yorkie_pudd Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 Failing that , we form an orderly queue to punch his lights out . NO mate we just move the kettle further away so he has to do more then the 20 yard walk for a cuppa, or deflate the tyres on the company mobility scooter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Stubby47 Posted March 6, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 6, 2012 Other than the few in the know, would anyone have realised the change in ownership if Andy had not been open & honest and told us himself ? Yes, we all have a vested interest in the forum because of the huge benefit we all get ( see the Best of / Worst of thread ), but can we just wait and see what, if any, changes are made before arranging the joint lynching of Andy & Warners ? Yes, voice concerns if you perceive there has been , not might be, a change which is detrimental ( not just different) to the forum, vote with your feet if you must, but for goodness sake, give it a chance. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Y Posted March 6, 2012 Author Share Posted March 6, 2012 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wombatofludham Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 As I said, from experience from a gaming forum that I was a mod for some years ago - was part of an independent network, then the game was bought by Electronic Arts, I could understand your concern had RMWeb been acquired by Electronic Arts, you've only got to look at the furore they created when they took control of the Rail Simulator project and wanted to stick advertising billboards linked by the web to servers selling advertising space to see quite what their view is of "community", I'd trust EA about as far as I can p**s into a Force 10 gale. However, my experience of a major publisher taking over an entertainment website is completely different, apart from a tiny strapline across the bottom and some discreet but increased advertising banners which don't affect the site functionality, you wouldn't know the publisher of Vogue had any input to the site. I think the fundamental issue is this: Andy has said donations and advertising were only just covering running costs but it was a wing and a prayer job - if donations reduced, which is highly likely as people forget, move on or cut back on expenditure, or ad revenue was down, who knows what would happen. Having to rattle the electronic begging bowl every year is a thankless task. Andy has said also he had been made redundant, and was uncertain as to what time he would be able to devote to running the site. My experience of trying to get others involved in the running of other railway websites is that whilst many are prepared to gob off on issues, no-one will step up and offer help to run the site, and I suspect Andy had already got as many active members as he was ever likely to get. So, with Andy having to find full-time work, and the site having to run financially on relatively insecure sources of revenue which in themselves required an amount of work to get the electronic begging bowl around, I really can't fault Andy's decision to not only seek a more secure basis for keeping the site going but, by a stroke of genius, also turn the management of the site into a paid job to boot. In that respect, I actually think it will be a positive move in that Andy will now have no excuse for not keeping the site going - it's his livelihood now. Unfortunately, and it isn't unique to websites, people regularly underestimate the costs and time penalties involved in doing any voluntary work and assume more can be done than is physically or financially possible - and running this site was a voluntary job, let us not forget. I think given a choice between joining forces with Warners and having Andy take on a paid role looking after the site, or the alternative, which could well have been a fruitless appeal for help and financial support followed by a decision to put real life first and mothball the site (my experience says there would not have been a mass stepping up to the plate to help, nor would there have been a massive financial boost, not without a lot of arm twisting although Andy might have different experiences on that), I'd prefer a relationship with a publisher. Cynical? Yes. But I point you towards the electronic railway magazine "Railway Herald" which has been free for some years, but recently got into bed with Ian Allan following much the same reasoning as has happened here, increasing cost of hosting, time taken to produce the magazine and insufficient ad and other revenues to keep going. What's happened? It's gone subscription. I haven't subscribed - I'm old fashioned and if I pay for something I like something tangible back, which is why I never buy download only software or music, plus I already have several IA subscriptions. Oddly enough, the "free trial period" has just been extended, ostensibly because of technical issues, but I suspect more likely because they haven't had enough subscriptions to make the project worthwhile. At least Warners haven't asked us to pay for this site. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Worsdell forever Posted March 6, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 6, 2012 That's a bit negative Andy... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Debs. Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 That's a bit negative Andy... ...,,,,and we`ve still got nothing in black and white! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bon Accord Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 At least Warners haven't asked us to pay for this site. As has been mentioned numerous times in many dozens of posts (from both 'camps'), it's early days yet.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Y Posted March 6, 2012 Author Share Posted March 6, 2012 nor would there have been a massive financial boost, not without a lot of arm twisting although Andy might have different experiences on that), I'll be the first to say that any such requests for funding have always been very well supported and therein lay part of my problem; I didn't want the same people year in, year out feeling an obligation, no matter how graciously given, to prop the place up for those who would never dream of coughing up a ha'penny if they were choking on it (or giving a second of their time that they'd rather spend moaning about something). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted March 6, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 6, 2012 Jeez Pete; have you installed a webcam?! A lunchtime shower today once I knew the outage was sorted; yukk! I hate to ask - but what sort of outage ? I really hope you mean the down time this morning. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Y Posted March 6, 2012 Author Share Posted March 6, 2012 Yes; I must get some blinds for the conservatory. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackRat Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 The only thing I ask from Andy is to take a shower and put some clothes on in the morning. Andy...........................Work in the 'nuddies' mate! Thats where the big bucks (and we aint talking money here ) is on this interwebby thing! Cue lots of naughty railway related do8uble entendres phnarr phnarr ps as an aside re funding, how many of the actual total membership ever put their hands in their pockets to keep the site running? How many have actually contributed to anything at all? How many just look and take? No once again, Andy has made a good decision for himself, the site and I think ultimately us. And Warners............they get access to 1000's of fruitloops, wibble (we all KNOW you gotta be mad to be into toy trains dont we ) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Chris116 Posted March 6, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 6, 2012 Hang on - RMweb's been bought by Warners - not an Italian cruise line! It would have sunk by now if that were true!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted March 6, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 6, 2012 Presumably advertising and donations were covering the server costs - otherwise we wouldn't still be here. How much time? That could be overcome with a larger moderating team, more volunteer contributors etc - just like every other "not for profit" forum on the web. Are they as big/busy as RMWeb? Maybe, maybe not, but whilst I accept that Andy Y has done a great job with the forum up until the takeover, are we really saying that there is not one other person on the face of this planet, let alone member of this forum, that would not have been capable of doing a similar thing? I know I'm not ... but that's not really the point, is it? Those suggestions cover the cost and time options, so those are 'solutions' in a way. I am sure that the right members would have stepped up to the plate if the request for help had been made openly in the forum. Fair enough then - we should have asked Andy to simply run it to his rules on our behalf and have paid him a decent salary to do it. All we need to decide is what is 'a decent salary' for someone with some clearly pretty good IT skills and who is prepared to work the long hours which Andy has put in - and having agreed it we give him a contract and sign ourselves up to pay that plus the site costs for X years. How much will you be in for, every year? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Worsdell forever Posted March 6, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 6, 2012 Cue lots of naughty railway related do8uble entendres phnarr phnarr Cue Boris... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted March 6, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 6, 2012 Or, if you prefer, given a choice between visiting one small club run model show and ten Ally Pally's (run by Warners) then I'd go for the one small club show any time. It's the whole atmosphere that's completely different because it doesn't have the commercial emphasis. Conversely some local shows are cr@p, give me a professional show over them any day of the week. Commercial emphasis is not wrong, it can easily complement the more "amateur" offerings. (I use that term loosely and not derogatory), after all, every one is in it for financial gain, be it their own coffers or corporate ones, who are we to say which is better. Try getting off the high horse about Warners, we all realise you don't like them, it's getting boring now. PS - You haven't addressed the point about Andys mortgage yet. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagrizz Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 when I started working at home I recorded half an album before taking a shower once - divorce was threatened after that (I will not mention my butt sticking to my leather chair which was thrown out by the powers that be, we all have them). Pete, too much information I think.......... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 Pete, too much information I think.......... Hence "TMI". But seriously Andy could have just closed the site....Full stop. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagrizz Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 Hence "TMI". Sorry Pete, I didn't get the TMI bit. ABA (another bl**dy acronym) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
halfwit Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 ps as an aside re funding, how many of the actual total membership ever put their hands in their pockets to keep the site running? How many have actually contributed to anything at all? How many just look and take? Me personally, not a penny. I seem to be perpetually skint and any spare hobby money goes on solder, tools, motors etc. I am a bit ashamed of that though, which is why I spent time volunteering at the Chasewater event manning a gate and volunteered to help at the last event (although I coudn't make it at the end). I reckon that there's plenty more like me who would have contributed financialy if the funds were available. I'd like to think that I've contributed with some hopefully interesting modelling content and some help and advice. As for looking and taking - you get out of a forum, club, etc. what you put into it. So the 'lookers and takers' are missing out really. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 Yes; I must get some blinds for the conservatory. Just imagine if RMWeb had been bought by Rupert Murdoch........."Hunk of the Day" or in my case "Lump of the Day". The other truism is what Paul is getting at. The real value of the site is the information (or drivel) that gets written by the Members (oo'er...). Best, Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwin_m Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 I'd like to add my congratulations to Andy on securing a well-deserved employment via this forum. I have to admit to being sceptical about Warners, so I hope Andy will influence the way Warners operate rather than the other way round! As we seem to be getting into nautical metaphors I'm hoping it's "steady as she goes" with Andy's hand remaining firmly on the tiller. The new owners need to understand that a forum is fragile - get things wrong and it withers - which isn't in the interest of the owner, the operator or the membership. Fortunately the man who has got so many things right on this forum is still in charge. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted March 6, 2012 Share Posted March 6, 2012 ......when I started working at home I recorded half an album before taking a shower once - divorce was threatened after that (I will not mention my butt sticking to my leather chair which was thrown out by the powers that be, we all have them). Yep, cream leather can be a bitch, you'd have got away with it on brown leather.......... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJS1977 Posted March 7, 2012 Share Posted March 7, 2012 This sounds like good news to me - my father's an avid reader of BRM and it seems a good magazine, so I think they will be good custodians of RMWeb. And of course Andy working full time will give him more opportunity to develop the site and maybe iron out a few of its minor foibles. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Many years ago a London gentleman was a part-time (unpaid?) editor of a model railway magazine. One day he was called to an interview at Waterloo station where another man told him his company had just bought the title and would he like to edit the magazine full time? The Londoner just had time to shout "Yes" through a window as the train pulled out. Shortly afterwards Cyril Freezer moved to Devon to take up his new job and Railway Modeller has never looked back! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorkie_pudd Posted March 7, 2012 Share Posted March 7, 2012 That's a bit negative Andy... ...,,,,and we`ve still got nothing in black and white! and there was me thinking RMweb 3D had been cut down to 1 dimensional gauge. Be no good in touch screen as wont be able to feel the lumps n bumps....... ooooooer mrs Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
signalmaintainer Posted March 7, 2012 Share Posted March 7, 2012 Congrats, Andy! I'm very happy for you and for RMWeb. I will ned to re-evaluate my magazine subscription needs and perhaps opt for BRM again. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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