garyw1970 Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 Ive bought 3 of these at £4 each in Wellingborough ( whsmith,coop and a newsagent). i think they are not bad for there price ,ok they are not so detailed as a Bachmann model and there is no badges/numbers etc but they have flush glazing, small hooks for coupling that are removeable . So does anyone know whom makes it ,my mk1s (triang/Hornby/lima/Bachmann plus few more brands) are in my parents loft so couldnt cross reference them. Maybe Bachmann has done a sort of Hornby railroad version Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thunderer08 Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 WHsmiths in the mall in Blackburn has 8-10 left Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
'CHARD Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 Ive bought 3 of these at £4 each in Wellingborough ( whsmith,coop and a newsagent). i think they are not bad for there price ,ok they are not so detailed as a Bachmann model and there is no badges/numbers etc but they have flush glazing, small hooks for coupling that are removeable . So does anyone know whom makes it ,my mk1s (triang/Hornby/lima/Bachmann plus few more brands) are in my parents loft so couldnt cross reference them. Maybe Bachmann has done a sort of Hornby railroad version The consensus seems to be that this is a Chinese home-brewed product to fulfil Hachette's commission. Its features suggest that it's been reverse engineered from the Bachmann MkI with a few Replica and possibly Hornby elements. It has also been suggested that Bachmann may be about to launch its own version of a Railroad range. I'm not sure where that rumour originated. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyw1970 Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 It's an offer, so its not one of the part works, it'll prob be something like under/circa £30 jinty is a Bachmann one and its an extra at £70 as are the controlers and working lights Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Huw Griffiths Posted September 2, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 2, 2013 Just found out that a local-ish newsagent to me (who is a very keen rail enthusiast) ordered 100 of them! I've taken a couple off his hands for possible future use. I believe he still has a substantial stock left though. I wonder if any conspiracy theorists see a timeline developing here: August 1968 - rumours started to circulate of a "Strategic Steam Reserve" - which turned out to be a load of withdrawn locos sitting in a scrapyard in Barry - a port which had been expanded for exporting coal, but was more recently used for importing "hands" of a yellow fruit known for its slippery skin. The only reason most of these locos weren't scrapped was that it was easier / more cost effective for the workers to deal with wagons etc already on the site. By the time the wagons were gone, groups of enthusiats were looking for steam locos to restore - locos which the scrapyard owner was only too happy to sell them. August 2013 - rumours of a new strategic reserve - this time of unbranded plastic model coaches - some likely to be modified / upgraded - some scrapped / used as parts donors - some sidelined for future projects, which may or may not happen. However, it's probably best to point out that there's no danger of people "going bananas" ... . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyw1970 Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 Although the discussion about this partwork has mainly been around the coaches I've been wondering what its launch says about the hobby. Clearly Hachette thinks there's enough of a market to make it worth putting at least the first few installments into the general news trade and although it might seem crude to many of us, the advertising makes it clear what sort of layout you'd have if you completed it. Outside of a few serious modellers most of the adults I know who have layouts, including within my own family, seem quite happy with a roundy round (often double track so two trains can run) with a few sidings mounted on a flat board on which they run unmodified proprietary rolling stock. There may be a few buildings plonked down in more or less appropriate places and maybe a suggestion of roads etc.but that's about as far as the artistry goes. I remember the reports on John Snow's layout last year and that seemed to be really a large version of the flat board circuit as was the layout (possibly put together for the occasion) that appeared as James May's in his Toy Story series. Does this mean that for most people the hobby is really more about running model trains and that actual modelling is rather a minority taste and is this due to lack of interest or a lack of faith in their ability to achieve more actual modelling? Do most people who look at a well finished layout at a show simply think that it's very nice but not what they're interested in or do they, as I rather suspect, simply think that they could never do that? If the latter then maybe something could be done to encourage more people to dip their toes into the really creative and more satisfying aspects of modelling. Any ideas? i think its not as such for proper modelers moe people that want a layout and dont undstand the ins and outs . or for a parent who kids likes trains but never considered a layout. On a plus side these people that stick with this in turn might want more trains etc. Being on tv will make people more aware of what railway modeling is about and thats a big plus Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyw1970 Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 from an email to the company doing this set Dear GaryThank you for your email. Please note that we operate independently of any newsagent and as such, work on a different dispatch cycle. Please be advised that there are, at present, a planned number of 120 issues in this collection. However, please keep in mind that the publisher may decide to extend the series at any time without any formal or prior notice. The frequency for subscribers will be forthnightly for the 1st 9 issues and then weekly from issue 10 onwards. All the track, buildings and accessories are included within the collection. The only additional items needed to purchase, which will be made via reader offer, will be the engine and electrical kit. costs for subscribers:Issue 1 £3.99 Issue 2 £5.99 Issue 3 onwards £8.99 each Binders £5.99 each Locomotive Engine- Buchmann 00 gauge Flower Class 3F 'Jinty' £69.99 Electricsand speed controller for layout £39.99 Please do not hesitate to contact us should you require further assistance. Yours sincerely, CJ Retief Customer Care Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyw1970 Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 and this was another i hope this helps people out Dear Gary Thank you for your email. The buildings are plastic, and there are other wagons and/or coaches planned for the collection. The engine is the Bachmann Jinty which will be available via reader offer Please do not hesitate to contact us should you require further assistance. Yours sincerely, CJ Retief Customer Care Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold traction Posted September 2, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 2, 2013 Hi Gary, I also got the same replies on price of the extras. Then they came back with this as well base board size 180cm x 220cm!!! Where the hell are you supposed to keep that!! In the email I got the girl did say this was all in the magazine, not in the first one, I've not seen any mention of a finished sized. Then £69.99 for the Bachmann Jinty. Then £39.99 for electrics and controller........would that mean layout wiring, it can't also mean point motors? This is going to be the biggest problem with this series, the size is just way too big. When I've been at exhibitions with the N-gauge TrakMat layout most parents have loved it because of the size and it will fit under a single bed. This certainly won't! I would liked to have subscribed to this and done a build thread with photos and write ups but I just don't have that sort of room, it's huge! Although it could be zapped with the shrink ray down to N, which is still on the large size but much more manageable! Cheers Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Huw Griffiths Posted September 2, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 2, 2013 Although the discussion about this partwork has mainly been around the coaches I've been wondering what its launch says about the hobby. Clearly Hachette thinks there's enough of a market to make it worth putting at least the first few installments into the general news trade and although it might seem crude to many of us, the advertising makes it clear what sort of layout you'd have if you completed it. Outside of a few serious modellers most of the adults I know who have layouts, including within my own family, seem quite happy with a roundy round (often double track so two trains can run) with a few sidings mounted on a flat board on which they run unmodified proprietary rolling stock. There may be a few buildings plonked down in more or less appropriate places and maybe a suggestion of roads etc.but that's about as far as the artistry goes. I remember the reports on Peter Snow's layout last year and that seemed to be really a large version of the flat board circuit as was the layout (possibly put together for the occasion) that appeared as James May's in his Toy Story series. Does this mean that for most people the hobby is really more about running model trains and that actual modelling is rather a minority taste and is this due to lack of interest or a lack of faith in their ability to achieve more actual modelling? Do most people who look at a well finished layout at a show simply think that it's very nice but not what they're interested in or do they, as I rather suspect, simply think that they could never do that? If the latter then maybe something could be done to encourage more people to dip their toes into the really creative and more satisfying aspects of modelling. Any ideas? Something like basic model coaches, sold at a price low enough for people to be happy about hacking them to pieces - and for them not to worry too much if they make mistakes? Joking aside, I wonder how long it will be before one of the mainstream magazines decides to do another of those project layouts - running over 6 or 12 months - and marketed along the lines of: "For the Average Beginner". (To make things even easier, they could even include a "what's needed" list in the first part.) Either that - or a "bookazine", sold through newsagents and based on the writings of a late former editor of Railway Modeller. If any TV schedulers were to take note of viewer wishes, perhaps it might also be time for a major free-to-view channel to start doing a series about model railways - or about modelmaking in general. Something interesting - aimed at ordinary people - and shown at a time when ordinary people would be likely to watch. I'm sure they could think of someone suitable to present it - there seem to be a number of well known people who are interested in the subject - and I'm sure that a number of members of this site (and other similar sites) would also be more than capable of doing the honours. Whatever the end-product turned out like, my guess is that a number of people here would find it rather more interesting than the current fare of: soaps - "Pond Life with Jezza" (haven't you heard - they're all stars - well there are plenty of the things coming out of their mouths) - "Y Factor" (as in "why bother") - and zzzzzzzz-list "Strictly go Prancing" that we're forced to endure at present. Saying all this, I'm sure somebody will be along soon with different views. Huw. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrewribs Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 A couple of hours work and they don't look too bad, quite acceptable to me. Not my era but I got some to run behind my Westerns/Warship. Roof has been re-sprayed with Humbrol 67 before the whole coach was satin varnished, masking the windows took the most time. Once I have done my others I will give them a gentle weathering. Before After The only thing I will do is replace the coupling bar with one from Keen Systems so I can use the Hornby Roco style couplings. Andrew Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevo185 Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 I bought 4 of these to add to my Hornby Mk1s. I'm not fussed about detail inaccuracies, just wanted to have some more coaches to drag behind a loco. However when the trailing bogie reaches either of the Hornby points on my outer loop, that bogie derails. It does it whether they are running in a rake, or just pushing them over the points manually. I can feel a very big lump as it derails when pushing them over the point and it is never the leading bogie always the rear, even when I reverse the carriage. All my other rolling stock passes the points without a problem. Might it be a function of the wheel profile, or the spring loading of the coupling? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baby Deltic Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 Check the back to back tolerances on the axles in question. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Downendian Posted September 2, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 2, 2013 In the interest of balance it's worth recounting a discussion I've just had today with Jim Smith-Wright on detailing mark 1 coaching stock. Jim's projects on Bachy mark 1s can be found here http://www.p4newstreet.com/mark1 Both the Hachette and Bachmann models have errors, it's just that the Bachmann models have less of them and serve as better "donors" for detailing projects, in my opinion, despite the cost differential. As always we should not be comparing one model to another (remember the Dapol vs Heljan Western debate) it should be a critique based on the new model to prototype and not to an existing one which has a number of other errors. On saying that though, I've recently bought a number of inferior Heljan Westerns (to Dapol in some departments) because they are cheap and serve as easier detailing projects. Therefore I fully support those that want to have a go at detailing the Hachette models, despite it being more work than Bachmann. The rivet counter debate doesn't seem to go away, we are a model railway forum. Isn't a big part of what we do debate new models? Bob's criticisms of the models were a detailed list of what needs to be done to improve them - I didn't see any element of discouragement of those that have bought them, but pointing out facts to help people that want to have a go. Neil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrewribs Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 http://www.keen-systems.com/Bachmann%20MkI%20Coupling%20&%20Corridors.html Keen systems recommend a few mods to the Bachmann bogie, might be worth a try as the close coupling system is identical. Andrew Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 As always we should not be comparing one model to another (remember the Dapol vs Heljan Western debate) it should be a critique based on the new model to prototype and not to an existing one which has a number of other errors. That's a very bold and radical idea! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Evil Bus Driver Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 They do have Bachmann style stepped couplings with close coupling mechanism, but the roof isn't ribbed quite as deeply and the bogies clip in rather than screw in Replica style. Maybe they're old Bachmann tooling.? That was what I was thinking. Perhaps the old tooling they used to use or have sold to someone like replica. I bought one because I thought it was the new Hornby railroad coach (and lets face it, it'd be a great way to promote those) so I wanted to have a look. In any case you can't really argue with £4 for a length of track and a RTR coach. Even if it does go up after issue 2. I think the partwork idea is ok in theory, although most of the stuff i can source elsewhere but as far as a layout idea it's more for the Dad who wants to build a train set for the kids, as I will be doing in a couple of years for my nephew. After a while I can just see "Smokey Joe" bombing around at lightning speed with its blu-tacked in driver and fireman flying out of the cab and vanishing into the ether. I might try and get a couple more copies of this issue as then I have the basis of a new "experimental" rake - The two or three coaches that have new ideas/liveries/close coupling experiments) inflicted on them. The other three I had have long since given up the ghost - I don't think the push stud bogie mounting idea was a goer lol Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete 75C Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 The rivet counter debate doesn't seem to go away, we are a model railway forum. Isn't a big part of what we do debate new models? Bob's criticisms of the models were a detailed list of what needs to be done to improve them - I didn't see any element of discouragement of those that have bought them, but pointing out facts to help people that want to have a go. Neil The rivet counter debate will always be with us as long as *some* of those that know a truss rod from a lightning rod adopt a somewhat superior attitude towards those that don't. Having said that, it works both ways too... far too may threads develop into a "my dad's bigger than your dad" playground standoff. Thank God for those that try to inject a little (sometimes misguided) humour into what could be a very very dull place. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baby Deltic Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 The rivet counter debate will always be with us as long as *some* of those that know a truss rod from a lightning rod adopt a somewhat superior attitude towards those that don't. Having said that, it works both ways too... far too may threads develop into a "my dad's bigger than your dad" playground standoff. Thank God for those that try to inject a little (sometimes misguided) humour into what could be a very very dull place. Well, my dad IS bigger than your dad, so there! Ner ner-ner-ner-ner! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Reid Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 I don't think it's old Bachmann tooling - it's a bit coarse for that but it is definitely budget adaptations of the same moulds used for producing the Bachmann Mk1's. There's been a few revisions/alterations to the tooling - the sides, being that 2mm longer, have had some extra length added - similarly the ends have been thickened up - however have a close look and you'll see on the underframe/body end moulding, the mould ejection marks are in exactly the same place, and they've copied the error Bachmann made in not making the brake shafts the correct length... They could have come from the same factory however they could be as mentioned before a bit of reverse engineering as some subtle changes have happened along the way.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baby Deltic Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 I don't think it's old Bachmann tooling - it's a bit coarse for that but it is definitely budget adaptations of the same moulds used for producing the Bachmann Mk1's. There's been a few revisions/alterations to the tooling - the sides, being that 2mm longer, have had some extra length added - similarly the ends have been thickened up - however have a close look and you'll see on the underframe/body end moulding, the mould ejection marks are in exactly the same place, and they've copied the error Bachmann made in not making the brake shafts the correct length... They could have come from the same factory however they could be as mentioned before a bit of reverse engineering as some subtle changes have happened along the way.... They probably had to change them by about twenty percent to avoid a copyright infringement against Bachmann. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Reid Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 Kind of looks like that BD - there's a lot of similarities - but a lot of 'not quite' as well - certainly more than 20% It has all the hallmarks of a copy of a model funnily enough.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Y Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 If there was any likelihood that such a publication may have brought newcomers into the hobby (at least through developing curiosity rather than 2 years of hand-holding) that's probably unlikely to happen in any great number as Issue 1 has been harvested by those who aren't going to be interested in following the course. I know partworks anticipate reducing sales after the first issue(s) but I think the coach-carrot will be what's likely to scupper the run as I'm sure a number of newbies will have missed the boat. I'm not blaming the modellers but I'm not sure the 'gift' element was thought through due to its stand-alone value. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baby Deltic Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 The 'gift's were gratefully received. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete 75C Posted September 2, 2013 Share Posted September 2, 2013 Well, my dad IS bigger than your dad, so there! Ner ner-ner-ner-ner! It's not my fault he's only 4'9"... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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