make some pickups. The original pickups that I fitted were made from phosphor bronze strip that pressed on the wheel treads and were glued to the underside of the running plate. Of course this meant excess wire and the inability to completely seperate body and chassis. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruston Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 It lives again! I copied 5050's method of fitting pickups, which conists of an extra frame spacer, soldered in and a piece of copperclad that is held on by a countersunk screw. I remember that when I built this loco, 25 years ago, I did use it on my then scrapyard layout but to be honest I'm surprised that it ever ran at all. I have had to open out the holes in the crankpin bushes with a broach (something I'd never even heard of, let alone posessed back then) to get the rods to run freely and after some adjusting of the pickups it now runs well, though somewhat noisily in reverse. This must be down to the gearbox. I could have replaced it with a modern gearbox but A) I am tight-fisted and B) the bonnet has sheets of lead superglued in, which will not budge so there is no room for a High Level 'box. So there we have it - weathered as a quite work-worn machine and posed on River Don Works. It's not perfect but is an improvement on how it looked and ran before I took it from the shelf where it had lain for over 20 years.If only I'd waited a quarter of a century before beginning to build it in the first place... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted August 11, 2017 Author Share Posted August 11, 2017 Looks much better for it's overhaul, Dave and I'm pleased to hear that it now runs properly. It looks just wonderful on the layout. Adam Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5050 Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Oyy, them pickups is patented! But I'm glad they work OK for you. Looks good. What is the gear ratio, it looks like a Romford 60:1? How is the slow running with the 99p motor? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruston Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Oyy, them pickups is patented! But I'm glad they work OK for you. Looks good. What is the gear ratio, it looks like a Romford 60:1? How is the slow running with the 99p motor? So sue me! I have no idea what ratio the gearing is - it was a long time ago when I first built it. The slow running is very good. This is the second of these motors that I have used now. The first was in the 200HP Brush loco and that runs perfectly and right down to a crawl. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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