Aylesbury Traffic - late 70's/early 80's

[Barry W]

Hello all, I have been looking for a location to model and reckon Aylesbury looks like an interesting prospect and after much internet trawling have a lot of good information and photographs. I do however have a few questions that I was hoping the collective knowledge of the forum may be able to help me with?

 

Did international alloys have an active flow in this time period or did the coal depot takeover their site? Speaking of the C.C.D I believe the household coal was sourced from up north, but did it arrive from the north or the south? I only ask as I think the coal for Chinnor came via Banbury and presume the two flows originated from the same place.

 

Were there ever any bricks worked south through Aylesbury from Calvert to London, from what I have read I guess most went north to Bletchley?

 

To the north of the station adjacent to the Oxford Road there were oil tanks with rail access, did this facility ever have a delivery in the above time period?

 

And finally, the four sidings in the 'east yard' adjacent to the Mandeville Road, did these ever have a use in the 70's/80's? Every photo I have shows that area as being empty.

 

Apologies for a mammoth first post, I have been lurking for a while and I am itching to get back into modelling, so any info would be greatly received.

 

Many thanks Barry

[caradoc]

I remember visiting Aylesbury on Sundays in the mid-1970s to get Marylebone DMU car numbers (sad or what ?) and there were units stabled all over the place, both at and north of the station, on sidings and running lines IIRC.

Edited December 12, 2011 by caradoc

[D826]

Hello all, I have been looking for a location to model and reckon Aylesbury looks like an interesting prospect and after much internet trawling have a lot of good information and photographs. I do however have a few questions that I was hoping the collective knowledge of the forum may be able to help me with?

 

Did international alloys have an active flow in this time period or did the coal depot takeover their site? Speaking of the C.C.D I believe the household coal was sourced from up north, but did it arrive from the north or the south? I only ask as I think the coal for Chinnor came via Banbury and presume the two flows originated from the same place.

 

Were there ever any bricks worked south through Aylesbury from Calvert to London, from what I have read I guess most went north to Bletchley?

 

To the north of the station adjacent to the Oxford Road there were oil tanks with rail access, did this facility ever have a delivery in the above time period?

 

And finally, the four sidings in the 'east yard' adjacent to the Mandeville Road, did these ever have a use in the 70's/80's? Every photo I have shows that area as being empty.

 

Apologies for a mammoth first post, I have been lurking for a while and I am itching to get back into modelling, so any info would be greatly received.

 

Many thanks Barry

 

 

Barry,

 

As an Aylesbury boy I wish I had documented more of what you could see in the 70's than I did. Memory can play some tricks over time, but I never saw traffic into International alloys - though there was still a siding connection laid in there in the 70's.

 

There were oil tank trains to the Shell depot on the Oxford Road in the 70's - I recall them being 47 hauled. The tanks and unloading pipes were still there in the mid 80's though I don't remember seeing that much activity there.

 

I don't ever remember seeing brick traffic.

 

I thought the coal concentration depot was in the yard by the, (what was, in retrospect), gorgeous big red brick goods shed. - roughly round where the multi cultural centre car park was built.

 

You'll see photos elsewhere - see Geoff Plumb photopic website of 31's in the 80's serving Akeman Street 'Industrial area' - (fertiliser depot) on what remains of the GC link to the GWR cut off route at Ashendon junction - but I don't know if these originated from Bletchley or came up from the south.

 

I forget the name of the coal merchant who used to have their office in the recesses of the road leading out from Friars Square, just by the exit of the bus station, but the fug down there from the cooped up buses used to rival that of the 115s idling at Marylebone.

 

Used to be masses of 12 ton box vans, CCTs, GUVs etc in the sidings adjacent to the muti storey and the long gone, but much used bay platform, which is now part of the station car park.

 

Used to pretty regularly see 25s, and for a long time in the early 80's, a green 08 - ( I seem to recall it was a namer - Faversham ?) used to be stabled in the carriage platform at the end of the up platform, underneath the old footbridge across which I headed to the Floyd to school every day.

 

Thought that Aylesbury used to be solely 115s, so it came as a bit of a surprise to come across a picture of a 104 about to leave from the bay for Marylebone in First Gen DMUs in colour by Stuart Mackay (pg 28).

 

Ah, the place had atmosphere with all those semaphores and what would now seem like incredible variety.

 

The four sidings you refer to were I think, as you say, conspicuosuly empty, and used primarily for storing stock at the weekends. - Least, I remember there didn't used to be much to see from the bridge past the gyratory on Stoke Road other than at the weekend.

 

 

Regards

 

Matt Wood

[rob D2]

Well,

I think the coal for aylesbury came from bletchley direction in the early 80s - I have seen photos of 2 class 25 with a load of 21T hoppers both at Aylesbury and crossing the flyover at Bletchley. Latter on in the 80s it was a class 37 gig from Didcot via Neasden, then even later a class 58.

 

Also I have a pic c.1983 of a 25 at princes risborough with HEAs, 'to be attached to a chinnor -acton speedlink' so there must be a period when it came from that direction as well !

 

I take it you have already clocked the wine traffic to aylesbury in this period ? Have you seen derbysulzers.com ? Whole section in there about 25s working from bletchley and around Aylesbury in the period.

 

Never seen any brick traffic through there, and was unaware of any oil trains - never seen any photos of that.

 

What about some movements of tubestock, and tube battery powered engines to derby - these went through Aylesbury as well.

[Barry W]

Thanks for the replies guys.

 

Caradoc, would that have been the all over blue era? There are some nice photos on flickr from that period and judging by the empty car park could be the weekend too!

 

Matt, thanks for sharing your memories, some good information there, the thought of having an 08 in residence is pretty cool. Do you recall seeing much in the way of engineers wagons at Aylesbury, would be another source of interest.

 

Cheers Barry

[lmsforever]

There was a lovely GWR wooden goods shed before the Oxford Rd bridge ,also the farm equipment on flat cars ,and a regular newspaper train with a Hymeck on the front ,plus the regular parcels to Northampton usualy pulled by a 25 .We had a real mixture of units at the end of BR operation due to the regular units falling apart daily ,Marylebone grabbed anything that would move and some that tried but didnt!The old loco shed was still about but derelict ,became a wharehouse now flats,I agree about the oil depot never saw a single wagon there .By the way the Risboro MRC looked into renting the wooden goods shed as a club room but BR didnt want to know they had other ideas and were in cahoots with the council.Dont forget the station entrance was on the front of the building not were it is now ,the regular ticket collector was a great guy and only passed away a few years ago.The buildings in great Western St were very interesting in design all swept away now of course one was a pub and another became a wholesale newsagents depot.Have a look in the Old Aylesbury books there are many photos of the station in them,the Bucks Herald newspaper have the details.

[Barry W]

Hi Rob, Now you mention it I do have that photo of two 25's hauling coal from the north, DOH! I have indeed seen the derbysulzers site, it was my interest in 25's that first brought the variety of traffic at Aylesbury to my attention. As you say there was the wine concentrate and LU stock movements and also the binliners too. I'm loving the variety there seemed to be in the parcels vans, some of the CCT's look ready for preservation! Thanks for your comments.

 

Barry

[Baby Deltic]

I've seen a clip of 45012 working through Aylesbury with the binliners.

[lmsforever]

The coal depot was by Rabans Lane my ex worked there for a while busy place ,but now a scrap yard .The firm that made farm machinery was New Holland a part of Clayson who are still manufacturing bailers.I used to go to the station every morning in the sixties when I worked for Smiths and had to clear up the bookstall on the station.Quite often I met the paper train and sorted the paper rounds out and then went for a coffee and cheese roll in the cafe one morning a van split the points at the north end of the platform all hushed up of course.

[caradoc]

Yes, the DMU stabling was definitely during the all-blue period. I also seem to recall Aylesbury being a hotbed for SPV parcels van action - Was there a particular traffic they were used for ? I certainly recall seeing lots there.

[bennyboy]

Yes, the DMU stabling was definitely during the all-blue period. I also seem to recall Aylesbury being a hotbed for SPV parcels van action - Was there a particular traffic they were used for ? I certainly recall seeing lots there.

 

Aylesbury was the Plan Of The Month in Railway Modeller during the 80s and I'm seem to remember that the article mentioned that there was a Freemans/Kays type catalogue warehouse near the station that sent a lot of traffic by rail.

[D826]

Barry,

 

Some good shots of a 31 at Akeman Street here - confirming the working went through Aylesbury to run round and return to Bletchley - also 47's.

 

http://petertandy.co.uk/Bucks&ox_page.html

 

And 25's on parcels here ;

 

http://www.railbrit.co.uk/imageenlarge/imagecomplete2.php?id=25452

 

I have a nagging feeling that Ford used to distribute some spare parts by rail, and Perrys used to be somewhere off Walton Road I think. Also, in Brian Morrison's First Generation Diesel Railcars and DMUs there's an interesting picture of 115s at Marylebone depot, next to the servicing platform and loads of what look like bread lorries lined up next to it. Annoyingly, I just can't make out the name on the lorries, looks a bit like Eden Vale ?

 

Anyway, the above shows some interesting workings. Been unable to turn up any photos of the Shell Oil depot off Oxford Road though - there must be something out there. I'll see if my mother can recall the name of the oil company - and the coal merchants too - used to deliver to a lot of the houses on Broughton - flat bed Bedford truck and sacks and all that.

 

Regards

 

Matt W

[caradoc]

David Larkin's softback book 'BR Standard Freight Wagons - A Pictorial Survey' (D.Bradford Barton 1979) has a picture, dated 1970, of a HOP32AB (ie HAA post-TOPS) at Aylesbury. I presume it was being used as a barrier wagon, as in the background is a static oil tank and some 100t Shell tank wagons. A bit too early for your period, however !

Edited December 14, 2011 by caradoc

[Junction3]

Around 1980-81, the coal and wine tanker came up from Acton with the Chinnor coal train to Princes Risborough. The 31 would deposit the wagons in the sidings and a 25 would come across the branch from Aylesbury and collect them.

 

In the early to mid 80's, the overnight newspaper train from Paddington to Aylesbury was often class 50 hauled as well.

[David Bigcheeseplant]

Hartwell Sidings used to have an 04 shunter, plus there always seemed to an 08 around the station too.

 

The Risborough MRC club is modelling Aylesbury in the 1950s & 1960s, and I have built quite a few of the buildings, and have a few hundred photos of the station, let me know if you want any other info, or see some of my threads on building the station.

 

David

Edited December 16, 2011 by David Bigcheeseplant

[Rugd1022]

Around 1980-81, the coal and wine tanker came up from Acton with the Chinnor coal train to Princes Risborough. The 31 would deposit the wagons in the sidings and a 25 would come across the branch from Aylesbury and collect them.

 

In the early to mid 80's, the overnight newspaper train from Paddington to Aylesbury was often class 50 hauled as well.

 

I used to work the Aylesbury papers as a callow youth in the early 80s, if the right driver was on it a 50 would be requested and put on instead of the usual 31 or 47. With a single van in tow we probably set a few records going up Saunderton bank! I think the most we ever had on this job was three or four 4 vans tops, on arrivial at Aylesbury I'd usually do the hooking off and hooking on during the run round move while the guard assisted with unloading the vans, it saved a bit of time and we'd be ready to take the empties back to Old Oak as soon as possible for an early pre-dawn finish.

 

[D826]

Hartwell Sidings used to have an 04 shunter, plus there always seemed to an 08 around the station too.

 

The Risborough MRC club is modelling Aylesbury in the 1950s & 1960s, and I have built quite a few of the buildings, and have a few hundred photos of the station, let me know if you want any other info, or see some of my threads on building the station.

 

David

 

 

David,

 

That was the name of the Shell depot, Hartwells well done sir, been searching my memory all week.

 

I have admired your work on previous posts David. Really like the engine shed you have been working on.

 

Especially keen on Aylesbury, since not only was it my home town station but my dad drove Met E and F class, and later Panniers for LT from Neasden. Unfortunately he passed away 16 years ago, but I am sure that while the power station at Neasden was extant, he used to go out to the Oxford - Bletchley line to pick up strings of coal wagons. Swanbourne sidings springs to mind, but may be a figment of my imagination.

 

I have the Metropolitan Railway Appendix to the Working timetable dated 1st August 1921, that was given to Dad by one of the old stagers at Neasden when he joined London Transport after the second world war. Includes gradient profiles and loadings or Met A,B,C,D, E and F and G class out to Quainton Road and Verney Junction in both Up and Down directions.

 

Anyway, with that Hartwells name you have nailed the fuel depot name, now just the coal merchants who used to have an office in Great Western Street facing the station.

 

When my mother and father moved out to Aylesbury in the mid 60's the line in from Cheddington to Aylesbury High Street was still extant, but used for storage of 16 ton mineral wagons that could be seen from the first floor windows in our house on 'Broughton' - None of that namby pampy Broughton 'Pastures' estate agent twaddle back then.

 

A few years back we took my Mum for dinner at the pub in Broughton, always referred to by me as The Prince of Wales, but renamed, 'The Crossing', only to find the landlord did not realise that there had been a level crossing there, and right through to the early 80's the gates with the big red targets were still there.

 

Keep up our fantastic modelling. I don't suppose you have a photo of the green class 08 I was banging on about in an earlier post - I've a feeling it was towards the end of my time at the Floyd, so sometime in 83/84/85 and while it wasn't there for years, I recall that it was resident for some time ?

 

And Nidge, - 50's at Aylesbury - I wish I had stayed out later down by the station !!

 

Anyway regards

 

Matt Wood

[Fat Controller]

Yes, the DMU stabling was definitely during the all-blue period. I also seem to recall Aylesbury being a hotbed for SPV parcels van action - Was there a particular traffic they were used for ? I certainly recall seeing lots there.

It was printed catalogues and Radio Times for BPCC, Robert Maxwell's printing company- I think they might also have printed 'Reader's Digest' there as well.

[big jim]

That was the name of the Shell depot, Hartwells well done sir....

 

funnily enough there is a temporary AA road sign just over the railway bridge near the new college that says "access to hartwell sidings only", no sidings to be seen though

 

D826, what night were you at the panto? if it was saturday it was my lad up on stage with johnothan wilkes

[hmrspaul]

It was printed catalogues and Radio Times for BPCC, Robert Maxwell's printing company- I think they might also have printed 'Reader's Digest' there as well.

That is the traffic I understood the SPVs (ex fish) and other parcels wagons - LMS BGs SR 4 wheelers etc were in. Quite a lot dotted around my collections are at Aylesbury.

 

Also a nice rake of international freightliners http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/brferryfreightliner Also one of the last resting places of H containers http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/brhodcontainer/e33d43bca and some rather colourful ex Tube wagons http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/brlnertube/e30357aa3 http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/lnertube/e36d4f66c which are probably a bit late for you.

 

Paul Bartlett

[roythebus]

funnily enough there is a temporary AA road sign just over the railway bridge near the new college that says "access to hartwell sidings only", no sidings to be seen though

 

D826, what night were you at the panto? if it was saturday it was my lad up on stage with johnothan wilkes

Oh no he wasn't; oh yes he was...

 

Don't forget the ECS DMUs from Bletchley to Aylersbury at about 0430 every morning in the mid-70's. The Bletchley brickliners ran via the WCML; One was a Rugby turn, empty from Crewe to Bletchley with 2x25s. a couple of times I worked Bletchley-Kings Cross goods with a Bletchley driver.

 

In the early 70's there was no freight via the Met to Aylesbury that I know of.

 

You might ask on the District Dave Underground site for more info, they're quite friendly on there.

[Barry W]

I am back, no thanks to BT's Infinity!

 

So much interesting stuff thank you all, always nice to get a drivers perspective too.

 

So Matt, The only Eden Vale I know is a very good ale from up Carlisle way, highly recommended. I believe the coal merchant was G.W.Talbot, at least that is the name mentioned with a photo of the 04 shunter on Flickr. The green 08 was 08011 'Haversham' and a local celebrity it would seem, this page tells the story http://www.leightonlogs.org/08011locostory.

 

Caradoc, nice find! I will have to seek out that book, I wonder how long that traffic lasted? Not long it would seem.

 

HMRSPaul, interesting stuff, I have already purchased some photos of the Ermefer tanks from your site, but missed the others. I Don't suppose you know what the freightliners were doing there?

 

Junction3, So the 25 would come light engine from Bletchley to pick up the wine and coal from Risboro', seems like a long trip for a small number of wagons.

 

With regard to the underground stock, was it just delivery of 1983 stock or did other rolling stock pass through also?

 

Thanks again for all the info. Barry

[rob D2]

I think alot of stock went to derby for refurbishment, this was running all the way up until the early EWS years.

 

Also I have seen the photo of a class 47 with 2 LUL battery locos pulling them through wycombe, may be a bit late for you circa 1987

[lmsforever]

Yes, the DMU stabling was definitely during the all-blue period. I also seem to recall Aylesbury being a hotbed for SPV parcels van action - Was there a particular traffic they were used for ? I certainly recall seeing lots there.

The vans were used by Hazels printers to distribute Readers Digest and other books. Chris

[lmsforever]

 

 

David,

 

That was the name of the Shell depot, Hartwells well done sir, been searching my memory all week.

 

I have admired your work on previous posts David. Really like the engine shed you have been working on.

 

Especially keen on Aylesbury, since not only was it my home town station but my dad drove Met E and F class, and later Panniers for LT from Neasden. Unfortunately he passed away 16 years ago, but I am sure that while the power station at Neasden was extant, he used to go out to the Oxford - Bletchley line to pick up strings of coal wagons. Swanbourne sidings springs to mind, but may be a figment of my imagination.

 

I have the Metropolitan Railway Appendix to the Working timetable dated 1st August 1921, that was given to Dad by one of the old stagers at Neasden when he joined London Transport after the second world war. Includes gradient profiles and loadings or Met A,B,C,D, E and F and G class out to Quainton Road and Verney Junction in both Up and Down directions.

 

Anyway, with that Hartwells name you have nailed the fuel depot name, now just the coal merchants who used to have an office in Great Western Street facing the station.

 

When my mother and father moved out to Aylesbury in the mid 60's the line in from Cheddington to Aylesbury High Street was still extant, but used for storage of 16 ton mineral wagons that could be seen from the first floor windows in our house on 'Broughton' - None of that namby pampy Broughton 'Pastures' estate agent twaddle back then.

 

A few years back we took my Mum for dinner at the pub in Broughton, always referred to by me as The Prince of Wales, but renamed, 'The Crossing', only to find the landlord did not realise that there had been a level crossing there, and right through to the early 80's the gates with the big red targets were still there.

 

Keep up our fantastic modelling. I don't suppose you have a photo of the green class 08 I was banging on about in an earlier post - I've a feeling it was towards the end of my time at the Floyd, so sometime in 83/84/85 and while it wasn't there for years, I recall that it was resident for some time ?

 

And Nidge, - 50's at Aylesbury - I wish I had stayed out later down by the station !!

 

Anyway regards

 

Matt Wood Matt come over to Chinnor you can photo our green 08 it looks great is correct to the nt,th degree Chris