Flood Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Sorry guys but you're missing a specific point. Rob F said Mk 3 and Mk4 DVTs, which are not as long as the other stock. I think the reason for the DVTs being C3 is because they have the same end profile as the stock that they run on a day to day basis which, as we already know, is C3. They probably could get away with being C1 but that may cause confusion have two different loading gauge classifications for the same build of stock. As Rob F says above the DVT data panel states 18.83 (as seen in the photo in this post: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/62838-british-rilways-codes-on-br-coaches-mk1-mk2-mk3-coaches/?p=812948). So wiki is correct for DVTs. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vin Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Cheers Flood, That clarifies the situation. Both mark3 and mark4 DVTs are shorter than the passenger coaches. The profile of the bodies would change the kinematic envelope of the carriage, therefore C3 restrictions make sense. Vin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob F Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 (edited) Irrespective of what (or not) Wiki says, the data panels on both Mark 3 hauled stock and HST vehicles give the length as 22.57m and width 2.74m - see illustrated examples above.Yes, but not the DVTs, which are shorter. Compare the Hornby DVT to a mk3 coach and you will see. We also have a photo of the data panel of an actual DVT in this very topic which corroborates the wiki value, so I don't think this is in doubt. So, if we can return to the original question, why are shorter vehicles given a C3 restriction? Rob EDIT. Sorry, early in the morning and hadn't noticed we had got to page 3 and the issue was being dealt with. Edited January 17, 2014 by Rob F Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob F Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Cheers Flood, That clarifies the situation. Both mark3 and mark4 DVTs are shorter than the passenger coaches. The profile of the bodies would change the kinematic envelope of the carriage, therefore C3 restrictions make sense. Vin Plausible, but if the body profile matches the stock they are used with, would that not make them narrower than a mark 1, and thus even further away from a C3 restriction as the body is shorter? Rob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
45125 Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Kinematic envelope is one of the reasons mk3 and 4 DVT are C3. The shape of the vehicle, throws on curves and vehicle roll all go in to the decision what restiction the vehicles come under. Regards Al Taylor 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
'CHARD Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 (edited) Plausible, but if the body profile matches the stock they are used with, would that not make them narrower than a mark 1, and thus even further away from a C3 restriction as the body is shorter? Rob Mk3 and 4 stock isn't narrower than Mk1. Edited January 17, 2014 by 'CHARD Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium keefer Posted January 17, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 17, 2014 (edited) just wondered if the under frame casings have an effect on clearances especially near track level? Edited January 17, 2014 by keefer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
'CHARD Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 just wondered if the under frame casings have an effect on clearances especially near track level? They potentially could, although in reality their outermost dimensions don't really infringe the cross-sectional extremities of things like battery boxes and other equipment slung under Mk2s, at least not by much (a few mm). The key is the inside curve gauge infringement of these longer vehicles at the vehicle centre-line, and the outside curve gauge protrusion of the vehicle's outer corners when on a curve. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catkins Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 I'm not sure if the C3 restriction for rolling stock is related to the 'bogie centre to end of vehicle' measurement, and then the end throw on curves, along with the body mid point cut in. Much like we gauge the curves on our layouts using the longest (rigid) model that we have. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium keefer Posted January 17, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 17, 2014 The passenger doors on the mk3s are quite heavily 'sculpted' below waist level, presumably to keep them in gauge on sharper curves Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shed Posted May 4, 2019 Share Posted May 4, 2019 Learning something new every day. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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