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Rough Engineering Made Easy, Making me own Brush 4


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Very interesting conversion on the jouef 40 clive, iv about 20 of them picked up very cheaply over years so will have a crack at slimming one down, any pitfalls encountered doing yours? Looks very simple to do.

Cheers

James

Hi James

 

They came apart and went back together quite easily. As I have said there was not too much filing at the joints where they showed and not much filler needed either. By using the engine hatches as the datum there is quite a long stretch where a natural line occurs thus no need to hide the joint. They just drop on to the Lima chassis and I should think they would a Bachmann one. 

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Cheers Clive, will have a go with one once iv cleares my desk a bit, woeful lack of modelling being done at the mo, had a pair of 04s on the go for months now....

My jouef ones seem to run ok bt can take a bit of fettling so ill investigate slimming the jouef chassis.

Cheers

James

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  • 2 months later...
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From now on I will only be posting serious model railway post.

 

I have never knowingly seen a model of a Class 48, these were D1702-6 when first built. They differed from the rest of the Brush type 4s in having a 12 cylinder V engine not the twin bank. They were not too successful and were later rebuilt to conform with the rest of the class. Until recently I had not realised that they had a different roof layout over the engine room. Using Gimp to take out the perspective from two photos. One with the number one end towards the camera and one facing the other way I drew a grid of where the cant rail grilles were. I then took the background out of the two pictures leaving the two grids. One was inverted and they were placed so that they both lined up with each other. From here I was able to adjust the grids to make one which gave constant dimensions.

 

This grid was scaled to fit a class 47 drawing and the new grilles were drawn. I repeated the same exercise with the roof hatches etc.

post-16423-0-33639500-1483480340.png

 

Next was to locate the class 47 body I have knocking around spare. Stage one was to remove the engine room roof detail and the train heating boiler exhaust. I then as carefully as I could took out the ribs on the cant rail grilles, this was quite difficult as a slight slip could meant I ended up removing the raised part of the grille and ruining the effect. I also filed off the radiator shutters as these locos had the early three part fixed radiator grille.

 

post-16423-0-71873100-1483480679_thumb.jpg

 

When happy with my effort I then started to add the new grille supports. micro strip does not come in the sizes I needed so I cut my own from 10 thou plastic card. I also added the new supports for the radiator grille.

 

post-16423-0-48720600-1483480812_thumb.jpg

 

The next bit was easy, again using 10 thou plastic card I added the rest of the engine room roof detail. I am not too sure the new twin exhaust are in the right place, I may need to replace this panel with them set closer together.

 

post-16423-0-41073500-1483481089_thumb.jpg

I had also added the bars for the radiator grille from 10 thou rod.

 

The easy bit now done, all I have to do is add the handrails, paint it and get the chassis working.

 

post-16423-0-49441300-1483481273_thumb.jpg

 

Hopefully you can see the difference between a 47 and a 48 in this photo.

 

post-16423-0-56256900-1483481416_thumb.jpg

Edited by Clive Mortimore
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  • 2 weeks later...

I'm afraid I haven't done one, but after catching up with "Wright Writes", and seeing your pictures on there, I came back for another look here.

 

Your pictures on this thread do seem to have very little problem, as you can see clearly the hinges and ribs on the central panels, particularly on the final images.

 

Thinking about the adjustments you've made, I presume that the tricky and time consuming work was in remaking the cantrail grilles. It's amazing really that Brush suddenly decided to have 19 small grilles in the central group on the 48 (3+5+3+5+3), rather than the 18 on the 47 (3+3 in three groups), what difference to ventilation could this have made? In theory I suppose someone could modify the model by carefully cutting out the central group on the plain side, shunting them along and finding a spare off another body to provide the extra, but I'd be doubtful if my skills were that good. And as you said elsewhere, someone would have to be quite brave to mess with a Heljan model at today's prices.

 

On a separate subject, I stumbled across the Barrowmore drawings yesterday, and was delighted to find the one for the 1/558 Brake tender, which I've always coveted! Many thanks for having made this publicly available.

 

John.

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I'm afraid I haven't done one, but after catching up with "Wright Writes", and seeing your pictures on there, I came back for another look here.

 

Your pictures on this thread do seem to have very little problem, as you can see clearly the hinges and ribs on the central panels, particularly on the final images.

 

Thinking about the adjustments you've made, I presume that the tricky and time consuming work was in remaking the cantrail grilles. It's amazing really that Brush suddenly decided to have 19 small grilles in the central group on the 48 (3+5+3+5+3), rather than the 18 on the 47 (3+3 in three groups), what difference to ventilation could this have made? In theory I suppose someone could modify the model by carefully cutting out the central group on the plain side, shunting them along and finding a spare off another body to provide the extra, but I'd be doubtful if my skills were that good. And as you said elsewhere, someone would have to be quite brave to mess with a Heljan model at today's prices.

 

On a separate subject, I stumbled across the Barrowmore drawings yesterday, and was delighted to find the one for the 1/558 Brake tender, which I've always coveted! Many thanks for having made this publicly available.

 

John.

Hi John

 

The whys and wherefores of the engineering side of trains are sometimes best not to be explored, just model what you see. :yes:

 

I to thought that it might be easier to use the cant rail grilles of a second loco but when I looked at the positions of the support/dividing bars they are not in the same places so I would end up with 19 bits of grille. On the class 48 the end 3 grille panels  and the next 3 are of the same size (smaller than a 47s) then the 2 panels are smaller with the 3 middle ones being slightly longer than the end 3 but still smaller than the 47s. I do have another Hornby 47 body which has been ear marked to convert to a Cuban 48 so I will be repeating the grille work as the Cuban locos had the same grilles as the 48s, I thing it might be due to the same engine.

 

Without looking in my diagram book the 1/558 brake tender is the two short ones with LMS bogies? Did you follow the Hornby Magazine Brake Tender thread, where photos of both appeared on the same day proving that they were fitted with LMS bogies after years of rumours they had BR mk1 bogies.

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Hi Clive,

 

Looking again at your model and the drawings I can see what you mean about the sizes, they aren't simply 19 class 47 grille sections in a different arrangement.

 

The picture in the last post does make the roof detailing stand out more, which is obviously what is intended, but at the expense of more even illumination of the model as a whole, as the side is quite dark without the flash. It will be interesting to see this when painted, although if you're anything like me that might be a while!

 

The 1/558 brake tender is the angular Stratford one. Yours is the only model I've ever seen of one, put I think on your? Brake Tender thread (its in my bookmarks). I have read through the Hornby Brake tender thread, a success snatched from the jaws of disaster it would seem by members of RMweb, and if they've any left next time I see Hornby at a show I shall go for one. My only one is the Mopok variant, bought I suspect when still at school c.1972 and assembled a bit later, painted later still and transfers added when Fox did their sheet, I think these cost a fair bit more than the original kit! I never corrected the rounded top corners of the ends, as you did, and wouldn't touch it now as I quite like the finish I managed.

 

Many thanks again for the guidance.

 

John.

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Hi John

 

If you intend to make a Stratford Brake Tender use Bachmann LNER bogies as they are 8 foot wheelbase. Many LNER bogie non passenger carrying stock had 8 ft bogies not the normal 8 ft 6 ins.

 

On Tony Wright's thread he suggest I shine a torch on the side as I click the shutter, that should show the sides etc better than in the above photo.

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There is the Britannia Pacific Models 'RTR' 1/558 brake tender.

 

Sadly it's a scale 3' too long and rides on roller-bearing 8'9" Gresleys... something of a disappointment that costs £50.

 

Better to scratchbuild, as Clive continues to amply demonstrate :)

 

Hi Clive,

 

The 1/558 brake tender is the angular Stratford one. Yours is the only model I've ever seen of one, put I think on your? Brake Tender thread (its in my bookmarks).

John.

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  • 1 year later...
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This has been sitting in a stock box for too many years it is about time I got and made it. So for the next few weeks I will try and do a little bit each night. Today's work has been to repair the chassis. I had only made it from 40 thou plastic card and where the bogies pivot on the chassis it had become damaged so I added a stiffener to each pivot point.

 

post-16423-0-46495000-1515950504_thumb.jpg

 

post-16423-0-07210800-1515950513.jpg

 

 

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This has been sitting in a stock box for too many years it is about time I got and made it. So for the next few weeks I will try and do a little bit each night. Today's work has been to repair the chassis. I had only made it from 40 thou plastic card and where the bogies pivot on the chassis it had become damaged so I added a stiffener to each pivot point]

 

Go on, Clive. A clue as to what it is? Doesn’t quite look like Brush Type 4 or will it become one?

 

Tim T

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Go on, Clive. A clue as to what it is? Doesn’t quite look like Brush Type 4 or will it become one?

 

Tim T

 

Hi Tim

 

It will be a Brush 4.

 

 

A Class 49.

 

That or a one-off built at Smethwick.......

 

Hi Peter

 

I done Lion years a go.

 

The more I think about this model, the more I realise it was started before the Heljan model came out. The bogies I think came from a Hornby 37 which has spent most of its life as a Baby Deltic.

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Tonight I have been adding the fronts. I first had to cut out the headcode panel and drill the light sockets.

 

post-16423-0-69635000-1516046490.jpg

post-16423-0-42843100-1516046498_thumb.jpg

 

I did start to file the shape but the cement hadn't quite set and the front panels started to move.

 

post-16423-0-13760300-1516046506.jpg

post-16423-0-36971700-1516046514.jpg

Edited by Clive Mortimore
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Clive, is that a scratch built body shell there?

 

Tim T

Hi Tim

 

Yes, I was trying to work out when I started it. Before the Heljan model was resleased. It missed being scraped like my part built Deltic, 24, and 25/3 were when the Bachmann models were released. Don't know why I held on to it but now I am retired I might as well finish it.

Edited by Clive Mortimore
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I think I am at a point where I need to consider what variant of Brush 4  this will end up as.

 

Choices

A freight only loco, no boiler. I believe most of these had Serck shutters from new.

One of the D1501-1509 locos. 3 part radiators and a single supporting bar on the engine room grilles.

Or something else?

Edited by Clive Mortimore
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I think I am at a point where I need to consider what variant of Brush 4  this will end up as.

 

Choices

A freight only loco, no boiler. I believe most of these had Serck shutters from new.

One of the D1501-1509 locos. 3 part radiators and a single supporting bar on the engine room grilles.

Or something else?

Whatever you end up doing it will be good and, more importantly, all your own work.

 

Regards, Tim T

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Tonight was a bit of a disaster. I planned to slap on the filler to the roof. Now that would have been a few seconds work so I decided to do the inner box for the underthingies. I measured the drawings then a Heljan model. 14mm deep by 52mm long by 25mm wide. While I was at it thought I would do a simlar box for the Great British Locomotives Brush 4 I motorised. cut the bits out, assembled them , fitted the one to the GBL model. Whoops I had measured from the bottom of the body not from the underside of the chassis which on both models is a few mm inside the body. So I had to make two more and they were different depths. 

 

post-16423-0-11005100-1516227703_thumb.jpg

Box under the scratchbuilt body. The box will be filled with lead and a lid/bottom will be added the supports for the lid have already been added.

 

post-16423-0-47661400-1516227817_thumb.jpg

As fitted.

 

post-16423-0-32340000-1516227843.jpg

And to the GBL model.

 

post-16423-0-66855200-1516227872.jpg

I have used Squadron green stuff on a loco for the first time, I normally used Milliput. I wonder what the result will be.

 

To be continued......

 

 

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Tonight was a bit of a disaster. I planned to slap on the filler to the roof. Now that would have been a few seconds work so I decided to do the inner box for the underthingies. I measured the drawings then a Heljan model. 14mm deep by 52mm long by 25mm wide. While I was at it thought I would do a simlar box for the Great British Locomotives Brush 4 I motorised. cut the bits out, assembled them , fitted the one to the GBL model. Whoops I had measured from the bottom of the body not from the underside of the chassis which on both models is a few mm inside the body. So I had to make two more and they were different depths. 

 

attachicon.gif100_4709a.jpg

Box under the scratchbuilt body. The box will be filled with lead and a lid/bottom will be added the supports for the lid have already been added.

 

attachicon.gif100_4710a.jpg

As fitted.

 

attachicon.gif100_4711a.jpg

And to the GBL model.

 

attachicon.gif100_4712a.jpg

I have used Squadron green stuff on a loco for the first time, I normally used Milliput. I wonder what the result will be.

 

To be continued......

Give the squadron putty loads of time to dry, it will soften the underlying plastic. Don't ask how I know...

 

Andi

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What is loads of time, days, weeks, months, for ever? 

 

I normally give Milliput a day.

I find that the time depends on how thickly you apply it, although I have recently used the white version as I couldn’t find my tube of green. Admittedly it was a bit on the thick side at a millimetre plus to fill the gap in the skirting where I’d dropped a cast metal sign (see Plye Wood for details). That took three days to dry out enough to start sanding it back

 

Tim T

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I find that the time depends on how thickly you apply it, although I have recently used the white version as I couldn’t find my tube of green. Admittedly it was a bit on the thick side at a millimetre plus to fill the gap in the skirting where I’d dropped a cast metal sign (see Plye Wood for details). That took three days to dry out enough to start sanding it back

 

Tim T

Hi Tim

 

3 days, I'll get bored waiting and put it to one side for the next 15 years....

 

Last night I remembered why it was put to one side in the first place, it is too long by 2mm. I am not going to try and cut out 2mm but will have to remember to shuffle the roof thingies about to absorb the 2mm . I knew I shouldn't place my homemade locos next to RTR ones.

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