RMweb Premium Barry O Posted March 5, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 5, 2019 Gordon, Nice ballasting. Sorry I haven't commented before but wifi in India is a bit flaky.. Regarding the supports..are there any swap meets near you? If yes you could try there. Keep up the good work Baz Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post gordon s Posted March 5, 2019 Author Popular Post Share Posted March 5, 2019 Thanks Barry. India? Wonderful place if you can handle the huge contrasts between wealth and poverty. Lovely people and surprisingly as a curry lover, the food was spicy, but almost mild to medium in terms of heat. Are you travelling around or based in one place? March 5th and there is some progress, but a month has just disappeared. Golf wise has been a nightmare. We were strolling towards qualification and without a care, but we lost to West Berks. That increased the pressure and then we lost to Calcot and that really turned things up, with nothing less than a win at The Downshire to see us through. Needless to say we went down and that was it. A dead rubber match against Donnington Grove which we won, but finishing third was no consolation. As a competitive animal, failing to qualify really took its toll and we were all gutted for several days. Of course its only a game and there are far worse things in life, but at the time, its a bummer. Thankfully that's gone and modelling is now back on again. Here's the state of play as of a few minutes ago... Managed to track down some of the the elusive Hornby canopy supports. Found a pack of six on eBay and I'm just waiting for alerts for others. There's loads of complete canopies kicking around, so happy to buy some of those if needs must. Drew a blank with Hornby and Peter's spares. Still surprised they came from Hornby as somehow I thought they'd be something far more exotic. Platform wise, the edging is on and they are starting to take shape. I still have some gap filling to do and a bit of sanding where stuff is not as level as I first thought. The Screwfix mitre bond is magnificent stuff and sticks anything and everything very quickly. I did slip up a couple of times, but managed to slide an old knife in quickly to remove and realign parts which clearly offended the OCD side of my brain..... For some reason, probably to avoid joins, I decided to make these in one piece. Never really considered just how big and unmanageable an 8' length of platform would be. particularly in a loft conversion with modern ceiling heights, but got there in the end. Managed to swipe my dear wife a couple of times, which went down well... Track is finally ballasted and platforms roughly in position. I used small mdf offcuts to lay out the edge lines of the mdf strips, but will now remove them and glue blocks under the platforms which can then be screwed into, from below. Here's a couple of gratuitous loco pics, just to get a feel for how it might look. Of course the buildings need a bit of a tidy up with lines that aren't straight etc, but having looked at some pics of real buildings, I do wonder if my quest for alignment of canopies etc actually takes me further away from reality. There must be something about model photography that offends the eye, whereas the real thing is an experience and we take in a bigger picture and overlook the detail. Gilbert told me his station buildings were originally based on Spalding and Sleaford. Looking at some real pics, demonstrates what I mean. https://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/4768046 https://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/4291197 https://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/4291373 Loco wise, I loved the Brits when they were in their heyday, particularly the later ones with the BR 1G high sided tenders. .....but there is a story behind this one. I knew about one thing, but looking at this pic more closely suggests another issue. Several years ago, I'd had the loco out for a test run and the worst thing happened. As you get older, your fingers and grip on things seems to deteriorate and I managed to drop the tender. At first I thought it was OK, but then I realised it had dropped right on one corner and this was the result. Looking at the pic above also shows a wave in the brass side close to the front edge where it joins the loco. I think the tender steps are also bent, but that's easily fixed. I suspect I will now have to find a real craftsman, who will be able to repair the damage as I love this loco and can't bear to see in in this condition. I'd forgotten all about it until this morning. One final shot and not a particularly good one as the exposure is all wrong (and the background is a mess!) but a D16/3 with a local passenger service. A lovely loco that must be fitted with a Portescap as it free wheels along the track. Can't wait to see it up and running properly again. Not much else to report. Looking underneath at the adjoining board, I'm going to need some additional wiring with a 0v bus wire and switch wires to around a dozen Tortoise motors. I should have done that before I joined these two together, but hadn't realised at the time. Deep joy, it will now have to be done from underneath, as the curvature and size of these two finished boards means it would be impossible to lift and twist them around in the limited space. Memo to self. Check all the other boards first before bolting together and ballasting.... 26 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hayfield Posted March 5, 2019 Share Posted March 5, 2019 The station is really coming along now and I expect will look stunning once finished, shame about the loco, we hall have done similar 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Barry O Posted March 5, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 5, 2019 Gordon, We flew into Delhi, then to amritsar and the golden temple, Acra, jaipur, shimla, Delhi, Varenassi, Kolkata, Darjeeling, Mumbai, kochin, alleppey, thekaddy, kochin, Mumbai then home. The difference between the ultra rich (a family of 5 live in a 27 storey apartment with 600 servants) and the poor ( who can scrape food together and live in the open) is startling. We managed two "toy" train journeys and a trip on the main line (Kalka to New Delhi) so saw a bit of Indian rail. Now on our 40 year old HST heading to Leeds...older than all of the coaches we travelled in in India. Got a lot of modelling to catch up on..sound, weathering for others and some layout building for me. Baz 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Barry O Posted March 5, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 5, 2019 The brit needs a tweak with some flat pliers, a luck of paint and a dash of weathering...I am sure you can do that Baz 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon s Posted March 5, 2019 Author Share Posted March 5, 2019 (edited) Apologies Barry, I wasn’t laughing at you, just the idea that I have the skill for an invisible repair! I did think at one time of simply painting over the bare patch and hoping no one would notice, but that would really be a cop out for such a lovely loco. I guess I don’t want to be reminded of my carelessness every time I ran the loco. It’s back to this thing I have of reality versus a model. I’m sure in the real world tender panels were dented and bashed about, but seen on a model it somehow looks out of place. Maybe in our imaginary world everything is perfect. No doubt a psychologist wouldn’t have field day with some of us....... Now something a little more deep rooted...... As a kid I grew up in North London and you would have heard me talk before about Platform 10 at Kings Cross and the endless hours I spent sitting at the end of Wood Green platform watching Gresley’s finest thundering down from Hornsey and through the fast line at Wood Green. I realised today that the track layout at ET is not that far removed from Wood Green and my thoughts about a road bridge and retaining walls etc all come back to Wood Green. The deep rooted and sub conscious thoughts have a lot to answer for....... I want to explore this further as I can see two station buildings either side of the platforms with ET set below the adjacent roads. There was a building at the bottom of Alexandra Palace Hill joined to ‘the other side’ by a skeleton footbridge and a passenger footbridge with down stair ramps to each platform. One end of the platforms was a brick arched over bridge. Of course it won’t be a scale model of Wood Green, but it will bring back all those memories of Gresley’s finest thundering through plus the local N2’s and L1’s. Take a look at this map and you will see where my thoughts have come from..... The Alexandra Palace entrance could be a low profile building and I have the opportunity to bring in both the station bridges plus the road bridge. Off to search for some more pics.... https://www.google.co.uk/search?biw=1586&bih=966&tbm=isch&sa=1&ei=4cl-XJSJLoOZjLsPiM65gA8&q=wood+green+lner+railway+station&oq=wood+green+lner+railway+station&gs_l=img.3...10617.17533..18471...0.0..0.53.410.10......1....1..gws-wiz-img.XVzANWtFDZE#imgrc=qUjeeQ8nBap8vM: https://picclick.co.uk/Wood-Green-Railway-Station-Photo-Hornsey-to-Oakleigh-253323693237.html Edited March 5, 2019 by gordon s 9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium St Enodoc Posted March 5, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 5, 2019 1 hour ago, gordon s said: Apologies Barry, I wasn’t laughing at you, just the idea that I have the skill for an invisible repair! I did think at one time of simply painting over the bare patch and hoping no one would notice, but that would really be a cop out for such a lovely loco. I guess I don’t want to be reminded of my carelessness every time I ran the loco. It’s back to this thing I have of reality versus a model. I’m sure in the real world tender panels were dented and bashed about, but seen on a model it somehow looks out of place. Maybe in our imaginary world everything is perfect. No doubt a psychologist wouldn’t have field day with some of us....... Now something a little more deep rooted...... As a kid I grew up in North London and you would have heard me talk before about Platform 10 at Kings Cross and the endless hours I spent sitting at the end of Wood Green platform watching Gresley’s finest thundering down from Hornsey and through the fast line at Wood Green. I realised today that the track layout at ET is not that far removed from Wood Green and my thoughts about a road bridge and retaining walls etc all come back to Wood Green. The deep rooted and sub conscious thoughts have a lot to answer for....... I want to explore this further as I can see two station buildings either side of platforms with ET set below the adjacent roads. There was a building at the bottom of Alexandra Palace Hill joined to ‘the other side’ by a skeleton footbridge and a passenger footbridge with down stair ramps to each platform. One end of the platforms was a brick arched over bridge. Of course it won’t be a scale model of Wood Green, but it will bring back all those memories of Gresley’s finest thundering through plus the local N2’s and L1’s. Take a look at this map and you will see where my thoughts have come from..... The Alexandra Palace entrance could be a low profile building and I have the opportunity to bring in both the station bridges plus the road bridge. Off to search for some more pics.... https://www.google.co.uk/search?biw=1586&bih=966&tbm=isch&sa=1&ei=4cl-XJSJLoOZjLsPiM65gA8&q=wood+green+lner+railway+station&oq=wood+green+lner+railway+station&gs_l=img.3...10617.17533..18471...0.0..0.53.410.10......1....1..gws-wiz-img.XVzANWtFDZE#imgrc=qUjeeQ8nBap8vM: https://picclick.co.uk/Wood-Green-Railway-Station-Photo-Hornsey-to-Oakleigh-253323693237.html So Eastwood Town could become Eastwood Green... Just saying. 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Michael Edge Posted March 5, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 5, 2019 That tender would be easy to repair, the paint might be a bit more difficult and I would want to remove the division plate, not fitted to BR1D tenders which this is. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon s Posted March 6, 2019 Author Share Posted March 6, 2019 (edited) Thanks Michael, my mistake as I thought it was BR1G not D. Surprised my loco builder missed the division plate issue. Not like him...... I have a pic of 70049 and the division plate is there on that loco...Hmmm... Seems 48 swapped tenders with 47 in July 64. Maybe that explains it. Had another look and the plot thickens. 49 swapped tenders with 47 in 55 and then 47 with the division plate plate tender from 49 swapped that with 48 in '64, so that would make it correct after '64. Edited March 6, 2019 by gordon s 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
calvin Streeting Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 or just paint rust runs on it.. i am sure locos got damaged in real life Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Michael Edge Posted March 7, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 7, 2019 It should have a coal pusher as well. Those division plates produce more mistakes than anything else on a BR tender, they were fitted in one of two positions to reduce the coal space, DJH provide two with their high sided tenders so very often you see the builder has put both in. There shouldn't be any coal behind the plate either but you often see them coaled up all along, no idea how the fireman would get the coal out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KalKat Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 Perhaps manumaticaly, in a bit of a temper and the aid of a small ladder (to get out afterwards) Emma Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon s Posted March 7, 2019 Author Share Posted March 7, 2019 Well, the coal pusher appears to be working.... I suspect the fireman may be looking for another job soon, though. 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon s Posted March 8, 2019 Author Share Posted March 8, 2019 (edited) Found a slightly more detailed map of Wood Green which confirmed the up and down stair ramps. The two outers were double sided and the inner just single sided. Had the place to myself this morning, so gathered together a few bits of mdf and some mitre bond and had a bit of fun cutting and glueing bits and pieces to see where it led. At this stage it's purely an academic exercise to see how it would go together and more importantly, did it look OK. Early days yet as there is still much to do. The building sizes need a little work as everything is going to be compressed and I've always said this isn't a scale model of a prototype location, just something that catches the essence of an LNER through station. As you can see, I haven't got any of the canopies in position and the angle of the footbridge on the AP side needs loads more work. I've limited the up slope to 10 degrees, but the side angle needs a custom built bend to take it through 45 degrees, rather than the 10 I've used. I've always found mitre angles a mental challenge, so cutting the compound angle was a hoot.... There's also a shot with the MK1 glazing falling out, so they'll all need attention when I have the inclination. The two station buildings will need additional space, but that shouldn't be an issue. Edit: I've since noticed the centre stairs are the wrong way round. I thought it went too well....Now corrected. This end will have the road bridge that loops around the whole station. It will certainly frame the whole station and presents an opportunity to build up the ground either side and reduce the 'flat earth' possibility. Ready for take off..... I wish in hindsight I had made this nearside platform wider, but it reflected the width of the station canopy. I've reduced the width of the buildings on this platform so they now exceed minimum clearance, but much more reduction and they look a little on the skinny side. I suspect once the canopy is in place it won't notice at all. The footbridge will look something like this, not a solid chunk of material. It was subsequently updated by adding inner and taller wood panels, but the steel work remained. Tempting to leave it like this. H & S would have a field day.... Look like the tarmac needs a little work. I say it was overkill if I saw that on a model... All in all an enjoyable day. Edited March 8, 2019 by gordon s 15 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian_H Posted March 8, 2019 Share Posted March 8, 2019 (edited) Hi Gordon, Just looking at the drawing of Wood Green, did the stair ramp on platform 2 return on itself? it is clearly not as long as the stair ramps on platform 1 and 3 and is wider, you can also see a line down the centre of it indicating a balustrading. Also, just for fun, on the otherside of the footbridge, you appear to have a slide down to platform 2, I guess its for the traveller in a hurry Ian Edited March 8, 2019 by Ian_H 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon s Posted March 8, 2019 Author Share Posted March 8, 2019 (edited) Well spotted! Yes, I agree with you. 70 year old eyesight..... I also realised after I taken the pics that I had put the stairs on the wrong way round, so have now turned them round. Of course, I’ll need to remake them now anyway..... Edited March 8, 2019 by gordon s 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmsforever Posted March 8, 2019 Share Posted March 8, 2019 Used to stand on that bridge looking for streaks to cop looking really good. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
manna Posted March 9, 2019 Share Posted March 9, 2019 G'Day Folks Yes, I've stood on the footbridge many times, but only with the high timber cladding, bikes were handy to stand on to see over it. Any Idea when the timber planks went up ?? must have been pre 1958. manna Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon s Posted March 10, 2019 Author Share Posted March 10, 2019 (edited) Well it was a really interesting diversion, but having added a canopy to the planned buildings, I realise it's not going to work. I cut out one canopy and that was fine other than the station buildings beneath the canopy were now completely hidden from view. The whole thing became a helicopter view, one which also removed the possibility of allowing you to watch trains at platform level. One of my favourite sights are 6'8" Gresley driving wheels and the complexity of the valve gear moving in various directions and once you block that view, you have lost one of those special view points. It placed ET in a cutting which further restricted the various viewpoints. This is something I would not have realised had I not knocked together some basic buildings out of mdf sheet. Yes, it was well worth taking the time to mock something up, but the eventual outcome was not something I was expecting. What it has raised however was the possibility of adding a road bridge plus a passenger footbridge. The rear of ET station was going to be a retaining wall similar to this from an earlier version. I quite like the idea of a road overbridge and if it's located near to the station, then rather than a steep up ramp, I may choose an additional arch for an access road that can then loop round through a span of the bridge, rather than a ski jump slope up to the main road. Passengers could also use a footbridge similar to that used at Welwyn Garden City. This could come from the higher level at the rear, over the tracks and down to road level. It would certainly add some interest to that end of the station. All in all, a good weekend playing around, even though the outcome was not what I was expecting. Certainly shows the value of knocking up some dummy buildings and turning those one dimensional thoughts into three dimensional reality. Edited March 10, 2019 by gordon s 19 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcolm27 Posted March 10, 2019 Share Posted March 10, 2019 Hello Gordon, Have been following your topic for some time and great to see your recent progress, the videos show just how smoothly your trains run. I was intrigued by the screenshot of the bridge in your post last Friday. Looks very much like Oakleigh Park looking north. I grew up in East Barnet and remember spotting from that bridge around 1960, I guess we are probably of a similar age. Later whilst studying mechanical engineering at Hatfield Polytechnic (now University of Hertfordshire) I would commute from Oakleigh Park to Hatfield, this would be around 1970. Steam all gone of course, but if going in later in the morning I remember aiming to catch a loco hauled train (Brush Type 2 usually) which was made up of mainline stock, may have been a Cambridge service which just happened to stop there. I remember seeing a Deltic at Brookmans Park one morning hauling 2 Quart Art sets, I guess it was the only loco available. No camera phones then! I still commute on the Great Northern, but from a few stations further north, now of course on the new 700 series EMUs built by Siemens - the ones with the hard seats! I bought a couple of your turnouts a couple of years ago, I thought you might like to see they have been put to good use on my own layout Afon Junction. Regards, Malcolm 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon s Posted March 10, 2019 Author Share Posted March 10, 2019 Hi Malcolm, great to hear from you and many thanks for following my ramblings. I'm fairly certain that is the double junction that you bought a few years back. I hope it's still behaving itself... I'm so glad you recognised the bridge as I thought it may have been Welwyn Garden City, but having trawled the web, I can see it was Oakleigh Park. I picked it up from this film... https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/142783-kings-cross-to-welwyn-viaduct-in-the-60ssuch-memories/&tab=comments#comment-3491170 Lovely memories of the area. I was at Southgate Tech and then left to work at STC which features in the film of steam in the 60's. Small world! Apologies, but I'm just off to bed as I have an early start tomorrow and need to be at the golf club at 7.00am for a qualifier. I'll catch up later.... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted March 18, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 18, 2019 On 24/11/2012 at 18:55, gordon s said: The brown paint is household emulsion mixed by my local paintshop. I think there is a code number on the tin, so I'll take a look later. I get a litre of it for a few quid, so much cheaper than most other paints. Whatever you do with tracklaying, something is going to take a while. In my case it's ballasting, although I have followed the good Captain's method which although time consuming, gives a good result with no rework. I know Coachmann prefers to glue his track down and then sprinkles ballast into the wet glue. That has upsides, but then you have to wire it and hand paint the rails and sleepers, so you save a bit on one process and then lose out on another. I airbrushed all the track on this board in less than an hour. There's little or no smell and because the airbrush is pretty accurate from an inch or so away, there is little overspray, unlike a aerosol can. I'm using emulsion paint so there is little or no smell. I just have the windows open to ensure the room is well ventilated. If you want to split hairs, I know the rails aren't the same colour as the sleepers in real life, but once airbrushed, ballasted and then airbrushed again to tone down the ballast, the result is an acceptable compromise. Once finished it looks something like this. In this old pic, I have used medium ballast and it has yet to receive the final dirt overspray. It's still a bit on the big side, so the new ET will use fine ballast, but you can get the idea... Dragging up a post from the distant past, I am interested to hear more about your approach using regular emulsion when painting your track. Its probably a little too much to ask now, but do you have a record of what colour you used? Were there any specific preparations you needed to make to get the emulsion to adhere to the plastic / copperclad sleepers and to the rail sides? Finally, were you spraying it neat from the tin, or was an element of thinning required to get it working with the airbrush? I need to get the track painted on Brent, and with a reasonably large area to cover I am looking for alternatives to the usual tin of Phoenix Sleeper Grime. The cheaper price of emulsion + avoiding nasty solvents when spraying deep in the garage, make this sound like a winner. (with the added bonus that the leftover paint will make for a good ground covering) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordon s Posted March 18, 2019 Author Share Posted March 18, 2019 (edited) No problem at all. I have them in front of me. Many years ago, I used Humbrol Chocolate for track painting and a small tin went nowhere and it was horrendously time consuming. At that time I used Simonize red oxide primer in a spray can and hand painted the track. As I had a ton of track to do, I thought I'd give emulsion a go, so painted a wood patch sample with Humbrol Chocolate and then took it down to my local paint merchant. He stuck in his spectrophotometer, which basically analyses the colour and then provides a match. From memory a 2.5 litre tin was around £15 and I use it for track and all baseboard painting. The last tin I bought has a label with a Natural Colour Systems 2nd Edition (NCS) code on it of S 7005-Y80R and is dated November 2016, so that number may still be valid. It's mixed up in a Johnstone's Covaplas Vinyl Matt. Since then, I have bought an airbrush and no longer use red oxide. I now use a Vallejo primer 74 601 Grey Primer. They say it is suitable for plastic and brass, but I do have one small reservation that I'll come on to. Once the track is ready for painting I use the primer straight from the bottle via an airbrush. Once dry, I have a mix of the brown track colour, which is just a few spoonfuls of paint, thinned with water. I keep that in a normal size glass jar, which tends to last a while if sealed after use. Basically, just thin the emulsion down to the consistency of double creamed then spray it on with my airbrush. If I'm honest the grey primer is probably not as good as the red oxide as I do find the odd paint chip. It might be something I'm doing or it could be the plastic of SMP sleepers, but it's not a huge problem for me as I have a lot of track to paint and the there are probably less that 10 chips in around 300-400 ft of track. Of course you end up with the sleepers,chairs and rails all the same colour, but that's a compromise I'm prepared to make with so much track to do. Here's a couple of pics... If you look at the first pic, there is a chip on the 2nd right sleeper. The emulsion is fine, so I think it is a primer issue. If I'm hyper critical, there are a couple of minor abrasions on the rail, but this is an incredibly close up pic and you can't see these from normal viewing distances. Overall, I'm very happy to still use emulsion paint. It's cheap and can be used for a whole raft of applications. I'm still playing around with primers to see if there is a better product for the SMP plastic sleepers, but even if I couldn't find a more suitable one, then I will happily accept the odd compromise, particularly with so much track to paint and ballast. Hope that helps.... Edited March 18, 2019 by gordon s 7 1 7 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Rowsley17D Posted March 18, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 18, 2019 Larry Coachmann Goddard uses Halford's grey Etch Primer and their plastic primer too, for his coaches and plastic buildings. I don't think he's used it on track though as is layouts are not that big and he uses rattle can track dirt. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Re6/6 Posted March 18, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 18, 2019 (edited) Gordon, this may not be relevant to the 'look' that you want but it is what we've decided upon to suit our needs. A general brown grimy, brake dusty, appearance is what we wanted. I achieved this by airbrushing Precision Paints HS215 'Track Colour Matt' (same as/very similar to the old Humbrol track colour) which was a bit dark for our taste so I gave it a very light waft of PP 'Brake Dust' and then a blow over with PP 'New Concrete' which had the effect of giving it all a lift with a highlighted appearance. With the vast amount of track that had to be painted I couldn't face painting 'individual' touches like contrasting rail, chair and sleepers! Anyway, it's only going to be viewed from 'normal viewing distance' at shows! PP do supply in 50ml tins when large amounts are required. Edit.... The juice rails need toning down a bit I think. Edited March 18, 2019 by Re6/6 5 1 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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