DavidBird Posted March 9, 2013 Share Posted March 9, 2013 Thats exactly what I am doing right at the moment! cheers Shane That good to hear Shane. I'm cringing at the thought of all those rare-ish coaches being cut up :S Keep us posted please, Shane. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
7APT7 Posted March 9, 2013 Share Posted March 9, 2013 Mmmm Yes...! I've just watched some APT Coaches go on eBay for £22 ea or there about...so £44 to cut a coach up as you need two of them to make just one good coach... Yes... I can see why you would be upset..., I'm still coming to terms with having to carry the job out on my coaches and with success first time, not my best point and I have not come to terms with the idea yet... I think I might just not tell her about the shoes and just watch het trying to walk in them, taking it I get it right first time, after all... I do have to get it right first time when I come to cutting up the APT coaches... Writing this I don’t know whether to laugh or cry myself... laugh because of the shoes, and cry because of the consequences it will cost me when she sees what I have done... nothing to do with the APT really at this point.... lol Let me know how it goes with some photos if possible.... of the APT Coach Cut, not the shoes although just for a laugh it would be funny... Jamie Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidBird Posted March 17, 2013 Share Posted March 17, 2013 ... I've just watched some APT Coaches go on eBay for £22 ea or there about... ... That could have been me... Am I regretting it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamiel Posted March 26, 2013 Share Posted March 26, 2013 Instead of building a 14 car set to run on electrified lines, an option I plan to explore in the very long term is to make a testing set which would consist of one HST class 41 power car, a Derby test coach, and several coaches of the APT-P.OK, it would need a lot of altering of existing models, and maybe a fair bit of compromise (hard to model an HST prototype with the full yellow ends, rather than the original smaller yellow fronts), but it would have the advantage of allowing the APT-P to run on un-electrified lines.No doubt by the time I get around to it one of the ready to run manufacturers will bring out it anyway.I couldn't find a lot of info on the web at the moment, but Western Sunset has an image that shows the kind of setup that was run - http://www.flickr.com/photos/westernsunset/page8/There were other sets with just a power car, and two Derby departmental coaches.If anyone has more info on these test sets, or indeed further information on detailing/converting the relevant models, I would be very interested.Some lovely versions in this thread, and the thread linked on detailing the Hornby model.Jamie Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
winky84 Posted March 27, 2013 Author Share Posted March 27, 2013 Instead of building a 14 car set to run on electrified lines, an option I plan to explore in the very long term is to make a testing set which would consist of one HST class 41 power car, a Derby test coach, and several coaches of the APT-P. OK, it would need a lot of altering of existing models, and maybe a fair bit of compromise (hard to model an HST prototype with the full yellow ends, rather than the original smaller yellow fronts), but it would have the advantage of allowing the APT-P to run on un-electrified lines. No doubt by the time I get around to it one of the ready to run manufacturers will bring out it anyway. I couldn't find a lot of info on the web at the moment, but Western Sunset has an image that shows the kind of setup that was run - http://www.flickr.com/photos/westernsunset/page8/ There were other sets with just a power car, and two Derby departmental coaches. If anyone has more info on these test sets, or indeed further information on detailing/converting the relevant models, I would be very interested. Some lovely versions in this thread, and the thread linked on detailing the Hornby model. Jamie I plan on doing something very similar with some of my spare APT vehicles. Found a lot of information here http://www.traintesting.com/ The Shortest formation I have seen was a Class 41 acting as a DVT, RTC Test Service Car 8, APT Power Car (With no APT logos but painted in executive livery) and RTC Test Car 5 Hope this is of some help... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamiel Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 Thanks for that Winky84. There were a few a variations on the test trains. The one I am tempted to model was 1HST prototype power car, 1 test coach (I don't know which, but looks similar to Test Car ) and the last 3 APT-E coaches (FV3, S2, SD3). I did find a good photo of that, but can't find the link now. I also saw a formation, very similar to the one you detail, but with two APT-E cars, both power I think. The photos you have posted do really show the lower roof line of the APT-E compared to the other coaches either side, one of those things that can look wrong when you model it, but is accurate. Jamie Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
winky84 Posted March 27, 2013 Author Share Posted March 27, 2013 Thanks for that Winky84. There were a few a variations on the test trains. The one I am tempted to model was 1HST prototype power car, 1 test coach (I don't know which, but looks similar to Test Car 8) and the last 3 APT-E coaches (FV3, S2, SD3). I did find a good photo of that, but can't find the link now. I also saw a formation, very similar to the one you detail, but with two APT-E cars, both power I think. The photos you have posted do really show the lower roof line of the APT-E compared to the other coaches either side, one of those things that can look wrong when you model it, but is accurate. Jamie the only instance I'm aware of that involved any of the vehicles from the APT-E was the pop train that used one of the trailers with blanked out windows which was repainted into RTC livery and was used as part of the development for APT-P Here's some pics of the double power car test train Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamiel Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 Hi Winky.I have a few photos of the set I described above on a hard drive, but I haven't got it mounted to my new computer yet, and I can't find any on the web. I did see one last night, but didn't save the address (stupid).I have also seen images of a class 37 pulling the APT-E with the nose section up, and I also saw an interesting photo of an APT-E set at Newcastle in pre East coast line electrification days, plus a lot of other images of the APT-P and APT-E at: http://www.flickriver.com/groups/apts/pool/interesting/I'll try and post the images I have as soon as I get the disc sorted out, it makes a nice diagram.Jamie Edit: I found this on the traintestting website, which also answers which of the Derby test cars was used: I think this is the train you can see on western Sunset's image on Flickr, but I have seen better images of it too, they just seem to have disappeared from the net. Sorry about the smiley above, it must be ) and a number. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
winky84 Posted March 27, 2013 Author Share Posted March 27, 2013 I suggest you get yourself a copy of Modern Locomotives Illustrated No. 176. Loads of pics in there. Currently looking at the 37 pulling a short rake. I also plan on making up a selection of "Imagined" RTC Locos and rolling stock, some of which will be fitted with spare APT couplings I have, to make up test trains like the one pictured above. My APT set will soon be expanding after the arrival of two more trailer cars at a really good price on eBay... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
winky84 Posted March 27, 2013 Author Share Posted March 27, 2013 Hi Winky. I have a few photos of the set I described above on a hard drive, but I haven't got it mounted to my new computer yet, and I can't find any on the web. I did see one last night, but didn't save the address (stupid). I have also seen images of a class 37 pulling the APT-E with the nose section up, and I also saw an interesting photo of an APT-E set at Newcastle in pre East coast line electrification days, plus a lot of other images of the APT-P and APT-E at: http://www.flickriver.com/groups/apts/pool/interesting/ I'll try and post the images I have as soon as I get the disc sorted out, it makes a nice diagram. Jamie Edit: I found this on the traintestting website, which also answers which of the Derby test cars was used: I think this is the train you can see on western Sunset's image on Flickr, but I have seen better images of it too, they just seem to have disappeared from the net. Sorry about the smiley above, it must be ) and a number. The image on Western Sunset's Flickr is very similar. It does appear to be Test Service Car No. 9 although the grainy image does make it difficult to be 100% certain. It does appear to consist of at least 4, possibly 5 APT trailer cars. (On a side not Jamie, Are you getting your E's and P's muddled up?) RE modelling the various vehicles, It really depends on how accurate you want to be with the detail aspect. If you want it to be spot on, It would be potentially an expensive and laborious pursuit. If you want something that most people would look at and think "yeah, that's somewhere near" and be visually satisfactory, It wouldn't be as hard. The Prototype HST power car is potentially the biggest hurdle as it is totally different to the ones that see regular use to this day. Genesis did white metal cabs for the class 41, which can be grafted on to standard (older and cheaper) Hornby class 43's and when painted into the correct livery, look somewhere near. For the 'rivet counters' out there though, you'd need to sort the roof grilles and guard's doors and windows out, plus many other items I'm sure... Bodies with the Genesis cabs appear on eBay from time to time (I have a spare which I may put on at some point) On the RTC Test car front, a lot of them were heavily modified rolling stock with generator grilles where windows were, blanked out windows, strange bogies, pantographs in the rooves and all sorts of other funny business. Modelzone commissioned various models which often appear on eBay, but rarely go for less than £45 a go. There are various brass etch sides available too, but obviously, a lot of work required to get them looking good. What I plan on doing is going into my local model shop, buying whatever used vehicles they have roughly of the correct period that take my fancy and getting creative with the rattle cans and the transfers... This site has quite a few good pics of the assorted test cars- Departmentals Hope this helps Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamiel Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 Thanks again Winky. Yes, I always get my APT-E and APT-P mixed up, sorry. I quite agree on the exact replica, verses a near representation. I have the copy of Modern Locos Illustrated, but it is packed away as I have just moved back home. I have a pair of the Genesis metal cab fronts for the class 41, the detailing and window holes are a bit twisted, as are the buffers, so they will need some filing and filling to make them square again. I have a couple of the later Hornby HST's, slightly damaged from Ebay as a body and a selection of etched grills and fine metal mesh to use. I have asked at a few shows if anyone has any etched sets specifically for the class 41s, but the answers has always been 'not at the moment'. The guards end and second driving position would need a bit of work to reproduce.I think the big compromise I would want to make is to model the power cars with the yellow band as they were in the early 70's, I would like to run them more as an HST prototype set, probably as the 5 car sets I have occasionally seen, so some MK3 coaches to detail to the prototype models too.I have a Modelzone 'Test car 6', again wrong, but could possibly used. The overprinting of the grill doors over the windows is understandable for the price, but would be nice to replace with etched grills as well.Lots of plans, but at the moment the layout, some track replacement (C&L) and buildings are more of a priority for me, but this is a great thread, and it is very inspiring to see what other are doing at the moment, and I only hope I will get around to this before too long. Jamie Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
winky84 Posted March 27, 2013 Author Share Posted March 27, 2013 Yeah, I have got loads of ideas too. You are however further along than I am as currently my layout is whatever I can be bothered to chuck down on the living room floor when the mood takes me... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheesysmith Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 I would love to have been on that twin power car test train, the acceleration would have been awsome.10000 hp on tap for how many tons? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwr Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 I made a prototype HST about 20 years ago using Hornby Power cars where I cut away the front and rebuilt it with plasdticard and filler. I still have it even though I now model in 7mm. The roof line grills need replacing whcih I did with indivifual strips of platicard so they are see through. I didn't bother to change the main bodyside grill through. The train is powered by Lima chassis and the coaches were amde from the Jouef models whcih I had to alter to get the correcdt catering cars. I also have the MK1 catering car although I think this was just a Mainline repaint and is thus possibly not accurate. I will see if I can get it out a photo bits of it Paul R Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidBird Posted April 3, 2013 Share Posted April 3, 2013 The other vehicles, not the APT-E trailer, really do look like the Dapol Track Cleaner in profile. As much as I like the humour in Electra Graphics' "Cleaning Coach Ajax" here http://www.warr.biz/erg/OOCleaner.htm, I wonder if it would be possible to replace the rather short bogies on the Track Cleaner with Hornby APT trailer half-bogies... the only instance I'm aware of that involved any of the vehicles from the APT-E was the pop train that used one of the trailers with blanked out windows which was repainted into RTC livery and was used as part of the development for APT-P pop train.jpg ... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
winky84 Posted April 4, 2013 Author Share Posted April 4, 2013 Anything is possible with imagination and time. The only issue would be the height of the vehicle in comparison to the APT-E vehicle. I'd go down the scratchbuild approach if it was me doing it... Which it isn't Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ess1uk Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 A great read this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
winky84 Posted April 6, 2013 Author Share Posted April 6, 2013 In relation to my original introduction, my collection has somewhat expanded recently due to some finds in my local Cash Generator store, at prices not be refused. Just from this store but on separate visits, I bought: Hornby Coronation "City Of Birmingham" Boxed, DCC fitted Hornby Gresley A4 "Silver Link" Boxed Hornby NRM Silver Jubilee Coaches Boxed (Minus A4 "Quicksilver") Hornby Limited Edition Flying Scotsman Enterprises MK2 coach pack, Boxed with certificate Bachmann dummy Plasser & Theurer Tamper Boxed Bachmann Deltic 55020 "Nimbus" Boxed, DCC Fitted Bachmann MK1 SO, CK & RU in BR blue/grey all boxed I have also gained various other bits from my local model shop too and now have more than I know what to do with, particularly as I don't even have a layout! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
7APT7 Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 In relation to my original introduction, my collection has somewhat expanded recently due to some finds in my local Cash Generator store, at prices not be refused. Just from this store but on separate visits, I bought: Hornby Coronation "City Of Birmingham" Boxed, DCC fitted Hornby Gresley A4 "Silver Link" Boxed Hornby NRM Silver Jubilee Coaches Boxed (Minus A4 "Quicksilver") Hornby Limited Edition Flying Scotsman Enterprises MK2 coach pack, Boxed with certificate Bachmann dummy Plasser & Theurer Tamper Boxed Bachmann Deltic 55020 "Nimbus" Boxed, DCC Fitted Bachmann MK1 SO, CK & RU in BR blue/grey all boxed I have also gained various other bits from my local model shop too and now have more than I know what to do with, particularly as I don't even have a layout! Wow Not a place you would expect to find a GEM... I'll have to check out where my nearest shop is... Jamie Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
damo2929 Posted July 6, 2013 Share Posted July 6, 2013 Thanks Guy, I have just managed to have a proper look at the pics you sent me, I need to have a look at the other as these have the crucial info about the area above the bogies. I have not as yet sorted the taper, it still looks a bit square. Escuse the quaility of the pic, I took it about 5minutes ago! IMAG0086 by Shane Wilton, on Flickr cheers Shane Shane How you getting on with the units, as I would be intrested in purchasing some resin casts of the improved nose and any centre coaches you produce to extend my sets to 3 full units. based on your work on the HST prototype in model rail am sure you work will be well worth it. Damien Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf27 Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 Its coming along, a bit slower than I would have liked but as mentioned in the other APT thread I hope to put some pics up at the weekend. cheers Shane Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
7APT7 Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 Hi Mate Look forward to seeing your photos dude... Jamie Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold sotars Posted March 4, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 4, 2014 I am just preparing to begin modifying my APT and have two Eurostar power bogies to install into the power car. Has anyone actually installed these power bogies themselves and would be willing to give some advice or indeed post some photographs of the installation. AlexC Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Tilt Posted March 4, 2014 Share Posted March 4, 2014 the only instance I'm aware of that involved any of the vehicles from the APT-E was the pop train that used one of the trailers with blanked out windows which was repainted into RTC livery and was used as part of the development for APT-P pop train.jpg I found this whole site rather by accident, came upon this VERY interesting thread and found myself mentioned in it twice! I can shed some light on this pic of an APT-P trailer car in the POP Train formation as I was there..... The APT-P Trailer Car was the very first one built and was named Lab 8 Pilot, numbered RDB975636, and it was used in the early APT-P development. PoP Train had been previously skinned and fitted with a BT-12 bogie in the centre and run in 2 car form for a while, with PC3 having its original Mk 2 Tilt Pack inside and an APT-P type Mk 5 Tilt Pack hung underneath so it could test both systems. PC4 only had its Mk 2 pack at that time. Lab 8 Pilot was added to the consist later, together with another BT12 of course, and it was painted in the red/blue scheme at the time, but it hadn't been painted at all previously. Being all aluminium it just sat in the RTC Yard in its natural metal finish on a couple of slave bogies. You can just see one end of it on the right hand side of this pic, which not only shows APT-E but Lab 4 Hastings right up against the APD laboratory at the top. It's great to see so much enthusiasm for APT models, for many years they've almost seemed to be the 'Great Unwashed' on the model railway scene, and some of the stuff you guys have produced is awesome. Well done indeed. Regards Kit Spackman aka 'Mr Tilt' Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold RedgateModels Posted March 4, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 4, 2014 Welcome welcome welcome to the forum Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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