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  • 3 weeks later...

Good Evening

 

Latest progress report on Haymarket and why there has been no photos for some time.

 

Shock horror, the two photos enclosed shown the current position with the layout, no locomotives or building structures.

 

I am now in the process of a complete wiring of the whole layout using 16/02mm wiring.

 

I am just about to order 14 Digital Cobalt point motors from DCC Concepts and all necessary track detailing components such as cosmetic brass fishplates, track ballast and ashes etc.

 

One tricky point is trying to cut out the sleepers to expose the engine shed inspection pits.

 

I was a bit soul destroying taking everything apart including all fixings that hold the baseboards in place but all necessary.

 

A bit of a contrast from my last posting back in September.

 

Future photos to follow as I progress and hopefully all back together including scenics in the near future

 

Regards

 

David

 

 

IMG_2706_edited-1.jpg

IMG_2708_edited-1.jpg

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7 minutes ago, jcarta said:

Phew....... There was me thinking that you were going to bin it..............

 

So glad it is just a rewire job.

 

Jim

Hi Jim

 

its not a rewire I have never got around to Wiring the layout in the first place.

 

This should have been done at the beginning of the year but COVID 19 put a stop to that.

 

I know have most of the materials I need so I am in full flow with the wiring, I had to learn how to solder as well before I made a start.

 

Thanks for your reply and interest.

 

Regards

 

David

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Good luck with the wiring David, big gap in the website until you get up and running again!

 

If I may, some pictures of Crownline Great Northern which is almost complete.

 

2124939047_004(2).JPG.4572347de488af1e3ed820e85868bb8e.JPG

 

190298017_005(2).JPG.7f7ea7ffb428503190624f3d5a90b263.JPG

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

 

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2 hours ago, 30368 said:

Good luck with the wiring David, big gap in the website until you get up and running again!

 

If I may, some pictures of Crownline Great Northern which is almost complete.

 

2124939047_004(2).JPG.4572347de488af1e3ed820e85868bb8e.JPG

 

190298017_005(2).JPG.7f7ea7ffb428503190624f3d5a90b263.JPG

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

 

Hi Richard

 

60113 looks a real treat, please keep us posted on your progress.

 

The track wiring is a bit of a laborious task, today I have dismantled and turned all four baseboards upside down to enable me to glue copper clad sleeper strips the entire width of each baseboard.

 

That completed I can now securely fix back together all four baseboards to continue with the soldering and track wiring which to be honest I do find a bit therapeutic.

 

Regards

 

David

 

 

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Many thanks David!

 

Glad to hear that there are health benefits to track laying and wiring. I shall be doing the same once we have moved up to Buxton.

 

Good luck with the work and I look forward to the return of Haymarket!

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

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1 hour ago, 30368 said:

Many thanks David!

 

Glad to hear that there are health benefits to track laying and wiring. I shall be doing the same once we have moved up to Buxton.

 

Good luck with the work and I look forward to the return of Haymarket!

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

Hi Richard 

 

Thank you and good luck with your move.

 

One of the reasons I am behind with the wiring is Norman Saunders of Just Tracks was going to visit to help and advise but COVID put plaid to that and then Norman Moved away from Swindon to Yorkshire.
 

Anyway a good start has been made and once the wiring is all completed and point motors fitted I can Concentrate on the scenics.

 

Regards

 

David

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21 hours ago, landscapes said:

Hi Richard 

 

Thank you and good luck with your move.

 

One of the reasons I am behind with the wiring is Norman Saunders of Just Tracks was going to visit to help and advise but COVID put plaid to that and then Norman Moved away from Swindon to Yorkshire.
 

Anyway a good start has been made and once the wiring is all completed and point motors fitted I can Concentrate on the scenics.

 

Regards

 

David

Glad to see progress with the wiring , David . It will be great for you when you can actually run your engines around . Keep us all updated on progress after the delay caused by this damn virus .

   And Richard, " Great Northern " is looking very good . Keep the pictures of progress coming . How have you found the build , have you had any problems with the kit ?

                                   Best Wishes ,

                                              Ray .

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Hi Ray,

 

Yes we all miss David's Haymarket.

 

I have built PDK kits before (and DJH A2/3) and they go together very well. The only problem with 60113 was the resin boiler which had rather a lot of voids due to poor casting, however, it was a Crownline kit and possible early days for resin loco boilers? I'm sure the latest PDK kits ussing resin are much better. No other real problems, I have made a number of changes and additions as is my want! High Level motor and gearbox first class as always.

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

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Great Northern now complete. I may apply some weathering powder and then clean and polish. I should add that I am perfectly happy with the "touch up" look of the Brunswick Green, the loco is as it was in early 1955 just after a Casual Light overhaul at Doncaster when it would probably have had its paint touched up rather than a full re-paint. My personnel preference is for loco's to look a bit careworn rather than pristine.

As far as I can tell in January 1955 it would not have had AWS fitted.

 

On to the tender. How is the wiring going David?

 

1281205538_001(2).JPG.75a85c0d59b24fd771fc30336c670ec0.JPG

 

337775343_003(2).JPG.01e09d0535196c0b7cea1a08d0297407.JPG

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

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40 minutes ago, 30368 said:

Great Northern now complete. I may apply some weathering powder and then clean and polish. I should add that I am perfectly happy with the "touch up" look of the Brunswick Green, the loco is as it was in early 1955 just after a Casual Light overhaul at Doncaster when it would probably have had its paint touched up rather than a full re-paint. My personnel preference is for loco's to look a bit careworn rather than pristine.

As far as I can tell in January 1955 it would not have had AWS fitted.

 

On to the tender. How is the wiring going David?

 

1281205538_001(2).JPG.75a85c0d59b24fd771fc30336c670ec0.JPG

 

337775343_003(2).JPG.01e09d0535196c0b7cea1a08d0297407.JPG

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

Hi Richard 

 

Your  A1/1 Looks absolutely superb and a locomotive that is not available in RTR and probably will not be either as it was so unique.

 

The wiring is going Very well, all three main running lines passing the MPD are all wired plus a few others as well.

 

Hopefully Gareth of Replica Railways in Swindon is due to visit me later this week to wire up al the points.

 

I have just ordered some weathering spray cans from the  Railmatch range to just give an overall dusting to all track work before its glued down in position then individual weathering by either brush or air brush will be applied

 

I am just about to order the Digital point motors from DCC Concepts as well.

 

I am also looking in advance on how to build up the main shed floor to the top of the rail level, I have already completed a small prototype section so now have a good idea on what’s reguired.

 

I was dreading the wiring and solder but now thoroughly enjoy doing a bit at a time.

 

Happy with it all so far but I must make sure all the electrics are in and fully operational before I get onto the scenic works.

 

please post more photos of 60113 with tender when all completed.

 

Best Regards 

 

David.

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On 19/10/2020 at 16:27, 30368 said:

Hi Ray,

 

Yes we all miss David's Haymarket.

 

I have built PDK kits before (and DJH A2/3) and they go together very well. The only problem with 60113 was the resin boiler which had rather a lot of voids due to poor casting, however, it was a Crownline kit and possible early days for resin loco boilers? I'm sure the latest PDK kits ussing resin are much better. No other real problems, I have made a number of changes and additions as is my want! High Level motor and gearbox first class as always.

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

Yes , it was an early example of resin boilers &they seemed to vary a lot . Mine wasn't too bad , only needing a bit of filling & rubbing down to make good .Even on the best kits there is always something to improve on to make it even more your own & yours certainly looks very realistic .As far as I can tell "Great Northern " got it's A.W.S in June 1959  so you are fine there . It was quite a common visitor when I was a young spotter at York station ( unlike the W.1 which rarely worked North of Doncaster) & was usually as I remember in pretty good condition .

   Look forward to seeing the completed engine & tender .

                         Best wishes ,

                                  Ray .

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Good evening David,

 

GREAT NORTHERN....................

 

One of the most reviled locomotives of all time? Yet, for any latter day ex-GN ECML steam depiction  it has to be included.

 

I built mine from the Crownline kit about a quarter of a century ago, writing up my account in the late-lamented MORILL. 

 

The resin boiler was very poor, with some distortion and 'scuff' marks. 

 

1242588717_20A1160113Crownline.jpg.109fa41abc6c4333cb0df0322f21dd69.jpg

 

Ian Rathbone painted it superbly (even down to hand-painting the GNR device), though some marks are still evident on the boiler's surface. 

 

60113.jpg.77ea12f3be0fff21a6288220f37baefb.jpg

 

One thing I should have altered is the angle of the radius rod; it's more inclined to be in reverse!

 

She's definitely a layout loco, having seen service on Stoke Summit and now Little Bytham...........

 

1026884830_60113GREATNORTHERN.jpg.5cbfd6130f8356554e60876a9ea9d90b.jpg

 

8338680_A1160113.jpg.e0fdf7fd8ee1363e27bafdad4d753505.jpg

 

854716188_A1160113GREATNORTHERNonDownexpress.jpg.bd93d14c472dc701d274b1177d71752b.jpg

 

Is the kit still available from PDK? If so, I'm sure the resin boiler will be far superior, because it's basically a very sound kit. 

 

I look forward to Haymarket's progress.

 

Regards,

 

Tony.  

 

 

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34 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

 

 

Good evening David,

 

GREAT NORTHERN....................

 

One of the most reviled locomotives of all time? Yet, for any latter day ex-GN ECML steam depiction  it has to be included.

 

I built mine from the Crownline kit about a quarter of a century ago, writing up my account in the late-lamented MORILL. 

 

The resin boiler was very poor. I suggested it was 'plagiarised' from a Hornby A3 one, which rather upset the proprietor - until I took a picture showing 'Hornby' inside it!

 

1242588717_20A1160113Crownline.jpg.109fa41abc6c4333cb0df0322f21dd69.jpg

 

Ian Rathbone painted it superbly (even down to hand-painting the GNR device), though some marks are still evident on the boiler's surface. 

 

60113.jpg.77ea12f3be0fff21a6288220f37baefb.jpg

 

One thing I should have altered is the angle of the radius rod; it's more inclined to be in reverse!

 

She's definitely a layout loco, having seen service on Stoke Summit and now Little Bytham...........

 

1026884830_60113GREATNORTHERN.jpg.5cbfd6130f8356554e60876a9ea9d90b.jpg

 

8338680_A1160113.jpg.e0fdf7fd8ee1363e27bafdad4d753505.jpg

 

854716188_A1160113GREATNORTHERNonDownexpress.jpg.bd93d14c472dc701d274b1177d71752b.jpg

 

Is the kit still available from PDK? If so, I'm sure the resin boiler will be far superior, because it's basically a very sound kit. 

 

I look forward to Haymarket's progress.

 

Regards,

 

Tony.  

 

 

Hi Tony

 

Superb examples of A1/1 60113 Great Northern, it always eluded me in my trainspotting days even though it was a regular visitor to Kings Cross Station.

 

I have taken a leaf from your book, from watching the  very first video on Little Bytham you produced quite a few years ago now, it came with one of the Model Railway journals.

 

You stated in your video how important it is to get all the electrics and wiring  installed and Working correctly before going on to the scenic works and that’s exactly what I am doing now.

 

And I have to say I am thoroughly enjoying doing it as well.

 

Thank you for posting your photos.

 

Regards

 

David

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Hi

 

I hope this photo shows how I intend to fit the track work and open up the inspection pits both inside the shed and in the east yard as well.

 

I have removed a few of the sleepers at each end wheee the trackwork covers the relevant inspection pit.

 

Once the track is wired and stuck down the remains sleepers over the pit will be removed using a razor saw..

 

I have already built up the floor to sleeper level using 1.5mm thick cork sheeting.

 

when the track is stuck down a second layer of 1.5 mm Cork will be applied to cover the outer sleepers and bring the floor up to rail level.

 

Thats the theory.

 

Regards

 

David

E51D4074-D5CB-414E-B14E-93C7DD376750.jpeg

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Hi 

 

This was the prototype mock up I made to get some idea on how to create the inspection pit areas.
 

It is very basic but it proved my idea would work, obviously there is no Inspection pit below the rails, it was used Purely to see what was needed to raise the floor up to rail level

 

Regards

 

David

52020F52-76E5-469E-9EA5-2F260BBD6FF2.jpeg

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21 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Good evening David,

 

GREAT NORTHERN....................

 

One of the most reviled locomotives of all time? Yet, for any latter day ex-GN ECML steam depiction  it has to be included.

Good evening Tony,

 

Wonderful pictures of your Great Northern running on your great layout. It obviousely can pull a bit and whilst built so long ago is still to a very high standard. An ugly prototype but it still makes a powerful model! One thing I replaced on my version was the casting for the superheater manifold covers - too small in my view.

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

 

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Great Northern x2 .

     A far better example than the very poor ex Crownline  PDK version , I built a Blue version and then sold it on. I  used the excellent Hornby A3 and Graeme King's resin and etched conversion parts for these two.

 

post-7186-0-35741500-1367866979.jpgpost-7186-0-26483900-1418746398_thumb.jpg

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8 minutes ago, micklner said:

Great Northern x2 .

     A far better example than the very poor ex Crownline  PDK version , I  used the excellent Hornby A3's, and Graeme King's resin and etched conversion parts.

 

post-7186-0-35741500-1367866979.jpgpost-7186-0-26483900-1418746398_thumb.jpg

Hi Mick

Two  very nice models indeed.

 

Regards

 

David

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2 hours ago, 30368 said:

 

 

Good evening Tony,

 

Wonderful pictures of your Great Northern running on your great layout. It obviousely can pull a bit and whilst built so long ago is still to a very high standard. An ugly prototype but it still makes a powerful model! One thing I replaced on my version was the casting for the superheater manifold covers - too small in my view.

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

 

Thanks Richard,

 

I agree about the too-small superheater header covers.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

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13 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

Thanks Richard,

 

I agree about the too-small superheater header covers.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Hi Tony

 

My PDK A2/1 also had undersized super heater covers, I removed and replaced them with new covers I obtained from Graeme King.

 

A big improvement.

 

Regards

 

David

 

image.jpeg.802f6945cd4bc9f1ec96e081cf050a00.jpeg

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1 hour ago, micklner said:

Great Northern x2 .

     A far better example than the very poor ex Crownline  PDK version , I built a Blue version and then sold it on. I  used the excellent Hornby A3 and Graeme King's resin and etched conversion parts for these two.

 

post-7186-0-35741500-1367866979.jpgpost-7186-0-26483900-1418746398_thumb.jpg

Good evening Mick,

 

'A far better example than the very poor ex Crownline  PDK version'.

 

I'd be more careful about making such bold statements. I've never claimed anything I've made is 'better' than anything anyone else has made. 

 

Let's examine how your pair is 'better' than the Crownline/PDK version.

 

Which of your versions has the right boiler? On the green one, the combustion chamber ahead of the firebox is longer (draw an imaginary line through the rear driver from the cladding band above it to see). The dome is also further back on the blue one (I assume it's blue - it looks more black in the picture). Another difference is the relative positions of the washout plugs on the firebox sides. Since the A1/1 always had an A4 boiler/firebox, both can't be right, can they? 

 

The bogie is way too far back on the blue version. 

 

The spacing of the 'LNER' on the tender of the green one looks too close to me. 

 

As for the crosshead/slidebar arrangement on both, both lean upwards towards the rear (the opposite of how they should be - an inheritance from the incorrect Hornby arrangement?). 

 

There's no doubt you've done a fine job on these conversions, and there are elements on them which are 'better' than on the Crownline/PDK version. However, other elements are 'worse'. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

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9 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Good evening Mick,

 

'A far better example than the very poor ex Crownline  PDK version'.

 

I'd be more careful about making such bold statements. I've never claimed anything I've made is 'better' than anything anyone else has made. 

 

Let's examine how your pair is 'better' than the Crownline/PDK version.

 

Which of your versions has the right boiler? On the green one, the combustion chamber ahead of the firebox is longer (draw an imaginary line through the rear driver from the cladding band above it to see). The dome is also further back on the blue one (I assume it's blue - it looks more black in the picture). Another difference is the relative positions of the washout plugs on the firebox sides. Since the A1/1 always had an A4 boiler/firebox, both can't be right, can they? 

 

The bogie is way too far back on the blue version. 

 

The spacing of the 'LNER' on the tender of the green one looks too close to me. 

 

As for the crosshead/slidebar arrangement on both, both lean upwards towards the rear (the opposite of how they should be - an inheritance from the incorrect Hornby arrangement?). 

 

There's no doubt you've done a fine job on these conversions, and there are elements on them which are 'better' than on the Crownline/PDK version. However, other elements are 'worse'. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Tony

        I dont need to be careful about anything ,the PDK version I built was poor in the extreme from the beginning of the build . I was refering to the PDK version I built, I hadnt even looked at your Crownline version shown on here. It was designed by P Hill ,so it has links to the Crownline version, no idea how close they both are.

       Nothing was stated is relating to anyones else's models . Dont suppose before you type in bold please, a totally unecessary reaction.

 

PDK

The main problem was the over width one piece chassis etch , when folded up and soldered together ,following the instructions the built in spacers were far too wide , as a result the bearings had to be filed to nothing before any side play existed at all. Hence it would not go around any curves. The only solution would have been a totally rebuilt chassis. The valve gear was poorly designed and etched, the cab had rivets as found on a A2/3 layout. Resin Boiler poorly made. Poor quality whitemetal castings as well. Luckily Graemes version then arrived ,and it was sold and its not missed.

 

Relating to the comments on my Hornby based builds.

 

  Both Locos  are based on the same NRM Flying Scotsman bodies and chassis . The washout plugs are correct, dome postions are identical on both ,as made by Hornby , as are the Bogies postions , perhaps the camera angle is creating your percieved problems . 4470 is in GER Royal Blue . The LNER on Tender of the Apple Green version is out by 2mm in width or less. The slidebar is up by perhaps 1mm or less, limitations of having to reuse parts of the Hornby valvegear.

 

Compared to the PDK version I see nothing better (see below). The Tender was also poorly designed, with large cut out areas in the internal support frame for the sides, as a result it was impossible to avoid large curves/sagging along the body due to the thin Brass etches supplied when soldered.

 

A better rendition of the Hornby Blue GN version in the first photo below.

 

The PDK version on the left below in the second picture below, yes it is also Blue , the colour doesnt show well under artificial light . That also has a slight lift on that slidebar as well.

  When compared to the Hornby version it looks too low,as does the Loco, it simply doesnt have the prescence of the Hornby version.

 

post-7186-0-47762500-1367867013.jpgpost-7186-0-03370600-1367867026.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

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21 minutes ago, micklner said:

Tony

  I dont need to be careful about anything ,the PDK version I built was poor in the extreme from the beginning of the build . I was refering to the PDK version I built. It was designed by P Hill so it has links to the Crownline version.  Nothing was stated is relating to anyones else's models . Dont suppose before you type in bold please, totally unecessary.

 

PDK

The main problem was the over width one piece chassis etch , when folded up and soldered together ,following the instructions the built in spacers were too wide , as a result the bearings had to be filed to nothing before any side play existed at all. Hence it would not go around any curves. The only solution would have been a totally rebuilt chassis. The valve gear was poorly designed and etched, the cab had rivets as found on a A2/3 layout. Resin Boiler poorly made. Poor quality whitemetal castings as well.

 

Relating to the comments on my Hornby based builds.

 

Both Locos  are based on the same NRM Flying Scotsman bodies and chassis . The washout plugs are correct, dome postions are identical on both ,as are the Bogies postions , perhaps the camera angle is creating the percieved problems . 4470 is in GER Royal Blue . The LNER on Tender of the Apple Green version is out by 2mm in width or less. The slidebar is up by perhaps 1mm or less, limitations of having to reuse parts of the Hornby valvgear.

 

Compared to the PDK version I see nothing better (see below). The Tender was also poorly designed, with large cut out areas in the internal support frame for the sides, as a result it was impossible to avoid large curves/sagging along the body due to the thin Brass etches supplied when soldered.

 

A better rendition of the Hornby Blue GN version in the first photo below.

 

The PDK version on the left below in the second picture below, yes it is also Blue , the colour doesnt show well under artificial light . That also has a slight lift on the slidebar . It also compared to the Hornby version  it looks too low, and simply doesnt have the prescence of the Hornby version.

 

post-7186-0-47762500-1367867013.jpgpost-7186-0-03370600-1367867026.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hi Mick

 

I do agree with your comment regarding the tender height of your PDK A1/1

 

I noticed exactly the same problem with my A2/1 and actually returned it to PDK asking can anything be done to increase the height.

 

Spacers were placed between the tender chassis and the tender body which did improve the appearance but not to the the same height of the tenders on my two Bachmann/ G king conversations which in my opinion look more like the prototype locomotive.

 

My comments above are by no means any criticism of Paul Hills superb skills in making up these kits I think it’s just a design fault.

 

Regards

 

David

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