Any Question Answered

[Caley Jim]

Now, Stewart Hine built his own motor for that Small Prairie. That you might consider insane.

 

Chris

In those days there wasn't much option! If you couldn't shoehorn in a Minitrix or Tri-ang X500 you either built your own motor, tried to modify a continental N-gauge chassis or did without!

 

Jim

[2mmMark]

SECR coupled wheelbase 16'-6", 57xx wheelbase 15'-6" according to Wikipedia. The LMS Jinty has a 16'-6" wheelbase, but whether the rods are the same style is another matter.

 

To be honest, the cost of a new etch is not significant, and a custom one can cover things like balance weights and bufferbeam overlays (depending how big the cut-out for the N gauge coupling is).

 

The tender wheels should be do-able using the same process as the 4F. Unfortunately that project has been delayed due to Alan Smith having to spend a lot of time sorting out loco wheels, pcb sleepers and other products following the sad death of Bill Blackburn.

 

Andy

 

C Class has the same wheelbase as a Jinty but the rods are very slightly fishbellied.  There's a good drawing in Model Railway News, December 1968.  I have a scanned copy if required.

 

This drawing seems to exaggerate the shape somewhat:

 

A popular 2mm subject. It was the subject of an early 2mm whitemetal kit in the 1960s, Andrew Cox had the Jidenco(!) kit etched down from 4mm and Nick Tilston (N Brass) does a whitemetal/etched kit.

 

Incidentally, I think it's a little bit cheeky to describe building a motor as "insane". At the time Stewart Hine built his 45XX in the early 1960s, it was the only option.

 

Mark

[queensquare]

John Greenwood's three Beattie Well tanks ran with home made motors for years, only being replaced when he went DCC a decade or so ago.

 

Jerry

[Chris Higgs]

C Class has the same wheelbase as a Jinty but the rods are very slightly fishbellied.  There's a good drawing in Model Railway News, December 1968.  I have a scanned copy if required.

 

This drawing seems to exaggerate the shape somewhat:

 

A popular 2mm subject. It was the subject of an early 2mm whitemetal kit in the 1960s, Andrew Cox had the Jidenco(!) kit etched down from 4mm and Nick Tilston (N Brass) does a whitemetal/etched kit.

 

Incidentally, I think it's a little bit cheeky to describe building a motor as "insane". At the time Stewart Hine built his 45XX in the early 1960s, it was the only option.

 

Mark

 

The main difference is that the rods of a Jinty are fluted, whereas the C class are plain-fronted.

 

If you actually tried, I'll accept your opinion on building your own motor. I did actually try to follow the instructions on the Small Prairie, and I'm sticking with insane.

 

Chris

[Mr chapman]

Some very useful replies here already I would assume then if it was just a case of them being plain fronted rather than the available fluted I could flood them with a tiny bit of solder and gently file back? Looking at the Farish EP in the latest CC mag the coupling rods look huge compared to 2mm. Those well tanks really are superb little models!

Edited March 12, 2018 by Mr chapman

[Steven Draper]

Looking at photos of the preserved C class, the coupling rods 'fishbellied' look is very very subtle and it doesn;t look like the OO gauge model they bothered ! 

I think it will be a very popular loco, I'm going to get at least one so a coupling rod and detailing etch would be very useful 8^)

Will be placing an order for other bits later this week too - so hopefully not long and I can start making things in 2mm happen. 

Edited March 12, 2018 by Steven Draper

[2mmMark]

Some very useful replies here already I would assume then if it was just a case of them being plain fronted rather than the available fluted I could flood them with a tiny bit of solder and gently file back? Looking at the Farish EP in the latest CC mag the coupling rods look huge compared to 2mm. Those well tanks really are superb little models!

 

The Association rods are designed to be laminated so just fold them so the fluting is on the inside faces.

 

The main difference is that the rods of a Jinty are fluted, whereas the C class are plain-fronted.

 

If you actually tried, I'll accept your opinion on building your own motor. I did actually try to follow the instructions on the Small Prairie, and I'm sticking with insane.

 

Chris

 

I attempted to cut down a Minitrix motor which wasn't successful.  I did cut down a Fleischmann motor which went into the first Sentinel I built. That did work well.  I don't really know why I did it when Tenshodos were already available. I expect it was a Sunday afternoon and I wanted to build it  right  now as I had most of the other bits I needed. 

 

Inherited from Denys Brownlee, I have a tin of bits which was going to become a model of Viking (IoMR no. 17). There's a couple of partially complete handbuilt coreless motors but the actual chassis is using a readymade tiny can motor which had just become available.

 

Thankfully we now have lots of people out in the far east working in electric motor asylums.

[2mm Andy]

There's a good drawing in Model Railway News, December 1968.  I have a scanned copy if required.

 

A popular 2mm subject. It was the subject of an early 2mm whitemetal kit in the 1960s, Andrew Cox had the Jidenco(!) kit etched down from 4mm and Nick Tilston (N Brass) does a whitemetal/etched kit.

 

Mark

 

Thanks Mark - a copy of the drawing would be very useful.

 

Andy

[Valentin]

[...]

 

A popular 2mm subject. It was the subject of an early 2mm whitemetal kit in the 1960s, Andrew Cox had the Jidenco(!) kit etched down from 4mm and Nick Tilston (N Brass) does a whitemetal/etched kit.

 

[...]

 

I am so looking forward to get the Graham Farish Class C so I can replace mine (Alan Cox body kit on Fence Houses chassis):

 

[snitchthebudgie]

I'm trying to decide whether to take the plunge into 2mm.  I would start with a Wisbech & Upwell layout, using Farish O4 shunters with tram skirts.  So my question is, what is the minimum amount of work on the Farish wheels needed to get them through 2mm points?  I don't need full replacements, and cosmetics are not critical as the wheels are going to be hidden.  Cheers, Jon

[Kylestrome]

I'm trying to decide whether to take the plunge into 2mm.  I would start with a Wisbech & Upwell layout, using Farish O4 shunters with tram skirts.  So my question is, what is the minimum amount of work on the Farish wheels needed to get them through 2mm points?  I don't need full replacements, and cosmetics are not critical as the wheels are going to be hidden.  Cheers, Jon

 

Unscrew the crankpin nuts to remove the connecting rods. Take off the bottom plate to release the wheel sets. Send them off to the wheel turning service to get the flanges thinned and the wheels re-gauged.

 

When you get them back, re-assemble, tweak the contacts a bit and you're ready to go.

 

David

Edited March 13, 2018 by Kylestrome

[Chris Higgs]

Unscrew the crankpin nuts to remove the connecting rods. Take off the bottom plate to release the wheel sets. Send them off to the wheel turning service to get the flanges thinned and the wheels re-gauged.

 

When you get them back, re-assemble, tweak the contacts a bit and you're ready to go.

 

David

 

Of course, I hope you are aware that the body of W&U 04s is not like the Farish ones, which represent later 04s. Different number of compartments on the hood, different front grille, different cab. I was going to do the same conversion but gave up on it. Someone has done a nice 3D-print of the skirted 04s,  you can see it on another thread. Not sure if he is planning to offer it for sale though. 

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/8147-3d-printing-class-25-parts-also-class-2037-2mm-and-7mm-wagons-and-132-bogies/page-19

 

Chris

Edited March 13, 2018 by Chris Higgs

[snitchthebudgie]

Thanks! Though from photos the main differences are the front grille and cab - both easy to fix.  Jon

[Donw]

In those days there wasn't much option! If you couldn't shoehorn in a Minitrix or Tri-ang X500 you either built your own motor, tried to modify a continental N-gauge chassis or did without!

 

Jim

 

If I remember aright when I chatted to Stewart at the MRC exhibition at Central Hall neither the x500 or continental N gauge chassis existed. He had some bits and bits of clock gears from which he made the bits he needed. Wheels, Motors, Gears were all made by the modeller in those days. I think Stewart had the prairie in the showcase.

 

Don

[oily]

I used to have my locos and chassis under construction run themselves in on a length of track with a gap in the rail with a diode across the gap. Then a timer would reverse the current and the loco or chassis would run back. And so on all day and all night.

 

Problem is now I have gone DCC the track is AC and the system doesn't work. So my question is, how can I set up a shuttle system with DCC? I have a Digitrax DCS51 controller and an even older ZTC system that was really great but rather bulky and now stored in the loft!

 

Is it even possible without a massive amount of new electronics?

 

Oli

[Ian Morgan]

Not impossible, but you would probably need a PC running something like JMRI, and an interface to your DCC Command Station. Some sort of sensor at each end would be advisable too, although you could create a JMRI script that changed direction after a given time, and hope your loco does not speed up as it runs in.

[Crosland]

A Raspberry-Pi would be a good "PC" and sensors could be connected to the GPIO pins. JMRI already supports this, I believe.

 

A rolling road would be another option.

[2mmMark]

Of course, I hope you are aware that the body of W&U 04s is not like the Farish ones, which represent later 04s. Different number of compartments on the hood, different front grille, different cab. I was going to do the same conversion but gave up on it. Someone has done a nice 3D-print of the skirted 04s,  you can see it on another thread. Not sure if he is planning to offer it for sale though. 

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/8147-3d-printing-class-25-parts-also-class-2037-2mm-and-7mm-wagons-and-132-bogies/page-19

 

Chris

 

Allen Doherty (Worsley Works) has etches for the various types of 04, including the specific W&U version. Could be a useful source of parts for converting the Farish body. There will be a scale difference as Allen's are to 1:152, although he may have an option for 1:148 scale.

 

Building the complete body from the etch would be a gentle intro into etched kit assembly, it's not a complicated build.

 

Mark

[2mm Andy]

I used to have my locos and chassis under construction run themselves in on a length of track with a gap in the rail with a diode across the gap. Then a timer would reverse the current and the loco or chassis would run back. And so on all day and all night.

 

Problem is now I have gone DCC the track is AC and the system doesn't work. So my question is, how can I set up a shuttle system with DCC? I have a Digitrax DCS51 controller and an even older ZTC system that was really great but rather bulky and now stored in the loft!

 

Is it even possible without a massive amount of new electronics?

 

Oli

 

Would this do the job?

 

http://www.blocksignalling.co.uk/index.php/10-products/57-dcc-shuttle-sdcc1

 

Andy

[oily]

Would this do the job?

 

http://www.blocksignalling.co.uk/index.php/10-products/57-dcc-shuttle-sdcc1

 

Andy

Thanks Andy that's looks a possibility. I will invesigate that further.

I must confess to feeling extremely old and dated as Ian Morgam and Crosland (sorry don't know his first name) might well have been talking in a foreign language. JMRI, Raspberry-Pi, sensors, GPIO pins. I am totally lost, sorry guys, I've only just managed to fit a DCC decoder with some apprehension.

Oli

[queensquare]

Its ok Oli, you're not alone in not understanding all that stuff. I use a rolling road for running stuff in, works for DCC or analogue

 

 

Jerry

[justin1985]

Another part finished wagon that ended up with me was an LMS van (2-511). The blurb on the product page lists this as LMS van to diagrams D1808/D1812/D1830.

 

I followed the listings on the project page and ordered chassis 2-332 (10ft 2 shoe per side) and the steel solebar conversion kit 2-337 (17'6"). 

 

I don't have any reference materials for the LMS to hand, but looking at the photos on Paul Bartlett's site, all of the LMS vans of this body style (with minimal strapping) and all of those listed as D1812 or D1830 are vacuum fitted with clasp brakes (4 shoes per side). There are some similar but different body style vans with unfitted 9' wheelbase chassis. All of these photos are survivors in the late 60s to 90s so I realise they might not be representative! 

 

I can't see any pictures labelled as D1808, or find any other reference to it on the internet. Could anyone with the LMS wagon books check whether there was indeed a 10ft unfitted/2 shoe per side brake version of this van body style? Or do I in fact have to use a different chassis if I want to get it right?

 

Cheers

 

Justin

[oily]

Its ok Oli, you're not alone in not understanding all that stuff. I use a rolling road for running stuff in, works for DCC or analogue

 

IMG_1696.PNG

 

Jerry

Yes I thought of and even tried a rolling road, but although I found it fine for a tank, it was less satisfactory for a tender loco with tender drive.

Plus I like to get the bogie and tender wheels thoroughly run in too.

And it always looks so much more authentic watching a new creation running up and down some track rather than sitting stationary, albeit with revolving drivers.

Oli

[Nigelcliffe]

I used to have my locos and chassis under construction run themselves in on a length of track with a gap in the rail with a diode across the gap. Then a timer would reverse the current and the loco or chassis would run back. And so on all day and all night.

 

Problem is now I have gone DCC the track is AC and the system doesn't work. So my question is, how can I set up a shuttle system with DCC? I have a Digitrax DCS51 controller and an even older ZTC system that was really great but rather bulky and now stored in the loft!

 

Is it even possible without a massive amount of new electronics?

 

Oli

Cml electronics automatic shuttle device. Works with LocoNet (Digitrax).

 

There are many other ways.

[65179]

Another part finished wagon that ended up with me was an LMS van (2-511). The blurb on the product page lists this as LMS van to diagrams D1808/D1812/D1830.

 

I can't see any pictures labelled as D1808, or find any other reference to it on the internet. Could anyone with the LMS wagon books check whether there was indeed a 10ft unfitted/2 shoe per side brake version of this van body style? Or do I in fact have to use a different chassis if I want to get it right?

 

Cheers

 

Justin

Justin,

 

The diagram suggests these were built as hand brake only, through piped and fitted (all 10ft wb). That said all the pictures appear to be fitted vehicles and the example running numbers don't differentiate between fitted and unfitted.

 

Your alternative is to add a piece of diagonal strapping and use a 9ft unfitted underframe for D1832A.

 

Contact me via PM if you need more info.

 

Simon