Colin parks Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 I can't claim originality for this sort of topic. 5 BEL has recently described building a rather fine 4 CIG, using MJT etched sides, similar coaches and the drive from a Hornby class 73. This conversion though, will be done with custom-etched window frames, (supplied by Pete Harvey) fitted to scratch-built plasticard body sides and cab fronts. (That should be interesting given the Hornby 4 VEP controversy re. cab windows and corridor connectors.) Having taken one Bachmann coach apart, it looks best to try and make the new sides to clip-fit like the originals. This will involve adding a strip of plastic at cantrail level at a right-angle to the side with spigots locating into holes in the roof moulding. I am going to try and utilise the close coupling feature of the coaches, although how it will work on the motor bogie is not yet clear. Nevertheless, when the four donor coaches were tested with the close-coupling parts (which look like vacuum pipes) they looked mighty fine running with the corridor connections touching on straight track. Today, the donor class 73 has been fitted with its Ultrascale wheels. A small amount of the motor bogie moulding has had to be removed to allow the wheel flanges to revovle freely. The total time taken to fit the wheels was 20 mins. I might order finescale wheels for all the other bogies, but the Bachmann ones will do for now. Here is the state of things so far. Its very early days, but instead of making as much as I can for the CIG, use will be made of as many manufactured components as possible. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Trevellan Posted February 2, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 2, 2012 I look forward to watching progress on this project. I'd also like to thank you on behalf of all of us waiting for Bachmann to announce the r-t-r version. Your work is bound to hasten the latter... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Added to the links in the Southern Electrics forum Colin - look forward to watching progress on this http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/41640-southern-electrics-forum-and-other-useful-links/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Siberian Snooper Posted February 2, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 2, 2012 I look forward to another intresting thread of stock that I used to ride on as a nipper. Cheers SS Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted February 2, 2012 Author Share Posted February 2, 2012 I look forward to watching progress on this project. I'd also like to thank you on behalf of all of us waiting for Bachmann to announce the r-t-r version. Your work is bound to hasten the latter... Hi Trevellan, I don't think my little topic will have much influence on Bachmann, but all the better if they do produce a CIG. In fact, I hope it is Bachmann who make a 4 CIG rather than anyone else. Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted February 2, 2012 Author Share Posted February 2, 2012 Thanks to Rod and Siberian Snooper for your interest. The bit that worries me about this project is the application of the white lining on the sides. I have plans to make some sort of jig and guides to get this right. Gulp! 5 BEL used Fox tranfers on his 4 CIG, but I'd prefer to line out the sides with a bow pen if I can. Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5Bel Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Hi Colin, Good to see you have started the 4Cig. I think the Bachmann coaches are a good starting point. I am looking forward to seeing it progress to see how you tackle the ends and to see a different approach to the same prototype. Cheers for now, Ian. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted February 3, 2012 Author Share Posted February 3, 2012 This might be a silly question, but what does it mean when a topic is 'pinned'? Have I said something wrong? Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted February 3, 2012 Author Share Posted February 3, 2012 Hi Colin, Good to see you have started the 4Cig. I think the Bachmann coaches are a good starting point. I am looking forward to seeing it progress to see how you tackle the ends and to see a different approach to the same prototype. Cheers for now, Ian. Hi Ian, Yes it will be a slightly different approach to yours. I am not familiar with Replica Mk.1 coaches, but the Bachmann ones have detachable sides which is a big bonus at the painting stage. I can foresee having to be very careful about getting the cab front to join up exactly with the roof and sides. Bachmann Mk.1s seem to be virtually pre-painted kits assembled at lightening speed in the factory. This makes them easier to convert: the underframe equipment should not take long to remove for a start. I have a Southern Pride set of underframe equipment mouldings for the 4 CIG - just wish I'd known about their B4 bogie details when I ordered. The cost of postage for all the parts for a project like this soon mounts up. The coach roofs are going to be sanded flat - away witht the 2 x 1 style ribs! I shall order MJT roof vents and orange curtains. I wonder, are the MJT curtains tranfers or some sort of paper? Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 This might be a silly question, but what does it mean when a topic is 'pinned'? Have I said something wrong? Colin I suspect it's simply that someone (Andy Y?) has seen fit to highlight the content. I reckon it's meant as a compliment! It's certainly an interesting project. Adam Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Harvey Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 The topic has been pinned as it's going to be popular and it will be easier to find for people. Pete Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5Bel Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Hi Colin, The MJT curtains are whitemetal castings and good they are too! The Replica bodies are one piece so it is easy to line up the ends and roof. I have found that when you sand down the roof on these coaches, you get left with a very faint mark where the ribs were. It is quite convincing once painted. While you are on the MJT website look in their downloads section, you will find instructions for using the 4Cig sides. These instructions include a good plan of the interior. Cheers for now, Ian. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted February 3, 2012 Author Share Posted February 3, 2012 Hi Colin, The MJT curtains are whitemetal castings and good they are too! The Replica bodies are one piece so it is easy to line up the ends and roof. I have found that when you sand down the roof on these coaches, you get left with a very faint mark where the ribs were. It is quite convincing once painted. While you are on the MJT website look in their downloads section, you will find instructions for using the 4Cig sides. These instructions include a good plan of the interior. Cheers for now, Ian. Thanks for the reply Ian. I would never have guessed that the curtains would be made of metal! I suppose that someone must make paint of the correct colour for such things colour then? I will look at the instructions on the MJT website re. interiors. All I have to go on as yet is "The Book" and we know what happened last time I relied on that! We shall see what happens to the roof ribs. I tend to think no ribs is best, like the Bachmann 4 CEP. Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted February 3, 2012 Author Share Posted February 3, 2012 The topic has been pinned as it's going to be popular and it will be easier to find for people. Pete Phew, the pressure nto to mess this project up! P.S.Still waiting for the OK for another RMweb member to forward the 4 CIG photos to you - I hope he will allow me to. Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5Bel Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Hi Colin, I was using "The Book" a couple of days ago to ascertain wether or not the LAV's have vents above the doors. Luckily I had only removed one vent on the donor coach side when I looked at a photo and found they had them. Good though the book is, it does have some minor errors. As for the orange colour, it is plain old Humbrol orange. Cheers for now, Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted February 3, 2012 Author Share Posted February 3, 2012 Hi Colin, I was using "The Book" a couple of days ago to ascertain wether or not the LAV's have vents above the doors. Luckily I had only removed one vent on the donor coach side when I looked at a photo and found they had them. Good though the book is, it does have some minor errors. As for the orange colour, it is plain old Humbrol orange. Cheers for now, Ian Hi Ian, I do find the "book" useful for some things, but as you say, check with photographs. I have even managed to scale the 4 CIG end elevation plans up to the right size by enlarging them by 117%. (Actually that is what the Kodak printer says, but logic would suggest it really means 17% larger.) The one thing the "book" seems to have got right is the general proportion and measurements of the cab ends: windows/corridor connection width etc. So I can't be too scathing about said tome can I ?! No, at least two things are right with the book! The 4 CIG cab side-windows are of equal width on each side. Thanks to Ceptic (Frank) for confirming this point with some very clear pictures. Colin Are your referring to a 4 LAV by the way? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5Bel Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Hi Colin, I am indeed referring to a 4LAV. I have cobbled together the sides for the TCL from two Ian Kirk CK's I have had in the loft for a while. I intend to start a new topic early next week once I have a day off. I may have enough parts to do one of the driving trailers with a couple of brake ends I have. So far it's quite promising. Cheers for now, Ian. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted February 5, 2012 Author Share Posted February 5, 2012 I've just had a message from Ceptic re. 4 CIG ends. He has informed me that the inner carriage ends have a uniform curve, unlike the loco-hauled Mk.1 stock which have three flat panels. Now I don't want to grumble and get the topic locked, so I'm not going to say why I had assumed the 4 CIG had ends with essentailly three flat faces. This means that there is a great deal more modification to do to thse end (if they can beused at all). The roof ends are also now in need of re-profiling. Having looked at the parts again, I can see that the roof carries the section of the end above the corridor connector. I could ignore the problem, but as I haven't even started on the bodies, there is time to think. (Expletives deleted.) Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lochnagar Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 A bit of 'modellers license' may be required! Fine reprofiling can be achieved with needle files and wet and dry. Don't drop the project! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Evil Bus Driver Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 There are some good detail photos here: http://semgonline.com/gallery/class421_04.html Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted February 5, 2012 Author Share Posted February 5, 2012 There are some good detail photos here: http://semgonline.co...lass421_04.html Thanks, Ceptic has just pm-ed me the same link. It definitely is going to be out with the needle files as Lochnagar says, although looking at the amount of work involved, scratch-built ends might be quicker. Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave_long Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 Hi Following with interest but being a midlander I'm far from knowledgeable on these EMUs but have you checked out the Genesis kits EMU front, they state that they are for CIG units also. http://pluto.servers.rbl-mer.misp.co.uk/~torqueoc/genesiskits.co.uk/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.tpl&product_id=45&category_id=19&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=3 Regards Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold griffgriff Posted February 5, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 5, 2012 Perhaps a structural flat end with a resin cast 'bow' end stuck to it??? ...will be following this closely you might just inspire someone to follow in you footsteps Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5Bel Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 Hi Colin, I wasn't aware the ends were a uniform curve either. It's a bit late for mine though! At least you found out at the start of the project. I am sure you will think of a solution. Cheers for now, Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted February 5, 2012 Author Share Posted February 5, 2012 Well, all thoughts of ends, curved, bowed and certainly not three-faceted, were put out of mind for a bit. It was time for some action: The Hornby pick-up motor bogie has gone into the chassis really easily. If I am now told that the bogie centres of the 4 CIG motor are not the same as a standard Mk.1 centres, there will be more swearing! Having cut one original Bachmann bogie pivot boss flush with the bottom edge of the solebars and drilled out the pivot hole to 5mm dia., the bogie just popped in. But then, flushed with success, I set about excising all the parts that were on a class 73 motor bogie, but were not on a CIG one. Off came the sand pipes and their boxes. The brake gear looked well out of line with the wheels so of that came too. A lot of careful cutting has had to be done to the polythene bogie side frames. Having looked at the link to the Smeg webpage with photos of bogies, it is clear that a lot of linkages and cylinders as well as new brake gear can be added. I shall have in-line brakes on the B4 bogies too - a much simpler job. It'll be the usual Parks-style 'smoke and mirrors' detailing, but good enough from a distance. Still some tidying up to do around the spring hangers, but at least the offending parts are gone. The ride height of the new bogie might need a tweak. "Close enough for rock & roll" as my old friend Arthur would say. Edited for bad punctuation Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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