Train spotting in the late 60's

[pH]

Thanks for the info again Gwiwer were abouts would these static boilers be used?

 

Here's a list of stationary boilers - http://www.abrail.co.uk/stationary_boilers.htm

[Black8]

Huge thanks again for everyone's replies, never expected i would get this much help . The list of stationary boilers was very interesting, i had no idea some of them lasted so long. I do most certainly hope to have fun recreating this period and have finally started working on the baseboards. I do have one more question though, would blue and grey stock have been more likely in a particular type of train or would it have simply been shoved together?

[RJL]

Hi Russ, i haven't made a start yet but i will be modeling the north west from around 1966-68 and possibly of up to the early 70's. Due to a lack of space and funds i will probably take a Chris Nevard type approach and simply make a large amount of small layouts over time with the intention of eventually making something modular.

 

 

 

That's an approach I use ,you able to see finished results quicker. not only that it is easier to transport it.

 

Russ

[Gwiwer]

Blue-grey stock would have appeared first on the west coast main line expresses in the form of new Mk2 coaches then slowly spread as the Mk1 fleet was repainted. Not all Mk2 coaches were delivered blue-grey - a few began life in maroon or green. As the WCML was and is the major artery it generally got the newest rolling stock. But for quite a few years trains of mixed livery were common with the proportion of maroon to blue-grey slowly shifting in favour of the latter. Check the rolling stock in pictures of the "15-Guinea Special", the official BR farewell to steam tour, for example.

[Black8]

Thanks again for the reply Gwiwer and sorry for not replying sooner, i have been very busy setting to work with base boards and forays into basic kit building. Would i be right to assume by 67-68 most WCML expresses would be diesel hauled, im guessing the newly delivered class 50's in most cases? looked at the 15-guinea special, lovely mix of stock and impressively clean locos for the time!

[edcayton]

If you look at photo albums of the end of steam in the North-East there appear to be a surprisingly large number of clean loco's. There were groups (the Master Neverers being the best-known) who took it upon themselves to clean loco's for photographic purposes. In some cases they only cleaned the side they were going to photograph. Replica nameplates were made too.

 

Ed

[Gwiwer]

I had almost forgotten the Master Neverers. A well-known band at the time who gave their spare time (whether or not employed by BR - the shed masters were happy enough for them to come in under those unique circumstances) to do as Ed says namely to prepare and present locos suitably in their last days knowing that they would be extensively photographed. Those on the 15 Guinea special were among the locos specially "bulled up".

 

By 1967-8 WCML expresses south of Crewe were in the hands of AC electrics as there was a ban on diesels entering the new Euston station once complete. Locos were changed at Crewe for those trains proceeding north of Weaver Junction and into unelectrified territory. The Anglo-Scottish trains (and some other important ones) had a D400 (later class 50) and often two to get them over the banks. Lesser passenger trains would have had a D200 (class 40) in most cases. Vans and freight would have had what ever the shed master had available which might have been a 24, 25 or 40 and occasionally something else.

[Black8]

Thanks for that Gwiwer, I find it very helpful knowing which classes were used for what, there seemed to be a lot of Britannia's still in use in 1967, any chance you know what these would be used for, from what i have found it mostly seems to be freight?

 

Edit - i have been enjoying looking at your layout, reminds me of when i was younger on holidays to Cornwall telling my mum i was going to the beech and then sneaking of and catching the train to par to see the clay trains

 

brings back good memories

[Gwiwer]

"Brits" were found on parcels and newspaper trains in the mid sixties and occasional passenger duties though by then only as a stand-in for a failed diesel in most cases. When that happened it would be a case of taking the steam loco off a train already in the area as it could not simply be switched on and run. They were seen on the Settle & Carlisle as much as anywhere but were also found on the WCML until almost the end of steam.

 

i have been enjoying looking at your layout

which means it is now my turn to thank you.

[johnw1]

I saw my first Brit 70026 Polar Star at Lenton South Junction in the summer of 1966. Althogh I saw a few more at Crewe in 1967 and the couple that escaped the cutters torch on and off since it would be forty three years before I saw another Brit at Lenton South

 

['CHARD]

This is the thread you want:

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/52572-why-is-this-so-rarely-modelled/page__st__350

 

All the key subjects of the period are discussed in this thread at some length.

[90171]

I lived as a child in Accrington about 3 miles from Rose Grove shed and watched the end of steam as a teenager.

Originally the master shed of the group, Accrington was the passenger shed and Rose Grove mainly freight duties. Accrington closed as a steam shed in 1962. At this point, local passenger services became operated by green diesel multiple units (which we called bug-boxes).

 

A general point to make about liveries in 1967, is that "rail blue" was first introduced in 1965, but obviously it could not be extended to the whole BR fleet overnight. In fact, after the coming of the green DMUs, the general impression alongside (mostly black) engines pulling (mostly red) carriages, was of green diesels, particularly green Type 4s. As an example, my old copy of Trains Annual 1967 has pictures of a green DMU set at Edinburgh, a two-tone green Deltic at Kings Cross, and a green Type 4 at Carlisle. A B&W shot at Euston looks like the electric loco is in blue. Obviously there was some overlap, and there are pictures elsewhere of (eg) a Black 5 pulling mixed red and blue/gray passenger stock. However, I think there would be quite a bit of green diesel around, if before the end of steam in August 1968. To be accurate needs careful study of dated photographs.

 

We used to watch railway trains most nights at our local sports field. Steam services were parcels or empty stock workings, plus excursions, football specials etc. As wagon-load freight gradually declined, the most typical freight was 16-ton mineral wagons, loose-coupled, hauled by an Austerity 2-8-0.

In the early sixties, Rose Grove had Stanier 2-6-4 tanks, Crabs, Black 5s, a couple of Jinties, one of the last L&Y Class 26, and (in 1960) 15 Austerities.

As the years went on, BR rationalised the remaining loco classes, so that by 1967 Rose Grove had 9 Black 5s and 21 8F 2-8-0s.

The Britannias were rationalised too, with the whole class concentrated at Carlisle Kingmoor by about 1965. Kingmoor (apparently) had a very bad reputation for cleaning and maintenance, so by this stage the Brits were running about in a filthy condition, often hauling freights over the S&C and thus to Rose Grove. Most if not all of them were minus nameplates towards the end.

All Britannias - except for Oliver Cromwell - had ceased work by the last day of 1967.

We used to get a B1 through most evenings in the mid-60's, with an empty stock working (I think) from Yorkshire.

Occasionally we might see a 9F 2-10-0.

To spot a Jubilee in north-east Lancashire was a definite treat. They were more common at Preston of course. We also regularly saw Flying Pigs from Lostock hall.

Down at Preston prior to 1964 a major attraction was to see a Duchess. I can remember these in red livery, reduced to hauling parcels or empty stock. If you were lucky, the Duchess would slip when getting away, and make a heck of a racket in the station. There were still 22 Duchesses in traffic at the beginning of 1964, but all were withdrawn by September.

 

I model what I remember, based on the composite period about 1959 to 1966. A point of interest, is that it is possible to reflect the full span of locomotive design over 80 years. My stock includes ex-L&Y 52179 (1889) [shedded at the Grove withdrawn 1960] and a 4F 0-6-0 (the classic British type of loco), with a Jinty station pilot. Then the two great successes of the 1920s LMS being the Crab and the Fowler 2-6-4T. The 30's are represented by Black 5, Jubilee, and 8F. Ivatt 43006 represents the post-war LMS, and an Austerity plus a Brit complete the picture.

There are however no bug-boxes on my layout !