The Hintock Branch-1930's Dorset Joint GWR/SR Workings in OO

[Danemouth]

John,

 

The more I look at Hintock the more I think of scrapping Danemouth (which I haven't touched in months due to other commitments) and building a BR(W) branch terminus a sort of cross between Hintock and Much Murkle :yes: :) 

 

Please do keep up the good work and keep the photos coming,

 

Regards,

 

Dave

[Andrew P]

I'm sure your not alone with those thoughts Dave, we must all look at our LARGE layouts at times and then look at MM and Hintock and think; what if  .

[nickwood]

John,

 

The more I look at Hintock the more I think of scrapping Danemouth (which I haven't touched in months due to other commitments) and building a BR(W) branch terminus a sort of cross between Hintock and Much Murkle :yes: :)

 

Please do keep up the good work and keep the photos coming,

 

Regards,

 

Dave

 

 

I'm sure your not alone with those thoughts Dave, we must all look at our LARGE layouts at times and then look at MM and Hintock and think; what if  .

 

I'm sure that John will agree that we get different enjoyment from our layouts.

 

In my view, John obviously enjoys operation immensely but is an artist in creating a believable scene and drawing you into his ever developing world. The train movements on Hintock are well thought out and have a purpose to serve the community which is all part of the modelled area. John dispenses with superfluous detail that he feels isn't necessary to convey the story. For example, he won't get hung up about using the incorrect bogies on a coach and doesn't always model parts of buildings that can't be seen.  

 

I on the other hand get little enjoyment from operating on a day to day basis. I do enjoy sessions at the occassional exhibitions where I also try to make sure that movements are as authentic as possible; but they are a procession of trains rather than running for a specific reason. I get most of my enjoyment from building structures, scenics, adding detail and interacting with the interested public at exhibitions. I do like things to be correct so I would try to ensure that stock has the correct bogies etc but I do strike a balance sometimes in order to get things available for exhibitions. I am for example currently ensuring that all my GWR locos have an approriate livery for the 1930's which means getting rid of the GWR insignia which has been adorning a number of them for some time.  

 

So our approach is very different but also very complementary and we often compare notes and critique each others work with no commitment to agree.

 

I believe most modellers fail to make progress because they have projects that are too ambitious or just haven't planned properly. For many years I fell into this trap and for such a small layout, Much Murkle has given me so much fun and enjoyment over a number of years now and still delivers for me, although there is very little left now to develop. Hintock has been around even longer and yet John continues to change and develop this little bit of Dorset in ways that keep all of us interetsed and intrigued. Long may it continue.

[john flann]

Nick's post demonsrtates how complementary we are, we've never met for several thousand miles are between us, but I couldn't have said it better myself. Nick is a craftsman and I'm something of an artist. And our respective results speak for themselves.

 

He says Hintock has been around for a while. True. It's exact predecessor was Little Hintock that I built about 1970. Getting on for 45 years or so. The basic track plan has served me well in the interim and is likely to be employed once in a new layout (Port Bredy) I have in mind. That again will be about the size of Hintock Town Quay which brings me to Nick's so true point that the smaller layout offers more in satisfaction and that's because it's more readily achievable in a reasonable time frame. An approach I've been advocating for years. The other valid point is that the chances are it can be built indoors, whether that be the home or a nice cosy shed. No cold and drafty garage, for example.

 

Now to get back to Dave's remarks, I'm so pleased you are considering and starting afressh. It's something I've been thinking for a long while but I never said anything hoping you would come to such a decision yourself. And, you have. My only counsel is that even MM and Hintock, as is, are fairly big projects to consider being able to complete in a reasonable time span. There, I would suggest for your consideration my Owlcombe (that I think you recall from a  much earlier comment) or Little Hintock. Both are smaller, have appeal and a lot of playability.

 

For AndyP, i agree, I think there is the opprtunity for me to write a few words on the subject of "the value of small".

 

Now to conclude with a pretty picture and an example of my artistry allied with a little craftsmanship, in the manner it functions superbly.

 

Thanks, gentlemen for your continued interest.

 

[Nearholmer]

Having now got a "reader's ticket" to both the MM and Hintock threads, it's great to see the two masters discussing the craft!

 

I agree with the sentiments about what is being termed here "small" layouts being "just right" for many people in many circumstances.

 

Over time I've had a go at genuinely small layouts (less than about five square feet), which are great for mega-detail, but a tad restrictive operationally, and am currently into the largest indoor layout I've ever built (c16ft x 10ft), which is beginning to look a bit intimidating now that the track is down, and I need to get on and construct buildings etc.

 

The layout that seemed to get the balance right was one in H0, which was 15ft x 20in. I managed to get a good deal of operational interest into it, and a lot of structures (Maine waterfront theme), but also have it finished enough to be exhibitable within a reasonable timespan. Unfortunately, I built in a whopping great flaw, in that I made it as 3 x 5ft long baseboards. Each board was lightweight enough, because they were plywood boxes, with lots of lightening holes, but they were annoyingly bulky!

 

Kevin

[Danemouth]

John, Nick & Kevin (sounds like a 60's group)

 

I found your replies very interesting. My interest in model railways is operations - building a layout is a means to get there. This is because I am all thumbs and whilst I can manage the basic tasks the artistic stuff I tend to make a Grade A b*lls of! I can build a Metcalfe kit but scratch building particularly painting is beyond me.

 

Both Hintock and Much Murkle look interesting to operate which is what gets my attention - the beautiful buildings and scenery really add to the whole but as Nick says the layouts have a purpose. I look at your layouts and think that's a good idea.

 

I am also a keen photographer and am preparing a new show for Camera Clubs which need to be ready for early November - once that is done I will revisit Danemouth - I may continue with it or start over yet again - a lot of thought will go into it as I don't want to be an armchair modeller.

 

Thanks again for the inspiration your layouts give me,

 

Regards,

 

Dave

[Jock67B]

Shouldn't 'do yourself down'John - I consider you as a consummate artist! I'm afraid that I've missed 'Much Murkle' so far, but with such an accolade from you, I suspect I'll have to look in on it before the week is done!

Kind regards,

Jock.

[john flann]

 

It's mid morning on a beautiful summer's day at Hintock. Running in is is a 14xx and autocoach, ready to depart is the Up SR goods for Dorchester. The passenger train is a special bringing members of the WI from Weymouth and district to the AGM of the south-west Dorset area held at Hintock where, after a nice lunch arranged by the host WI they will hold their meeting. Then, after busineess, tea and cakes the special will take them back

 

Ever original in their thinking the WI ladies thought it a good idea to travel together and so it was. It was handily arranged as the chairwoman of the Weymouth association just happened to be the wife of Weymouth station-master, Mr W.P.Rees.

 

 

Dave, I do understand-but you do have to make a decision. You will feel the better once it's made. I would also suggest you take a look at a new RM publication, A Compedium of Track Plans, and if you can't find inspiration there I shall be very surprised.

 

As a contributor I was sent a complimentary copy and I have enjoyed looking through it. If I was wondering what next, I'd be spoiled for choice.

 

 

.... just a bonus.

 

PS, on edit, as ever a right click brings the first two images up a treat. The third is disappointing.

[Danemouth]

Dave, I do understand-but you do have to make a decision. You will feel the better once it's made. I would also suggest you take a look at a new RM publication, A Compedium of Track Plans, and if you can't find inspiration there I shall be very surprised.

 

As a contributor I was sent a complimentary copy and I have enjoyed looking through it. If I was wondering what next, I'd be spoiled for choice.

 

 

John,

 

Many thanks for your encouragement - my current photographic commitments means I won't have time to look at the layout until mid November when the first task will be to sort out the garage containing the layout. However I don't intend to rush any decisions - done that before and regretted it. I may well alter the scenario of Danemouth rather than completely scrap it.

 

I have this thing about trackplans so I will seek out the book you mention and add it to my pile of GWR track books including the complete R.H. Clark books.

 

Please keep the photos coming.

 

Regards,

 

Dave

[Peter Kazmierczak]

Dave,

PAUSE and THINK before scrapping anything.

 

We each have our different enthusiasms and specific areas of interest in this great hobby of ours. Whilst we can get inspiration from many others, what might be ideal for Mr X is his moddelling, might be completely different from what Miss Y requires in hers.

 

Regards,

Peter

[john flann]

 

In AndyP's Trecarne thread a conversation has recently ensued between RayH and Mike the SM regarding a building and in which window and door openings were hampering some desired changes. These problems can, I suggest be overcome if the openings are blinded. Quite a common event in ealier times when changes were made after building works commenced or afterward.

 

Such examples can be seen in the first images of  Carr's warehouse at Hintock and where too a door and gibbet crane has been placed over what had been a window aperture. And in the second at Hintock TQ where in the cottage adjacent the warehouse a window similarly has been blinded. Such blindings also give relief to the face of buildings.

 

 

Too, whilst posting; Alan on Wencombe cleverly got two cottages from one by cutting it in half. I also did a similar trick with what had been a Metclafe card kit. That I cut length wise, one half I retained the other I cut in two again. So obtaining four from one. All found homes at Hintock TQ and as can be seen in the images above and below.

 

 

 

[Jock67B]

Morning John,

Clever work as ever!

A thought when modelling very old buildings - lots of window apertures were bricked up or otherwise blocked to avoid the onerous 'window tax', first imposed in 1696, and not repealed until 1851. The tax was 'banded', dependant on the number of windows in a building and as usual seemed to punish the middle and lower classes more than the landed gentry! Hope this explains why so many older buildings have this, what could be considered unsightly, feature.

Kind regards,

Jock.

[john flann]

Yes, Jock thanks. I had remembered that but I forgot when posting. All my structure were built after 1851 as the railway didn't get to Hintock until a little later than that, but it's certainly a valid point for buildings prior to 1851.

 

Very much hope you are coping with the after affects of the treatment and will soon be feeling the better for it.

 

Best regards,

[Andrew P]

DSCN3842-1.jpg

 

In AndyP's Trecarne thread a conversation has recently ensued between RayH and Mike the SM regarding a building and in which window and door openings were hampering some desired changes. These problems can, I suggest be overcome if the openings are blinded. Quite a common event in ealier times when changes were made after building works commenced or afterward.

 

Such examples can be seen in the first images of  Carr's warehouse at Hintock and where too a door and gibbet crane has been placed over what had been a window aperture. And in the second at Hintock TQ where in the cottage adjacent the warehouse a window similarly has been blinded. Such blindings also give relief to the face of buildings.

 

DSCN4083-1.jpg

 

Too, whilst posting; Alan on Wencombe cleverly got two cottages from one by cutting it in half. I also did a similar trick with what had been a Metclafe card kit. That I cut length wise, one half I retained the other I cut in two again. So obtaining four from one. All found homes at Hintock TQ and as can be seen in the images above and below.

 

DSCN4075-1.jpg

Morning John, some very good and interesting ideas here, and again some excellent pics. BTW its PENCARNE, the BLT will be Trewenn, but thanks anyway.

[john flann]

My apologies Andy, I didn't check and I should have done. Even so "Trecarne" seems quite Cornish, but I'm always ready to learn.

 

And thanks gentlemen for your likes and other positive comments.

 

Hintock TQ does look well in those two images-and I have been having some second or third thoughts about the scope of the changes. More about that later.

[Andrew P]

My apologies Andy, I didn't check and I should have done. Even so "Trecarne" seems quite Cornish, but I'm always ready to learn.

 

And thanks gentlemen for your likes and other positive comments.

 

Hintock TQ does look well in those two images-and I have been having some second or third thoughts about the scope of the changes. More about that later.

Funnily enough John, as Pencarne is based around Boscarne Junction I went through all the Tre Pol and Pens to go with Carne, so it could have easily been Trecarne. but as the BLT was going to be Trewenn, a play on the name of a TV program over here, Doc Martin with Martin Clunes based in Port Wenn, which is actually filmed in Port Isaac where my parents used to go swimming in the summers after the War, hence wanting a similar name.

[john flann]

Andy, there's always a story behind a name! That's very plausible and very understandable given the family background to it. John.

 

(PS & OT. Doc Martin is on PBS here and popular. For me the setting is more interesting than the stories.)

[Andy R]

John...and Nick; nicely said gentlemen. Interesting observations from you both that we can all ponder on and draw from your different experiences.

 

Thanks, Andy R

[john flann]

 

As a winter project I thought I would extend the Hintock Branch to its terminus at Port Bredy.

 

It will be another stand alone layout as is Hintock TQ, the reason for that being a smaller project is easier to build and it's a handy size. The intent is that the basic layout shall be no longer than 5'0 and having a separate staging yard. Thus enabling a greater variety of trains to be run. The trains themselves will be short: the passeger Prairie and one coach plus vans, the goods, three or four wagons.

 

There are three sidings, one serving the loading dock, another for general traffic and coal and one for traffic to and from Port Bredy harbour. From this the harbour traffic is worked on the Port Bredy Harbour Tramway to and fro, by horse. The harbour itself is not modelled. The vans arriving by passenger train will be dealt with at the platform.

 

All structures will be scratch built and the baseboard of lightweight construction. Track will be Peco code 100, I have considered using code 75 but in all the circumstances shall stay with what I know.

 

Those are the broad outlines, above is my first sketch plan and below a worked up plan. As a straight line diagram It is for guidance only to give me the feel of siding lenghts and the like.

 

 

[Ray H]

That looks very good John.

 

Presumably it is handed the way it is because of the room/space it will be used in. It just seems strange to be viewing it from the other side relative to the larger layout which we have come to know and love (and recognising that the two will never be worked as one).

 

I wonder whether the signal box would be positioned adjacent to the single line so that the signalman doesn't have to roam too far from the box when delivering or collecting the staff/token/tablet. I'm sure that someone will now provide evidence to support your positioning!

[The Stationmaster]

That looks very good John.

 

Presumably it is handed the way it is because of the room/space it will be used in. It just seems strange to be viewing it from the other side relative to the larger layout which we have come to know and love (and recognising that the two will never be worked as one).

 

I wonder whether the signal box would be positioned adjacent to the single line so that the signalman doesn't have to roam too far from the box when delivering or collecting the staff/token/tablet. I'm sure that someone will now provide evidence to support your positioning!

At one of the 'boxes on a past patch of mine the Signalman had to cross a siding, the Down Main Line, and then the Up Main Line in order to reach the single track branch line in order to deliver or collect a token.

[john flann]

Gentlemen, thanks for your interest and Ray and Mike for your approving comments on this and my other endeavours..

 

The plan is provisional and I was left with juggling the positions of the water tower and the signal box and this is the solution I came up with. It follows that at Easton, on the Portland Branch and from which so much of my inspiration is derived, I did think of positioning it at the end of the platform where the porter/signalman could readily walk to it,  but that seems the best location for the water tower.

 

Similarly it is not too inconvenient to reach when trains are due-the box would not be manned all the time as that cannot be justified-and it's a good location for lines of sight and considering runs of point rodding and signal wires. I'll make a final decision when things are further ahead and what makes the best scene. For both locations are feasible.

 

I rather like this orientation as it clears the immediate area, up front, and so easier to reach across for coupling/uncoupling when shunting. I too rather like the potential for realizing an attractive scene created by the arrangement. The non-modelled harbour branch is a nice feature and when I thought about I recognized it was the way to go.

 

I'm looking forward to getting on with it. It will be fun to build and should be a pleasure to operate-all in 5'0" plus say 2'6" for the staging yard.

 

My regards,

 

PS,on edit, I have an illustration of Easton and the signal box and I shall post it-when I can find it!

[Ray H]

At one of the 'boxes on a past patch of mine the Signalman had to cross a siding, the Down Main Line, and then the Up Main Line in order to reach the single track branch line in order to deliver or collect a token.

I suspect that such antics wouldn't be acceptable today on a new build (assuming that a box was still required).

[The Stationmaster]

I suspect that such antics wouldn't be acceptable today on a new build (assuming that a box was still required).

Quite likely Ray - however it should be noted that the single line concerned was only handling about 40 - 50 trains a day at its busiest (back in the 1970s), since resignalling in teh 1980s it is fully track circuited with color light signalling and the signalbox is over 10 miles away. 

[Jock67B]

John,

Sorry I missed your post last night, I think it looks like a superb opportunity to demonstrate more of your fine modelling skills. It will be interesting to see how you treat the modelling of the water in the forefront. Do you intend that this layout could link with either of the others in time?

Kind regards,

Jock.