Popular Post Timara Posted June 28, 2012 Popular Post Share Posted June 28, 2012 I've long wanted a half-decent 'Princes Royal' pacific. The Hornby model's shortcomings are well known and best left unsaid. Suffice to say, the tooling is well over 25 years old and can be best given up for a bad job. So where do we go if we want a Princess that actually bears more than a passing resemblance to one......? A year or so ago, a discussion with Paul Hutfield (Kempenfelt of this parish) brought up the subject of these fine locomotives and he happened to mention that Mike Edge did a "scratch aid" for one, but only for the loco half. This sounded a rather good idea and one would only require a Comet tender to sling behind it and "Bob's your uncle" (in my case, he actually is....). Discussion ensued between myself and Mike and an etch was procured. To my joy, the ability to finally be able to model the doyen of the class, 46200 The Princess Royal, was not to be passed up. It is probably not a surprise to many that I have a serious weakness for red-painted LMS pacifics...... So, what does one get on this here etch.... Almost everything bar the boiler and firebox, plus a handful of other sundry items such as the chimney, dome, top feed, safety valves etc. All members of the class can be modelled from this etch, including 46205 with its distinctive motion brackets. The use of a rivet press is an absolute must as the running plate and cab (to name just two) have a plethora of half-etched rivets to push through. This takes less time to do than I expected it would. Some photos to start things off. I've got both the valences soldered to the running plate and the dropped plate at the front has also been fitted. I still need to add the inside cylinder casing.... The cab has also been built up, though I still need to solder some soft-ish wire around the half-etched cab windows. This does make more sense than having a separate frame on the etch (I've recently built a Brassmasters Jubilee cab, which was fun in this regard) and it also frees up space for important items. Cruelly enlarged I know, but it is a fine bit of artwork from Mike. I've got the basics of the rear bissel truck built, which comes as a three part etch for the main assembly with a set of sides (also with rivets to be formed) that fit straight on to it. Resin castings for the axleboxes are yet to arrive. In order to build the chassis (frames shown above), I'm awaiting a set of bespoke spacers in around a month or so, which means I can concentrate on other projects in the meantime. The important thing is that I've finally got myself building my first all-metal loco for my layout, which just happens to be the biggest. I ought to add that this is being built to EM gauge. So that's the start of it and here's to the end, which is closer in sight than it was a few months ago. Cheers! 21 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 (edited) I didn't know about the existence of the "Princess" etches. How much does Mike charge for this etch set? Might he consider doing one for the "Duchess" as well? ...... the ability to finally be able to model the doyen of the class, 46200 The Princess Royal..... Don't forget that the valve gear / motion brackets / slidebars (which resembled that of the GW "King" class) for 46200 and 46201 were different to the rest of the class! The motion brackets in particular interrupt the line of the footplate...... Edited June 28, 2012 by Horsetan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timara Posted June 28, 2012 Author Share Posted June 28, 2012 I didn't know about the existence of the Princess etches. How much does Mike charge for this etch set? They're £45, unless the price has gone up since March! There are half etched hornguide lines on the rear of the frames by the way, which lend themselves open to a CSB chassis, should that be how you like to float your boat Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 (edited) Right, e-mail sent to Mike Edge already....... They're £45, unless the price has gone up since March! There are half etched hornguide lines on the rear of the frames by the way, which lend themselves open to a CSB chassis, should that be how you like to float your boat This can go together with some leftover ProScale "Princess" parts that I have......which includes a boiler and a firebox! Edited June 28, 2012 by Horsetan 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timara Posted June 28, 2012 Author Share Posted June 28, 2012 Don't forget that the valve gear / motion brackets / slidebars (which resembled that of the GW "King" class) for 46200 and 46201 were different to the rest of the class! The motion brackets in particular interrupt the line of the footplate...... Both types of valve gear and slidebars are on the fret, which is what made me do that. The early motion bracket comes as two identical pieces that require a sweating together. The original style slidebars are a quadruple laminate etch to scale thickness. As I said, it wasn't a difficult decision to do the first one! This can go together with some leftover ProScale "Princess" parts that I have......which includes a boiler and a firebox! That'll be interesting to see for sure! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 (edited) I was a bit cheeky, and asked whether a similar type etch might be done for the "Duchess", as Martin Finney refuses to do a 4mm kit! Both types of valve gear and slidebars are on the fret, which is what made me do that. The early motion bracket comes as two identical pieces that require a sweating together. The original style slidebars are a quadruple laminate etch to scale thickness. As I said, it wasn't a difficult decision to do the first one! No manufacturer (not even Comet) has properly rendered the motion of the first two, until now! I think a Brassmasters tender would, if appropriate, be equally acceptable as the Comet one! Edited June 28, 2012 by Horsetan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timara Posted June 28, 2012 Author Share Posted June 28, 2012 I was a bit cheeky, and asked whether a similar type etch might be done for the "Duchess", as Martin Finney refuses to do a 4mm kit! I'd love to see something like that myself, but I'll content myself with dolling up the Hornby body for now. I've got them already and it'd be rude not to. But I digress... No manufacturer (not even Comet) has properly rendered the motion of the first two, until now! What I like about Mike's etch (see pic below) is that it's just spot on in that regard. I'll wait and see whether Mike might post up a few pics of the first locos built from this etch (I believe it's three Mike?) when he gets a moment to do so. They look superb! I think a Brassmasters tender would, if appropriate, be equally acceptable as the Comet one! It would, but only if they had one in their range, which they sadly don't . The Comet one will more than do though. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 He kept it very quiet, though! Not even a suggestion on his trade stand at RailEx..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timara Posted June 28, 2012 Author Share Posted June 28, 2012 He kept it very quiet, though! Not even a suggestion on his trade stand at RailEx..... There's a reason for that! I believe it was originally commissioned by someone else to do the entire class 4 years ago. If I play my cards right, I could have either the 4th or 7th production one to be completed from it. I dare say it could go the way the N5 went. as it too started life as a commission one (thankyou Tony Gee ). It's in the main range now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 (edited) I'd like to try building 46201. (& maybe also 46203 if I haven't bankrupted myself!) UPDATE: Mike has replied to say that it's not a "production" etch and will need alteration. So it looks like I'm not as lucky as you, Tim! Edited June 28, 2012 by Horsetan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Popular Post Michael Edge Posted June 28, 2012 RMweb Premium Popular Post Share Posted June 28, 2012 I've built three of these so far (another three on order at present), first one was 46205 Princess Victoria which is not often modelled. First photo shows the RH side before painting, Romford driving wheels on this one (nobody produces a Princess wheel), Comet bogie and tender. The same loco after painting and weathering by Graham Varley. footplate and cab assembly The next two were 46200 and 46201, I haven't actually built one of the production series yet. ready for painting, Gibson N15 wheels this time - all these models are EM gauge and again painted by Mr. Varley If there is sufficient demand we will put this etch into production but I do need to do some more modifications to it - I did one lot after building these three but Tim has already come up with some more. I must emphasize that these are not intended as kits but as an aid to scratchbuilding. This is now my normal method of working - all the parts which will benefit from etching, either for detail or for accurate fitting are etched, other simple parts are not. This saves space on the etch, which means that each sheet has parts for several locos but this makes production runs much more difficult. I now have a fairly large number of these etches in 3mm, 4mm and 7mm scales but I won't publish a list just yet. Michael Edge Judith Edge kits 40 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timara Posted June 28, 2012 Author Share Posted June 28, 2012 Many thanks for putting those photos up Mike. It now gives me an idea of what to aim for once painted . Cheers, Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 (edited) ....(nobody produces a Princess wheel), ...... Ultrascale does.... Usual 10/12-week waiting period applies, though. And it's £80+ for a complete set. Edited June 28, 2012 by Horsetan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kempenfelt Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 Excellent work there Tim!!! She's going to be a beauty! As for the the finished articles Mike, they're absolutely stunning!!! I'd quite like one in P4, best started finishing some of my other projects before I even consider that though!!! With regards to the tender Tim you could do a BM hybrid! The tender body is different but I think the chassis is the same, just a thought if you can get hold of a chassis etch!? Actually I've just started a BM Fowler tender kit with the intention of fitting a Dave Franks chassis to it, there may be a few pic's finding there way to my WB if I find some time and pull my finger out!! ;-) Cheers for now Paul 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 (edited) I've publicised this on the Scalefour Forum, so hopefully it might drum up an extra sale or two...... Pour encourager les autres...... Edited June 29, 2012 by Horsetan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tom F Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 (edited) I'm looking forward to following this thread Tim. There is something most powerful and imposing about a Princess, and as you say, the Hornby model far from cuts the mustard. Looking at Mikes etches and his finished models, this is going to be one heck of a princess, keep up the good work! Edited June 29, 2012 by Tom F 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikemeg Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 (edited) I'm looking forward to following this thread Tim. There is something most powerful and imposing about a Princess, and as you say, the Hornby model far from cuts the mustard. Looking at Mikes etches and his finished models, this is going to be one heck of a princess, keep up the good work! Rarely seen in 50A Tom, just as they were even rarer at Hessle Haven. But, as you say those photos above, of finished Princess's, just look the business. Thread to watch, this one, Horsetan! Tom, wasn't there a rail tour from York to Scarborough and then to Hull, sometime in the summer of 1950 - little publicised and not photographed (wishful thinking)? Might have been a trial run for the Scarborough Spa Express, even if it was half a century later. Cheers Mike Edited June 29, 2012 by mikemeg Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisf Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 Excellent work there Tim!!! She's going to be a beauty! As for the the finished articles Mike, they're absolutely stunning!!! I'd quite like one in P4, best started finishing some of my other projects before I even consider that though!!! With regards to the tender Tim you could do a BM hybrid! The tender body is different but I think the chassis is the same, just a thought if you can get hold of a chassis etch!? Actually I've just started a BM Fowler tender kit with the intention of fitting a Dave Franks chassis to it, there may be a few pic's finding there way to my WB if I find some time and pull my finger out!! ;-) Cheers for now Paul All those exclamation marks. Has someone been reading BRM? Seriously though, Tim, this has the potential to be a fine model of a fine beast. As you demonstrated with the Stanier Mogul, it is amazing what the careful sourcing of parts can achieve. Chris 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tom F Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 Rarely seen in 50A Tom, just as they were even rarer at Hessle Haven. But, as you say those photos above, of finished Princess's, just look the business. Thread to watch, this one, Horsetan! Tom, wasn't there a rail tour from York to Scarborough and then to Hull, sometime in the summer of 1950 - little publicised and not photographed (wishful thinking)? Might have been a trial run for the Scarborough Spa Express, even if it was half a century later. Cheers Mike I wish Mike, I wish! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
artisan100 Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 >....(nobody produces a Princess wheel), ...... I understand Markits are working on one. Geoff 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 (edited) .....what does one get on this here etch.... Almost everything bar the boiler and firebox, plus a handful of other sundry items such as the chimney, dome, top feed, safety valves etc...... .....If there is sufficient demand we will put this etch into production but I do need to do some more modifications to it......these are not intended as kits but as an aid to scratchbuilding. .... You know how they say you should never throw anything away? Well I didn't, and these leftover ProScale "Princess" bits have been waiting in a box for a 21st century solution: Edited June 29, 2012 by Horsetan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike G Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 >....(nobody produces a Princess wheel), ...... I understand Markits are working on one. Geoff And he's willing to sell it!...has there been a change of business plan at Markits? Tim Wonderful work, a beautiful engine in the making. If it can be built in P4, count me in - and looking at the etches I can see no reason why not - excellent development!! Mike 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timara Posted June 29, 2012 Author Share Posted June 29, 2012 TimWonderful work, a beautiful engine in the making. If it can be built in P4, count me in - and looking at the etches I can see no reason why not - excellent development!! Mike Thankyou Mike! The only mods I can see being required for P4 would be to thin down the insides of where the cylinder ends and either of the two types of motion bracket slot into the mainframes. There are two choices of rear bissel truck and I've gone for the one that allows more movement, rather than the exact scale one that would give little to none (according to Mike anyway!). What isn't included is a bogie which, like the tender, is available from Comet. Although I won't be doing mine with it, I do wonder what one of these with CSB would be like when done...... Cheers, Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timara Posted June 29, 2012 Author Share Posted June 29, 2012 Excellent work there Tim!!! She's going to be a beauty! As for the the finished articles Mike, they're absolutely stunning!!! I'd quite like one in P4, best started finishing some of my other projects before I even consider that though!!! With regards to the tender Tim you could do a BM hybrid! The tender body is different but I think the chassis is the same, just a thought if you can get hold of a chassis etch!? Actually I've just started a BM Fowler tender kit with the intention of fitting a Dave Franks chassis to it, there may be a few pic's finding there way to my WB if I find some time and pull my finger out!! ;-) Cheers for now Paul Cheers Paul! Interesting what you say about the cross-kitting aspect here on the tender front. It's a very serious thought too.... I think the only reason I'm possibly going to stick to the complete tender from Geoff is down to personal cost and the fact I've successfully built one of his tender kits before on my first 46256 (there's a mk2 model coming soon). Having said that, I will be buying the remainder of a BM 4F to go with the body I bought last year so as to give me a "bling" 4F, so I shall have a further look. I shall look forward to seeing some of that work on your tender, so I agree about the finger pulling! Cheers! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWJ Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 Tim - great work so far, I'm looking forward to seeing this develop. Michael - absolutely beautiful models, thanks for sharing the pictures; seeing these makes one wonder why a decent model isn't available RTR (not that a mass-produced product could match the quality and finesse of your handbuilt Princesses). Cheers, Will 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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