Breakdown Train - What Engine?

[M.I.B]

M.I.B Senior thinks he remembers break-down trains of the early 50s BR(W) being hauled by panniers.

 

I think that they would have been pulled by something a little more substantial such as a Collett 0-6-0, a 43XX Mogul or even a 28XX.

 

Can anyone assist?

 

Thanks

[Pennine MC]

Open to correction on this, but I'd think more or less anything that was available and that was suitable for the route involved would be used (with obvious exceptions like wee Pugs and the like). I'm not sure how much a crane actually weighs, but a fully kitted out breakdown train with tool/packing vans and staff coach etc probably wouldnt weigh in at more than a couple of hundred tons - and a Collett 0-6-0 is in any case a 3F power rating AFAIK, the same as a 57xx pannier.

[buffalo]

I'm inclined to agree with Pennine here, as I would have thought a 57XX was quite capable of doing this job. That said, I've just been looking at a photo of a mogul (6309) with a crane at Frome in 1959.

 

Nick

[Arthur]

Agree too, certainly within the capability of a 3F tank. The advantage of using a tender locomotive might be, that with greater coal and water capacities, it could remain at the work site longer. I'm not sure just how useful that was in reality, just a thought.

[DavidB-AU]

I agree with "anything available". I have seen photos of GWR/WR breakdown trains with Panniers and Prairies, and even one with a Manor.

 

Cheers

David

[The Stationmaster]

'Take the first one off' - i.e. take the nearest loco that's fit to go and ok to work over the route where the train is going. Tank engines have advantages if the layout is cramped or there is no chance of turning to get back home and when there's going to be a lot of shunting required; tender locos have the advantage (in some cases) of much greater water supply but then in the old days water columns abounded.

And don't forget that in the majority of cases breakdown call-outs didn't involve cranes - which were only available in limited numbers anyway (just as well really, they were a bl**dy nuisance to work with). For example on the WR London Division in 1960 only one depot (Old Oak Common, Crane No16, 45 tons capacity) had a crane but all 6 depots had tool vans. Similarly on the Bristol Division only one depot (Bath Road, Crane No.1, 36 tons capacity) had a crane while seven depots had tool vans. And this sort of pattern repeated across the Region as far as I can tell from the more limited information I have for the other divisions. And once we come to tool vans we're talking about trains of probably no more than 100 tons trailing load and that was how the vast majority of derailments were dealt with - because it was the cheapest and quickest way of undertaking most rerailing jobs (although some folk used less conventional but even cheaper and quicker methods).

[M.I.B]

Many thanks. Then I too will use whatever comes to hand - a mogul, a grange, a 57XX, prairie or Collett.

[Boris]

I've attended an earth fault or two over the years and never cease to be amazed by what can be achieved by some strategically placed pieces of wood and steel packing!

[ringo]

Basically, any engine available at the time, as long as that engine can handle that train.

 

I was on the breakdown gang at Tyseley in the 80s (and at saltley as an apprentice), and you took what ever diesel was at hand, so have had 20s, 24s, 25s, 31s, 37s, 45s, 47s, 56s, 58s etc, we even as desparation used a 08 off Tyseley as Saltley didnt have a spare loco!

 

08 power, Tyseley No1 Carriage sidings to Washwood Heath yard, with the breakdown train and crane, very predestrian but great fun!....think of the overtime at 15mph!!!

 

This is why we pinched 40135 off the back of the scrap train, so we could reinstate it as our emergency breakdown train engine, a task it never actually did, mind it was too busy doing trips on the SVR, Didcot and the like.... ah the good old days!

 

R