47901

[keefer]

i've seen a pic of 47 523 with one of these lights, described as a 'quartz' headlight, fitted to a few 47/4s in the 70s for evaluation re:track workers etc.

the pic in 'motive power recognition 1 - locos' (1981) shows 523 with a headcode '1A04' still in use, albeit using small paper characters stuck to the glass of the headcode panel!

slightly OT, but it doesn't seem to have carried it for long

http://www.class47.co.uk/c47_gallery.php?index=2&jndex=1&kndex=23&s_loco=47523

 

has it (or perhaps was fitted) when in works in 1977, but lost it by 1979 and carried the blanked off light mount into i/c livery

[brian daniels]

47432, 434 and 523 had the original quartz headlights fitted.

[Penrhos1920]

So what sound file would you want for it? A 56 for 47601 and a 58 for 47901?????

[griffgriff]

Hi chard

 

What do you mean intolerable shape issues? The Hornby duff despite being crude in it's detail is still considered onne of the best for body shape. The lima model looks much more like a 47 than the Heljan one ever has and is also better than the original Bachmann one. The hejlan mech draws huge amounts of power (try double heading them on dc and they will probably trip your controller). The vitrains model does come with original cowls and with such drastic surgery required to the roof and a full repaint why complain about the separate detail when you'd have to take it all off anyway?

 

Hth

 

Jim

 

... and to be fair 47 901 spent a considerable amount of time double heading

[mjkerr]

47432, 434 and 523 had the original quartz headlights fitted.

I knew I had seen at least one other Class 47s with these, but they had been removed and plated over

 

47432 :

http://www.class47.co.uk/c47_zoom_v2.php?img=0849000014000

The fitting was completely removed at both ends, but can be seen here

http://www.class47.co.uk/c47_zoom_v2.php?img=0849000157000

If you didn't know it had one previously, you would never have known

http://www.class47.co.uk/c47_zoom_v2.php?img=0492051072211

 

47434 :

http://www.class47.co.uk/c47_zoom_v2.php?img=1151051470211

Due to accident damage, this remained at one end only, there end lost it by receiving a flat repair end

 

47523 :

http://www.class47.co.uk/c47_zoom_v2.php?img=0748020530000

[mjkerr]

... and to be fair 47 901 spent a considerable amount of time double heading

Not sure how it was double heading, as it was not fitted with multipe working equipment

It would either be double crewed or hauling another loco dead in tow

 

If it was double heading by way of a double crew then it is no wonder they didn't want to use it too often!

However some benefits may outweigh the additional crew costs, in effect making them insignificant

A 47/9 plus a 37 or 56 is much better than a single loco and the 47/9 can deputise for a failed loco in the short term

[griffgriff]

Not sure how it was double heading, as it was not fitted with multipe working equipment

It would either be double crewed or hauling another loco dead in tow

 

 

 

... you missed the obvious one i.e. it being hauled dead

 

It spent a lot of time running (sic) between Canton, Bath Road, Westbury and the great works in the north

 

 

Mind when it was working and not dead in a siding somewhere it was a beast

[mjkerr]

... you missed the obvious one i.e. it being hauled dead

I did mention Dead In Tow, showing that multiple working was not possible

I do agree though, there were far more reports of it being rescued and then moved around

[griffgriff]

I did mention Dead In Tow, showing that multiple working was not possible

I do agree though, there were far more reports of it being rescued and then moved around

 

... to be a pedant .... how could a dead engine haul anything

[mjkerr]

... to be a pedant .... how could a dead engine haul anything

Train composition :

37+DIT+train

DIT+37+train

Does that make it clearer?

The worst situation is obviously the dead loco leading, this causes all kinds of problems

[D6975]

I live in Bristol and I can confirm that 47901 spent long periods sat at the back of Bath Road shed in its plain blue days. It would be there for months at a time, easily recognisable by the headlight.

When it received 3TG it spent much more time down Westbury and it visited Bristol with about the same frequency as the Aggregates sector 56s.

[simon47603]

Hi Guy's

 

If I remember correctly from reading various articles in the railway press over the years, 47901 when running smoothly, was considered to the best 58 of all. Mechanically it's main problem was that the traction motors, probably could not handle the power from the Engine and alternator. It's traction motors were the same as a normal class 47/0 and easily would have been overloaded. So would have had a habit of going bang, when working hard. As it would have been hauling the stone trains out of the Mendips. As a prototype test bed, once the 58's had entered squadron service, 47901 would have been bottom of the pile for spare parts, as it would not due for a nice new 58 to be sitting around waiting for spare parts!

 

Operationally, only Westbury Drivers were trained on it, so when it was due a B-exam or higher and no Westbury drivers available to man it, it would make sense for it be towed dead to and from Bath Road or Canton. As no Canton driver would have been qualified to drive it. The qustion remains is to why it remained in the West of England, as Toton was where the 58's were allocated to. You would have thought that B.R. would have sent it North to work from Toton. As that Depot would have more qualified to look after it, with a 56 sent southwards in its place. As a non-standard locomotive and with ARC 59/1's and the class 60's on the horizon it was only a matter of time for it to have been withdrawn and its engine and alternater removed for spares.

 

Simon

[griffgriff]

Train composition :

37+DIT+train

DIT+37+train

Does that make it clearer?

The worst situation is obviously the dead loco leading, this causes all kinds of problems

 

nope ..if it's dead it's dead. However I think it's time to agree to differ

[daveyb]

All the pics on this thread show 47601/901 with 47 style bogies, but I'm sure I remember a pic with 56 style bogies. Did it ever run with 58 style bogies or was that only the 56 test bed loco?

[Pugsley]

47901 only ever ran with class 47 bogies, to the best of my knowledge. The 56 that was fitted with the class 58 bogies was 56042, which as far as I know was the only non-58 to run on 58 bogies.

 

HTH

[keefer]

likewise, never heard of 601/901 on anything but cl.47 bogies.

56 042's bogies were classified CP1, being the prototype for the cl.58 CP3 bogies.

 

a point that just occured to me that i remember reading - as both 601 and 901, the loco was type 5. i'd have thought BR might have renumbered it to class 50-something, given its unique nature and increased power. unless of course it was given sufficient info in the relevant operating notices

[daveyb]

I must be mixing up 56042, though I did realise that they were not 'pure' 58 bogies.

 

Your numbering question would create RA assessment problems (as a guess) and doesn't reflect the fact the 50s, 52s and Falcon were surely only Type 4 and 20s were Type 1.

[ess1uk]

must dig out my battered Hornby 47 and have a go

[50042]

Yes, I beleve A1 did produce some sort of conversion kit. I was at an exhibition a few years ago and I remember seeing the kit with a reduced price ticket on it.

[ess1uk]

do A1 have a web presence?

or will i have to resort to hunting them down at a show?

now the dark nights are here i'll want something to do whilst the wife is at work, tv is rubbish.

[lyneux]

You could try MG Sharp although I don't hold out much hope of A1 still doing the conversion kit. It's certainly not in their 2010 catalogue: http://www.kato-unitrack.co.uk/images/pdf_2/a1_2010.pdf

 

I have a plan to do 47901 as well and will probably go down the custom etch route for the roof grills. Alex Carpenter did an 7mm one (as a commission?) that featured in Rail Express a while back. When I spoke to him at DEMU showcase he explained that most of the roof was made up styrene sheet of various thicknesses and the cantrail grilles were modified from the existing ones by cutting them. It might be hard to adopt the same approach in 4mm.

[ess1uk]

that would be why i didn't seem to find anything on the web then.

looks like this may be a long running project

were there many differences in detail between 901 when it was blue and when it went sector grey?

i'm probably going to go for the blue version but was just wondering in case i change my mind

[The Stationmaster]

a point that just occured to me that i remember reading - as both 601 and 901, the loco was type 5. i'd have thought BR might have renumbered it to class 50-something, given its unique nature and increased power. unless of course it was given sufficient info in the relevant operating notices

Whatever it had been numbered it would still have been a ruddy nuisance - which it very definitely was! The thing about those who have enthusiasms for such odd balls as 47901 and Falcon etc is that they don't have to put up with the headaches they create in extra training and availability of drivers with the right knowledge and so on. Let alone having the thing maintained remotely with a need to get it to & fro at the most inconvenient time; far more convenient to make sure it gets itself failed and dumped on someone else's depot as far out of your way as possible.

 

As far as what it could haul and where it could go the first two digits were irrrelevant because all the info was in TOPs and the Loads Book & Route Availability book.

[lyneux]

were there many differences in detail between 901 when it was blue and when it went sector grey?

 

Not that I've noticed from looking at pictures (have collected a stack from Fotopic before its demise and flickr).

 

The roof is the main area that is going to need loads of custom work. As mentioned before, the cantrail grills in particular will be hard to get right in 4mm.

[ess1uk]

need some decent pictures of the roof then

or some drawings