Pennine MC Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Can we expect a U-turn of political proportions, then? Constantly: http://www.pakfiles.com/watch-video/MTQ3MDg=/Fast-Show-Indecisive-Dave 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
micklner Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 quote Because you can buy them off Hattons, and generally Hattons only photograph models when they come into stock. Ah generally I have no idea if they use their own pics or not. I am sure some more pics will appear soon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tom F Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 (edited) quote Because you can buy them off Hattons, and generally Hattons only photograph models when they come into stock. Ah generally I have no idea if they use their own pics or not. I am sure some more pics will appear soon Well they came in stock today, and that's when the pics appeared, so I'd say they are the production models. As soon as mine arrives, I'll posts some pics gents Edited December 8, 2011 by Tom F Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Ah generally I have no idea if they use their own pics or not. I am sure some more pics will appear soon I am telling you Dave, they do indeed use their own photographs! Look here: Hornby B1 on Hattons Constantly: http://www.pakfiles....Indecisive-Dave You know, it's not far off...!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted December 8, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 8, 2011 (edited) The Hornby one is nice but for some reason it just doesn't quite do it for me. It just somehow looks too nice and "ornate" for such an anonymous class of locomotive. Might just be the weathering but the Bachmann one looks a lot more rugged and workmanlike. Agree with you there bluex5. I found the same kind of thing with the 4MTs a few years back. The Hornby 4MT had the finer detail, but seemed a bit "clinical" with its shiny valve gear etc. Maybe the same thing here - VERY subjective! The dirtier Bachy looks the biz. Got a few of each version of 4MT and will get at least one of each B1, so it doesn't really matter I suppose. In the end as long as both types perform and chug round my layout I will be a happy chappy. Jeff Edited December 8, 2011 by Physicsman 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
D605Eagle Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Damn it..I was hoping that the D49 would have been delivered with it...that Chrimbo's plans at sea then..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timara Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 It has to be conceded, despite my preferences and budgeting...the Hornby B1 really does look rather smashing in the Hattons pics. The Bachmann B1 looks good too, but there is that extra finesse that, being objective, one cannot deny is there on the Hornby B1... Can we expect a U-turn of political proportions, then? Surely not...? Got to say, having now looked further at the Hattons pics, it's still not readily obvious how it's coupled together. I'll be interested to see pics once someone has one, purely to see if the thing is divisible or not. Trust me to have picked a subject to model that requires a self-weighing tender..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Damn it..I was hoping that the D49 would have been delivered with it...that Chrimbo's plans at sea then..... Still a week to go! I was pretty sure that the promotional pic showing the B1, B17 and suburbans had it in green, but then that may have been computer edited Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deltic Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Hornby Bis have arrived - well R2998, R2998X, R2999 & R2999X. Along with some more Gresley Suburbans in teak. There are a few at John Dutfield's in Chelmsford Essex (01245) 494455. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted December 9, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 9, 2011 quote Because you can buy them off Hattons, and generally Hattons only photograph models when they come into stock. Ah generally I have no idea if they use their own pics or not. I am sure some more pics will appear soon Kernow do use their own pictures of models - especially new models - and they are in photos in this week's newsletter so Kernow have definitely got some in stock. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tom F Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 (edited) Evening Gents. Just got back from the NRM to find a locomotive shaped box awaiting me at the neighbours, posted from Merseyside. Could only be one thing. The Hornby B1 really is a fine looking loco, and all I will say is the new packaging does the job...very much like the Bachmann new packaging, everything was intact, no bits missing. Have not tested yet, with my layout not being wired yet, but will hopefully being run in on Wednesday (as long as great northern is happy with that) The coupling between loco and tender has two settings as the photo shows and I notice a faint seam on either side of the smokebox and boiler...prototypical I'm guessing not, but it's not over the top like on the underside of the A2 boiler. Anyhow I will shut up, and let the pictures do the talking! I apologize now as the photos aren't the greatest of quality. Edited December 9, 2011 by Tom F 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 The RCTS green book says the same chimney was fitted to Thompson's L1 2-6-4T's.....So Hornby already had the chimney! A thing prominent by their absense from the B1 are smokebox wrapper rivets. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Thanks Tom for the pics. Not as sure now about the Hornby B1. Not sure what it is, but that front on pic of yours Tom is making me think "hmm?" Something looks off other than the chimney, but I can't put my finger on it yet. Will take some time to ponder. The chimney is such a missed opportunity - I note a wonderful rendition of the bottom half, complete with rivets (bolts?) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tom F Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 The RCTS green book says the same chimney was fitted to Thompson's L1 2-6-4T's.....So Hornby already had the chimney! A thing prominent by their absense from the B1 are smokebox wrapper rivets. Hmm good point Coach, interesting they added those rivets on the L1.....hmmmm Not sure what it is that doesn't look right to you Simon about the front end. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 (edited) Just worked it out - look at the smokebox straps. Now look at the real thing, then look at Bachmann's, then Hornby's. Hornby's one may reflect a particular condition, but I thought with the short smokebox straps, there would be visible rivets. EDIT - I'll say this - looking at the picture of Mayflower I have linked to, its chimney is a perfect match for the one Hornby have fitted. So there is a precedent for that type after all! Edited December 9, 2011 by S.A.C Martin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tom F Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Just worked it out - look at the smokebox straps. Now look at the real thing, then look at Bachmann's, then Hornby's. Hornby's one may reflect a particular condition, but I thought with the short smokebox straps, there would be visible rivets. EDIT - I'll say this - looking at the picture of Mayflower I have linked to, its chimney is a perfect match for the one Hornby have fitted. So there is a precedent for that type after all! You know it had crossed my mind if Mayflower had been used as the basis for this....seen as the other B1 is in bits, I'm wondering, with so many small variations within the class, that being rivetless is prototypical, seen as, like Coachman has shown, Hornby did those little details on the L1. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tom F Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Also, the thing that had a few concerned regarding the tender coupling, the loco and tender CAN be detached, remove DCC plug and screws 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete55 Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 And the really good news is it has 3mm diameter axles..........Gibsons already do the right wheel with 3mm axles....... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timara Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Just worked it out - look at the smokebox straps. Now look at the real thing, then look at Bachmann's, then Hornby's. Hornby's one may reflect a particular condition, but I thought with the short smokebox straps, there would be visible rivets. EDIT - I'll say this - looking at the picture of Mayflower I have linked to, its chimney is a perfect match for the one Hornby have fitted. So there is a precedent for that type after all! Simon, Do you have The Power of the B1s by any chance? If not, I'd say that the vast majority of the photographs in it show B1s with rivet-less smokebox door straps. I was going to say that it appeared to be clear-cut between NBL and "company" works builds as to the difference, but soon found an early NBL machine with rivets, so that idea got thrown out! I'd probably go so far as to say the Hornby model caters for a goodly proportion of the class, rather than the entire thing (obviously, given smokebox door differences, for starters). Cheers, Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 The following pictures of Mayflowers chimney are not conclusive evidence. But if Hornby has blindly followed details on the preserved loco, then it is time the company employed someone who knew what he was doing. Actually I think Hornby has just made a booby. Afterall, the smokebox rivets are there for all to see! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timara Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 The following pictures of Mayflowers chimney are not conclusive evidence. But if Hornby has blindly followed details on the preserved loco, then it is time the company employed someone who knew what he was doing. Actually I think Hornby has just made a booby. Afterall, the smokebox rivets are there for all to see! On 1306, yes. However, referring to the book I've mentioned above, already I have found several exhibiting countersunk flush riveted smokeboxes (and quite clearly so at that!). One would expect/hope that Hornby have made preparations in their tooling to do the riveted version. Only one way of finding out I suppose! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium great northern Posted December 9, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 9, 2011 I decided it was time to get out the RCTS Green book, which gives the following information:- "The smokeboxes on the engines built by NB Loco co were all welded. The remainder had riveted seams." 1138 was a NB engine, so it seems Hornby have got that detail right. However, RCTs also tells us that "smokeboxes were frequently exchanged in the works, so the above notes can be little more than a guide to the origin of the different varieties". We are back to the old adage. Find a good reliably dated photo or photos of the loco you wish to model! As to chimneys' RCTS says "The chimney ...was the pattern which Gresley had introduced ..... for class 02." It also appeared on K4 01 K1 and as already pointed out, L1. However it goes on " The profile of of the chimneys on 61360-99 built by the NB Loco Co was slightly different in that the uppermost part of the cap was taller." There is a photo (fig 215) in Part 2B. I wouldn't like to say whether the Hornby chimney is that one, my eyes aren't good enough,but it could be, and of course that might well be because 1306 acquired one of the chimneys from the later batch at some time. As I said earlier, it's a minefield! Hope this furthers the discussion a bit. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tom F Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 (edited) Thanks for that Gilbert, I'm sure we all appreciated that Makes a lot more sense of things! How could any of us doubted Hornby!! Edited December 9, 2011 by Tom F Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
D605Eagle Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 (edited) Its a fine looking model for sure, the rendition of all the detail parts is quite breathtaking, but I'm just left thinking this should be a B16, or any other of the many classes we don't have.....a wasted and missed oppotunity. Jim Edited December 9, 2011 by D605Eagle Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverlink Posted December 9, 2011 Share Posted December 9, 2011 Come on lads, give Hornby a chance! have just purchased a couple from my local model shop & I think they're great. When I look back to the 60's & even the 80's at what we had then there is no comparison with the models of today. It just shows how far ready to run has come on when you're arguing over the amount of rivets on a chimmny! Let me ask you this, how many original bits are there still left on Flying Scotsman? how many loco's came out of Doncaster after general repair with other loco parts fitted? hundreds I would say. silverlink 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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