doctorjbeam Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 Hi all, I'm building a series of Parkside Dundas ex LNER grain van kits, and would like to fit these with scale couplers and sprung buffers. However, I've got no flipping idea which buffers and couplers would be suitable! I'm hoping that RMWeb's hive mind would be able to recommend the suitable parts in dummy format - ie, manufacturer, product name...would a direct link to the products an online shop be asking too much? For those unfamiliar with the particular van I'm talking about, here's a drawing courtesy of Google Images and Stockton Modeller. Thanks everyone Michael. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwealleans Posted June 22, 2011 Share Posted June 22, 2011 Hi Michael, I've built a few of these over the years. The buffers are RCH standard for unfitted stock, 16" long and a 13" head. I think Alan Gibson may do a sprung version and MJT certainly do , but the most cost effective way to do them if you have a lot to do would be to use the LMS cast ones and replace the head with an MJT sprung replacement. Couplings are really a matter of personal choice; I use 3 links but if you want automatic coupling there are plenty of systems available to suit different people. Are you detailing them at all? Geoff Kent's wagon book volume 1 gives plenty of good advice which makes quite a difference to your finished model. I always ditch the floor and make a new one piece one and usually put a rocking unit on them as well, it makes a hell of a difference to the running. Most of mine were built for shunting on Thurston, though, where that is crucial. Are you modelling LNER or BR? Modelmaster do transfer packs for these in BR days which are pretty good. For the LNER period it's not so easy - only PowSides make any attempt at all the lettering and their transfer is too big to fit where it's supposed to go. I have contemplated commissioning some from John Peck and I may get round to that one day. If you want variety in a rake, it's surprisingly easy to convert to the first batch, which were to GWR diagram V25. The GWR ones were later rebuilt with different side framing and I've done one of those as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorjbeam Posted June 22, 2011 Author Share Posted June 22, 2011 Jonathan, Thanks very much for the data I'm modelling BR , already ordered the transfers. I'd like to detail these as much as possible, so I guess I'll be tracking down a copy of Geoff Kent's book this week! Cheers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennine MC Posted June 22, 2011 Share Posted June 22, 2011 The buffers are RCH standard for unfitted stock, 16" long and a 13" head. 18" long, to be pedantic. Which I can be However, I've got no flipping idea which buffers and couplers would be suitable! A question Michael; why do you think you need sprung buffers if you've not decided on couplings yet? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davefrk Posted June 22, 2011 Share Posted June 22, 2011 18" long, to be pedantic. Which I can be A question Michael; why do you think you need sprung buffers if you've not decided on couplings yet? I hope we're not going to have a 'debate' on the pros and cons of sprung buffers, I've heard all that before. Personally I don't see the point in sprung buffers if the wagon/coach/loco have RTR couplings and if the buffers are used then do they actually compress when buffering up, not very often. Having said that I do fit sprung buffers on a few wagons which are spread thoughout a long train length just to take the shock out of an emergency stop or over exuberance of the operator, it does work. I've seen many well known layouts where the goods stock have solid buffers and run without any problems, 'Mostyn' is one. On the other hand, I remember watching a lovely small GW layout shunting only for it to be spoilt by an operator trying to move wagons about and them just bouncing ahead of the loco by an inch or two..... Not very realistic. I can understand people wanting a turned steel head for finesse but with today's modern casting metals it would be hard to tell if the head was cast or steel once painted. As far as Lanarkshire Models goes, our solid buffers are selling well and yes we've had a few enquiries regarding sprung versions and we will do some selected ones eventually but for the moment the solid buffer range is still being developed. Hydraulics and pneumatics are next, if I can just get the time to finish the masters, make the moulds, do the packaging etc.etc. All the best, Dave Franks, www.lanarkshiremodels.com Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwealleans Posted June 22, 2011 Share Posted June 22, 2011 18" long, to be pedantic Hell, Ian, who am I to begrudge you an extra couple of inches? I have to say that Ian's question did cross my mind, but the OP was very specific on sprung buffers so I went with it. Personally I hardly ever spring the buffers on my wagon stock. The example above (almost certainly ABS buffers) has Sprat and Winkle couplings so the buffers are merely an adornment. I remember watching a lovely small GW layout shunting only for it to be spoilt by an operator trying to move wagons about and them just bouncing ahead of the loco by an inch or two..... Not very realistic. You can get odd effects and lack of realism with almost any system... I recall seeing Clarendon at Taunton, I think, last year... There was a small tank engine pulling a single wagon using AJ couplings. The wagon kept dropping behind the loco, springing back towards it when the two ends of the AJ met and then bouncing backwards again off the buffers of the loco. The effect was to oscillate rapidly backwards and forwards while moving up the yard - very odd. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wagonman Posted June 22, 2011 Share Posted June 22, 2011 I remember watching a lovely small GW layout shunting only for it to be spoilt by an operator trying to move wagons about and them just bouncing ahead of the loco by an inch or two..... Not very realistic. Could it have been that the wagons were not heavy enough and/or the springs not soft enough. Sprung buffers, when used with scale couplings, do help to reduce buffer locking when being propelled through reverse curves in particular. Well it works in P4 anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
billbedford Posted June 22, 2011 Share Posted June 22, 2011 On the other hand, I remember watching a lovely small GW layout shunting only for it to be spoilt by an operator trying to move wagons about and them just bouncing ahead of the loco by an inch or two..... Not very realistic. Obviously someone in need of working brake gear................... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorjbeam Posted June 22, 2011 Author Share Posted June 22, 2011 Sorry guys, maybe I wasn't 100% clear. I definitely want scale couplers of some form - not Kadees or tension locks - as I prefer the realism of them, even if it is only an illusion. As for sprung buffers, it's always been my understanding that 3 link / screw / instanter couplers work best with them. I've spent the early half of my modelling life building Australian kits to average quality, so I'm looking to do things "properly" My next question is regarding weights - what weight range should I be aiming for to ensure smooth running? Is there a standard I can defer to? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennine MC Posted June 22, 2011 Share Posted June 22, 2011 I hope we're not going to have a 'debate' on the pros and cons of sprung buffers, I've heard all that before. Personally I don't see the point in sprung buffers if the wagon/coach/loco have RTR couplings and if the buffers are used then do they actually compress when buffering up, not very often. That was pretty much going to be my point, Dave. Not only that but I've seen many folk on here ask what type of sprung buffers they want for a given selection of wagons, only to find that what they required was only available rigid. Faced with a choice between a buffer that was right for the vehicle, and an incorrect one that was sprung, to me it's a no-brainer. Hell, Ian, who am I to begrudge you an extra couple of inches? I bet you say that to all the boys My next question is regarding weights - what weight range should I be aiming for to ensure smooth running? Is there a standard I can defer to? You've been rummaging in the big bag of stock questions, havent you 25g per axle is what's usually quoted IIRC, a tad more wont hurt although it's not necessary IMHO to get too prescriptive about it as other factors also affect smooth running. I certainly wouldnt go too far below it though, over-light wagons behave like a flea in a fit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigwelsh Posted June 23, 2011 Share Posted June 23, 2011 The main thing with weights is sticking to an amount on 4 wheel stock otherwise you'll pull over a light wagon in the middle of a train going around a corner. I've got a pile of Larnarkshire buffers waiting to go in the club lathe to be drilled out for springing at the moment as the range has covered some specialized holes that existed in other ranges. Using AJs or 3-links for a lot of propelling they do make a difference in track holding moreso than sprung axles. Wagons flying off with too much momentum is more an effect of pin point bearings than sprung buffers which should dampen the effect. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwealleans Posted June 23, 2011 Share Posted June 23, 2011 I didn't grasp what you were asking about couplings either. I use Smiths, 3 link and screw on all my stock. i haven't ever modelled anything which needed instanters. They're slightly longer than other makes which helps buffer locking on our tight curves. The screw ones also don't suffer from the rigidity of perhaps more accurate looking ones like Romfords. You can also buy them in bits and make them up yourself if you're tight like me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorjbeam Posted June 23, 2011 Author Share Posted June 23, 2011 Brilliant answers - thanks for your help, fellas Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
70021 Morning Star Posted December 18, 2014 Share Posted December 18, 2014 Hello Guys, I've got a Hornby 9F that came with sprung buffers. Problem is that I need to temporarily remove them, so I can do some modifications to the loco chassis. Looking at the back of the buffers, it looks as though that 'retaining bulge' might be screwed in to a thread on the buffer. It doesn't look like it's a rivet. Anyone know if this is correct? Many thanks, Rick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian777999 Posted April 9, 2016 Share Posted April 9, 2016 I have also been thinking about sprung buffers as I intend to use 3 link couplers (or something similar ) on my kit built wagons. I want to build a number of the Dapol brake van kits and the Cambrian Dogfish and Catfish wagons. Are any of the sprung MJT buffers correct for these kits ? I realise that sprung buffers may be more trouble then they are worth but I need 3 link couplers and buffer lock is a problem in OO gauge. ...and I cannot post the links for some reason ! That often happen here and I do not know why ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hicksan Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 I just purchased some MJT sprung buffers to go in my Parkside Dundas plate wagons - those had plastic buffer heads that broke when my daughter dropped them. They look stunning but I have no idea how to fit them and no instructions were included. Does anyone know how to go about this? Thanks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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