Grantham - the Streamliner years

[Loxborough]

Really enjoying this thread, not least because I have a sort of intention ('sort of intention'; is that what they call 'aspiration'?) to build a model of Grantham in exactly your period, though I am still stuck on Tallington and that's not going as fast as it should as I keep having to go to work.

 

All of which is to say that I am jealous/admiring of the fact that you have cracked on and are doing a great job of something that I have been dreaming of doing for a couple of years now.

 

You ask about platform design; you are perhaps already aware of this superb resounce; http://www.lner.info...php?f=15&t=3429 but if not you may find it useful...

 

Keep 'em coming,

 

George

Edited July 29, 2012 by Loxborough

[Markeg]

Enjoying also. Excellent modelling. Like those buildings.

Keep it coming.

 

I have added a photo of my extension, from 15' (4.5m) to 20'(6m apx). Based in the NE, Newcastle area.

I will have to start my own thread I think, so that means more photos and work on the layout.

 

Mark in OZ

[LNER4479]

more pics please, I'm missing my 'fix' of Grantham. Anything from the loco depot and more of the southern approaches, goods yard etc.

 

If track laying has slowed down, I'm happy to help speed it up!

 

Thanks for continued interest Dr G-F. I wish I could build it quicker but I currently work full time and what you see so far is the result of five years effort. Currently the layout is packed up following the first complete set up and test running in April, but panicketh not as this is just a temporary hiatus whilst I complete a house move. Fingers crossed that I come out the other side with a dedicated space to have all or part of Grantham up at any one time so as I can continue the development.

 

In the meantime, it does at least give the chance to catch up a few rolling stock projects and the work on the buildings (hence recent posting). So, for now I only have a finite stock of pictures of the layout. But, seeing as you asked so nicely(!), here are a couple more of the south end.

 

I quite like this one (from the April test run). This shows the arrangement of the various running lines and sidings to the south of the station. The Atlantic is on the Up main (heading to London). To her immediate right is the Up goods relief (which continues alongside the Up main all the way up Stoke bank) and further to the right is the Up goods reception line. Beyond that, on the bare area of plywood will be the Up goods yard (when I get round to building it!). Reading across to the left is the Down Main (obviously), followed by the Down passenger relief which gives access to the back platform. If you look carefully, you can see a slight kink in this line as it passes the signal. This is deliberate as, from study of the prototype, the real thing did this, presumably to maintain clearances around the signal post! To the left of this are two carriage sidings. At this point there is something of a compromise as they did not in fact branch off from the down relief as I have depicted; there was actually a further line parallel to the down relief - but I have to compromise somewhere. Finally, the two lines to the left are part of the goods through lines. Where the good train is sat is the up and down goods line itself with a loop line alongside. As you can see, beyond this there is currently a rather unsightly gap! This is where the Down goods yard will go, so at the moment neither goods yard is in existence! The pointwork bottom centre hints at how the goods yard lines will fan out from this point. The Atlantic incidentally was a visitor on the day and it ran superbly for about half an hour continuously with not a murmur. The stock was a bit of a random mixture but actually looks quite convincing nonetheless - that's two 12-wheel clerestories at the back!

 

Looking in the other direction, but from the opposite side of the line, these are the junctions that South box controls. The K2-headed coal train has turned off the Down Main and is accessing the up and down goods. What might not be immediately apparent is that the fourth wagon the train is astride a double slip; via this a train can alternatively be routed onto the down (passenger) relief here so there are in fact three choices of route at this point. These were guarded by a glorious three post junction signal whose (somersault) arms were set high up to aid sighting from behind the Great North Road bridge - I'm looking forward to tackling that signal. Also of note is that the train is traversing the other 'super scissors' I referred to earlier; you can see the trailing crossover joining into the down main in front of the fifth/sixth wagons. This arrangement allows for a goods train to be recessed to the 'lay by' siding behind and then subsequently rejoin the mainline to continue its northbound journey. In front of all this is the sequence of trailing crossings and slips that forms the exit from the down goods yard. Via this arrangement, a goods train can access either the up main or, perhaps more likely, the up goods relief. This all looks quite comprehensive but is actually somewhat of a reduction on what really existed here - for example, there was also a separate up main to up relief facing crossover. Finally, the crossover at the bottom left signals the end of the up goods reception as it rejoins the up goods relief. The straight on route (where the tracks just end for now) will form the entry into the private sidings for the Ruston & Hornsby works yard, which will add interest at this end of the layout.

 

As you can see, the development of this end of the layout is minimal other than the tracklaying. It is my intention to have the station and north end reasonably finished before tackling the south end.

 

Hope this is of interest for now; as you can see, there's still plenty to be getting on with.

[LNER4479]

I have added a photo of my extension, from 15' (4.5m) to 20'(6m apx). Based in the NE, Newcastle area.

I will have to start my own thread I think, so that means more photos and work on the layout.

 

Mark in OZ

 

You should start your own thread - that look like one hell of a station being set out there Mark!

 

Really enjoying this thread, not least because I have a sort of intention ('sort of intention'; is that what they call 'aspiration'?) to build a model of Grantham in exactly your period, though I am still stuck on Tallington and that's not going as fast as it should as I keep having to go to work.

 

All of which is to say that I am jealous/admiring of the fact that you have cracked on and are doing a great job of something that I have been dreaming of doing for a couple of years now.

 

You ask about platform design; you are perhaps already aware of this superb resounce; http://www.lner.info...php?f=15&t=3429 but if not you may find it useful...

 

 

Thanks George, glad it is of interest.

 

Yes, I discovered the Grantham thread on the lner.info forum some while ago. People very helpfully post pictures on there and I can sometimes catch a glimpse of some of the platform building details in the background so I am gradually getting a picture of how the buildings were configured on the down side. So if worse comes to the worse I should be able to put together a reasonable depiction. But it would be good to have some definitive drawings nonetheless...

 

Good luck with Tallington.

Edited July 31, 2012 by LNER4479

[ROY@34F]

Robert, regarding the down side platform buildings; I took a series of photos from the west view of them. ie.from the wasteland where the north end of the loco used to be.This was just before they were demolished,in the late 70's ?? Problem is I'm completely useless with computers,belonging to the steam age you understand,and can't upload them on here-I've tried before .BUT if you're ever in the Grantham area,as you mentioned you were not long ago,it would be a pleasure to meet up and show you them.They cover the extent of the buildings I think.You may of course find enough info in the meantime.PM me if you feel it would help.

Regards,Roy.

[LNER4479]

Time for some stock details – everyone loves stock (especially locos), don’t they?

 

As I mentioned in the opening post, I’m lucky to be able to call largely on the collection of a friend who is an LNER ‘nut’ (he has a considerable collection of stock but nowhere to run them); however, I’m keen to have a bit of stock of my own. I hope you enjoy this parade and there’s one or two requests for help along the way.

 

Let’s kick off with my signature loco: Gresley A1 4479 ‘Robert the Devil’

Here is the real thing in all her glory on Grantham’s turntable in 1933. She was one of three of the first production batch of 10 Gresley A1s (1472-1481) that was sent new to Grantham in 1923 and, stayed the longest (until 1942) so she was a ‘must’ for the layout. In fact, as 60110, she returned for a further six years 1951-1957. Looking at this picture, was there ever a locomotive that so effortlessly combined grace and power as a Gresley A1/A3?

 

The model version photographed from a similar angle. Yes, it is a ‘just’ a Hornby ‘Flying Fox’ renumbered but I’ll point out a couple of things. First of all the addition of front lifeguards, unfortunately not too clear in this photo but makes quite a difference to the pre-war front end view. Secondly, I’ve added the black to the outside of the wheel rims (they’re plain metal on the original model) which makes the otherwise exquisite white line stand out more.

 

Here is fellow Grantham stablemate 4494 ‘Osprey’ (apologies the sun went in at this point!) She was also allocated new to Grantham, in 1938 and was one of a few that were outshopped in apple green. As there are plenty of garter blue A4s to call on(!), I was rather taken with the idea of a green one as ‘mine’. There was a bit more work involved here as the starting point was a Bachmann A4. Although it was already in apple green, the boiler band lining was a horribly over-size single white line and the wheels weren’t lined. Other details added include front guard irons (again), full length drain cock pipes, the footplate grip steps (above the cylinders) and lamp brackets. She became ‘Andrew K McKosh’ after the war – I think I prefer her in this format.

 

Just to prove we do have garter blue A4s(!), here is ‘Empire of India’ with a full 10-coach teak rake, all super-detailed Kirks, the exquisite work of Roy Mears. Despite the apparent clash of colours, there’s something quite appealing about the combination of garter blue and teak, don’t you think? The owner will not allow the roofs to be weathered in any way!

 

More attractive colour combinations as the ‘Coronation’ heads south through Grantham. The northbound train is headed by non other than 2751 ‘Humorist’ (an A3 right from the start); if you look closely you can just make out the double chimney but it is not otherwise depicted with any of its hideous pre-war smoke-deflector experiments.

 

Here’s my triplet set, which always seems to get a reaction. There weren’t too many of them but happily their operation was concentrated on the ECML and not just as part of the Flying Scotsman sets so use of a set on the layout is quite prototypical. It is in fact one of a collection of old PC Kit teak coaches I acquired some years ago (pre-Grantham) which just goes to show you should never throw anything away! They came with some rather poor running white metal bogies so I simply substituted some Bachmann ones which you can very handily buy separately. Teak wheel centres and white rims are a must!

 

Moving down the pecking order somewhat here is a depiction of a delightfully mixed bag of stock that seemed so typical of the local services of the era. Increasingly ousted by the Pacifics, the Atlantics apparently found much gainful employment on such services. The origins of this Atlantic are uncertain(!) but it appears to be scratchbuilt. It has obviously had a hard life so it’s currently ‘in works’ to hopefully make it fit for a further tour of duty on Grantham. Behind it follows an ex-NER brake composite (probably downgraded to all third class by now), my composite 6-wheeler (Bill Bedford kit), a Kirk Gresley all third (sadly now eclipsed by the recent magnificent Hornby offering) and my 6-wheel brake third (Bill Bedford again). Only one coach with toilets and not a corridor to be seen!

 

And now my first plea. If you can tear your gaze from the Atlantic(!) and concentrate instead on the stock. Behind the 6-wheel brake is a fully articulated 5-coach local set. But this is no quint-art; instead these are delightful Victorian survivors, re-cycled by Doncaster carriage works for further service. They were formerly 6-wheel and 8-wheel (rigid) vehicles, formed up into rakes like this in lieu of new vehicle construction (a telling symptom of the depression years of the ‘20s and ‘30s). And by the looks of the white roofs and wheel rims it’s been recently outshopped! My question is – how best to go about creating a set like this? The centre three are former six-wheelers so I could order some more off Bill, but the end brake vehicles are a different proposition. Any suggestions? (a few 6-wheel brakes wouldn’t go amiss either!).

 

Here’s some Non-passenger stock. On the left is of course the well-known Chivers 4-wheel brake; coupled to it is a slightly more exotic vehicle, being the D&S ex-GNR horsebox. I acquired the kit for this earlier this year and prioritised its completion for the April test run day – the paint was still wet on the day!

 

Whilst on the subject of horseboxes, I couldn’t resist sharing this picture. First of all this is a larger type of vehicle. Does anyone know origin and more importantly whether there’s a kit of one? The idea of a horse shunting a horse box is delightful! I’m tempted to build a vehicle around a Black Beetle motor bogie and fix a stout piece of wire to a scale horse and have it shunting up and down somewhere… (perhaps not top priority just yet though?)

 

Not forgetting freight wagons of course. Here is a little selection of kits I’ve made so far. Cattle wagon (Parkside), Coal hopper (slaters), RTR iron ore wagon (I’ll come back to that), 13T hopper (David Keen white metal kit, brake van (Parkside). But the reality is that I’m only going to be able to portray a tiny slice picture of the near infinite variety of wagon types to be seen in the 1930’s, most of which would have been at least 20-30 years old and thus rooted in the pre-grouping past (for which kits are even harder to come by). The research for this aspect of the project is particularly challenging.

 

This picture illustrates the conundrum. Grantham was of course famous for the iron ore traffic originating at High Dyke, some five miles to the south. The archetypal image is of an O2 with a train of steel bodied mineral wagons. But this 1930’s view (passing Grantham south box) appears to be very different. For a start it’s an O4 – apparently, the O2s were only drafted onto the iron ore traffic after the war, having been displaced from their longer distance workings – and it’s a completely uniform rake of, well, what looks to be the RTR iron ore hopper wagon above! Can anyone confirm this? And what could be the lettering on the wagons in this picture? Or perhaps this is a complete red herring!

 

To end on a light hearted note, this is ‘Liverpool’ – all my own work! Despite not being really ‘right’ for Grantham, she’s become something of a favourite. The component parts were acquired in a somewhat piecemeal fashion and she is something of a hybrid – what you’re looking at here is a Cornard white metal loco body, running on a Jamieson chassis kit, coupled to a tender from a Replica B1! As I had all the parts anyway and at the time we lived on the Liverpool side of Warrington and my son was something of a Liverpool (football) fan(!), we decided to build it as ‘his’ loco for Grantham more as a bit of fun than a strictly accurate/typical loco for the layout.

 

The kit elements are really from a previous age; the whitemetal parts were quite crude, with many moulding imperfections and with only a passing resemblance to the dimensions on the drawings! Yet, somehow, once assembled and, most importantly, the attractive LNER green livery applied, the model seemed to ‘come alive’ and its deficiencies are surprisingly concealed. As a Darlington built loco I painted her in Darlington green (ie a somewhat darker hue) together with the distinctive painted cylinders. Lining is the usual HMRS (Pressfix) transfers, although I once again added the all-important wheel lining by hand. As the paint was drying, Hornby announced their intention to introduce the B17 to the range. There’s no justice in the world…

 

 

Well, hope you’ve enjoyed this canter through some of my stock considerations. Any comments and information you may have will be most welcome as always.

 

‘Robert’

Edited August 13, 2012 by LNER4479

[micklner]

Some nice stock and photographs. Which book(s) are the captioned pictures from ?

The Horse shunter is the best ,sadly no idea of origin of vehicle GN?. I would think it a Perishable type vehicle from the amount of vents. I have a similar GCR Meat van on the go at the moment from D&S

Edited August 13, 2012 by micklner

[LNER4479]

Some nice stock and photographs. Which book(s) are the captioned pictures from ?

The Horse shunter is the best ,sadly no idea of origin of vehicle GN?. I would think it a Perishable type vehicle from the amount of vents. I have a similar GCR Meat van on the go at the moment from D&S

 

Thanks Mick,

 

The book that the captioned pictures are from is 'LNER Steam at Grantham' by Rev Arthur C Cawston. It must have been written with me in mind! Published by Wild Swan in 1987, it's long since out of print but worth keeping an eye out for in second hand book shops. Rev Cawston was assistant priest at the distinctly tall-spired St. Wulframs's church in Grantham 1930-1932 and he obviously loved his railways. Many of the pictures are from the early thirties therefore. As well as pictures, there's also some narrative sections which are quite interesting and enlightening.

 

I'm pretty sure that the vehicle the horse is shunting is in fact a horsebox (correction - I've since been informed that it is in fact a prize cattle wagon!). Note the large 'stable' type doors and lower loading ramp flap, also the windows of the groom's compartment at the far end. I've seen pictures of similar vehicles being shunted on/off the rear of southbound trains at Grantham, close to where the associated (horse) landing stage was alongside the old platform 1. The trouble is the bewildering array of different types. The new-ish Parkside kit looks lovely but is of a type that was only introduced in 1938 so it wouldn't really be right to have loads of those. I'm grateful to have acquired the D&S one pictured, even if it's of a different type, as it seems far more typical of the period (or am I being too picky?!)

Edited August 13, 2012 by LNER4479

[69843]

I must ask, are those Mailcoach Coronation coaches? If so, they are exquisitely painted.

[Markeg]

Marvelous stuff.

 

B17 Liverpool, go reds. I was planning to renumber/rename a Hornby B17, but the lner version is the smaller GE tender, wrong for Footballers.

 

Not much progress on my layout other than wiring up points and motors.

 

Mark

[LNER4479]

I must ask, are those Mailcoach Coronation coaches? If so, they are exquisitely painted.

 

Yes, the Coronation set is assembled from the mailcoach kits (the ones with the see-through plastic sides). Roy Mear's work again. I only get to see the set on special occasions(!) but will hopefully be always made available for exhibitions (along with appropriate 'empire' motive power!).

 

The Silver Jubilee set is in the paint shop at the moment so we're all looking forward to seeing that speeding through Grantham, hopefully later on this year!

 

You've had me reaching for my reference books with your number (69843). Are you planning a project to recreate an A5 then? (nice) The A1SLT would be suitably impressed with your P2 icon picture!

[69843]

You've had me reaching for my reference books with your number (69843). Are you planning a project to recreate an A5 then? (nice) The A1SLT would be suitably impressed with your P2 icon picture!

 

I am planning to model a 'new' A5 as #69843. The model will be 13ft high, have air brakes, OHLE flashes and other subtle tweeks. I would love to build one in real life but two minor problems 1. cost (always a problem) and #2 location. It's a little far to ship around easily...

 

That C1 is a wonderfully handsome little locomotive, and doesn't appear to be camera shy either.

[LNER4479]

Whilst details of the 'Up' platform buildings are relatively easy to work out, those on the 'Down' (island) platform are proving very tricky, mainly because they're all long since demolished. I can only snatch the odd detail here and there in the corner of pictures. They seem to be of wood construction (as opposed to the brick of the other platform) but more than that I cannot tell. So if anyone knows any more or has any plans showing details of their construction then that would be most helpful.

 

Well, further to the above, I'm delighted to say that Roy@34F very kindly responded to my plea for details of the old buildings on the down (northbound) platforms and is happy for me to post so all may benefit. These are the series of pictures he took shortly prior to their demolition in the early 1980’s.

 

These first two are composites showing the buildings from the west side from left (north) to right (south). The footbridge steps come down behind the telephone box. Note the missing section of valancing towards the left hand dagger boarding below where there seem to be quite a few missing roof slates. All looking a bit ‘dodgy’!

 

I’m rather taken by how the buildings go from brick to wood… to brick …and back to wood (I’d never actually realised that before I saw Roy’s photos).

 

A further view of the north end.

 

Here is a good view from the platform looking north. Roy advises that the white screen on the right covers the entrance to the gents toilet (note the ‘Gentlemen’ sign on the building).

 

These collection of wooden buildings do appear in the background of some south end shots but again this is a further useful viewpoint.

 

So there we have it. Thanks very much Roy for having the presence of mind to take these photos. If I wasn’t already convinced as to the power of the RMWeb community then I certainly am now. This was an area where I was going to have to use a little too much ‘guesstimation’ for my liking; thanks to these photos I now won’t have to do that (especially as these views will be facing the 'audience' at an exhibition!).

 

…hopefully my crummy cardboard mock-ups will soon be a thing of the past!

 

‘Robert’

[great northern]

That is exceptional good fortune Robert! My memory told me that most of those buildings were brick, but I didn't dare say so, as the memories of a teenager recalled more than fifty years on are not to be relied on.

[Theakerr]

For some reason I have missed this thread before, so I have really enjoyed the last 20 mins reading it. BR E is my interest having spent most of my younger years at Grimsby. So from time to time I did pass through Grantham.

[LNER4479]

That is exceptional good fortune Robert! My memory told me that most of those buildings were brick, but I didn't dare say so, as the memories of a teenager recalled more than fifty years on are not to be relied on.

 

That's interesting GN because I was labouring under the mis-apprehension that the exact opposite was true, ie that they were all wooden structures (based on the fact that every picture I've seen has just a glimpse of wooden slats in the background). I'm so glad that it's been 'bottomed' before I got started in earnest. Research is great fun but there comes a time when you've just got to go with what you've got!

 

For some reason I have missed this thread before, so I have really enjoyed the last 20 mins reading it. BR E is my interest having spent most of my younger years at Grimsby. So from time to time I did pass through Grantham.

 

Glad you enjoyed reading Theakerr and thanks for kind comment. I'll try to keep the posts coming but, as always, it's a balance between time on the keyboard and time actually making things. So it's back to a hot soldering iron and the rather delightful London Road Models kit for a D2 that's on the workbench at the moment...

[Brian D]

Dear LNER4479,

This is a magificent layout and I am truly jealous. Another fantastic ECML project that I must follow on RMWeb.

Early in this thread you mention the use of underlay to give the high speed "whoosh" effect. May I enquire whether you will be adding nicks in the rails at 60 foot scale centres to replicate the "diddlydoo-diddlydah" or did all welded rail exist on the LNER pre-war?

I am looking forward to seeing this potential masterpiece develop. Please keep us all informed.

Regards,

Brian.

[LNER4479]

Dear LNER4479,

This is a magificent layout and I am truly jealous. Another fantastic ECML project that I must follow on RMWeb.

Early in this thread you mention the use of underlay to give the high speed "whoosh" effect. May I enquire whether you will be adding nicks in the rails at 60 foot scale centres to replicate the "diddlydoo-diddlydah" or did all welded rail exist on the LNER pre-war?

I am looking forward to seeing this potential masterpiece develop. Please keep us all informed.

Regards,

Brian.

 

Thanks Brian for kind comments and I'm glad you're enjoying the posts.

 

Re 'nicks' in the rail - yes, very tempting! Perhaps not at the top of the priority list just at the moment but maybe something to consider at a later date. Mind you, were they at 60foot intervals in 1935-1939?! According to the RCTS green book, volume 2A, p.126, AFTER Mallard's record run, the civil engineer pointed out to Gresley that some of the rails near Tallington were of the old 40foot type, laid in about 1910! (just noticed - and how spooky, or was it 'planned'? - that the description of Mallard's run appears on page 126 of the book!!).

[gordon s]

Not sure if this has been mentioned before, but there is a wealth of information and some beautiful pics in this thread. Worthwhile giving up an hour or so to wander through. Wonderful to see another ECML layout on RMWeb...

 

http://www.lner.info/forums/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=3429&sid=c6756b4eb0e3ff0ff1cf12a2c4cc4013

[coronach]

Thanks Brian for kind comments and I'm glad you're enjoying the posts.

 

Re 'nicks' in the rail - yes, very tempting! Perhaps not at the top of the priority list just at the moment but maybe something to consider at a later date. Mind you, were they at 60foot intervals in 1935-1939?! According to the RCTS green book, volume 2A, p.126, AFTER Mallard's record run, the civil engineer pointed out to Gresley that some of the rails near Tallington were of the old 40foot type, laid in about 1910! (just noticed - and how spooky, or was it 'planned'? - that the description of Mallard's run appears on page 126 of the book!!).

 

If your track is robust enough and securely fixed, I would certainly recommend 'jointing the track', including all of the additional rail joints through pointwork. I have done this on my layout http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/34460-whinburgh-and-slitrigg/, which uses SMP code 75 plastic based and paxolin track construction, stone ballast fixed with diluted PVA, which results in a rigid base. The effect is superb. I must work out how to upload a sound video to demonstrate the effect for you.

 

For me, the sound of passing trains is an important factor, nothwithstanding the fact that I don't have the benefit of DCC sound technology. The rhythm of wheels on rails is very distinctive and of course varies according to the rail length and the wheelbase of the vehicles being operated. A model of a slow moving long freight train made up of 4-wheeled wagons should sound very different to the sound of the Up Waverley! Also, a rake of 65ft mk1 coaches should sound quite different to a rake of 57ft staniers or a 2-car dmu.

 

It is not necessary to joint the complete layout. If you just do the station area, the sound increases as the train passes across the front of the layout and then goes quiter again - in effect, you hear it go away.

 

I have put quite significant notches in my track using a half moon needle file, to make sure that each wheel drops in slightly. Try a small section first.

 

R

[LNER4479]

Not sure if this has been mentioned before, but there is a wealth of information and some beautiful pics in this thread. Worthwhile giving up an hour or so to wander through. Wonderful to see another ECML layout on RMWeb...

 

http://www.lner.info...1cf12a2c4cc4013

 

Thanks Gordon. Yes, I discovered the 'Returning to Grantham' thread on LNER forum some while ago and it has indeed been a valuable source for my research. Enjoyed reading your layout thread. Hope your project remains 'on track' following recent deliberations.

 

If your track is robust enough and securely fixed, I would certainly recommend 'jointing the track', including all of the additional rail joints through pointwork. I have done this on my layout http://www.rmweb.co....h-and-slitrigg/, which uses SMP code 75 plastic based and paxolin track construction, stone ballast fixed with diluted PVA, which results in a rigid base. The effect is superb. I must work out how to upload a sound video to demonstrate the effect for you.

 

OK guys you've convinced me! On the 'to do' list (but not near the top just at the moment)...

[Atso]

Just wanted to say how much I'm enjoying reading this thread being a fan of the 1930's LNER myself. You've really made a great start capturing the atmosphere of the location and I love the recreations of some of the trains.

 

I've always felt that the LNER was a most interesting company where the latest state of the art innovations could be found alongside aging pre-grouping stock of 50 years of age or more! You've got this to perfection here!

 

Also I really like the triplet set, I've got some old N gauge sides of a similar manufacture and seeing this has made me dig these out again!

[Anglian]

I'll echo the comments above. I've very much enjoyed reading this thread and seeing the whole picture come to life. Great stuff.

[LNER4479]

Just wanted to say how much I'm enjoying reading this thread being a fan of the 1930's LNER myself. You've really made a great start capturing the atmosphere of the location and I love the recreations of some of the trains. I've always felt that the LNER was a most interesting company where the latest state of the art innovations could be found alongside aging pre-grouping stock of 50 years of age or more! You've got this to perfection here!

I'll echo the comments above. I've very much enjoyed reading this thread and seeing the whole picture come to life. Great stuff.

 

Thanks for kind comments guys (and apologies for slightly delayed acknowledgement due to a short trip away over Bank Holiday)

 

I’m also finding the research behind the LNER in the 1930’s more and more fascinating with every new piece of historical information I unearth. In some cases the themes are common to all the ‘big four’ companies in the era; in other cases they are peculiarly LNER.

 

You can easily get the impression that the 1930’s was the great era, with Gresley’s A4’s and Staniers ‘Duchesses’ vying for supremacy as the last word in steam locomotives design and records being broken with virtually every succeeding trial or press run. But scratch beneath the surface and it becomes apparent that the reality of the times was very different.

 

A particularly sobering read is the Hughes LNER book. This is quite different from your average ‘picture book’ (great though the latter are) as it gives a very factual account of the LNER’s commercial and managerial organisation. Particularly startling is the chapter on financial performance. The graph of actual revenue against predicted revenue is scarcely believable; for one year in the 1920's (the 1926 general strike year I think) revenue was only one third of what was predicted. It’s a wonder the company survived at all. You then vaguely recall the odd fact from when you were half paying attention during school history lessons and remind yourself that 1929 was the year of the Wall Street crash that heralded the years of economic depression of the 1930’s.

 

Also of note (and not always appreciated) is that it was in the 1930’s that the government first provided financial support to the railways. Nowadays we call it a subsidy; then they were ‘capital improvement grants’. This at least partly explains how the LNER was able to build V2’s in such numbers from 1936 (and the LMS likewise the Black 5’s).

 

So this seems to be background to the continued use of the ancient GNR stock in amongst the Streamliners; with financial reserves significantly depleted, renewal of stock for the local services in the outlying provinces had to wait, leading to much 'recycling' and make-do-and-mend. One could argue that it has pretty much been the case ever since for the railways of this country(!) but it appears to have been particularly acute for the 1930's LNER.

 

As you say, a fascinating period – and for me perhaps a conundrum as to what extent I replicate this in the model. After all, I wouldn’t want to thoroughly depress everyone watching at an exhibition! But I think a careful representative balance between the new and old should both 'tell the story' and be entertaining at the same time - which feels like the right sort of balance to aim for.

 

Be pleased and interested to hear any views folks might have (and feel free to correct me on any historical facts - I'm far too young to remember the era myself!)

[devondynosoar118]

You forgot the mighty Kings of the western!

The economies of this period are particularly resonant today and the gap between rich and poor. The other noteworthy issues caused by the grouping were the sheer scale of the management task created in each company. Not only had some been ruthless competitors of each other, they also had widely divergent views on loco development and management styles. In some ways it's a miracle the grouping companies survived as long as they did, let alone produce some of the incredible locomotives and performances entwined above.