Kinver Light Railway

[Wheeltapper]

As a long term project I have been gathering information on the Kinver Light Railway and the trams that were operated on it .

 

I have quite a lot of information and I think copies of all the booklets ever published about the line but I was wondering if anyone has actually ever built a model of the line or the stock used on it. I have come across references to models of individual trams being built but I dont know it they survive.

 

Had the line lasted it would have been a great preservation project. Sadly that didnt happen and all that is left is quite a well preserved stretch of trackbed between Stourton and Kinver , the inspection pits and some odd sections of rail on the site of the tram sheds at Hyde Woods and virtually all the tram sheds and depot buildings at the Stourbridge end of the line at Amblecote which are now in use as a Night Club.

 

 

If anyone has any information, plans or photos of any of the lines trams I would be most grateful if they would contact me.

[Andy Y]

I've never heard of anything being modelled Richard.

 

I've just tried to carry out a search for which of Ned Williams' books had several photos of the trams and points along the line to no avail. It was a book I had over 20 years ago but it may be something you've already seen of course.

[PLD]

As a model subject, there have been a couple of generic 'Black Country' lines but I can't think of a layout specifically of the Kinver LR. It should be interesting subject though because of the rural setting, through-running from other lines and the goods service operated using both open and closed 4-wheel trailers towed by the passenger cars.

 

With regard to rolling stock, were the 'Tividale' standard type (like Dudley & Stourbridge 5 at the Black Country Living Museum) used on the line? If so there is a 4mm white metal kit available from PD Marsh and a card kit I think in both 4mm and 7mm scales.

[Weekday Cross]

I seem to remember there is a model of one of the trams in the museum at Crich.

[melmerby]

In it's heyday cars would go to Kinver from all over the Black country and Birmingham for Bank Holidays so quite a variety of stock possible.

 

DS cars 63-68 (used on KLR) were rebuilt from City of Birmingham Tramways cable cars (CoB 257-262)

There is a picture in "Tramways of the West Midlands" (LRTA) of a couple of these plus DS car 56 at Kinver terminus.

 

Kinver was an interesting tramway as it started as a street tramway, went onto a reserved roadside track and then struck off across the fields on sleepered track with wooden overhead poles.

 

Keith

[Poggy1165]

I seem to recall a layout plan for Kinver in one of the old railway modelling mags. Not sure which but definitely not RM or MRJ. One of the more obscure publications and at least 20 years ago.

[Wheeltapper]

I've never heard of anything being modelled Richard.

 

I've just tried to carry out a search for which of Ned Williams' books had several photos of the trams and points along the line to no avail. It was a book I had over 20 years ago but it may be something you've already seen of course.

 

Hi Andy

 

The problem is that Ned Williams has written more than 40 local history books about the Black Country so without knowing the book title it will be quite a task to find any relevant pictures..

 

Books I do have about the KLR or which contain quite a bit of information are

 

 

 

The Kinver Light Railway by Susan Swingle and Keith Turner - 1st edition published 1974 ,Oakwood Press

 

The Kinver Light Railway by Susan Swingle and Keith Turner - 2nd edition published 1987 Oakwood Press

 

Tramways of the Black Country , Company Operated Lines of South Staffordshire and North Worcestershire by J S Webb 1954

 

Black Country Tramways Volume 1 1872-1912 by J S Webb 1974

 

Black Country Tramways Volume 2 by J S Webb 1976 (Includes Kidderminster and Stourport Systems)

 

The Webb books are extremeley detailed and a comprehensive history of trams in the Black Country.

 

 

Does anybody know of any other titles which contain KLR information ? I have found quite a lot of stuff on the web especially local history sites and have been pleased to learn there are at least a couple of models of actual trams from the line in existance in the larger scales.

[Andy Y]

I have found quite a lot of stuff on the web especially local history sites

 

Feel free to share the links to what you've found so far so that folks know if they come across anything else.

 

I've sent a message to Ned to see if I can find that title for you.

 

 

 

[PLD]

I seem to recall a layout plan for Kinver in one of the old railway modelling mags. Not sure which but definitely not RM or MRJ. One of the more obscure publications and at least 20 years ago.

'Model Trains' (The Airfix Branded/Supported Mag) March 1981 edition has a Tramway theme, including a Kinver inspired layout plan titled 'On the Edge of the Black Country'...

 

(Just stumbled accross it looking for a specific pic of another tram!)

[Engineer_London]

Already shared these tentatively with Wheeltapper, the fruits of my layout research in recent years:

 

http://www.petergould.co.uk/local_transport_history/fleetlists/tramways/kinver1.htm

 

http://www.qlhs.org.uk/oracle/kinver-railway/kinver-railway.htm

 

http://kinvervillage.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=94&Itemid=111

 

http://www.blackcountrygenealogyandfamilyhistory.co.uk/134959.htm

 

http://www.search.staffspasttrack.org.uk/engine/theme/default.asp?theme=286&originator=%2Fengine%2Ftheme%2Fdefault%2Easp&page=1&records=53&direction=2&pointer=13239&text=0&offset=12

 

http://www.robertdarlaston.co.uk/Trams.htm

 

While researching another light railway last year in Stafford Archive, I took the chance to get copies of the 25" OS plan [1920s era] for the area which provided some layout information and took me to the stage of working out feasible modules.

[Andy Y]

Thanks Charles!

 

I've not seen any tramway modelling capture a scene like this http://www.blackcountrygenealogyandfamilyhistory.co.uk/mediac/450_0/media/3bd2767eb7a7e8fffff828dd4355564.jpg , very appealing from the scenic modellers point of view.

 

I was silly to have overlooked staffspasttrack as I use it a lot and this image http://www.search.staffspasttrack.org.uk/content/images/69/70/Resource/13796-0.jpg was certainly in the book I'd mentioned previously.

[Wheeltapper]

Thanks Charles!

 

I've not seen any tramway modelling capture a scene like this http://www.blackcoun...28dd4355564.jpg , very appealing from the scenic modellers point of view.

 

I was silly to have overlooked staffspasttrack as I use it a lot and this image http://www.search.st...rce/13796-0.jpg was certainly in the book I'd mentioned previously.

 

 

The first picture or rather one very similar was what got me interested in the KLR in the first place as we used to moor our narrowboat at this exact spot many a weekend. There are a number of versions of this view by different postcard photographers with different types of tram so its been considered a photogenic spot for a long time. The scene eighty years on is still almost exactly the same with the obvious exception of the track and tramcar having gone but the beech trees are still there and the trackbed is very clear.

 

A short distance away behind the photographer was the Hyde Depot - I was fascinated to learn from Charles that on closure the tram sheds were purchased by a local farm , moved and re-erected. Obviously begs the question "Do they still exist" ?

 

There are other KLR pictures on staffspasttrack but take a little finding.

[Pugsley]

I went down that stretch of canal a couple of years ago and had no idea that there used to be a tramway that ran alongside. Fascinating stuff.

[PLD]

'Model Trains' (The Airfix Branded/Supported Mag) March 1981 edition has a Tramway theme, including a Kinver inspired layout plan titled 'On the Edge of the Black Country'...

 

And by total coincidence there is a copy on E-bay now!

 

(usual disclaimer, no connection etc etc)

[Wheeltapper]

During the course of research into the Kinver Light Railway I have come across reference to the fact that under the 1898 Light Railway Order the company was obliged to provide certain services to the surrounding area.

 

In the case of the KLR this provision included an early morning workmans service and for carriage of freight generated along the route. The workers service was straightforward but as the line passed through an agricultural area for much of its route the carriage of agricultural produce and livestock also needed to be undertaken.

 

There was a good trade in milk in churns being taken from Kinver and places enroute through to Dudley on the connecting system for bottling and distribution and a special Milk Tram Car was adapted for the purpose. Small livestock and produce would not have been a problem (indeed there was a good trade in pigeon traffic and horticultural produce in small quantities) but the tram company also had mileage rates for carrying horses , bulls , oxen , cattle , goats etc but no vehicles that could carry them as you certainly could not put a horse on an ordinary tram.

 

I presume if a farmer had turned up at Kinver with a Prize Bull the tram company would be obliged under the Light Railway Order to accept it as legitimate freight. There is no evidence to suggest this ever actually happened on the KLR but it got me wondering if this was a unique situation or if there were tram company systems in other parts of the country where freight and livestock movement was undertaken on a large scale and if there were in fact trams built or adapted for freight or livestock movement.

 

If so it would provide interesting alternative operating possibilities for some tram layouts.

 

Anyone know ?

[PLD]

I presume if a farmer had turned up at Kinver with a Prize Bull the tram company would be obliged under the Light Railway Order to accept it as legitimate freight. There is no evidence to suggest this ever actually happened on the KLR but it got me wondering if this was a unique situation or if there were tram company systems in other parts of the country where freight and livestock movement was undertaken on a large scale and if there were in fact trams built or adapted for freight or livestock movement.

While several tramways did issue rates for some types of freight, the vehicles and facilities to actually handle freight were very few and far between, what goods traffic there was normally being carried on the ordinary service cars...

 

The only tramway livestock vehicle I can think of is the Manx Electric Cattle Car converted from one on the 10-13 series semi-open passenger cars (another became a freight motor and the other two freight trailers)

[Wheeltapper]

I always forget the MER for some reason although I travelled on it a lot in the 1960's.

.

I have seen mention of a dedicated Express Parcels Service Tram that operated in the Tipton area.

[Engineer_London]

Forgot to add links to the Crich museum collection of postcards and pictures:

 

http://www.tramway.co.uk/our-collections/101/our-collections

 

One example:

 

http://www.tramway.co.uk/photos/150/14974.jpg

 

Suggest searching both collections for Dudley and for Stourbridge, and some useful Kinver line pictures will appear.

 

On the Parcels Express, I think there is an image of one of the vehicles in the LRTA West Midlands book.

[Andy Y]

I must have been wrong on the Ned Williams trail. He emailed me back last night:

 

there are two reasonable books on the Kinver Light Railway. One is in the Oakwood Press series, the other is by Paul Collins, I think...

These will tell you all you need etc...

Best Wishes

 

[Wheeltapper]

I must have been wrong on the Ned Williams trail. He emailed me back last night:

 

 

 

 

 

 

Not to worry Andy - it was a very logical suggestion . One of the problems looking for info on the odd or more unusual lines is that usually 50% or more leads or ideas are dead ends or non starters.

 

Charles came up with a couple of book possibilities one of which it transpires was written by Dr Paul Collins and I have one on order so will post details should it transpire it contains much information.

[Engineer_London]

Having remembered to mention the Crich on-line collections of pictures and postcards, one image in there was worth a second look, as a little bit of lineside character:

 

http://www.tramway.co.uk/our-collections/87/photo-library-picture/6533/

 

It had to be on the street track section of the route, and thanks to Google [and provided I've copied the computer link properly], it turns out to be on the western edge of Wollaston, on the Bridgnorth Road:

 

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=Stourbridge+DY8&hl=en&ll=52.460834,-2.173727&spn=0,0.013754&sll=53.800651,-4.064941&sspn=13.26154,28.168945&t=h&z=16&layer=c&cbll=52.460786,-2.173534&panoid=LmR-hMPLgw5N3YVKQGjdDg&cbp=12,279.57,,0,-4.64

[Wheeltapper]

Having remembered to mention the Crich on-line collections of pictures and postcards, one image in there was worth a second look, as a little bit of lineside character:

 

http://www.tramway.c...y-picture/6533/

 

It had to be on the street track section of the route, and thanks to Google [and provided I've copied the computer link properly], it turns out to be on the western edge of Wollaston, on the Bridgnorth Road:

 

http://maps.google.c...279.57,,0,-4.64

 

 

 

The location is known as The Ridge at Wollaston and its more or less the summit of the climb up from Amblecote and start of the descent down towards Stewponey . The line changed from a normal street tramway with inset track to a roadside tramway with sleepered track in this vicinity.

[Engineer_London]

Had a chance to divert from a recent journey and make a flying visit to the Kinver area, including a taking a look in at the local model engineering society which is sited in the village.

 

One overhead support pole remains from the KLR, and it's an untypical metal one, near the site of the Stewponey Inn:

 

Referring back to a previously-mentioned image link:

 

http://www.blackcountrygenealogyandfamilyhistory.co.uk/mediac/450_0/media/3bd2767eb7a7e8fffff828dd4355564.jpg

 

The probable modern equivalent views from the canal bank are:

[Wheeltapper]

I had heard rumours about another book about the Kinver Light Railway but any further information eluded me until one of my regular trawls through Amazon revealed a newly listed copy.

 

Entitled BY TRAM TO KINVER , a booklet would better describe it as it only has 22 pages , it was published in 1980 by a Kinver based business named Elda Publications and was written by D M Bills , E and W R Griffiths priced 70p.

 

 

Not much new on the information side but a number of photographs that I have certainly not seen before from private individuals and former members of staff from the line. One picture showed a large gang of men replacing bullhead rail with grooved girder tramway rails, I believe this was a condition imposed following the initial inspection of the line to allow the line to open as it was thought that the different profile of tramcar wheels from railway wheels would make the trams more prone to derailment on bullhead track.

 

One other interesting fact was that the last of the trackbed bridges to be removed was not dismantled until 1979 nearly fifty years after the line closed.

[Wheeltapper]

.

 

A short distance away behind the photographer was the Hyde Depot - I was fascinated to learn from Charles that on closure the tram sheds were purchased by a local farm , moved and re-erected. Obviously begs the question "Do they still exist" ?

 

 

 

 

A friend of mine went Tram Shed hunting earlier in the week and I am pleased to report that he found the Hyde Tram Depot in its new location. He said he and his brother got talking to the farmer who currently owns the building.

 

According to the farmer the depot buildings remained in situ when the line close in 1930 until 1947 when they were purchased by a firm from Brierley Hill , dismantled , moved and re-erected on their new site.As there never was any road access to the site of the depot the recovery of the building must have been an interesting excercise. The new owners ran an abbatoir business and imported livestock from Ireland so the building was used for the animals to recover from their journey before being sent for slaughter to supply butchers shops in the Black Country.

 

The buildings are now used as a stables complex on a farm about three miles from Hyde . They are quite recognisable although much of the corrugated cladding is " well past its sell by date" and the only major change is the addition of leanto extensions on each side of the building. Interestingly these have been supported on cast iron columns which predate the tram sheds by some time and are thought to date from around 1820.