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Building an N gauge coach kit


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Apologies for hijacking David's thread, but thought this might be of interest to some. I've just received an email to advise that Chris Higgs (Masterclass Models) will be producing kits shortly for a variety of Hawksworth coaches and later Collett coaches in 2mm scale. A flyer will be included in the next 2mm magazine/newsletter (due to be sent to members in about a week or so).

 

Andy

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Apologies for hijacking David's thread, but thought this might be of interest to some. I've just received an email to advise that Chris Higgs (Masterclass Models) will be producing kits shortly for a variety of Hawksworth coaches and later Collett coaches in 2mm scale. A flyer will be included in the next 2mm magazine/newsletter (due to be sent to members in about a week or so).

 

I saw that announcement too. I'm very tempted. The trouble is that I probably want most of the things he's planning to offer... and then the gloat box is already well stocked with Ultima Hawksworths and a couple of Chris's Maunsells for good measure... but Chris's kits are a one time run... some tricky decisions to make.

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Oh, I think more Masterclass coaches are an excellent reason to hijack a thread 🚂

 

I can see from the flyer that I shall have to invest in some, despite only now getting round to building bogies to go under one of Mr. Higgs toplights. So much to build, so little time ...

Edited by DavidK71
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I've just received an email to advise that Chris Higgs (Masterclass Models) will be producing kits shortly for a variety of Hawksworth coaches and later Collett coaches in 2mm scale. A flyer will be included in the next 2mm magazine/newsletter (due to be sent to members in about a week or so).

Ooo, do let us know when it is announced. I have looked at his products before and they are very nice but have been a bit early for me. If he is moving to the Collett and Hawksworth period I may have to start saving the pennies (or ask Father Christmas for an IOU :D).

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Ooo, do let us know when it is announced. I have looked at his products before and they are very nice but have been a bit early for me. If he is moving to the Collett and Hawksworth period I may have to start saving the pennies (or ask Father Christmas for an IOU :D).

 

Chris Higgs posted an announcement on the 2mm Association mailing list. There is a temporary URL for the flyer - I can't see any harm in reproducing it, so here it is: https://docs.google....Q0JyN3lRNkQxZDg

Edited by DavidK71
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  • 2 months later...

Having sent off an order to Chris Higgs for his latest Masterclass Models GWR coach kit run at the start of the year, it seemed like a good idea to start work on some earlier Masterclass kits. Out from the drawer came two 70' coaches, which have now progressed as far as the underframe being completed (except buffers), and the body is just being started on.

 

First up is a toplight brake third, to D.69. This is from pretty much the end of toplight building, so it has angle truss rods, and the body panels are all steel. (Hurrah, no panelling!) It is running on 9' plate bogies.

 

post-11879-0-96441200-1359818240_thumb.png

 

Even with just the underframe, putting this next to something like the 57' GWR full brake I made last year gives you an idea of how massive these coaches must have been in real life.

 

I found a photograph on Flickr by R.W. Carroll of a D.69 BTK in carmine and cream, W3403W, to base the model on. Unfortunately I've since realised that W3403W has the brake end at the wrong end compared to the kit, oops... As I've not found any information on which were built left-handed and which right-handed, I'll have to take a guess when I get as far as numbering.

 

The other Masterclass kit I intend to do something a little different with. The actual kit is for a 70' panelled toplight third, but I am going to build it as a H.15 restaurant coach, using sides from Bill Bedford. These were originally built as part of the 'Concertina' series of coaches, though they did not have recessed doors, were heavily rebuilt in the 1930s, and lasted until the late 1960s.

 

post-11879-0-68306000-1359819403_thumb.png

 

This is also running on 9' plate bogies, following pictures of coach 9542 in Russell's books. Since these coaches did not have full-length foot boards, I've used cosmetic solebars from Ultima, who also provided the dynamos and vacuum cylinders. Gas cylinders are represented by lengths of plasticard rod from Eileen's.

 

The etches for the truss rods and queen posts on this kit are impressively thin, making assembling them a challenge. (There were a few breaks along the way, requiring them super-gluing back together.) In the end folding up the inner truss rod assembly was too much: instead I used square plasticard rod to hold the separated pieces in place:

 

post-11879-0-63003500-1359820291_thumb.png

 

Right, now on to the coach bodies ...

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  • 1 month later...

Further progress on the D.69 toplight brake third: the body carcass has been assembled, the roof detailed and the sides have been started on. In this photograph the roof and sides have been loosely attached with blu-tac to check that everything lines up:

 

post-11879-0-19135500-1364820703_thumb.jpg

 

Unfortunately the photograph cruelly shows up that the tumblehome isn't quite even at the brake end of the coach. From previous coaches I'm reasonably confident that this will not be noticeable once the coach side is painted. You can also just make out the steps on the ends of the coach: my kits seemed to be missing the etches containing the steps (or more likely I lost them somewhere) so I ended up making replacements from brass strip, then filing them all down to size once assembled. Not the most fun task!

 

The level of detail on these Masterclass coaches is rather wonderful. I especially like the side lamp irons which are so delicate (and a bit difficult to get into place).

 

The next task is the interior, and then to start on painting, assuming the weather ever warms up enough. As the coach is already reasonably heavy I'm reluctant to use the supplied etched corridor partition. My current plan is to print out a replacement on an acetate sheet (used for printing overhead projector sheets) and make a floor and compartment walls from plasticard.

 

Also, I've found the link to the photograph of a D.69 mentioned in my previous post: http://www.flickr.com/photos/robertcwp/8035238616/in/set-72157603653607671

 

Also making progress is the H15 restaurant car, again shown with sides and roof just held in place with blu-tac:

 

post-11879-0-34130100-1364820710_thumb.jpg

 

The sides haven't yet had a tumblehome added, and the roof has a very slight bow in it, which is why there's a gap between the roof and the side at the kitchen end - once the roof is securely glued in place this gap should disappear. The fittings on the roof are something of a guess, based on photographs and the 4mm Comet Models instructions for their H15 kit. The interior is made from plasticard and a couple of sets of Mike Howarth plastic seats which I picked up on eBay and cut up to fit. On close examination it's rather crude, but tucked inside an unlit coach it will be quite serviceable.

Edited by DavidK71
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Hi David,

 

Glad to see that you're still turning out some nice coaches.

 

I could use some seating suitable for open stock myself but haven't found anything to suit yet. Is Mike Howarth stuff still available or is it old stock?

 

Regards, Andy

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I could use some seating suitable for open stock myself but haven't found anything to suit yet. Is Mike Howarth stuff still available or is it old stock?

 

He sells on eBay as "mikeskits", and the auction text gives the impression that he's selling off the last of his stock. At the moment it doesn't look like he's got any seating available for sale, except bundled up with his carriage kits. Once my supply of his seating runs out it will be time for a 3d printing experiment.

 

Can I ask how you formed the tumblehome in the coach sides? It's something I've always struggled with, especially with nickel silver sides.

D869 provided some very good advice on this here: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/38124-building-an-n-gauge-coach-kit/page-3&do=findComment&comment=543449

 

I've followed this advice and made a crude jig from cardboard and sticky tape, in proper Blue Peter style. From the local DIY store I got lengths of 5mm and 10mm brass rod which I use to do the rolling. It is a bit nerve-wracking as it is the one stage that can't be restarted if it goes wrong, but I think the only real danger would be pressing too hard, too soon, which would cause the metal to fold. I tend to start gently until the side has a slight curve it it that looks right, and then start increasing the pressure while rolling the rod back and forth. I have found that it's virtually impossible to get the tumblehome curve as low on the side as it is on the prototype, but in practice that doesn't seem obvious once the side is painted and in place. Good luck!

Edited by DavidK71
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Thanks David - I'd gone back through the thread before asking the question, but I must have missed that posting from Andy (D869)! :rolleyes:

 

I'll have to raid the recycling box tonight for some old strips of cardboard and make one of those jigs.

 

Andy

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Mike was still doing it last I checked, or you can 3D print your own for basic seating stuff.

He sells on eBay as "mikeskits", and the auction text gives the impression that he's selling off the last of his stock. At the moment it doesn't look like he's got any seating available for sale, except bundled up with his carriage kits. Once my supply of his seating runs out it will be time for a 3d printing experiment.

Mike still has one moulding available on eBay for the princely sum of 1 pound plus P&P. It seems to have 7 bays with two different seat spacings so not quite what I'm after. I thought I'd have a bash at a 3D model instead and then canvas the wisdom of the RMWeb readership before sending money to Shapeways. You can see my efforts at http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/70207-2mmn-simple-coach-seats/. It's fair to say that this route is going to cost rather more though.

 

Regards, Andy

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  • 3 months later...

The H15 restaurant coach is now nearly done:

 

post-11879-0-54090900-1374083734_thumb.jpg

post-11879-0-33280700-1374083739_thumb.jpg

 

Applying the lining transfers to a partially panelled coach was an interesting challenge, and one I hope to not be repeating any time soon! I am not entirely sure about the lining above the windows - there should be a thin band of crimson above the lining, but the space available at this scale is just not enough. Perhaps I should have just left the top lining off, as at normal viewing distances it tends to blend in with the roof cantrail anyway.

 

One other change is that the bogies are now attached with bolts fixed to the coach body, and a nut underneath the bogie screwed in place, rather than the other way round. Testing showed that the nut is less likely to come unscrewed than having the bolt underneath.

 

You might also notice that the coach is riding fractionally higher on its bogies than in the previous unpainted photograph. This is a compromise to get it to go round curves at all - it is nearly as long as an Intercity Mark 3 coach, after all. I've just put a washer from the 2mm bogie etch in between the bogie and the coach, so it can always be lowered back down again.

 

Anyway, overall I'm very pleased to have produced something quite unusual. Hopefully Farish won't be including a H15 in their 2014 catalogue ...

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On 21/07/2013 at 14:24, D869 said:

Do you have enough for a layout yet?

The supply of coaches is not a major impediment to creating a layout, the one year old daughter and the house bought as a fixing-up project definitely are! At the moment modelling is really done in the odd free moment, which coaches are quite suited for - layout or even loco building would require rather more attention over long periods of time than I have. I will get there in the end ... 🙂

Edited by DavidK71
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  • 1 month later...

Today it was bright enough to photograph the D.69 toplight van third. I didn't manage to track down a photograph of a suitable left-handed example of this diagram to base the model on, so I've chosen to number it as W3398W, and will have to hope no photograph emerges showing 3398 as right-handed!

14221493674_3cee586b18_o.jpg

14241875843_48fc9600f1_o.jpg

 

As noted in an earlier post, I constructed the interior partitions by printing out a pattern on acetate with a laser printer, then painting it once assembled. I'm not entirely sure that this was a good idea, as when I came to finally assemble the coach I noticed a very slight but annoying downward bow in the resin roof in the centre, which I corrected by propping the roof up with plasticard. I suspect that if I'd just used the supplied etched partitions the roof would have been kept in shape by that.

 

This is the first complete Masterclass Models coach I've assembled, and I have to say that they are lovely kits. I haven't seen photographs of many other Masterclass toplights finished, so all I can say is that we should all dig them out of the to-do pile and get going ... 🙂

Edited by DavidK71
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On 16/09/2013 at 23:15, D869 said:

Superb job David.

 

I especially like the way that the top crimson band and lining appears to have been designed without these coaches in mind - just like the real thing!

 

We still need to work on your track though ;)

 

There might have been some cursing of Swindon for not just leaving off the top crimson band as I struggled to get the lining decals in place ...

 

I suspect you of trying to tempt me towards 2mm trackwork 🙂 However, for the moment I do have some code 40 fineTrax track on order for experimentation purposes. So many ideas to try, and so little time.

Edited by DavidK71
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  • 3 weeks later...
  • 7 months later...

Such a long time since the last post ... I have not been entirely idle, though. I have been working on an Ultima kit of the GWR O.13 milk brake, and I also have another project on the workbench.

 

First of all, I should say that I really don't need another ex-GWR restaurant coach. But ... when I got the sides for the H.15 restaurant coach from Bill Bedford, I noticed his range also included H.24 sides, so I couldn't resist getting a set of those too. Plus I have a weakness for more unusual coaches like sleepers and dinners. This is what I've got so far:

 

post-11879-0-45826000-1399926713_thumb.png

 

This is a real mixture of bits and pieces. The basics of it are built around an Ultima 70ft GWR coach floor and underframe, with Masterclass models battery boxes and 2mm Association bogies.

 

The gas cylinders under the floor I had printed by Shapeways in FUD, based on an STL file I generated with OpenSCAD. Similarly, the seating and surrounding structure was printed by Shapeways in WSF, the idea being to provide a lightweight interior and support for the ends and roof. The ends are those that came with the sides from Bill Bedford. As you can see, there's still a long way to go.

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  • 8 months later...

Only one post in 2014, and now it's 2015 already. How did that happen? So, not a lot got finished in 2014, but one vehicle did make it off the workbench: this odd little thing is an Etched Pixels O.13 GWR milk brake, in BR(W) crimson.

 

21859007322_fea01300b9_o.jpg

 

This consists of brass sides and ends overlaying a 3D printed shell, with an underframe made from a cut-and-shut of two Peco brake van underframes. While not in the same league as richbrummitt's 2mm reduction from a Blacksmith's kit (see http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/blog/416/entry-8241-back-of-the-queue-o13-milk-van-part-2/), it does look the part. If I were to do another I would try harder to get the 3D printed roof smoother (possibly with Halfords filler primer) and the rainstrips are a bit too prominent, but overall I am pleased with the finished result.

 

The H.24 restaurant car now has a complete body shell, and is just waiting for the weather to be warm enough for spraying in order to do the sides.

 

post-11879-0-07363100-1423428206_thumb.jpg

 

A new project is two TPM conversions of Dapol B-set coaches to a K.40 full brake and a C.60 third. So far this has got as far as remodelling the underframes and savaging the body shells - shown here is what will become the full brake. I am intending to build this as W1177W, which had one centre gangway and one offset gangway for use on TPO trains. There are two photographs of this coach in Kevin Robertson's "Great Western Coaches in Colour" with an L.25 sorting van behind it, for which I have an Etched Pixels kit that I will build one day.

 

post-11879-0-75717100-1423428412_thumb.jpg

 

The underframes needed quite a lot of work: removing one of the battery boxes and adding a new one, moving the vacuum cylinders and adding V hangers and dynamos. I now need to decide whether to add roof ribs to these coaches - it's hard to tell from photographs how visible they would have been in real life. Decisions, decisions ...

 

Finally, there's this, which I am rather pleased with:

 

post-11879-0-81824300-1423428847_thumb.jpg

 

While it doesn't look that exciting, this is a 2mm Association GWR Pressed Steel bogie, with N gauge wheels from Etched Pixels on 13mm axles. To get this to work I used NBrass pin point bearings, which are rather deeper than the usual 2mm Association bearings. The result doesn't run quite as smoothly as when used with 2mm Association wheels (possibly due to increased contact between the axle and the larger bearing), so there is more work to be done, but this is a promising answer to what I am going to do with all the Masterclass kits that I have that need Pressed Steel bogies, given the continued unavailability of N gauge coach wheels on 2mm Association axles.

Edited by DavidK71
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David,

 

Glad you're still going with this - I'm just starting out with an Etched Pixels Thompson CL and your earlier posts have been very informative and helpful - especially regarding paints and glue. Like you, I'm waiting for warmer weather to prime and paint the underframe and ends.

 

Did you try to keep the underframe clear of paint where it's inset to take the sides, or will the impact adhesive lock on to the paint anyway? I'm worried a lighter strip might show through.

 

In the meantime I need to drill for grab handles before rolling some curve into the sides - this is the bit I dread most!

 

Regards,

 

Roy

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