RMweb Premium 7013 Posted April 28, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 28, 2012 Truly awesome beasts especially the 2-8-2t which I saw in my youth. We have to remember these are EPs and will be developed as time goes on but Hornby are to be congratulated on giving us an early glimpse. Hopefully those who really know these locos ( like Stationmaster) will be able to comment; and hopefully Hornby will take on board any comments made. I will be buying one of each but they will probably struggle to get round my curves on my home layout, but my club layout is huge and I have an end to end so there is really no excuse for me not to buy them! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 7013 Posted April 28, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 28, 2012 Would be a nice touch if those little shutters in front of the cab opening were made so that they slide Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Their large size comes over on footage shot on Lickey Incline during their tenure on banking duties in the late 1950s. I'll have to have one if only to admire! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unicorn1 Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 These both look great, I'll have to get a move on with Bishopscombe's quarry - so I've got half an excuse to run at least one 42xx! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
D605Eagle Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 Is the rigid wheelbase of a 42/52/72xx longer than that of a 9F? It always amazed me that Hornby Triang managed to make those go round 1st radius trackwork. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allegheny1600 Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 Beautiful looking beasts! I want, I want, I want! (a 42xx!). Something about eight coupled engines of any flavour, that just makes them look sooo impressive. Did they run over the Settle & Carlisle? Cheers, John E. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parklanerob Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 Finally a Hornby model worth buying! the 2-8-0 (52xx) looks fantastic, hopefully the detail in the final paintwork wont ruin the potential! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
37255 Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 Is the rigid wheelbase of a 42/52/72xx longer than that of a 9F? It always amazed me that Hornby Triang managed to make those go round 1st radius trackwork. Flangeless centre driving wheels helped the 9F in this regard, both real and model! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Cram Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 They do look impressive. It is just a pity that they do not produce any models that are of interest to me apart from the Gresley suburbans. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 No, they didn't run over the Settle & Carlisle, nor the Brighton line, the Peak District, the Dingwall line, Mallaig Extension, over the Delph Branch, through Gasworks tunnel, via Hebden Bridge, through Blaenau Ffestiniog, the Whitby line, Isle of Wight system, the Cambrian Coast line nor in the quarries at Dinorwic. They were built for heavy freight on the former GWR system, principally in South Wales.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flood Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 No, they didn't run over the Settle & Carlisle, nor the Brighton line, the Peak District, the Dingwall line, Mallaig Extension, over the Delph Branch, through Gasworks tunnel, via Hebden Bridge, through Blaenau Ffestiniog, the Whitby line, Isle of Wight system, the Cambrian Coast line nor in the quarries at Dinorwic. They were built for heavy freight on the former GWR system, principally in South Wales.... St Blazey did have two 42xx though so you can sneak them into Cornwall. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalo Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 Well, they certainly look the part on first glance but it's interesting to note that Hornby have modelled the little porthole windows on the cab front. I would be surprised if they were present on any 7200 tank and would guess they would have been plated over pretty early in the life of the 4200s. Yes, I haven't noticed any surviving non-plated portholes on 42XX in any post-war photos. It's also clear from photos that many 72XX never had them but, as they were all rebuilds, I wonder if some retained their original cab front panels? There's a photo of 7240 in Russell that looks like it might have plated-over portholes. Great models - lots to look forward too. I hardly like to mention my reservation, which is the way the safety valves are so much higher than the bonnet. That is not typical of the real thing, and this is an aspect of the model that I hope gets sorted before production. I fear this is Hornby's current take on the short bonnet; see their 28XX as another example. Presumably they got the idea from somwhere but it would be better if the nuts on top of the valves only projected an inch or so above the bonnet. Would be a nice touch if those little shutters in front of the cab opening were made so that they slide I doubt if this would be possible in plastic without producing a horribly over-thick lump that many of us would immediately remove and replace with metal sheet. Obviously it's early days and these first two engineering prototype models may not show us all the variety that may be produced, and we've yet to see their take on the 5205 series. On that basis it's probably too early to worry about minor details like the position of the upper front lamp iron, but I'll make a couple of observations on more prominent issues. We are told they intend to produce 4283 in some sort of GWR livery and 4266 in early BR. The model shown has the correct straight running plate with square drop, but why the outside steam pipes? According to the RCTS volume, 4266 never had them and 4283 had them by Jan 1957 but the exact date is not known. Hopefully, they are a removable feature and will not be there on all production versions. The 72XX class came in three distinct batches. The model has the raised platform over the cylinders so, in this respect, matches 7200-19 and 7240-53. 7220-39 had the straight/square type as seen on the 42XX model. However, the model also has the flanged motion plate which only suits 7200-19. We've been told that they intend to produce 7202 and 7229 so, again, hopefully the motion plate shown here on the 42XX can be fitted to the 72XX to match the second series. Perhaps we might even see a version with the raised platform running plate and older style motion bracket to match the third series. As I said, it's early days so further infomation in due course from Hornby will help to clarify all of this. Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Flying Pig Posted April 29, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 29, 2012 They were built for heavy freight on the former GWR system, principally in South Wales.... Can't be a bad thing if they focus attention on that region which has much to offer the (G)WR modeller. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parklanerob Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 Well, they certainly look the part on first glance but it's interesting to note that Hornby have modelled the little porthole windows on the cab front. I would be surprised if they were present on any 7200 tank and would guess they would have been plated over pretty early in the life of the 4200s. it looks like the model shown is a 52xx not a 42xx, which is why there are are porthole windows in the cab. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugd1022 Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 No, they didn't run over the Settle & Carlisle, nor the Brighton line, the Peak District, the Dingwall line, Mallaig Extension, over the Delph Branch, through Gasworks tunnel, via Hebden Bridge, through Blaenau Ffestiniog, the Whitby line, Isle of Wight system, the Cambrian Coast line nor in the quarries at Dinorwic. They were built for heavy freight on the former GWR system, principally in South Wales.... A few managed to find their way onto the Cotswold lines too on regular freight workings, there are photos of them in Bradford Barton albums at Kingham and Sapperton Tunnel.... I don't 'need' one but by the cringe I'm going to have a 42xx! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalo Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 it looks like the model shown is a 52xx not a 42xx, which is why there are are porthole windows in the cab. Some confusion here, surely? Firstly, there's no such thing as a 52XX. Engines from 5205 onwards were a continuation of the 42XX class, though they were fitted with outside steam pipes from new. 5200-4, with 4200 and 4286-99 were all built in the same lot. They all had portholes. Nick edit: no newts were involved... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parklanerob Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 Some confusion here, surely? Firstly, there's no such thing as a 52XX. Engines from 5205 onwards were a continuation of the 42XX class, though they were fitted with outside steam pipes from newt. 5200-4, with 4200 and 4286-99 were all built in the same lot. They all had portholes. Nick Thanks for clearing up :-) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unicorn1 Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 St Blazey did have two 42xx though so you can sneak them into Cornwall. Oh good..........! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted April 29, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 29, 2012 Very, very nice.Now wheres Stationmaster when you need him. Taunton! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Black Hat Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 Think Im betraying my usual NER loyalties again as the 42xx looks very nice.... think I will end up having one of them. Crikey, Ive got a 14xx, Pannier, a Castle and want another.... add the 42xx and its fast not looking North Eastern any more... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted April 29, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 29, 2012 Well I've only just booked on after return from an excellent SWAGday so this is very much a 'quickie' view from me . The 2-8-0T is, I think a nice looking representation of the second group of 5205 class as built (i'e. square drop end. straight footplating, outside steampipes and lengthened rear frames which from a quick check is 5215 - 5274 as built. In my view that is a good group to chose as representative of the 5205 Class as it was the principal variant in numerical terms, and - apart from the lack of the extended rear buffer (Plasticard or a nice little whitemetal casting for the 'after-fitters') - could also be made representative of the first group of the 5205 Class plus the few 42XX which received new front ends prior to the introduction of the curved drop end/stepped running plate. The chimney looks pretty good but, as Nick has already noted, the safety valve casing is a bit of a miss - definitely needs some work please Mr Hornby . I do suspect a slight anachronism with both a bunker fender (easily removed but probably a separate part as it's in a different colour?) and the cab front sheet porthole windows (plated over by the late 1930s I think). But to be fair to Hornby they got 'Castle' details on right on most locos by indvidual running number so no doubt they can do it again. The 72XX again suffers the safety valve casing blight but that apart is, I think, a good representation of the original group of conversions 7200-7219 (as already noted above of course), and again with a caveat regarding the bunker fender. But that of course means it's no good for any others members of the Class unless the front part of the running plate etc is interchangeable with either of the alternative patterns (which can't, I think, be deduced from the pics). Again I think Hornby have chosen the best detail variant as apart from a couple which acquired new bunkers in BR days (and hence the later rivet pattern on the bunker sides) it represents the longest timespan of the Class giving both the original version and some which lasted quite late in traffic If Hornby can vary the front ends and motion bar cross frame moulding then it could also represent the second (7220-39) batch as first converted; whaT IT can't do - unless they have another body moulding up theire sleeves - is accurately represent the final 7240-53 batch with the different rivet pattern on the bunker - and hence my questioning the original running numbers announced by Hornby, the body moulding can't be right for both. My only question mark on initial acquaintance (apart from please, please, do something about the safety valve casing) is what Hornby think the 2-8-0T sample represents because from a pedantic viewpoint it is clearly a 5205 Class loco of the second group and not a 42XX of any original group although it will do (rear bufferbeam thickness apart) for the few 42XX with renewed front ends which retained the straight running plate. In summary we thus far have a 5205 which definitely ticks my boxes and once it's confirmed as coming with the detail arrangements shown in the pics will be going on my pre-order list because whatever Hornby number it as it will be no problem tp delve out a correct number. And we have what looks like a pretty good (first batch) 72XX whch as t happens is precisely the variant I hoped they would; so no way will I be cancelling my existing pre-order for one (and surely I can't justify a second 2-8-2T?). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 Thankyou Mike for the detail differences and observations in general, very valuable. It reminds me of the 28XX and 38XX models, especially the front ends and other details, for which major mouldings I think Hornby did very well. To those who have expressed misgivings about the 8-coupled wheelbase being a problen on set track curves, I don't personally expect to be an issue... the above mentioned tender engines and other such as 8F do ok in my experience, but we shall see. Roll on production! (with details like safety valve housings fixed) Rob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
D605Eagle Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 Flangeless centre driving wheels helped the 9F in this regard, both real and model! yes this is true, but if you ignore that axle you have a 4 axle rigid wheelbase, like the GWR tank. I just wonder which is the longer of the two. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalo Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 Yes, Mike, I think you are right that the 2-8-0T is closer to being one of the second batch of 5205s than a 42XX. My earlier comments were just based on the assertion that this was the 42XX. However, that again raises a question about the numbers that have been published. 5243 would be fine, but 5283 was one of the 1930 batch with raised platform and flanged motion plate (as on the illustrated 72XX). Maybe they will change the numbers but I do wonder whether this suggests that they will be able to produce all of these variations. Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted April 29, 2012 Share Posted April 29, 2012 ....surely I can't justify a second 2-8-2T? Oh yes you can. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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