RMweb Premium St Enodoc Posted September 18, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 18, 2020 16 minutes ago, queensquare said: I have limited knowledge of aircraft but want the sort of thing that amateur pilots would have been buzzing around in in the 1920s. I've ordered a couple of 1:144 plastic kits of WW1 aircraft on the assumption that, like lorries, they were sold off after the war as army surplus - or at least similar aircraft produced for civilian use. Jerry, an Avro 504K woudl be suitable. Hundreds were sold off for civilian use after the war: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avro_504 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
justin1985 Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 51 minutes ago, queensquare said: I've ordered a couple of 1:144 plastic kits of WW1 aircraft on the assumption that, like lorries, they were sold off after the war as army surplus - or at least similar aircraft produced for civilian use. Any further information, particularly pictures, would be welcome. Jerry I don't know which kits you found Jerry, but the Czech manufacturer Valom makes some exquisite 1:144 WW1 aircraft, almost all as twin packs. I bought a few a while back with the intention of making some little dioramas, but haven't got beyond opening the boxes and admiring the parts! They all have really nice detailed plastic mouldings, and etched brass struts etc - a world away from the old Airfix I knew from when I was a kid! https://www.hannants.co.uk/manufacturer/valom?per_page=50&sort=0&search_direction=asc&scale_id=957 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold queensquare Posted September 18, 2020 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted September 18, 2020 52 minutes ago, justin1985 said: I don't know which kits you found Jerry, but the Czech manufacturer Valom makes some exquisite 1:144 WW1 aircraft, almost all as twin packs. I bought a few a while back with the intention of making some little dioramas, but haven't got beyond opening the boxes and admiring the parts! They all have really nice detailed plastic mouldings, and etched brass struts etc - a world away from the old Airfix I knew from when I was a kid! https://www.hannants.co.uk/manufacturer/valom?per_page=50&sort=0&search_direction=asc&scale_id=957 Hi Justin, it is Valom kits I bought - a Fokker D.VII vs Spad XIII and a Bristol F2B vs Rumpler C.IV. The kits come with four aircraft in each and I thought, for the price, it was worth a punt. From your description they sound an absolute bargain. I can see me buying more of these, a row of tiny tri and bi planes would look great in my display cabinet. I did a quick Wikepedia search and many hundreds of aircraft were sold off after the war. The Bristol F2B two seater fighter/reconnaissance was particularly popular in civilian use. Jerry 3 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 03060 Posted September 18, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 18, 2020 When I was a 'small' kid back in the 70's (as opposed to the 'big' one I am now) one of my brother's friends dads used to build kits of WW1 planes to a very high standard and had them displayed all up the stairs and around the landing, a superb display which I've never forgotten. Over the years I've bought several kits and magazines for myself to try and replicate some of these.....but, as ever, haven't quite got there yet. Would love to see some photos please, Jerry, when you've completed some. Regards, Ian. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium DLT Posted September 18, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 18, 2020 I built all the biplanes that Airfix and Revel produced, some of them came in pair as "Dogfight Doubles". I've still got them packed away somewhere. Cheers, Dave 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted September 18, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 18, 2020 Dogfight! 6 3 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Donw Posted September 18, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 18, 2020 When living on the Isle of Wight one of the Airfields was just down the road so we had daily displays from a yellow Tiger Moth and all sorts of small planes. We had a Spitfire flying over several times. Don 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anglian Posted September 20, 2020 Share Posted September 20, 2020 You might want to improve the wings in the Valom kits. I bought a couple but found that the rib position is indicated by depression ie. scored line, when in fact the wing ribs are prominent once covered with fabric. Of course if you suspend your aircraft high enough above the layout you'll only see the undersides of the wings. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
neilkirby Posted September 20, 2020 Share Posted September 20, 2020 . . . . Or would it? An aircrat in flight has a lower airpressure over the surface of the wing, Would this not 'suck' the fabric upwards when in the air? I don't know, and am certainly no aircraft expert, it just that what you said got me wondering? Regards, Neil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted September 20, 2020 Share Posted September 20, 2020 2 hours ago, neilkirby said: . . . . Or would it? An aircrat in flight has a lower airpressure over the surface of the wing, Would this not 'suck' the fabric upwards when in the air? I don't know, and am certainly no aircraft expert, it just that what you said got me wondering? Regards, Neil Not sure doped cloth behaves suite like that - it’s pretty stiff, unlike say sail cloth. Adam Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Donw Posted September 20, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 20, 2020 3 hours ago, neilkirby said: . . . . Or would it? An aircrat in flight has a lower airpressure over the surface of the wing, Would this not 'suck' the fabric upwards when in the air? I don't know, and am certainly no aircraft expert, it just that what you said got me wondering? Regards, Neil Ah but it is the air having to go faster round the shape of the wing that causes the uplift. I think the air travelling faster reduces the pressure and the air below the wing being at a higher pressure pushes the wing upwards. So it depends on whether the air inside the wing is at the higher pressure from the air below or the lower pressure from the air above. I suspect the doped fabric is fairly stiff. Sucking is not really a force all it is just removing air (or water) to reduce pressure causing the pressure around to force material in. Don Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
richbrummitt Posted September 20, 2020 Share Posted September 20, 2020 3 hours ago, Donw said: Ah but it is the air having to go faster round the shape of the wing that causes the uplift. I think the air travelling faster reduces the pressure and the air below the wing being at a higher pressure pushes the wing upwards. So it depends on whether the air inside the wing is at the higher pressure from the air below or the lower pressure from the air above. I suspect the doped fabric is fairly stiff. Sucking is not really a force all it is just removing air (or water) to reduce pressure causing the pressure around to force material in. Don if the wing is truly sealed then the pressure inside will only change with varying temperature. I suspect that sealed is, however not the case. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anglian Posted September 20, 2020 Share Posted September 20, 2020 The fabric is sewn onto the wing ribs so the wing profile remains fairly constant. The rib positions are always relatively prominent. The Valom wings can be improved if you at least fill the score marks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold queensquare Posted September 21, 2020 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted September 21, 2020 (edited) Well I know very little about the air pressure around the wings and the extent to which I shall modify/ improve them remains to be seen but my couple of kits arrived today and I have to say I'm very impressed. My picture shows just half of what comes in the box - two of the four aircraft comprising crisp mouldings, delicate etches and a nice set of transfers. All for around £12-£14 including postage - bargain. Jerry Edited April 1, 2022 by queensquare 14 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
2mm Andy Posted September 22, 2020 Share Posted September 22, 2020 16 hours ago, queensquare said: Well I know very little about the air pressure around the wings and the extent to which I shall modify/ improve them remains to be seen but my couple of kits arrived today and I have to say I'm very impressed. My picture shows just half of what comes in the box - two of the four aircraft comprising crisp mouldings, delicate etches and a nice set of transfers. All for around £12-£14 including postage - bargain. Jerry Jerry, Nice to see that you picked a prototype with disc wheels, not spoked.... More seriously, given your use of aerial photographs in building the model of Bath Queen Square, perhaps you could model an aeroplane fitted with aerial photography equipment? (I've no idea if Bristol 2FBs were used for this post-WW1 but it would make an unusual cameo). Andy 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold queensquare Posted September 22, 2020 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted September 22, 2020 39 minutes ago, 2mm Andy said: Jerry, Nice to see that you picked a prototype with disc wheels, not spoked.... More seriously, given your use of aerial photographs in building the model of Bath Queen Square, perhaps you could model an aeroplane fitted with aerial photography equipment? (I've no idea if Bristol 2FBs were used for this post-WW1 but it would make an unusual cameo). Andy Hi Andy, great minds and all that but that thought occurred to me as well - its one of the reasons I chose the Bristol 2FB as, being a 2 seater they would lend themselves to this sort of thing. The other potential use of the very nice fuselage and wing moldings is as an unusual wagon load. I presume aircraft being delivered to new owners would have simply been flown there but you then have to provide a pilot and get them back again. Does anyone know of pictures of aircraft being delivered, in parts, by train. There was a major military establishment at Blandford that recieved rail traffic so possibly some justification. Jerry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
neilkirby Posted September 22, 2020 Share Posted September 22, 2020 I was only vaguely 'thinking out loud' yesterday. A quick google today of WW1 aircraft in flight, shows that my speculation was wrong! Regards, Neil 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted September 22, 2020 Share Posted September 22, 2020 As it happens what Aerofilms actually used about this point was a De Havilland DH.9 which doesn’t look so dissimilar to a Bristol F2B. Can you get one of these in this scale I wonder? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerofilms Yes, I know it’s Wikipedia but the references are all contemporary periodicals which is promising. Adam Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jan W Posted September 22, 2020 Share Posted September 22, 2020 There's even a picture of the Aerofilms De Havilland with photographers: https://artsandculture.google.com/asset/francis-lewis-wills-jerry-shaw-and-claude-friese-greene-in-a-dh98-biplane-aerofilms-ltd/kAH9r_6ojIczUQ 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 65179 Posted September 22, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 22, 2020 5 hours ago, Adam said: As it happens what Aerofilms actually used about this point was a De Havilland DH.9 which doesn’t look so dissimilar to a Bristol F2B. Can you get one of these in this scale I wonder? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerofilms Yes, I know it’s Wikipedia but the references are all contemporary periodicals which is promising. Adam https://www.shapeways.com/product/SE2TGQX4J/1-144-airco-dh-9 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium MrSimon Posted September 22, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 22, 2020 In the Tatlow NPCS book there’s a picture of a North Staffs six wheel aeroplane van, and a L&Y CCT for aeroplanes too but I guess if you want to see the plane they're not much use to you... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jan W Posted September 22, 2020 Share Posted September 22, 2020 (edited) There's a prototype for everything.... Edit: what happend to the buffer of this wagon? It would not be used in regular traffic like this I think? Edited September 23, 2020 by Jan W 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 03060 Posted September 22, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 22, 2020 (edited) 17 hours ago, Jan W said: There's even a picture of the Aerofilms De Havilland with photographers: https://artsandculture.google.com/asset/francis-lewis-wills-jerry-shaw-and-claude-friese-greene-in-a-dh98-biplane-aerofilms-ltd/kAH9r_6ojIczUQ Well Jerry, I for one will be checking very carefully to make sure that you don't 'accidentally' slip an extra 'U' into this paintscheme should you decide to model it during Sat night MotD.....if so, I may have to paint a Fokker Triplane up in White, Yellow and Blue livery to hunt yours down, I wonder what their range would have been from Elland Road ? Edited September 23, 2020 by 03060 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bécasse Posted September 23, 2020 Share Posted September 23, 2020 11 hours ago, Jan W said: There's a prototype for everything.... Edit: what happend to the buffer of this wagon? It would not be used in regular traffic like this I think? The bogies, the use of a pin & bar centre coupler and presence of an air pipe, and, perhaps above all, the overhead power lines and their support poles, suggest an American prototype prior to the use of buck-eye couplers. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted September 23, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 23, 2020 The caption includes "Royal Air Force Fairey Gordon biplane ' cutaway ' on its way to Cairo, Egypt from Palestine - circa 1936", but there is reference to the Library of Congress. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now