luckymucklebackit Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 Hi Steve, I know D6127 was damaged by fire but do you know what happened to D6151? Are there any pictures? D6151 was withdrawn with 29 others in the great cull of 31/12/1967, having been transferred from Kittybrewster to Ferryhill on 24/09/1967 along with the rest of Kittybrewsters allocation, so I assume that there was no special circumstances surrounding its withdrawal Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dubaimike Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 D6151 was withdrawn with 29 others in the great cull of 31/12/1967, having been transferred from Kittybrewster to Ferryhill on 24/09/1967 along with the rest of Kittybrewsters allocation, so I assume that there was no special circumstances surrounding its withdrawal Jim Understood Jim, but among that great cull at the end of 1967 were locos which hadn't run for years because of accident or fire damage. For example D6127 didn't run again after catching fire in 1962, so it never received yellow panels. If D6151 was also withdrawn with no yellow panels as Steve says, it seems likely that it too had been out of traffic for a long time, hence my query as to why that was. Regards Mike Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckymucklebackit Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 Understood Jim, but among that great cull at the end of 1967 were locos which hadn't run for years because of accident or fire damage. For example D6127 didn't run again after catching fire in 1962, so it never received yellow panels. If D6151 was also withdrawn with no yellow panels as Steve says, it seems likely that it too had been out of traffic for a long time, hence my query as to why that was. Regards Mike I found a bit of an enigma tonight, there are three photographs in B.R. Diesel Traction in Scotland by George O'Hara purporting to be D6151. Photo #5 on page 9 shows it ex works at Kittybrewster in June 1960, then on page 109, photo #247 is described as D6151 at Cornhill in June 1964 - complete with yellow warning panels, but at the end of the book, photo #697 on page 301 shown the loco forlorn in McWilliams Scrapyard - with no yellow panels. The number is not clear on photo #247 so it must be assumed that this has been wrongly identified. Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold russ p Posted November 20, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 20, 2018 That must be one of a few production diesels to go to the scrapyard without accident damage and no yellow panel Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold stovepipe Posted November 23, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 23, 2018 I found a bit of an enigma tonight, there are three photographs in B.R. Diesel Traction in Scotland by George O'Hara purporting to be D6151. Photo #5 on page 9 shows it ex works at Kittybrewster in June 1960, then on page 109, photo #247 is described as D6151 at Cornhill in June 1964 - complete with yellow warning panels, but at the end of the book, photo #697 on page 301 shown the loco forlorn in McWilliams Scrapyard - with no yellow panels. The number is not clear on photo #247 so it must be assumed that this has been wrongly identified. Jim There's a picture on my HD of D6151 at Aberdeen Ferryhill with yellow panels - the number is visible, but taken from the other end to plate #697 in George O'Hara's book, with no yellow panel on the other end. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dubaimike Posted November 23, 2018 Share Posted November 23, 2018 Is it definitely D6151 without yellow panels at Shettleston? i.e is the number visible in the picture? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckymucklebackit Posted November 23, 2018 Share Posted November 23, 2018 Is it definitely D6151 without yellow panels at Shettleston? i.e is the number visible in the picture? Yes - it is quite clear in the photo, but here is more to add to the mystery - http://www.railuk.info/gallery/notes/getimage.php?id=2005 So did it run round with one end yellow and the other plain green, or was there a cab swap Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrushVeteran Posted November 23, 2018 Share Posted November 23, 2018 Yes - it is quite clear in the photo, but here is more to add to the mystery - http://www.railuk.info/gallery/notes/getimage.php?id=2005 So did it run round with one end yellow and the other plain green, or was there a cab swap Jim There is a colour image on Eastbank MRC showing a more overhead view of McWilliam's yard taken with the same 3 Class 21's on view. Although you cannot see the number it is the same loco as in George O.Hara's book on page 301 that depicts D6151. I cannot dispute the other image with a half yellow end although it could be D6157, but it also could be that it only had it painted on one end. I'm sure another image will materialise to confirm this in due time so yet another challenge is laid down! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckymucklebackit Posted November 23, 2018 Share Posted November 23, 2018 This one claims to be Inverurie Works 1965, no yellow warning panel https://picclick.co.uk/35mm-Negative-BR-British-Railways-Diesel-Loco-Class-372457705145.html#&gid=1&pid=1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold stovepipe Posted November 23, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 23, 2018 Yes - it is quite clear in the photo, but here is more to add to the mystery - http://www.railuk.info/gallery/notes/getimage.php?id=2005 So did it run round with one end yellow and the other plain green, or was there a cab swap Jim Yes that is the photo I was referring to in #130, not Aberdeen Ferryhill as I thought, but Kittybrewster Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold stovepipe Posted November 23, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 23, 2018 The MLI issue doesn't add much other than to record D6151 was stored unserviceable from July 1967. And BR Database says the Railway Observer from July 1968 records its movement from Aberdeen to Shettleston with two others in May 1968. Anyone got this issue and feel like checking the reference? Another anomaly is that the Shettleston pic is supposedly from 1972, a longtime to keep 6 complete locos. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dubaimike Posted November 24, 2018 Share Posted November 24, 2018 This one claims to be Inverurie Works 1965, no yellow warning panel https://picclick.co.uk/35mm-Negative-BR-British-Railways-Diesel-Loco-Class-372457705145.html#&gid=1&pid=1Interesting. If the date is correct it's late for it not to have panels, only 2 years before it was officially withdrawn. No visible damage, either accident or fire, but does this have the look of a loco in the early stages of being robbed for spares? No windscreen wipers, missing side window, open engine room doors. OK, I'm reading far too much into one picture!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dubaimike Posted November 24, 2018 Share Posted November 24, 2018 One more thing. The Kittybrewster and Inverurie pictures show opposite ends, so it's possible there's a yellow panel on the other end in the Inverurie picture. Which end can be seen in the Shettleston picture? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold stovepipe Posted November 24, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 24, 2018 I think this is the summary. Personally I think the date of the Inverurie one is probably wrong - there does not appear to be any OHLW signs. 1965 Inverurie no.2 end 1964 Kittbrewster no.1 end yellow panel 1968 Shettleston no.2 end Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Delamar Posted January 2, 2019 Share Posted January 2, 2019 [/url] I like the map, it’s a good idea, but it’s made me think. Where they not used to Kyle of Lochalsh? And why not? Many thanks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold russ p Posted January 2, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 2, 2019 I wonder if the red circle ones ever worked in multi with a cobo on the condor? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Delamar Posted January 2, 2019 Share Posted January 2, 2019 I had a small hardback book with quite a few good colour shots of these in, ive been trying to find it again. Had it in the 1990s. It may have been Derek Penney’s On Scottish lines but I cant be sure. Does anyone recall it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
'CHARD Posted January 2, 2019 Author Share Posted January 2, 2019 I like the map, it’s a good idea, but it’s made me think. Where they not used to Kyle of Lochalsh? And why not? Many thanks. Kyle diagrams were responsibility of Inverness shed; the GNoS fleet of NBLs were Aberdeen allocated. I doubt that Inverness Control had the confidence/ devilment to send a borrowed 21 out in the Dingwall direction, nor would its traincrew be trained for that traction over the route. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Signaller69 Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 Kyle diagrams were responsibility of Inverness shed; the GNoS fleet of NBLs were Aberdeen allocated. I doubt that Inverness Control had the confidence/ devilment to send a borrowed 21 out in the Dingwall direction, nor would its traincrew be trained for that traction over the route. That would seem reasonable. D6146 was based at Inverness from 24th April to 18th June 1960 ostensibly for crew training, though I have not seen anything to suggest it was used North of Inverness. It has been suggested that this was simply an exercise in spreading the burden of maintenance in areas where the class worked but were not necessarily allocated; Perth and Dundee each had one allocated (D6145 and D6151 respectively) around this time too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Revolution Ben Posted January 3, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2019 Where they not used to Kyle of Lochalsh? And why not? Hi Michael, When I compiled the map I worked primarily from photographs as well as written notes and I was - to my great chagrin - unable to find any evidence that the 21/29s reached Kyle of Lochalsh. cheers Ben A. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckymucklebackit Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 (Pedant hat on) There is a bit of the map missing, the class 21s were very common between Stirling and Crianlarich on the old route via Calander to Oban Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamiel Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 If the Class 21s deputised for failed Class 28s, did this mean that they would run double head with 28s, or were double headed 21s substituted?I am sure this could give modellers an interesting pairing to run if they did.Jamie Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ardbealach Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 In the book 'On West Highland Lines' by Robert Robotham there is a picture of D6108 and D6135 on a Glasgow-Oban in the Pass of Brander between Crianlarich and Oban on 13 May 1961. So they got to Oban. I cannot ever recall seeing any of them on the Kyle or Far North routes - maybe too far away from home - and away from the loco fitters. I have to hand 'On Scottish Lines' by Derek Penney - as mentioned by Mike Delamar. It is all steam and no diesels in this book. Also I can highly recommend 'First Generation Scottish Diesels' by David Dunn which has D6135 on a Stirling - Edinburgh passenger service. And there any more sad eyed pictures in the NE of Scotland illustrated in this book. And they were used extensively around Glasgow on freight. Three pictures taken in the early sixties at the Clyde Iron Works at Carmyle on the east side of Glasgow attached. (AM) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Delamar Posted January 3, 2019 Share Posted January 3, 2019 In the book 'On West Highland Lines' by Robert Robotham there is a picture of D6108 and D6135 on a Glasgow-Oban in the Pass of Brander between Crianlarich and Oban on 13 May 1961. So they got to Oban. I cannot ever recall seeing any of them on the Kyle or Far North routes - maybe too far away from home - and away from the loco fitters Thanks I think that’s the book I remember, I remember using it to try and detail my Hornby 29. The book has been lost but I’ve now ordered a replacement. Many thanks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Delamar Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 And it has arrived. £2. Id forgotten how many good shots there are in this book. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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