Dapol 'Western'

[adb968008]

Blue SYP for me..., groan i’d Be up to 10 Westerns then.

[D1056WesternSultan]

No trouble at all here.  Mine are glued and this one isn't quite centred correctly but was the first suitable image I found.

 

DSCN4163.jpg

 

 

Looks good but the coupling is actually hanging in the hook and not the rebate at the back of the hook.  I have found that removing the body and pressing the square end of teh loop down into the recess in the shank of the coupling hook works quite well. A small drop of superglue secures it. 

[Gwiwer]

Looks good but the coupling is actually hanging in the hook and not the rebate at the back of the hook. I have found that removing the body and pressing the square end of teh loop down into the recess in the shank of the coupling hook works quite well. A small drop of superglue secures it.

 

I take care to mount mine correctly. A check of the loco confirms it is on the rebate and not the drawhook. Must be a camera-angle thing. It is also, as all mine are on the 52s, secured with a spot of glue on both the rebate and the screw-link of the coupler which is resting against the valence. Edited October 25, 2017 by Gwiwer

[swiftbeam]

I've just bought a Dapol 52 MSYP. I believe it's new, but runs with a bad wobble. The shop has taken it back to fix. Having read some of this thread, it seems 52's are bad. But is it just old 52's that are bad and I got an old one sold as new?  Are properly new 52's good? I read older ones have a wobble and noisy, my 'new' one just bought has both these problems.

[Gwiwer]

It is not really correct to suggest that "52s are bad" based upon a single locomotive.  In any mass-produced item, whether for this hobby or not, there may exist some rogue ones in the batch when the rest are perfectly good.  They get called "Friday afternoon" models sometimes from the supposed lack of attention which might have arisen on the production line close to a weekend shut-down.  

 

I run eight Dapol 52s.  I also run four Heljan 52s and have had five Hornby ones though those have been disposed of.  I believe that gives me some grounds for making a more balanced assessment.        

 

Of the eight from Dapol six run perfectly well.  One has a slightly more audible gear whine which occasionally can be heard as a series of clicks.  One is as yet untested on the workbench.  All have a slight "waddle" or side-to-side slop which is a factor of the design and the need to build in some tolerance for the moving parts.  The Heljan ones do likewise to about the same extent.  Those from Hornby seldom ran without some sort of grief- either intermittent power loss caused by their train-set back-to-backs or failure to haul more than a couple of coaches due to their light weight.

 

A few Dapol 52s have been reported to have had more serious issues of which wobbling is one and can usually be fixed without the need to replace the locomotive.  Notwithstanding that most (not the very earliest batches) of them do carry Dapol's warranty and should be replaced (subject to available stock) if defective in manufacture.

 

You can tell whether your loco is "old" or "properly new" from the catalogue number on the box.  Early ones have a short number, later ones a much longer one.  Or simply tell us which name and number you have and we can tell you which batch it is from.  But if it is sold as "new" it must be new as in not previously sold or run, irrespective of its actual age.  It might be 5 - 6 years old and has sat on a shelf all that time but is still new legally if it hasn't been sold before.  There is no shelf life either so sitting there will not have affected its running qualities unless improperly stored such as kept in a sunny shop window and affected by heat.

 

I hope you get the loco back in a better condition.  They are very good representations of the class and as detailed as we are likely to see in ready-to-run.  While some modellers prefer the weighty Heljan ones which pull a bigger load and don't have the gear noise which a few Dapol ones do they are not as good in design and famously have a visibly inaccurate front-end with a "baseball cap" hood over the windscreens.   Most of us also don't need the extra power required to pull loads of 12 - 14 Mk1 coaches when the Dapol ones will happily manage 10 and 12 on good track without gradients.

Edited October 27, 2017 by Gwiwer

[swiftbeam]

 

4D-003-008 Dapol OO CL.52 D1023 'WESTERN FUSILIER' BR MAROON SML Y/ENDS

[Gwiwer]

One of the more recently produced specimens.

 

There might be a misaligned cog in the gears or there could be a wheel set out of alignment.  Either should be a reasonably quick fix and a job that some skilled / experienced modellers might undertake themselves.

[adb968008]

4D-003-008 Dapol OO CL.52 D1023 'WESTERN FUSILIER' BR MAROON SML Y/ENDS

I have two of these, since release, no issues at all. (Though neither are carrying the number D1023).

I’ve 9 Westerns, has 2 niggles.., I discovered a while back that the different chassis are not always interchangeable as the screw fittings are different, and 1 Western runs slowly on DC, no idea why. It works fine just slower than the rest in both directions.

[swiftbeam]

One of the more recently produced specimens.

 

There might be a misaligned cog in the gears or there could be a wheel set out of alignment.  Either should be a reasonably quick fix and a job that some skilled / experienced modellers might undertake themselves.

 

Are you suggesting  I'm not skilled or experienced and should have gone digging into a model that was well within its 24 month guarantee?

[amwells]

Are you suggesting I'm not skilled or experienced and should have gone digging into a model that was well within its 24 month guarantee?

I seriously wonder sometimes. You had a query that Gwiwer took time to provide a lengthy, helpful and considered reply to and got a short, direct response which again was responded to courteously. What does he get for the trouble? No thanks, no gratitude for trying to help. Nope, the start of an argument!

[Gwiwer]

Are you suggesting  I'm not skilled or experienced and should have gone digging into a model that was well within its 24 month guarantee?

I have no way of knowing how experienced or skilled you are as a modeller and made no assumptions. My comment reflects the fact that the possible causes of the problem you experienced are within the skill-set of some modellers to fix. Some will happily open up a locomotive under warranty. I do that myself to fit drivers and, on those rare occasions when it has been necessary, to refix glazing which has become detached in transit. To each their own. We are all just as much able to return faulty items as we are to complete our own repairs though in some cases the latter option might invalidate a warranty.

[Silver Sidelines]

I think you perhaps love Dapol or you have a healthy respect.  I only possess three Dapol models, two 63xx and  a Class 122.  One of of the 63xx is a replacement as the original model bounced all over the track.  The second 63xx had to go back to have a replacement PCB.  It wobbles and the skirts don't fit.  The Class 122 is a replacement, the first model having a a broken bogie mounting.  The replacement came with a twisted cab handrail which I fettled.  I have six Heljan Westerns which have been trouble free. The proof of the pudding is in the eating?
 
Ray

Edited October 29, 2017 by Silver Sidelines

[Gwiwer]

For the record I have five 22s. All run satisfactorily though the skirt panels fall off too easily. I also have a single 73 which has an incorrect shade used for the livery and from which numerous factory-fitted parts have fallen off. I do not have any Dapol bubblecars because I have a number of Hornby ones which will be more than adequate unless and until Bachmann release theirs.

 

I speak as I find and as impartially as possible. I know others have had some serious issues with their Dapol products, have found the company less than responsive when contacted for support and I have lost a degree of confidence in their ability to deliver a reliable, correctly-liveried locomotive which stays together. So not in love at all. But a customer who has a modest and varied collection of their products which mostly perform as they should most of the time.

[olivegreen]

I cannot match Gwiwer's numbers of models but I have one each of Dapol's 52, 22 and 122 and all have run perfectly as I would have wished from the start, though I have the same reservation about the panels dropping off the 22 (I am aware could glue them in place, of course).

 

I do not favour Dapol over any other manufacturer but pragmatism reminds me of an old business adage that for every group of satisfied customers, however large that group might be - the silent majority, as it were - the odd dissatisfied customer makes a lot of noise and intentionally or otherwise damages the reputation of the business.

 

That is not to say that mistakes are not made, of course, as Gwiwer points out, especially in mass manufacturing down to a price.

 

I thank Dapol for making the models I have bought but would add 'watch the quality control, please - you might be standing into danger'.

[time for a brew]

I'm new to the hobby and a lurker here for some time. Does this qualify me as one of the silent majority? I've tried to use posts here to help with my decision when acquiring a model and first appearances are "Don't buy Dapol"

But when I more carefully it seems to be the same people each time who have disaster after disaster. When they do, one post is not enough it has to be many repeating the same issue again and again.

 

The quantity and diversity of posts is telling. It seems people who are satisfied either don't post, or when they do are labeled as 'lucky' or just get lost in the chatter. Alternatively maybe Dapol only make and sell a dozen or so rubbish quality models which are exclusively bought by RMWeb members, instead of the thousands of salable ones I had imagined. I think any company that has been in business for as long as they have, without major management turmoil as experienced by other manufacturers must have an overwhelmingly happy customer base?

 

When I look at other manufactures models they seem to have an equal number of errors and mistakes, but Dapols are always highlighted on this forum, others, with glaringly over-scale injectors and poor running are welcomed as advances in the hobby, often by the same posters as found in the Dapol threads. It seems to me that there are those with vested interests who post without hindrance. Take for example the multiple postings by parties claiming Dapols class 68 and Bubblecars are wired incorrectly and the posts explaining how Dapol 'should' have done it. A quick check shows that these people have commercial interests tied to a chip which is not comparable with the standard Dapol has chosen, thereby they stand at a disadvantage. I wonder how many other posts have similar motivation?

 

The class 73 certainly had errors, but this was magnified out of all proportion. Dapol have certainly received much in the way of trolling. There will be a hard core few who even now are preparing much magnified photographs of tiny imperfections found in the latest example of a model or are scrutinising dealer pictures to use as evidence for Dapols new crime against the hobby.

 

Perhaps an frank discussion on this is overdue since I think it degrades RMWebs standing as a modelling resource? I do hope this post stays visible, as it is made in good faith, but perhaps it maybe better moved to its own thread?

And for those who think otherwise, No I am not connected with any manufacturer, my motivation is fairness and even handedness. I just do not want to see modelling choice and diversity reduced through lack of feedback from satisfied customers.

 

Jake.

[Ian Hargrave]

Thank you Jake.I admire your openness and candour. No doubt you are aware that several months ago,Dapol issued a statement warning that they would not hesitate to take action against what they considered to be malicious and harmful posting.This was directed at at least one member of this forum.There was indeed a full and frank discussion at the time.Fortunately,the dust has now settled and we can move on without such trolling....but the issue lurks still and not necessarily only on the Dapol thread.This is "social media" and in an age of freedom of expression and open access,it 's a matter of publish and be damned....no matter what damage can be set in motion direct from our own keyboards with whatever motivation be it malicious or genuine.There are in fact a set of forum rules which you might take a few moments to read.I wish everyone did.

 

Some of what you post above is contentious and challenging to those who might or might not be "guilty as charged",so be thoroughly prepared to meet any "incoming" with a sure and robust reply.Good luck.

[time for a brew]

Thanks for the support. I am a member of many online forums and few are without the occasional troll. Mostly this is balanced and there is a basis in fact, however even for those life and death situations an amount of reasonableness and calm is introduced by other members. As you have pointed out, few challengers here are met with open arms by those challenged.

 

I object most to supposition, inferences, posts without substance and broad sweeping statements. I could offer examples, but they can be easily found. I remember the postings you refer to and I for one support Dapols statement. The posts may have been removed, but many live on echoed as quotes by members with many hundreds or thousands of posts. Perhaps these members should use there undoubted experience on this forum to moderate as one member above has. Members should realize that having made many posts does not always imply knowledge or understanding especially  about a businesses operations or strategy, but it certainly does prove many hours of social media experience.

 

I am sure I will receive 'incoming' it will be interesting to read them since I consider my comments frank and only contentious to those who may for whatever reason wish to steer the conversation in a particular direction.

[No Decorum]

Very interesting posting, time for a brew. I think anyone certainly needs to know what they’re doing in RTR. Dapol has been mentioned. Dapol has a range of wagons and coaches made from old tooling. They aren’t to as high a standard as some other products but then they aren’t as expensive. In particular, the Stanier coaches must be a godsend to those on tight budgets and Dapol quite openly states that they are not to the highest standard but it is useful to some people to keep them in production. Dapol has been trying very hard and, at the other end of the spectrum, I would say that the Class 68s are breathtaking and (apart from a livery clanger which is being addressed) a step in front of any other diesel on the market.

 

Dapol isn’t alone in this. Hornby and its constituents has been around for a long time and some tooling is very old. Hornby’s newest wagons are in a different league from the older stuff.

 

Perhaps in a less extreme form, the same is true of most manufacturers. Some models they produce are just better than others. You need to do your homework before you buy.

 

It is not only a matter of price and quality. Personal preference enters into it as well. Some models have features which some people hate, yet those same features don’t bother other people. A good example is Heljan’s Class 47. Some dismiss it because it is too wide. Others love the running quality so much that they accept the width.

 

I am all for criticism. That is what leads to improvement. However, sometimes things get a little too heated, which is a pity. A calm and reasoned statement of opinion is much more likely to command attention than screaming and shouting. It is often the case that the louder the shouting, the weaker the case.

 

By the way, I like the moniker, time for a brew. It is redolent of “let’s sit down and sort this out over a cup of char”. Welcome on board.

[SRman]

I cannot match Gwiwer's numbers of models but I have one each of Dapol's 52, 22 and 122 and all have run perfectly as I would have wished from the start, though I have the same reservation about the panels dropping off the 22 (I am aware could glue them in place, of course).

 

... 

 

If it is of any help, I used some black-tack (Homelux Bath Seal) to stick the panels in place. this still allows them to be removed if i want, but they don't fall out all over the place!

[JSpencer]

I cannot match Gwiwer's numbers of models but I have one each of Dapol's 52, 22 and 122 and all have run perfectly as I would have wished from the start, though I have the same reservation about the panels dropping off the 22 (I am aware could glue them in place, of course).

 

I do not favour Dapol over any other manufacturer but pragmatism reminds me of an old business adage that for every group of satisfied customers, however large that group might be - the silent majority, as it were - the odd dissatisfied customer makes a lot of noise and intentionally or otherwise damages the reputation of the business.

 

That is not to say that mistakes are not made, of course, as Gwiwer points out, especially in mass manufacturing down to a price.

 

I thank Dapol for making the models I have bought but would add 'watch the quality control, please - you might be standing into danger'.

 

Personally, when it comes to bits falling off like the class 22 panels, I leave them off. Either that or I permanently glue them on. (Or in some cases, I make sure I have plenty of spares such as the Heljan class 23 lamp irons).

 

All manufacturers have faults on their models or some point or another. Some are easy to address, others we learn to live with or reject the model. Some people will want upmost detail with as little compromise as possible, others will want models to be more practical work-a-day models and so on. As prices increase, there is an expectation for QC to increase with it however the process to make the models has not changed.

 

I have only one Dapol 52, no issues to report but I feel it is light compared to the old Lima one it replaces. Still adequate for the loads I expect to pull and it is a reliable good runner (and surpasses the old Lima model by several thousand miles in terms of details, running etc etc!).

 

Funny enough, the old lima one had a wobble as it accelerates, but no wobble on the Dapol 52 (from a later batch and fully weathered too).

[Legend]

I was put off buying a 68 because of some of the reports coming through and decided to wait for the second batch which are almost upon us. I did buy a Dapol 52 during the summer with some intrepidation. Actually if I could have found a Heljan new one in blue I might have gone for that instead. However,Dapol it was,and I must admit I was impressed from the off . Nice packaging, very well secured, good accessories although I would prefer the name and number plates pre fitted. Heart in mouth as I put it on the track for the first time, but no issues. I’d say top speed is a bit slow , but still acceptable. She pulls 6 Bachmann mk1s, quite heavy coaches,about my max train length with no difficulties. No hint of a wobble. Relatively silent but with a bit of a low growl when at max speed. So overall very happy and will now get that 68 with maybe a bit more confidence.

[tarifa]

I run three Dapol "Westerns" and they run beautifully and IMO one of the better diesels made to date.  I also own and run many other loco's form other manufacturers and they also run beautifully.  As for bits falling off, they don't, if by chance they work loose I glue them on.  It's advisable to handle models delicately to avoid braking the add on bits, just common sense .  With my limited experience poor running is mostly due to poorly laid track.

[Horsetan]

I bought a maroon 52 not long after it first came out, just to see what the fuss was about, and rewheeled it with P4 Ultrascales. Other than a lamp iron falling off and disappearing, there's nothing wrong with it, and it has mostly coped alright on the circular test track of the North London Group. It's quite heavy and well screwed-together. I've disconnected the wiring for the cab lights as they hardly ever ran with those on.

 

One thing I also liked about it was the ability to obtain spares of most things from DCC Supplies, although I note that some bits have sold out progressively (pipes, mostly) and may not be restocked for some considerable time, such is the production method in China.

 

The light box for the headcodes is quite ingenious, when you consider how little space there is for it. I did take it apart to see if it was possible to fit working roller blinds, but I think that might be a very tall order!

 

Just waiting to see whether anyone might design a sprung bogie kit for it.

[Mutley]

Seven Dapol Westerns for me, one a recent purchase of one of the original releases that I found lurking in the Pecorama shop!

 

That particular model suffered from bad wheel wobble so I contacted DCC Supplies via their website, returned the loco under warranty for repair and in next to no time it was back, running very nicely as do the other six.

 

Looking forward to adding more Locos to the fleet in due course.

 

Mike

[adb968008]

D1000/10/13/15/23/41/48/58/62 for me..

Hedges my bets quite well, so I can flip between 60’s they preservation in 90’s with ease.

 

So to avoid confusion these were bought as, and renumbered too..

 

These were:

D1000 steam ltd Ed. - sand

D1002 Dapol became D1048 - green

D1010 Dapol (the only GA one I’ve not renumbered). -blue

D1015 CMC ltd Ed. -orange

D1018 LTM edition x2 Blue (became D1023 and D1013)

D1018 LTM edition maroon (became D1062)

D1023 Dapol Maroon (became D1041)

D1056 Dapol (became D1058) FYE Maroon

 

I recently saw a silver one in Foster Yeoman livery on ebay, sadly missed it, as i’d Loved to have had that one ! A near run close thing that stood a real chance of happening

Edited October 30, 2017 by adb968008