Danny W Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 Hello, I have an idea to do a model of a Steam Tramway, see my intro for why, but don't know what is available. Starting from a clean slate so not fixed on any scale but prob not smaller than 00 though. A web search only found kits for Wisbeach and Upwell or Glyn Valley locos, but I was thinking something more urban/interurban passenger service. Any suggestions please of what is available. Dan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armchair Modeller Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 Smallbrook Studio do a steam tram in 7mm scale http://www.smallbrookstudio.com/page_1201118902437.html Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve howe Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Hello, A web search only found kits for Wisbeach and Upwell or Glyn Valley locos, but I was thinking something more urban/interurban passenger service. Any suggestions please of what is available. Dan Branchlines do 7mm kits for the Clogher Valley coaches and a semi-freelance set for a 4 wheel steam tram and coach, also they do the chassis kit for the Peco GVT tram loco. These Beyer Peacock engines were pretty similar to the Kitson built locos and worked on various street systems before electrification. Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted January 26, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 26, 2011 The only UK urban systems were the early locos for tramways which pulled the trams in some big towns and cities. They were more common on the continent with examples lasting in Belgium and Switzerland where they were effectively trains formed from tram stock. If you want to model a hypothetical UK system how about removing the cab from a peco Glyn valley loco and adding a full roof to change the style. There's no reason the Wisbech locos couldn't have been used on an urban line either, maybe just cut out the panel in the centre so the cab front has windows all the way across. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Holliday Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 At one time there was a kit manufacturer (Tramalan?) who made two white metal steam tram kits, together with suitable passenger stock, but they pulled out of the market due to perceived changes in legislation regarding the use of white metal. Currently your best bet is Worsley Works who have recently produced "scratch-aid" etchings for two of the Wantage Tramway steam trams and a range of passenger stock to go with them. These have been reviewed in Railway Modeller. Being only the etchings there is quite a lot of work required and you need to source castings etc from elsewhere, but probably a good starting point. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PLD Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Hi Dan, Wisbeech & Upwell and Glynn Valley have both been done quite a few times in both 4mm and 7mm scale, but as you say a passenger orientated urban layout would be something different. Nick is right about Tramalan - he did a Kitson based on the early Leeds engines and a generic Beyer-Wilkinson type plus a Falcon passenger trailer. Long out of production but they occasionally turn up second hand (more commonly the Kitson) In 009 as well as the Peco GVT loco, there are a couple of options in Paul Windle's range pictured below - the Wisbeech style ' Toby' and Clogher Valley style Sharp-Stewart as used on our 'Crumley and Little Wickhill' which features a roadside tramway section Link to thread on the old RMWeb site (contact me off site for more info on Paul Ws locos) The other option is that immediately prior to electrification, the Swansea and Mumbles was worked by ordinary tank engines that simply had skirts fitted... Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny W Posted January 26, 2011 Author Share Posted January 26, 2011 <br />Hi Dan,<br /><br />Wisbeech & Upwell and Glynn Valley have both been done quite a few times in both 4mm and 7mm scale, but as you say a passenger orientated urban layout would be something different.<br /><br />Nick is right about Tramalan - he did a Kitson based on the early Leeds engines and a generic Beyer-Wilkinson type plus a Falcon passenger trailer. Long out of production but they occasionally turn up second hand (more commonly the Kitson)<br /><br />In 009 as well as the Peco GVT loco, there are a couple of options in Paul Windle's range pictured below - the Wisbeech style ' Toby' and Clogher Valley style Sharp-Stewart as used on our 'Crumley and Little Wickhill' which features a roadside tramway section <a href='http://www.rmweb.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=2757' class='bbc_url' title=''>Link to thread on the old RMWeb site</a> (contact me off site for more info on Paul Ws locos)<br /><br /><br /><br />The other option is that immediately prior to electrification, the Swansea and Mumbles was worked by ordinary tank engines that simply had skirts fitted... <br /><br />Paul<br /><br /><br /><br /> Thank you Paul. Think I have seen your layout. Was it at Manchester show last year? Now imagining what the town terminus of your line might look like. The Tramalan Wilkinson would be nice to have even if the layout become a different scale of gauge. Will have to look out for them. Dan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PLD Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 Think I have seen your layout. Was it at Manchester show last year? Now imagining what the town terminus of your line might look like. Manchester Show October 2009... Paul W has built many layouts based on the 'Roth Valley Tramway' over the years but apart from the freight only 'Moorton Bottom Yard' I don't think there's ever been a urban layout... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jamie92208 Posted January 27, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 27, 2011 If you are going to do a british outline steam tram, I believe that Alphagrafix do one. You woukd also need a nice double deck trailer like the one in Crich Museum (Dundee 21 I think). As far as I know most British steam trams were withdrawn round about 1901 when the electric manufactuerers got their act in gear and most municipalk systems couldn't wait to get rid of the steam trams. Jamie Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium melmerby Posted January 27, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 27, 2011 If you really want some variety, in 1899 Birmingham had examples of horse trams, steam trams, cable trams and battery trams. No overhead electric at that time! Electric trams, as mentioned by Jamie, started to appear about 1901 and the other forms of traction had vanished within the next 5 or so years. Keith Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johna Posted January 28, 2011 Share Posted January 28, 2011 Hi Worsley Works has recently introduced some "scratch Aid " etched kits for Wantage Tramway equipment including the Hughes and Walker tram locomotives. They were recently reviewed in RM. Johna Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Holliday Posted January 28, 2011 Share Posted January 28, 2011 Hi Worsley Works has recently introduced some "scratch Aid " etched kits for Wantage Tramway equipment including the Hughes and Walker tram locomotives. They were recently reviewed in RM. Johna Sorry, I must have used some of Beast's invisible ink in post#5! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
micknich2003 Posted January 28, 2011 Share Posted January 28, 2011 Are you talking of a Street Steam Tramway? If so get in touch, I have drawings of most types of "Street" engine plus many photo's of a Kitson engine. micknich2003@yahoo.co.uk Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
roythebus Posted January 28, 2011 Share Posted January 28, 2011 there's certainly still steam trams in Belgium. Try www.tta.be They have a nice steam tram loco awaiting rebuild (10 yr cert run out). I took some detailed pics of it last year. Metre gauge. I think someone does a model of it. As above, steam trams were quite common in Belgium on the Vicinal system. Steam trams in England weren't common at all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium melmerby Posted January 29, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 29, 2011 As above, steam trams were quite common in Belgium on the Vicinal system. Steam trams in England weren't common at all. Depends on the period, surely. In the Midlands there were steam tram routes in most of the Black Country boroughs and Birmingham, also Coventry and the Potteries had steam trams. They all were swept away in the electrifications of late 19th/ early 20th Centuries. London had a few street trams and I expect Manchester and other places also. Some trailers were converted from horse to steam traction, before electrification. Keith Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PhilJ W Posted January 29, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 29, 2011 Steam trams remained in use up until the 50's in Belgium, but they were only used for freight in particular the coal mining areas such as the Ardenne but they also remained in the agricultural areas, they resembled the Wisbeach and Upwell more than anything. A few street tramways retained some steam tramway locomotives for engineering use. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortliner Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 http://www.joueftrains.com/V17.htm Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny W Posted January 29, 2011 Author Share Posted January 29, 2011 As above, steam trams were quite common in Belgium on the Vicinal system. Steam trams in England weren't common at all. From my research there were over 50 tramways in Britain that used steam power at some point. Depends on the period, surely. In the Midlands there were steam tram routes in most of the Black Country boroughs and Birmingham, also Coventry and the Potteries had steam trams. They all were swept away in the electrifications of late 19th/ early 20th Centuries. London had a few street trams and I expect Manchester and other places also. Some trailers were converted from horse to steam traction, before electrification. Keith Not all steam tramways were electrified. some replaced directly by buses or trolleybuses. The last urban line to end steam power was "Birmingham Central Tramways" in mid 1906, just beating the "Manchester, Bury, Rochdale and Oldham Steam Tramways Co" by a few months but some interurban type lines kept steam power into the 1920s after some electric lines had already been abondoned. Dan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium melmerby Posted February 4, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 4, 2011 From my research there were over 50 tramways in Britain that used steam power at some point. Not all steam tramways were electrified. some replaced directly by buses or trolleybuses. The last urban line to end steam power was "Birmingham Central Tramways" in mid 1906, just beating the "Manchester, Bury, Rochdale and Oldham Steam Tramways Co" by a few months but some interurban type lines kept steam power into the 1920s after some electric lines had already been abondoned. Dan Spotted that there is a series of books about the British Steam Tram. Works out a bit expensive though if you by all of them (£355). http://www.ahg-books.com/html/steam_trams.shtml Keith Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PLD Posted February 4, 2011 Share Posted February 4, 2011 Spotted that there is a series of books about the British Steam Tram. Works out a bit expensive though if you by all of them (£355). http://www.ahg-books...eam_trams.shtml Keith Ouch! Bit different to the only book I have on steam tramways - "History of the Steam Tram" by H.A. Whitcombe (Oakwood Press 1961) A grand total of 32 pages and cover price of 8s. 0d. (think I paid about 5 times that for it 3 or 4 years ago... ) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mac Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 Hello, I have an idea to do a model of a Steam Tramway, see my intro for why, but don't know what is available. Starting from a clean slate so not fixed on any scale but prob not smaller than 00 though. A web search only found kits for Wisbeach and Upwell or Glyn Valley locos, but I was thinking something more urban/interurban passenger service. Any suggestions please of what is available. Dan Dan. Try searching this site..http://www.tramwayinfo.com/Deftlrs.htm There is a book about tram modelling but it concentrates on electric tramways. If you're really interested in UK Steam Trams; I suggest you buy Vol 1 of British Steam Trams (D Gladwin). I got a copy at half price as the bookseller was desperate to unload it: otherwise try the libraries(before they're closed down) or fork out £40. Mac. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wobblybob Posted February 6, 2011 Share Posted February 6, 2011 From my research there were over 50 tramways in Britain that used steam power at some point. Not all steam tramways were electrified. some replaced directly by buses or trolleybuses. The last urban line to end steam power was "Birmingham Central Tramways" in mid 1906, just beating the "Manchester, Bury, Rochdale and Oldham Steam Tramways Co" by a few months but some interurban type lines kept steam power into the 1920s after some electric lines had already been abondoned. Dan Rawtenstall Corporation ran steam trams until July 1909. One steam tram loco was retained after electrification and was periodically steamed in connection with special events. This continued even after electric trams were withdrawn in 1932. Whilst the copper overhead was worth recovering promptly, there was no such hurry to lift the tramlines and pay the cost of reinstating the highway, so the steam tram loco made odd appearances into the 1930s. Sadly it succumbed to the war effort's drive for recovered metals. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted February 6, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 6, 2011 I live about 200 yards from the route of a metre-gauge steam tramway, and the road I live in is called Rue de la Gare. It was one of a whole network of lines radiating from Le Mans, effectively killed of by that chap Hitler when his retreating people in August 1944 blew up a crucial bridge in the River Sarthe. The bridge was in the shape of an X, with a steam tramway 56 km long - the one that passes my house - crossing the town electric tramway, so they intersected in mid-river. The network was shut down in 1947, the year before I was born, and 57 years before I moved here! Google Earth helps identify the line of route. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PLD Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 Portstewart Tramway no.1 - According to at least one supposedly definitive history, destroyed in a bombing raid in WW2, but happily suviving and on display at 'Streetlife' (the Hull Transport Museum) to this day Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mac Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 Back in Hull to get more details of the Kitson Steam Tram. Does anyone know if a dedicated layout has ever been built to solely display British Steam Cars in an urban setting? Pricing the best deal for two volumes of Gladwin's British Steam Tram. I noticed you can get Volumes 1&2 for approx £20 & £30 respectively. Mac. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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