DJM Dave Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 Why not? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
two tone green Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 With how long a wait Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian Knowles Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 Why would a manufacturer duplicate another? For the same reasons that Dapol decided to produce a 4mm Western when there is already one out there from Heljan. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fay Posted November 28, 2012 Author Share Posted November 28, 2012 Why not? O gauge is a much smaller market, That said there are two £2000 plus models of A4s available but I doubt they are built in the same numbers and they are built when there is enough interest to warrant there construction. looking at the Dapol 4mm version im sure that they you, would do a superb job but this is not 00 gauge. If we was to simply wait and see what Dapol are going to do by the time any announcement is made any chance of getting a Heljan model would be long gone. I dont think there are many who model in O who would simply sell on older models like you (modellers in general) and indeed I did in 00 gauge and purchase the newer model. Dapols entry in to O gauge is great its what a lot of us 7mm modellers have been waiting for for a long time. I have an 08 on order and im looking forward to seeing what you produce in the future, But as for the western would it be good to confirm Dapols intention now so we can make our mind up on which model to purchase, ( I would consider both ) or stop the speculation now and concentrate on the things you do intend on building. On a few forums there are some who truly believe Dapol are going to do a 7mm western and have taken it as Gospel. So what Im trying to say is come on Dave put us all out of our misery before we spend £450 on a model we might just not want if there is one coming from Chirk. This is not a dig at Dave or Dapol so please dont misunderstand it as being so. I think Dapol should be highly commended for there entry in to the O gauge market. I personally think the O gauge market is different to the OO market from a modellers point of view and as an ex retailer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
frobisher Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 But as for the western would it be good to confirm Dapols intention now so we can make our mind up on which model to purchase, ( I would consider both ) or stop the speculation now and concentrate on the things you do intend on building. If I were Dapol I'd certainly not make any form of commitment one way or the other until it's totally clear what kind of job Heljan had made of it. If Heljan ultimately "fall short" would that necessarily mean that Dapol would leap in immeadiately as well? Wouldn't it be better to wait for the Heljan stock to clear out of the market place first with no prospect of a rerun and then leap in with an improved model? A bogied diesel is a very different animal to the (effectively) tank engines that Dapol are initially producing, so it may be better for them to experiment with another (currently unavailable) diesel first (I'll call Class 66 now for posterity... ). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
two tone green Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 Nice one Steve but I doubt Dave or Dapol will announce what their intentions are any time soon. Now there's a challenge. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJM Dave Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 Hi chaps, I won't post anymore after this mail to play fair with Heljan. Dapol won't announce a class 52 until we are happy to do so. With so many coming to the Dapol stand over the weekend after visiting the Heljan stand and asking for a 52 based on our OO version it is quite possible. I suppose it might also depend on delivery times as well. I seem to remember Brian saying here last week, or the week before that it was delayed until autumn 2013. If that's the case I can see a market for a £300.00-£350..00 RRP Dapol version and soon! 2 things are for sure........... 1) We won't bow like we did with the DP2 project if we decide to do it, and 2) The future of O gauge has never looked rosier. Cheers Dave Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
two tone green Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 Back on topic then, looking forward to seeing my future purchase at Reading this Saturday. Hope it arrives safe and sound with your Brian. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fay Posted November 28, 2012 Author Share Posted November 28, 2012 Hi chaps, I won't post anymore after this mail to play fair with Heljan. Dapol won't announce a class 52 until we are happy to do so. With so many coming to the Dapol stand over the weekend after visiting the Heljan stand and asking for a 52 based on our OO version it is quite possible. I suppose it might also depend on delivery times as well. I seem to remember Brian saying here last week, or the week before that it was delayed until autumn 2013. If that's the case I can see a market for a £300.00-£350..00 RRP Dapol version and soon! 2 things are for sure........... 1) We won't bow like we did with the DP2 project if we decide to do it, and 2) The future of O gauge has never looked rosier. Cheers Dave Couldnt have asked for a better answer. Thanks Dave. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Downendian Posted November 28, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 28, 2012 Unfortunately Heljan have a track record of not responding to clear errors pointed out with their preproduction models. I remember with pain the 4mm Western evolution and the disappointment when the model appeared. I very much want to reserve judgement until the 2nd version appears, but if there's a head to head with Dapol here I know where my money is going. Neil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fay Posted November 28, 2012 Author Share Posted November 28, 2012 Hopefully with Brian on board Heljan might take the recommendations on board. I cant say of any other time that they have done a second sample prototype so quickly like they have done with this one. I hope they get it right, For me this is the main Diesel along with the Warship for my project. I dont mind detailing it as Ive said before especially if JLTRT do release a detailing pack for it and of course a repaint and Severn mill plates. D1000 & D1015. then when Dapol release theres I will add a maroon and green one to go with them Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomstaf Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 If I were Dapol I'd certainly not make any form of commitment one way or the other until it's totally clear what kind of job Heljan had made of it. If Heljan ultimately "fall short" would that necessarily mean that Dapol would leap in immeadiately as well? Wouldn't it be better to wait for the Heljan stock to clear out of the market place first with no prospect of a rerun and then leap in with an improved model? A bogied diesel is a very different animal to the (effectively) tank engines that Dapol are initially producing, so it may be better for them to experiment with another (currently unavailable) diesel first (I'll call Class 66 now for posterity... ). I think some competition might get HJ to think about upping their game. Their O gauge range all seems a bit hit and miss ranging from wrong to good but no excellent as yet. Most frustratingly it's usually a fundamental shape that turns out wrong, rather than omitting a detail. Whilst they latter is frustrating it's extremely hard to rectify incorrect body shapes. Constructive criticism seems to fall on deaf ears, and if it isn't, then they're certainly not being clear about why they may be having to make such fundamental tooling compromises. Whatever the reason complacency is the current flavour. There is nothing like a bit of stiff competition to sharpen the mind. I would only hope that Dapol can, like other companies have done in 4mm, take the 7mm market forward. Cheers Tom Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancer1027 Posted November 29, 2012 Share Posted November 29, 2012 Hi, i hav'nt posted on here for ages. But thought that i would let Dapol/Dave aware there may be quite a few modellers of 7mm waiting to see if they bring out a Western. Going on the accuracy of the OO version and some of the in-accuracies with the Heljan i certainly would go for Dapol. Mind you if they are to be priced £300-£350 then possibly i would have 3 or 4. Cheers Rob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill Dyson (onslaught832) Posted November 29, 2012 Share Posted November 29, 2012 Hi, i hav'nt posted on here for ages. But thought that i would let Dapol/Dave aware there may be quite a few modellers of 7mm waiting to see if they bring out a Western. Going on the accuracy of the OO version and some of the in-accuracies with the Heljan i certainly would go for Dapol. Mind you if they are to be priced £300-£350 then possibly i would have 3 or 4. Cheers Rob From what I've seen on another forum, the response to the pics of the Heljan Western at Warley was decidedly luke warm, I will however reserve judgment until the Heljan is in the shops. I would Like to see the windscreen radius below the cab peak correcting, some relief to the sandboxes, the lip around the buffer beam adding & a non visible join between the front valance & bodyshell (or better still, it attached to the body) I fear if Heljan do not listen to their customers, they may will be left behind by Dapol. Cheers Phill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Downendian Posted November 29, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 29, 2012 If I were Dapol I'd certainly not make any form of commitment one way or the other until it's totally clear what kind of job Heljan had made of it. If Heljan ultimately "fall short" would that necessarily mean that Dapol would leap in immeadiately as well? Wouldn't it be better to wait for the Heljan stock to clear out of the market place first with no prospect of a rerun and then leap in with an improved model? A bogied diesel is a very different animal to the (effectively) tank engines that Dapol are initially producing, so it may be better for them to experiment with another (currently unavailable) diesel first (I'll call Class 66 now for posterity... ). I fear you've underestimated DapolDave's affliction for WR hydraulics, speaking as a fellow sufferer. I wouldn't bet against all WR hydraulics appearing in 7mm from the Dapol stable in the next few years - something nice in front of their milk tanks. I'm going to sign off on further Heljan/Dapol speculation until we hear from Brian on the Heljan mkII prepro model. Neil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Downendian Posted December 2, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 2, 2012 Brian has just posted mark 2 preproduction images here http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/60544-Heljan-7mm-western-due-for-imminent-release/page__st__25 Neil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BR_Blue_1986 Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 If they could cut the price to 3-350, that would certainly make Heljan ask questions. As for upping the model to 7mm, could the same be done with the grid? There are a lack of grids in kits, and goin by your n gauge model, I think a 56 would be great in 7mm.. And I for one would have at least 2! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian daniels Posted December 26, 2012 Share Posted December 26, 2012 I have now painted the second sample that Heljan sent over. Thought I would do it in maroon with a full yellow end as they are not going to do this version in the production run. Think I might weather it in due course. Trust me to photograph the end with only one headboard clip. The other is on the high sea's between here and China as it was not there when we got hold of this model. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
two tone green Posted December 26, 2012 Share Posted December 26, 2012 Looking good Brian. Thanks for showing us what a nice model we are getting. Would happily skip the 31 for the Western. Will you be at the Bristol show with it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
two tone green Posted December 26, 2012 Share Posted December 26, 2012 any chance of a loan for gauging trials . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian daniels Posted December 26, 2012 Share Posted December 26, 2012 It will be there with me. Of coarse you may try it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
two tone green Posted December 26, 2012 Share Posted December 26, 2012 See you in Bristol. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Tomlinson Posted December 26, 2012 Share Posted December 26, 2012 Looks magnificent and a fabulous paint job. One small query - I'm wondering if the headcode box is still a smidge low and if so would this be corrected before the production run? Many thanks for posting the pictures. John. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
campaigner Posted December 27, 2012 Share Posted December 27, 2012 WOW, Looks fantastic to me. tell Heljan not to hurry with these, that way I might be able to afford one when they arrive Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill Dyson (onslaught832) Posted December 27, 2012 Share Posted December 27, 2012 I'm wondering if the headcode box is still a smidge low and if so would this be corrected before the production run? Many thanks for posting the pictures. John. It's quite a bit too low, but I understand from this forum that the headcode will be re-positioned.........is this correct Brian ? Could I also ask what other mods/corrections will take place before they go in to production ? Cheers Phill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.