Rough Engineering Made Easy, Making me own Brush 4

[Clive Mortimore]

I have also done a series of locos with open Serck shutters. The closed ones are removed. Once I have filed the whole to size it is ready to receive the new open shutters. These are microstrip glued to a plastic card backing. This is an easy conversion and one that I have only ever seen on one layout, Mostyn. Yet most photos of Class 47s in action show them open.

Hornby

 

Lima

 

 

Heljan and Vi Trains being prepared.

 

Heljan

 

Vi Trains, I quite like the Vi Trains model as it seems to be backdating quite nicely.

 

 

 

[Clive Mortimore]

Hi All

 

Yesterday I grabed my tools and attacked two Vi Trains Class 47s to make them into Brush Type 4s. I wanted to make one with the early radiator grilles. Looking at the two the large logo locomotive has a early type boiler blanking plate and the triple grey one a universal bolier compartment. Therefore the large logo one was selected for this conversion. It was done in the same way as I had done the Lima model. Both had the front ends altered, the headlamp removed, the aerial mount filed off and the headcode panel opened up. The triple grey one had a flush end so the headcode panel had to be measured.

 

With all my Type 4 1/2 conversions I have the boilers to sort out and the under gubbins, most need water tanks added.

 

 

 

Edited December 29, 2013 by Clive Mortimore

[rmwsn]

Hi, I would be interested in seeing completed pictures of your triang class 31's

[Clive Mortimore]

Hi, I would be interested in seeing completed pictures of your triang class 31's

Hi

 

So would I, I haven't touched them for yonks. I have a problem in I get sidelined with new projects. Since starting them I have started two new layouts. :locomotive:

Edited November 21, 2015 by Clive Mortimore

[Peterpiper]

Hi

 

So would I, I haven't touched them for yonks. I have a problem in I get sidelined with new projects. Since starting them I have started two new layouts. :locomotive:

I'm glad to know I'm not the only one that gets sidetracked on new projects, I must have a few dozen on the go too

[Phil Bullock]

HAs anyone else twigged that the rad shutters/grilles on Bacchy 47s are a separate fitting and easily removed?

 

Just need a ready made source of replacement open serck shutters

 

Phil

[Clive Mortimore]

HAs anyone else twigged that the rad shutters/grilles on Bacchy 47s are a separate fitting and easily removed?

 

Just need a ready made source of replacement open serck shutters

 

Phil

Hi Phil

 

That nice Mr Evergreen or that nice Mr Slaters do sell micro strip just for such occasions.

 

Bachmann grilles pop out ? Now if I could get hold of some Bachy radiator shutters and another green with small panel Brush 4, I can swap the grilles over and have a serck fitted green small yella Type 4 1/2 which Bachmann seem reluctant to make...................................only half the class entered service in that state.

[Moggs Eye]

Nice to see life being breathed into those old models. Hopefully it will inspire folk to have a go themselves.

[Phil Bullock]

And I guess its the Sercks we all want! Any clever 3d printers out there please?

P

[Phil Bullock]

Hi Phil

 

That nice Mr Evergreen or that nice Mr Slaters do sell micro strip just for such occasions.

 

Bachmann grilles pop out ? Now if I could get hold of some Bachy radiator shutters and another green with small panel Brush 4, I can swap the grilles over and have a serck fitted green small yella Type 4 1/2 which Bachmann seem reluctant to make...................................only half the class entered service in that state.

Hey Clive

 

DO you have friends in High Places - or just Cornwall????

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/109812-kernow-announce-class-47-d1670-in-two-tone-green-and-mk1-guv-as-surbiton-okehampton-car-carrier/

 

Phil

[Clive Mortimore]

Hey Clive

 

DO you have friends in High Places - or just Cornwall????

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/109812-kernow-announce-class-47-d1670-in-two-tone-green-and-mk1-guv-as-surbiton-okehampton-car-carrier/

 

Phil

Hi Phil

 

I saw it and thought "Oh No"!!!!! I have just coughed up a load of dosh for one of Mr Sutton's skinhead Type 2's.

 

After reading your post, I went into the manshed (where I should be now) and took a Bachy type 4 1/2 with three part fixed grilles apart and they don't pop out. I must be having a Brush period, this week along with the Bo-Bo the postie delivered a Heljan two tone green one with the three part fixed grilles and a Lima George Jackson Churchwood in the same colours (a limited edition number 4  hundred and something of 550).

 

Now what am I going to do with the Heljan blue Brush 4 I purchased (at a good price) to convert into one with a 3 part grille? may be just renumber it to a D series number and run it on Ranelagh Bridge.

[Clive Mortimore]

Last week a Great British Locomotive Class 47 came my way. I have spare Hornby Brush 4 bogies from my re-chassising my Tri-ang English Electric Type 3 project, so I put two and two together and this is the result so far.

The GBL loco as it came. It is a clone of the Lima Type 4. I was hoping that the chassis would be plastic so all I had to do was cut out the holes for the Hornby bogies. No it is metal.

 

The solution is a new floor from plastic card.

 

This will be glued in place once I have sorted out some lead for inside the body, I have strips of plastic card to the inside so that I can mount the body on the chassis.

 

I also need to make the under belly gubbins, this will act as a guide to how I am going to modify my Lima, and Vi-trains tanks etc. that have had bits removed.

Edited April 10, 2016 by Clive Mortimore

[Clive Mortimore]

Having the locos dual motored is a good idea. I try to do that with all my locos but out of the modern image locos from classes 37, 66, 91 & 92 the only locos that are dual motored up to now with the the exception of 1 Class 37 & the Class 66 ( Bachmann locos ) I have a dual motored Hornby 37, Both 91s & 2 of the class 92s. The 3rd 92 was converted using parts from a Bachmann 66 and runs much better and quieter than the 37, 91s & the other 2 class 92s all 3 of which have been psinted green as if they had been bought by GWR for electrically powered services bith passenger and freight and been renumber into the 93xxx series as 93001/2 & 3, putely fictional I know but I thought why not.

 

93001 ( formerly 92009 Elgar ) which is the Bachmann drive loco can easily start 9 Mk3 or Mk4 coaches but has yet to be tested with Mk1 coaches.

And there is quite a bit of room for filling with lead. One of the power bogies had been used in my scratch built Kestrel. That had 2 Hornby ringfield motors and was packed with a steel bar and a brass bar. On our old club layout which was noted for the lack of level track was hauling 32 Lima and Tri-ang coaches at a scale speed of 60 mph.

 

Sadly it was badly damaged. I didn't repair it as it did not fit into my time line.

 

Two motored locos can also have a smother performance if the motors "balance" themselves. 

 

Hopefully this will be powerful, I wonder if it will out haul my MTK 47. It can pull a Heljan 47 backwards. It has twim MTK power bogies, geting one to run is s feat, but two in the same loco is great. I did not make this model, but saw it at a show selling for a reasonable price. I was very broke at the time. One year later it was still up for sale off the same stand for the same price.     

I know where the AWOL bogie side is, mind you the GBL mouldings for the 47 bogie are nice, so may be??????

[DCB]

Great thread.almost makes me want to forget about 4-4-2T conversions of M7s for the line they never built in the isle of Skye, but.

 

When I did a lot of train spotting circa 1985/2000 at Cheltenham mainly, when Class 47s were common on Birmingham Bristol passenger turns, the radiator shutters were very prominent as they opened up as the loco powered up to depart.   Also the bogie compensating beams used to work overtime on the uneven track.  Neither of these features ever seem to get modelled so they can actually work like the prototype.  Just a provocative thought.....

[John Tomlinson]

Great thread.almost makes me want to forget about 4-4-2T conversions of M7s for the line they never built in the isle of Skye, but.

 

When I did a lot of train spotting circa 1985/2000 at Cheltenham mainly, when Class 47s were common on Birmingham Bristol passenger turns, the radiator shutters were very prominent as they opened up as the loco powered up to depart.   Also the bogie compensating beams used to work overtime on the uneven track.  Neither of these features ever seem to get modelled so they can actually work like the prototype.  Just a provocative thought.....

I think there are now chassis kits for diesels that feature compensation. Mainly for the P4 guys (and well beyond my skills or desires), but it has been done.

 

John.

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

... Also the bogie compensating beams used to work overtime on the uneven track.  Neither of these features ever seem to get modelled so they can actually work like the prototype...

 First thing to think about is how much actual movement? Scaled down it becomes near invisible. Make your track poor enough to generate enough movement, and then all vehicles need suspension/compensation to stay on the rails.

 

I have a very poor 'humped' track profile in one location on the test track, thanks to a long ago roof leak. Bachmann's rather neat hinging fallplates can be seen to work over this; but you have to get up close and watch intently. It's a track profile that would only be found on temporary quarry lines in standard gauge operation in the UK.

[Clive Mortimore]

Last week a Great British Locomotive Class 47 came my way. I have spare Hornby Brush 4 bogies from my re-chassising my Tri-ang English Electric Type 3 project, so I put two and two together and this is the result so far.

001a.jpg

The GBL loco as it came. It is a clone of the Lima Type 4. I was hoping that the chassis would be plastic so all I had to do was cut out the holes for the Hornby bogies. No it is metal.

 

006b.jpg

The solution is a new floor from plastic card.

 

002a.jpg

This will be glued in place once I have sorted out some lead for inside the body, I have strips of plastic card to the inside so that I can mount the body on the chassis.

 

004b.jpg

I also need to make the under belly gubbins, this will act as a guide to how I am going to modify my Lima, and Vi-trains tanks etc. that have had bits removed.

The GBL was given a run on the club's roundy roundy. after a short while it settled down nicely. When travelling in one direction it derailed on a point, need to check its back to backs. Having said that my mate's Castle (that's what he said it was, all GW 4-6-0s look the same to me) kept jumping off on a another set of points.

[Clive Mortimore]

Yesterday I went to the Illford and West Essex exhibition and came home with another Great British Locomotive, a Deltic   I will let you guess the price. I already had a Lima class 37 chassis spare, well the whole loco, don't know what to do with the body

 

The GBL loco was striped down. I removed the fuel and water tanks from the chassis. Attention now turned to the chassis of the 37. Bogies were removed. First mod was to cut off the buffers, ping went the third one, I do hope the vacuum cleaner picks it before Mrs M sees it on the floor, or worse she finds it in the dogs paw. Using my favorite file I went to work on shaping the ends so the Deltic body could fit over them. I cut off the 37 fuel tanks form it chassis. Spliced in the GBL Deltic tanks and added some plastic card supports. The bogies were turned round so the foot steps lined up with the cab doors. It does mean the middle brake cylinder faces the wrong way. I can live with that. The soldering iron was fired up so I could add some new wires between the bogies, the Lima ones were too short. I waited until all the super glue had set hard before uniting the bogies with the frame. Two rolls of led were added to the belly tanks and off it went to be tested, Brummmm Brummm I went, as it ran along Sheffield Exchange. I then plonked on the body, no mods needed to the body. Hummmmmm Hummmmmm I went, it is a Deltic, as it trundled over the points at Sheffield Exchange. Job well done I said to myself.

 

End modifications

 

The chassis

 

Hummm Hummm  Hummm

Edited April 24, 2016 by Clive Mortimore

[Clive Mortimore]

Recently on Wright Writes thread I expressed my views about a Lima English Electric Type 4 that Tony posted a photo of. I went on to say that in my mind the best looking Class 40 was the Modern Outline Kits. Since then I have had a second look at my 2000s and I am not too sure if the MOK is the best or the newer Bachmann one. Both are very good. Here is a review of the D200s I have and my opinions of them. We will start with the first RTR model by Jouef.

 

It looks like a English Electric Type 4 but it was 4mm too wide. Even after 30 odd years since it went out of production to me in isolation it still looks like a type 4, it sort of has the bulk of the real thing that many other models seem to lack. 

 

You can see how wide it is next to my new Bachmann model.

 

I will get back to this model and who I modified some later on.

 

My next Class 40 was scratchbuilt after the Jouef one stopped being made.

 

It is a bit battered after 30 years of use, another one to add to the workshop list for when I retire.

 

It may not be the best detailed or painted but I feel I did get the shape reasonably correct when compared to the modern Bachmann model.  I will be using the Bachmann model as a comparison as I go along.

Edited October 13, 2016 by Clive Mortimore

[Clive Mortimore]

The Lima model was the next in my collection. From day one I was not happy with it. The nose seems too narrow, too high and teh corners too sharpe. The windscreen is flat, the driver's and secondman's windscreens should angle back a little. A consequence of the flat windscreen is the side cab windows are too long. Lovely chassis, like all Lima diesels will pull long layout sized trains, has a reasonable speed control and works every time (and even better if the wheels are kept clean). 

 

 

Can you see what I mean about the nose and windscreen?

 

The windscreen issue shows up when you look directly down on the loco.

 

I have tried to improve things, by cutting away the corner post of the windscreen and making a new one form plastic card. 

 

With this one I was a little too enthusiastic with rounding the corners. It does need a full repaint not just a touch up. The scored frost grille came out OK. 

 

The little bit of work I done has improved the look, despite my crude painting.

Edited October 13, 2016 by Clive Mortimore

[Clive Mortimore]

One Lima loco I found in my local shop (John Dutfield's Model Railways, Chelmsford) was this oddity. It has been fitted with True Scale Models power unit, and pick up bogie.

 

The bogies do look a bit better than the Lima ones.

 

For some reason the bogies are a rigid eight wheels, very little side play with the wheel that on the real ones was a pony truck. It has great difficulty with Peco points and I cannot recall ever running it with a train behind it. I cannot explain why I brought it, I think because at the time the model press was saying how wonderful the power unit was compared to the Lima pancake. It seems that etched brass and what to me look like steam loco frames inside the bogie won the hearts of the reviewers, not was it any good on a normal layout.  What was the saying when I was in the army bull something baffles brains.

 

 

 

[Clive Mortimore]

Back to modifying RTR locos. The Jouef loco when slimmed makes a reasonable looking 2000. 

 

I did narrow the Jouef chassis but it made it an even poorer runner than before. This loco shares its chassis with a Lima loco.

 

When I slimmed this one down and the others I done I made the cuts 2mm wide along the engine room roof hatches, and the nose top doors, and then at an angle on the nose fronts to save as much detail as possible.

 

 

Very little filing and filler were needed when rebuilding the bodies.

 

I have also had fun lengthening a Tri-ang Type 3. I had done a few cut and shuts to make Baby Deltics using the Tri-ang class 37 so I thought lets go the other way and make one longer into a 40. What chassis should I use? There was a second hand Lima model on the shelf. That loco body became a Baby Deltic and the bogies from the class 37 now run under a scratchbuilt 37.

 

The shape is pretty good, the modelling bad. The model suffers from the Tri-ang windscreen and scored on cant rail grilles.

 

 

I am in the process of making a few more of these, all to run on Mainline Peak chassis that I have knocking around.

 

I have tried to rectify the windscreen problem, so far looking OK so might do this to all my Tri-ang 37sas well. I have also made the cant rail grilles from laminated plastic card, trouble is being white the flash seems to have blurred them.

 

Edited October 13, 2016 by Clive Mortimore

[Clive Mortimore]

Now to kits. To start with the granddaddy of all 4mm class 40s is the MTK model.

 

I have two in similar states of construction. The one I photoed will run on two Tri-ang class 31 bogies, they need the side detail filled off and new side frames fitted. The pony truck is pivoted on the screw which would have held the tension lock coupling on the 31 bogie. The other one will have a Peak chassis. OK they are very crude by today's standards but they do look like class 40s.

 

The other kit I have is a Modern Outline kit, not made by me but by the Barrowmore Model Railway Group for their Mostyn layout. Hence the TOPS number, full yella end and lots of weathering. It is on the list to visit the paint shop.

 

 

Compared with the Bachmann model I still cannot say which is the best both look very good.

Edited October 12, 2016 by Clive Mortimore

[Clive Mortimore]

Finally the "old" Bachmann model alongside the "new" model. The old one is a mm to short in the body but this only shows when the scale size frost grilles supplied are fitted.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[jessy1692]

Very interesting conversion on the jouef 40 clive, iv about 20 of them picked up very cheaply over years so will have a crack at slimming one down, any pitfalls encountered doing yours? Looks very simple to do.

Cheers

James