trisonic Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 Anyone up for starting a thread on detailing and weathering locomotives? I must admit that I go to the sites selling "details" and my eyes quickly glaze over because of assumptions made at the sites. For example I've got a SD60M that needs new metal handrails - I go to the site and it is not listed - presumably because it is assumed that another locomotive has exactly the same handrails and you use those - and you know this! The site owners famously never answer questions like this if you ask by email. What about the Atlas Trainman Plus Genset - who has detailed that? It's all very well saying look at photos of the prototype and copy them but a lot of details I just don't know what it is I'm looking at! For BNSF someone said to me "oh, yeah the models alright but you need the A/C unit added on" - what does it look like? Often it bears no relation to what I consider an A/C box looking like. I use this as an example because I know quite a few of us own at least one. Best, Pete. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold roundhouse Posted March 21, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 21, 2012 (edited) Pete I will see what I can do for some Athearn Blue box GP40's in CSX and predecessors liveries and Florida East Coast ones I detailed some years ago for Fort Myers if any one is interested. Ian Edited March 21, 2012 by roundhouse 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
warbonnetuk Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 Pete A BNSF Genset with a curved fuel tank is on my (long) list of projects to tackle so I'll promote this up the list. Prob make a start on it this weekend at Ally Pally trainshow Dan 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold roundhouse Posted March 21, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 21, 2012 Dan You can weather some of my freight cars if you wish then i can run them on the layout to dry them off!! Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave_long Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 I've got a few updates for my GP38-3 thread that'll be along very soon. I must admit I did find the detailing lists daunting when I first came to look through them. I tend to put up a photo of what I need (proto) then ask 'can someone tell me what this is...? and who sells them?' Its worked quite well for me. Or you could put up a proto photo and ask what do I need for a atlas trainman whatever... and people will be able to discuss what you need. The first plan worked well for me, as the only people who make the NS GP38-3 AC unit is Athearn and its a spare for their CR SD70 spartan cab, no-one else does it, and I had to email their spares for it. Regards Dave PS, I've several projects to get going soon, a GP40 NS exCR blue, 2 SW9s. (CIRY) 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted March 21, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 21, 2012 This used to be much more of an industry than it is now, I think. Back in the '80s, when I first took a real interest in US HO, even dynamic brakes could be a real pain for the modeller. Take an Athearn GP7 - and leaving aside the fact that the hood was made too wide, thus allowing the use of the fat Athearn motor - the dynamic brake bulge, which sat atop the centre of the long hood, was moulded on. Cutting and shutting took some doing if you wanted a Rock Island or Missouri Pacific version, since they didn't have them. On the other hand, Tyco's GP20 had no dynamic brakes, which was a bit of a pain, because, of 260 units built, only the 15 for NYC didn't have them! In them thar days, hood steps were moulded on, lift rings were notional if at all - and there was a great market in the bits that Trisonic describes. Athearn realised they could make life easier for themselves by simply moulding dimples where some of these details should go, and that was how they went forward with SD40-2 and GP38-2, I think. Even the delicious Stewart Hobbies F Units - lauded at the time as the plastic mutts-nuts - spawned a whole new series of Detail Associates packages of steps, rings etc. I don't doubt that Trisonic is right to be adding more detail even now, but at least the locos look a bit more plausible out of the box! 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glorious NSE Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 Tough one this - i've done very little recently that would fit! Most of my recent loco projects have involved taking RTR adding DCC and some detail paint/weathering to make it look less toy-like. Very occasionally there's a 'generic' shell that i've had to add a few bits to, but i've done very little along the lines of Ian's 'old school' work recently! I've a couple of Trainman GP38-2 in the inbox which will need grabs etc, but even that shouldn't end up a huge project. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted March 21, 2012 Author Share Posted March 21, 2012 (edited) I'm wondering whether to get that Grab Iron bending tool (with a selection of lengths) from Micro Mark....TheTrainman Plus is peculiar in that it has some grabs and not others... The problem with the SD60M is that I destroyed the 3d front and rear railings getting it out of the box! I cannot bend in 3d like that! I know some people can...... What about light detailing? Ditch lights that look right? Best, Pete. Edited March 21, 2012 by trisonic Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
warbonnetuk Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 I'm wondering whether to get that Grab Iron bending tool (with a selection of lengths) from Micro Mark....TheTrainman Plus is peculiar in that it has some grabs and not others... The problem with the SD60M is that I destroyed the 3d front and rear railings getting it out of the box! I cannot bend in 3d like that! I know some people can...... What about light detailing? Ditch lights that look right? Best, Pete. Pete I'm assuming that it's an Athearn SD60M that is sans handrails? If so an email to the Atheran parts dept might yield a result? Re: handrail bending jigs, I picked up a nifty little device produced by Bill Bedford that is basically a square of etched brass with calibrated holes round the 4 sides to give differing length of handrails. Not as sophisicated as the Micromark tool as I understand you can do drop style grabs as well on that one Could you expand on your ditchlight comment? Ta! Dan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glorious NSE Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 The Trainman Alco RS, GP38-2, GP39-2 don't have any grabs or other stand-off detail at all - they do also have very chunky handrails but i'm not sure I want to get into dealing with them! The chassis is quite nice OTOH. No need for ditchlights either on the prototypes of these. So far i've done nothing, not even DCC'd them. They will represent half of ITC's batch of four GP38-2. http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1789572 - i've a dummy SW1500 I did many years back from the old bluebox model which will run between them (they used SW1500s as road power a fair bit!) I'll have a dig around tonight and see what I can add, I will have suitable loco's to show here, I just need to think back enough to what I did back in the day! Ref the SD60M, is it the Athearn one, and if so would they have spares? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
modelmaker87 Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 Anyone up for starting a thread on detailing and weathering locomotives? I must admit that I go to the sites selling "details" and my eyes quickly glaze over because of assumptions made at the sites. For example I've got a SD60M that needs new metal handrails - I go to the site and it is not listed - presumably because it is assumed that another locomotive has exactly the same handrails and you use those - and you know this! The site owners famously never answer questions like this if you ask by email. What about the Atlas Trainman Plus Genset - who has detailed that? It's all very well saying look at photos of the prototype and copy them but a lot of details I just don't know what it is I'm looking at! For BNSF someone said to me "oh, yeah the models alright but you need the A/C unit added on" - what does it look like? Often it bears no relation to what I consider an A/C box looking like. I use this as an example because I know quite a few of us own at least one. Best, Pete. Pete, I'm sure you can ask Andy Y to move this into this US/Canadian area of the forum now. The WFRM club room is moribund these days and has been for months. http://www.rmweb.co....clinic-ns-5424/ I can also do a new one on this bad boy if'n ya like. Just finished it yesterday ready for this weekends Savannah, GA. RPM meet. Ref A/C units. UP and BNSF generally favor this style of A/C unit. There are some UP and BNSF engines that also use this style of A/C unit which is identical to the NS type. The NS style. I do a custom etch for the NS type, superior than anything you can purchase from D/W and even the original plastic units that come with the models. Plus other custom etches for the prototype modeler some of which are generic that can be used on GE 6 axle power on other roads. This image was taken a while back and was my first test unit, there has been some small refinements, adjustments of several thousandths of an inch, that sort of thing. There is no soldering required, more because soldering is almost alien to the US modeler, almost, there are some around, like me. Cheers, Tony 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted March 21, 2012 Author Share Posted March 21, 2012 Athearn did not have any but I have managed to get some from an eccentric woman who calls herself: Miss Wesla F. Shoffner (on Ebay). They are very "bendy" which is why I really wanted metal - but I have these as a last resort.... Best, Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted March 21, 2012 Author Share Posted March 21, 2012 Pete, I'm sure you can ask Andy Y to move this into this US/Canadian area of the forum now. The WFRM club room is moribund these days and has been for months. http://www.rmweb.co....clinic-ns-5424/ I can also do a new one on this bad boy if'n ya like. Just finished it yesterday ready for this weekends Savannah, GA. RPM meet Cheers, Tony Yes please Tony!!!! Love the a/c units - they now make sense because you've photoed them from different angles...... If you have the answer to my question re the front and rear handrails of the BNSF lettered ( but in BN livery) SD60M - i.e. which other locos handrails fit the SD60M? Do let me know. I'm just not confident of my 3d bending abilities... I'll get on to Andy about transfering that thread over, many thanks. Cheers, Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
modelmaker87 Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 Anyone up for starting a thread on detailing and weathering locomotives? I must admit that I go to the sites selling "details" and my eyes quickly glaze over because of assumptions made at the sites. For example I've got a SD60M that needs new metal handrails - I go to the site and it is not listed - presumably because it is assumed that another locomotive has exactly the same handrails and you use those - and you know this! The site owners famously never answer questions like this if you ask by email. Best, Pete. Yeah, I know exactly how that is Pete. Same for me many years ago back in the early 80's. Try this site. http://www.trainreadyproducts.com/HAND-RAILS-AND-STANCHIONS-FOR-SD60M-KIT-210.htm?categoryId=27 A-Line offer handrail and stanchions. I'd go for item #104 or #108. Without the good old touchy feely it might cost you a few packs to find out what is. http://www.ppw-aline.com/detlloco.htm You could go for the Smokey Valley, SD60M handrail kit, #676-210. I like Smokey Valley and have used their stuff on many models. Mmmmm, maybe a tad oversize, its subjective. There's hundreds of locos out there with them fitted. You never know, this info may help you toward your goal. Cheers, Tony 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Gwinnett Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 (edited) Like Martyn, I'm only doing a few generic improvements at the moment - this is today's work: The subject is my old Kato GP35, picked up for a song at an NMRA meet in Linlithgow. I made the mistake of stripping the paint, which damaged the bodyshell - hopefully when it gets primer most of the scarring will disappear. Added lift rings, (which way should they be aligned in reality?); sunshades, grabs, (the curvy one on the end of the long hood was bent up by hand, not very neatly!) Waiting for a cab roof aircon box to be delivered, as well as replacement glass and fuel tank (the original was robbed in an attempt to modify a Genset as referred to earlier in the thread, This unit is going to be finished in a freelance livery - mainly because I've never done that before, and I'm not very confident with the airbrush so this is a cheap unit to practice on. Nothing lost if I make a hash of it. Blue and White with Yellow trim, inspired by the Dillon Panthers football colours from Friday Night Lights. The fictitious Dillon, Badger Creek and Woodville will get its first (and possibly only) loco. Edited March 21, 2012 by Jon Gwinnett 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted March 21, 2012 Author Share Posted March 21, 2012 That's the stuff, Jon! If it is just minor detailing then the project can go into this thread. If it is major detailing like Tony Sisson's then it should have it's own thread in the "Work in Progress" sub-fora. You GP35 looks pretty major to me. It's up to you but I suggest you start it's own thread for that, really. Detailing, re-paint then weathering, I suspect? If at all possible let us know where parts were obtained from where it is relevant, Tony posted some great links... Best, Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Gwinnett Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 I'll think about it. Its really not that big a job, but perhaps I'll do a thread. Might wait until I make some more progress. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Gwinnett Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 (edited) Parts used to date: Kato Phase 1C GP35 - formerly in UP colours as #792 Details West #SV-188 Sun Visors (You get four in a pack for a dollar or so) there are brass alternatives out there which give a finer finish. On the other hand, these glue on easily with liquid styrene cement. Detail Associates #SY2202 Grab Irons, 17" drop, Bulk package (24 in a pack for two bucks fifty!) I didn't need NBW mouldings as the Kato shell has these but you can get the same grabs in a pack with NBW mouldings I think. Detail Associates #101101 Lift Ring, 3 1/2" Eye Bolt, Brass (24in a pack for $2.25) These weren't totally satisfactory - in that there were one or two slight miscastings (and the carpet monster ate several as well). But for the price, who's complaining - not me. A bit of brass wire that was dumped in my tool box for the long hood grab. None of the above were bought specifically for this job - i tend to buy detail parts as and when I see them in shops over here (i.e not that often) and then squirrel them away, sometimes for years, on the basis that "that'll come in handy one day" So far, my total expenditure for this is a few quid - the most expensive items being the replacement fuel tank and glass mouldings - but even those are only costing $14. The aircon box was another £3 or so - but that'll have a spare I can use on one of my GP38s. (Edit forgot to mention I shaved off the class lights - figuring they wouldn't have survived into the noughties) Edited March 21, 2012 by Jon Gwinnett Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CraigZ Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 Pete, are you looking for a blow-by-blow detailing story? Parts list etc? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted March 21, 2012 Author Share Posted March 21, 2012 Craig, I think that it is handy to do so - a lot of people (like me) get confused as to where to source these parts from and which parts.... If you have a complete start to finish project on a loco then start it's own thread (per project in other words). Cheers, mate! Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
modelmaker87 Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 Like Martyn, I'm only doing a few generic improvements at the moment - this is today's work: Added lift rings, (which way should they be aligned in reality?) Jon, although this is not a GP35 its still an EMD. When out shopped all the eyebolts were aligned in a longitude orientation. These images of the roof of a GP50 should make it clear. There are a lot of older EMD machines out there now with the eyebolts tightened up past the military style alignment. Threads get worn, replacement eyebolts and all of that. Setting one or two eyebolts at a slight angle does add a little interest. Something that I do, makes the model look used. 2nd pic lower left eyebolt. Cheers, Tony 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CraigZ Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 Craig, I think that it is handy to do so - a lot of people (like me) get confused as to where to source these parts from and which parts.... If you have a complete start to finish project on a loco then start it's own thread (per project in other words). Cheers, mate! Pete. I've got an engine that's finished...but I'm able to say how and where I did pretty much everything on it...this Atlantic Coast Line F2A built on a Highliners shell. Shall I? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted March 22, 2012 Author Share Posted March 22, 2012 That's an affirmative! Watch out Jordan (F-UnitMad)! Best, Pete 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Gwinnett Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 Jon, although this is not a GP35 its still an EMD. When out shopped all the eyebolts were aligned in a longitude orientation. These images of the roof of a GP50 should make it clear. There are a lot of older EMD machines out there now with the eyebolts tightened up past the military style alignment. Threads get worn, replacement eyebolts and all of that. Setting one or two eyebolts at a slight angle does add a little interest. Something that I do, makes the model look used. 2nd pic lower left eyebolt. Cheers, Tony That's good then, 'cos mine will look well used. Although its fictional, I want it to look like a unit that's had three or four owners, been through at least one heavy overhaul etc, etc, So everything that contributes to the used look will be good. Then it'll get a shiny coat of new paint, 'cos the new owners want to put their mark on the property so to speak, but that won't hide that's its an old stager underneath. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glorious NSE Posted March 22, 2012 Share Posted March 22, 2012 Jon, something that seems to have happenned to lots of old GP35s is de-turboing them and upgrading the insides to something akin to a GP38-2, one possible mod would be putting an air filter box and 'normal' exhaust stacks on the top in place of the turbo-style one. Might be a good mod to depict 'old and messed about with'? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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