4472 Posted October 11, 2010 Share Posted October 11, 2010 Hello All, Any idea where I can get some insrument dial transfers for the Scotsman. Cheers Keith CPL Products have a dial decal set 01635 44001 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kramskee Posted October 11, 2010 Share Posted October 11, 2010 Hello all, Been a bit off for a while, and running the gauntlet of many medical tests. I have given up on the idea of logical build sequence, as I found I was running in ever diminishing circles, and was afraid that I would ...........................make mistakes. ! Somethig puzzles me however. I have just assembled the crank pins on all the driving wheels, and slightly countersunk the hole at the back of the wheel to stop the screw poking out so far - thought it may be a problem at some future point - and note that with the washers included with the chassis spring etchings ( X 3), there seems to only be mention of them being fitted to the front pair of drivers. I have hunted through all the etchings, and read through all the mags (we are up to part 113 here) and there seems to be no mention that I can see of washers on the second and third sets of drivers. And a washer left over to boot! This seems a bit odd to me, as there is a fair bit of side play in them, can any of you learned blokes that are finished tell me, are there washers to go on these later in the build, or are they not required.? Cant make much sense of this bit I'm afraid Regards, Bushrat Now this is very interesting!!! Thanks for raising this Bushrat!, I thought I lost the other three! it had me going too don't worry. Good thing someone here know's what they're doing!! I was jsut thinking to myself the other day......." where'm I gonna find brass washers that thin and that diameter" Phew saved by someone in the know! cheers Mark Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushrat Posted October 17, 2010 Share Posted October 17, 2010 Now this is very interesting!!! Thanks for raising this Bushrat!, I thought I lost the other three! it had me going too don't worry. Good thing someone here know's what they're doing!! I was jsut thinking to myself the other day......." where'm I gonna find brass washers that thin and that diameter" Phew saved by someone in the know! cheers Mark Yep, it's a tad confusing. I am plodding along slowly, tyring to catch up all the months that my bung shoulder kept me from doing anything. I have got to the laminating of that delightful stainless steel stuff - it's 'orrible! I'm finding that it doesnt solder very well at all, even with a gas torch or a 60 watt iron, super glue will probably let go, which leaves me epoxy. Not real sure what the best course is here. I have rejected the instructions re tapping a 12ba thread into the coupling rods, I think I can see a problem there with the gear eitrher locking up or coming loose, as was mentioned to me by a forum member some months ago. At the time I didnt have the issues to have a look at it, but now that I have, I am a little wary about this. I am afraid that buiilding this has put me off any thoughts of a future step into partworks, the build sequence is HORRIBLE and totally confusing, as are a lot of the instructions. I mean I've only been building kits for 50 years or so, and therefore lack any useful practical experience........... Anyhow, if somebody has a good suggestion for the laminating of these stainless steel bits, I would much appreciate any advice! Bushrat. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 30801 Posted October 17, 2010 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 17, 2010 Anyhow, if somebody has a good suggestion for the laminating of these stainless steel bits, I would much appreciate any advice! I never had any trouble with them. Just used Gaugemaster brass flux on the inside faces and then clamped them together with drill bits and clothes pegs. Ran a 40w soldering iron along the edges and let the flux pull the solder into the joint. Rubbing down the metal helped stop the flux beading and running off. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Peter Posted October 17, 2010 Author Share Posted October 17, 2010 I did mine with-Bakers Fluid-did it for me.----ROB Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushrat Posted October 17, 2010 Share Posted October 17, 2010 I tried tinning mine first, but it didnt work too well. I've been using "Bakers" soldering flux (the paste type) , maybe thats part of the problem and I need a different flux. Thanks for the tip, I will try again..............................................!! Bushrat Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
redgauntlet Posted October 18, 2010 Share Posted October 18, 2010 Has anyone on here got any bright ideas about the lubricating pipework? I have just spent a most frustrating weekend with the pipes, it was never my best point but I have found these ones ridiculous. All tips welcome. I have tried superglue as I find them too small to solder and I have lost what little faith that I had with superglue. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Peter Posted October 18, 2010 Author Share Posted October 18, 2010 Try Arldite---ROB Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 30801 Posted October 18, 2010 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 18, 2010 Has anyone on here got any bright ideas about the lubricating pipework? No. Mine are superglued, apart from the atomisers which are soldered at the expense of losing some of the cast detail to blobs of solder, but at least they're firmly attached. It was in real danger of ending up in the bin before I'd finished... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushrat Posted October 19, 2010 Share Posted October 19, 2010 OK, thats it! I have given up on attempts to solder the valve motion parts, I have tried three different fluxes, three different types of solder, heat guns, soldering irons and a blowtorch. On average it's taking me three hours to assemble one set, as the younger generation would say, "I'm over it".! So out with the superglue, out with the epoxy, and the devil take the thing! I have no plans for mine except for a static model, but it would have been nice to have been able to solder these bits. My ticker nearly stopped when I saw the lubricating pipework, (nice job, by the way!) although I think that was the final straw that pushed me over the superglue edge. So at this stage, just under halfway through, like a few others I am wishing I'd never taken that first impulsive step by picking up the cab.............. So be it. Superglue and epoxy it is for those bits that are too hard to work. I think that I will be sending Hachette a very strongly worded letter of complaint, if I can find who to send it to! Anyhow, only about seven issues from the end here, so I will just have to do a fabulous paint job to make up for all the other things that I know are not quite right! Bushrat Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pecksniff Posted October 19, 2010 Share Posted October 19, 2010 OK, thats it! I have given up on attempts to solder the valve motion parts, I have tried three different fluxes, three different types of solder, heat guns, soldering irons and a blowtorch. On average it's taking me three hours to assemble one set, as the younger generation would say, "I'm over it".! Bushey They do solder believe me, but you must break the surface of the material the shiny part, keep runing bakers fluid plus a low point solder another scraping of the flile and eventually end up with a seam any parts then can be touched up up with a dremil... file. bakers fluid . solder I know its a pain.. Ted.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheffield Posted October 19, 2010 Share Posted October 19, 2010 The main job of the solder is to hold the laminations of the rods together, not to transmit any of the operating forces, so I think a good quality adhesive on clean slightly roughened metal will probably hold. The rods and the mainframe assembly are just about the only parts of mine I soldered, but I would have been happy to have glued them with good quality adhesive.So if they will not solder do not despair. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
redgauntlet Posted October 19, 2010 Share Posted October 19, 2010 I used brass flux and had no problems, I roughed up the rods a bit to take away the shiney surface, run flux on the rods then soldered all around the outside of the rods with (by mistake) resin cored electronics solder, it worked a treat and the join seems to be strong. Thanks for the info 30801, I have been at my wits end with those pipes, there's more on the floor than the loco. I'm using super glue and I know that modern adhesives are good, I have tried several makes and types of cryo but I'm not too impressed. The pipes stick well enough, then I try to bend them and they fly everywhere, only six more to do. Sorry I haven't yet posted any pics of gauges, my son is on holiday and he has my digital camera. Another reasonable source is MS Train Sim Flying Scotsman cab. Take a screen shot of the cab (PRTSC SYSRQ) then paste into PAINT. Crop the images of the gauges, I then paste them into WORD 97. Once there size the images by clicking the image then using FORMAT yo9u can resize it by going along to the right hand side of the toolbar and put in the HEIGHT and WIDTH. Print off onto transfer paper or photopaper, phtopaper will need to be 'thinned' by peeling off some layers, my images of the dials are good using that method. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushrat Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 The main job of the solder is to hold the laminations of the rods together, not to transmit any of the operating forces, so I think a good quality adhesive on clean slightly roughened metal will probably hold. The rods and the mainframe assembly are just about the only parts of mine I soldered, but I would have been happy to have glued them with good quality adhesive.So if they will not solder do not despair. Yes, that is what I am hoping too. As you say, the force will be on the pins, not the joint. Now I have to try to do a cheat on the 12ba tapping - rang everyone in town and nobody carries any taps or screws and nuts that size! Also trying to figure out if I can put those two stainless valve gear motion brackets on before time so I can paint the chassis before assembling the wheels and conrods, anyone got any thoughts on that one? Bushrat Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
redgauntlet Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 Yes, that is what I am hoping too. As you say, the force will be on the pins, not the joint. Now I have to try to do a cheat on the 12ba tapping - rang everyone in town and nobody carries any taps or screws and nuts that size! Also trying to figure out if I can put those two stainless valve gear motion brackets on before time so I can paint the chassis before assembling the wheels and conrods, anyone got any thoughts on that one? Bushrat I think that you are in Australia, over here we would try ebay for the taps, I got mine for around £6, I know it's a long way from the Uk but it surely can't cost too much in postage for such a tiny package. Likewise the nuts and bolts, again small packages availble from several places e.g. Eileen's Emporium. I know it's annoying to rely on such remote places, it's closer for us but no easier. I simply coated the flux on the whole inside surface of the rods I was about to join and ran the iron around the outside, the solder flowed to the other side quite easily. I know it's probably a silly question but is your iron a high enough wattage? (40W). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushrat Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 I think that you are in Australia, over here we would try ebay for the taps, I got mine for around £6, I know it's a long way from the Uk but it surely can't cost too much in postage for such a tiny package. Likewise the nuts and bolts, again small packages availble from several places e.g. Eileen's Emporium. I know it's annoying to rely on such remote places, it's closer for us but no easier. I simply coated the flux on the whole inside surface of the rods I was about to join and ran the iron around the outside, the solder flowed to the other side quite easily. I know it's probably a silly question but is your iron a high enough wattage? (40W). Well, I HAD a 40 watt iron, unfortunately it died on me, I have been using a 60 watt iron, but the flux doesnt seem to want to suck the solder in. Shaky mitts and old eyes don't help much either I guess! Do you mean you tinned the inside surfaces, or just coated them with flux? Bushrat Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pecksniff Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 Hi Bushey Try these people www,ozziestore.com 12ba plug $23.40 www,brunelhobbies.com.au 12ba nuts and bolts possibly 12ba taps www.trainworld.com.au for small 12ba nuts and bolts etc.. Heres hoping Ted.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
redgauntlet Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 Well, I HAD a 40 watt iron, unfortunately it died on me, I have been using a 60 watt iron, but the flux doesnt seem to want to suck the solder in. Shaky mitts and old eyes don't help much either I guess! Do you mean you tinned the inside surfaces, or just coated them with flux? Bushrat I just coated the surfaces with flux, by mistake I used resin cored electronics solder, I don't know if the extra flux made a difference but the solder flowed straight through. I'm making two of these (my son's idea) and the place is in a hell of a mess. Believe me, the rods are nothing compared to the lubricators and pipes, have had another frustrating day. I'm not sure what else to add on the rods and valve gear, I really didn't have a problem (mind you , I don't know why). I have been modelling for well over 50 of my 63 years and I have never had anything as challenging as these lubricators and pipes, maybe you will wonder what I'm making a fuss about. I would use Araldite (rather than just any epoxy) for the rods if I was you. Oh, thank God for my optovisor my wife bought it for Christmas when she saw me struggling, not cheap but indispensible now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushrat Posted October 20, 2010 Share Posted October 20, 2010 Thanks Pecksniff, will give them a try, I managed to "tap: the nickel silver nuts using a spare driving wheel pin which is also 12ba, now I am ready to put them together and trying to figure out if there should be any movement in the rods - to me they would have to be rigid - and if thats the case that join could nearly be soldered to could it not? The rather wooley instructions are not real clear on this point, so I dont know what to do:unsure: but I am thinking that they would have to be rigid, otherwise the drivers would not turn uniformly, and lock up. Spent half the night looking at every scottie dvd I own, and the con rods seem to remain straight in all of them when running. I managed to resolder one of the rods by clamping them with one side up, fluxing, putting the tip of the iron underneath and running solder in from the top, it sort of worked. Redgauntlet, are you telling me it gets WORSE!!?? From what Ive seen I think that it will be araldite for the pipework! Thats a good idea re the optovisor, will get one! I will be in a home for the bewildered before much longer...........................! Bushrat Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pecksniff Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 If you think you lot are struggling I'm 72 is this the oldest on the forum.. Ted.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 30801 Posted October 21, 2010 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 21, 2010 Redgauntlet, are you telling me it gets WORSE!!?? From what Ive seen I think that it will be araldite for the pipework! With hindsight annealing the pipes before trying to bend them would have been a good idea.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushrat Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 If you think you lot are struggling I'm 72 is this the oldest on the forum.. Ted.. Your about 11 ahead of me Ted! So wot about the con rods, can anyone tell me if they are supposed to be a rigid assembly or do they have to be left loose to allow some movement? Cant figure this out, lost too many brain cells I think.................................................... 30801, annealing the pipes sounds like a good move, I'll do that when I get to them! Bushrat Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilEakins Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 Hi Bushrat If your chassis is rigid (ie you haven't used moveable axle boxes) then soldering/fixing your connecting rods in a straight line will be fine. If however, you have allowed vertical movement to your driving axles you will need a working knuckle joint in the rods to avoid binding. Phil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
redgauntlet Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 With hindsight annealing the pipes before trying to bend them would have been a good idea.... Yes! You have just reminded me of something I used to do years ago and for some reason it never crossed my mind, I still have a few to do so I'll do that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushrat Posted October 21, 2010 Share Posted October 21, 2010 Hi Bushrat If your chassis is rigid (ie you haven't used moveable axle boxes) then soldering/fixing your connecting rods in a straight line will be fine. If however, you have allowed vertical movement to your driving axles you will need a working knuckle joint in the rods to avoid binding. Phil Thanks Phil, That clears it up nicely! Ive just used the bearings as they were supplied, so I will solder it up! I'm thinking of painting mine in the experimental blue that it recieved for a short time, just to be different! Cheers, Bushrat. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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