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There won’t be any internet connection but if you have connected to the Z21 router - which you have, and you have an IP address that is 192.168.0.x - I don’t know who you check it in Android but best to check it - and you have entered 192.168.0.112 into the app as the address for the Z21 then all should work.

 

just check that you have connected the Z21 into one of the bank of 4 network connections and not the port that is on its own.

 

 

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can I suggest that you install this app (or similar) onto your phone and do a scan?

 

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.goodidea.network.ipscanner&hl=en

 

this should only show 3 items on the network

 

a) router

b) your phone

c) the Z21

 

the address you need to enter into the Z21 app is the last one, which should be 192.168.0.111.

 

come back with a screen shot of what you see if you still cant get a connection.

 

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19 minutes ago, WIMorrison said:

can I suggest that you install this app (or similar) onto your phone and do a scan?

 

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.goodidea.network.ipscanner&hl=en

 

this should only show 3 items on the network

 

a) router

b) your phone

c) the Z21

 

the address you need to enter into the Z21 app is the last one, which should be 192.168.0.111.

 

come back with a screen shot of what you see if you still cant get a connection.

 

scan done on phone , it brings up the mini pc (which is not connected to the Z21 or router at all) , my phone and the router , however when i switch the device on phone to the Z21 it brings up my phone and the TP LINK Router (Z21) which is saying the IP is 192.168.1.1 , if i open the Z21 app and change the IP address to match it still does nothing

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There won’t be any internet connection but if you have connected to the Z21 router - which you have, and you have an IP address that is 192.168.0.x - I don’t know who you check it in Android but best to check it - and you have entered 192.168.0.112 into the app as the address for the Z21 then all should work.

 

just check that you have connected the Z21 into one of the bank of 4 network connections and not the port that is on its own.

 

 

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4 minutes ago, sulzer71 said:

scan done on phone , it brings up the mini pc (which is not connected to the Z21 or router at all) , my phone and the router , however when i switch the device on phone to the Z21 it brings up my phone and the TP LINK Router (Z21) which is saying the IP is 192.168.1.1 , if i open the Z21 app and change the IP address to match it still does nothing

Sorry to be blink but you need to be very clear on what you are seeing as I am confused as to what you are saying and as I cannot see your setup you need to be explicitly clear :)

 

can you do a screen shot as that will be clearer. What you appear to suggest is that you have connected to something else as the addresses don’t seem correct.

 

And are you 109% certain that the only cable connected to the Z21 router is the cable to the Z21?

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23 minutes ago, WIMorrison said:

Sorry to be blink but you need to be very clear on what you are seeing as I am confused as to what you are saying and as I cannot see your setup you need to be explicitly clear :)

 

can you do a screen shot as that will be clearer. What you appear to suggest is that you have connected to something else as the addresses don’t seem correct.

 

And are you 109% certain that the only cable connected to the Z21 router is the cable to the Z21?

thanks for the help , oddly i have managed to get it working by pressing the reset button on the Z21's router a couple of times although now it shows as TP Link rather than Z21 but never mind , it works

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Excellent - though I am still confused as to what was happening before as you seemed to have the wrong subnet , but I couldn’t be certain.

 

Doesn’t matter now, though the TP link has now lost the ROCO configuration and is using the default OEM settings that fortunately are what are required for the Z21 ;) 

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17 minutes ago, WIMorrison said:

Excellent - though I am still confused as to what was happening before as you seemed to have the wrong subnet , but I couldn’t be certain.

 

Doesn’t matter now, though the TP link has now lost the ROCO configuration and is using the default OEM settings that fortunately are what are required for the Z21 ;) 

it's baffled me but it's working now which is what matters

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Z21 app V1.2.0 now available in the App Store 

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Hi all, I’m new to this forum and have been ‘lurking’ for a while. I have a room sized 00 BR outline layout and for the last 15 years have been happily using a ZTC 511 + a ZTC corded remote. I recently acquired a z21 (white) from a friend and have been playing with it – I’m very impressed. I would like to set up my layout to use the z21 but want to retain use of the 511 as a (static) extra throttle, but the z21 does not have the connectivity (i.e. sniffer port). I had the brilliant(???) idea of acquiring a Z21 (black) and using the white one as a booster (my layout has 2 power districts), since I read somewhere (on this thread?) that the Roco boosters are essential the same as the Z21 master unit.

Is this a good idea? Would it work OK? Would there be any conflict between the 2 power districts? Are there any other snags?

Any thoughts or help would be much appreciated.

Rod B

Glasgow UK

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Theoretically you could make the Z21 sniff the z21 but to do what you want you would then be making the z21 the master system losing all the benefits of having the Z21 and the additional interfaces.

 

If you are wedded to the z/Z21 then you could get a Z21 and attach a ROCO 10805 as the booster and that will work perfectly, this is the route I would choose and I would sell the z21.

 

Another option is to use a Z21 with a Digikeijs DR5033.

 

this route provides a supported pattern and is expandable.

 

 

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2 hours ago, rodney burnett said:

I read somewhere (on this thread?) that the Roco boosters are essential the same as the Z21 master unit.

You may be confusing the situation which applied with the Basic Roco Amplifier ...'764. Which is/was identical electrically to the separately available ( at the time) Booster ...... This was a great advantage to know  because Digital Start Sets were relatively cheap to buy .....and their amplifier could be used as a Booster without any  modification .       

When used as the MASTER unit .... Whichever Multimaus was plugged in to the MASTER socket is the MASTER DCC generator, AND the source of remembered values ....such as point/signal position ,  active loco names and function status.

The LIBRARY of 64 named locos is separate iñ each Multimaus ...but can be copied between them at any time.

ONLY the Multimaus plugged In to the MASTER socket NEEDS and USES the 6 cores of the cable ..... Slaves only use 4 of the 6.  Booster link is 4 pole.

 

Further multimauses and other xpressnet handsets ( including a Ztc511 via an adapter lead ) also including Lenz, Hornby Select can àll be plugged in to the SLAVE  port. And daisy chained.  ( including a PC interface ) .... Maximum 32 handsets.  .... Note some might use manual addressing, some are automatic and others fixed.

WHEN USED as. BOOSTER :   It uses its own power supply ... Not shared .... And ÑO connection is made using either Master or Slave sockets.

The LINK is made by the 'in/out' booster connections: this is a PASSIVE loop through .....here is no difference between the on labelled 'in' or 'out' on the 'booster' boxed version. ......and on the amplifier version the 'in' socket is simply not fitted at manufacture: You have a choice of adding it yourself ( including opening the box and soldering ) OR MORE SIMPLY by using an External Y adapter ....   

 

Additional notes of relevance:

The amplifier / booster does NOT provide voltage adjustment .... It follows the input supply ( up to the dcc limit ).  An 18V. DC SMPS 'brick' is recommended ( and now supplied by Roco ).  3.5_ 4A max is suitable.  This will then give a fixed track voltage of 16V  'DCC'.  ( this may show as a different voltage with some voltmeters ....but is the 0- flatpeak amplitude of the ac DCC track signal. With the old transformer the track voltage could rise to 22V .....which is still less than the acfual peak voltage from a '12Vdc' output from an H&M analogue controller !!!!!! ( both when 'off load' )

Boosters should match the Amplifier's power supply voltage to ensure no change of speed at a boundary between districts.

Phase MAY need to be swapped at the booster  'track output' connector  to ensure the matching phase and no short at a boundary.

The use of the earlier '761 and its transformer with white power tabs is NOT recommended as it has different internal circuitry with poorer protection.

 

The 764 amplifier and matching  booster do not support railcom ....the z/Z21 family Does.   The NEW rocoline embedded digital point motors NOW are okay with RAilcom ...  The OLD original production type ( of which I have many¡ ) are NOT railcom compatible.  .... Therefore my loft layout does not benefit from railcom   .... So i will probably continue to use multicentralepro ...... And my Z21 will continue to find itself used on our portable G scale layouts along with multimauses and tablet track plans ( but no railcom) ....although I have bought 1 digikeijs railçom module to try on a layout.

For anyone starting now .... I can strongly recommend the Z21 family. ..... But I also retain my 'heritage' systems as they still work well. 

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2 hours ago, rodney burnett said:

 

 

Edited by Phil S
Duplicate post ..double hit?

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Thank you Iain and Phil for your comments. So perhaps my 'brilliant plan' was not so brilliant after all!

I am going to disconnect the ZTC511 and booster from my layout and try the z21 to see how it works in the 'real world' (although I may have to limit it to 1 power district - we shall see). If I'm happy I shall probably be asking Santa for a Z21 Black and booster (with the intention of using the sniffer port to run the ZTC511).

As you have probably guessed I really am keen on retaining use of the ZTC511. Has anyone had any experience of running a  ZTC 505, 511 or 611 from the sniffer port of the Z21?

 

Thanks again

Rod B

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Rod

 

AFAIK the sniffer port is to enable the Z21 to sniff the DCC packets from another system and retransmit them through the Z21 into the layout controlled by the Z21.

 

This means that you can control anything in the Z21 district from the ZTC but not vice versa. The ZTC would need to sniff the Z21 to enable that to happen.

 

what protocol does the ZTC handset use? It may be possible to use it connected to the Z21 using LocoNet.T or XpressNet. I doubt that it will work with RBus.

 

if you can post a link to the manual for your ZTC I may be able to spot a way for you to do what you desire :)

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@trevora If that is the case then it will be a simple case of plugging the ZTC handset into the Z21 and full control will be available, though I don't know the kit, and we will need to wait for the link to the manual to see what is (or is not) available with it.

 

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Yes, the arrangement Rod B proposes should work.     The ZTC has no knowledge of the existance of the Z21, and the Z21 is just receiving track commands from an unknown DCC system.  
NB - may needs the DPDT switch which ZTC used to recommend to ensure the DCC output of the ZTC was "stable" before throwing the switch to connect power to the track.  In this case, the switch would sit between the ZTC and the Z21.   Without the switch, I don't know what might happen at the Z21 if an unstable or otherwise eratic signal was received whilst the ZTC started up.

 

 

The alternative would be to try the Lenz throttle bus input on the Z21, and connect the ZTC (used as a throttle) via that method.  That may give access to a few more capabilities.  This means putting the ZTC into "slave" mode (ZTC manual term).   Such connections are reported to work with ZTC onto Lenz systems, so should also work onto Z21. 

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@rodney burnett I agree with Nigel that this should work - unfortunately I didn’t interpret your post as you have drawn now - my apologies :)

 

What you can then do to get more power is good a DR5033 or ROCO 10805 (ROCO is better) onto the Z21 and create another power district with one are driven by Z21 and one by booster.

 

i will stand aside for Nigel’s recommendations on how to use the ZTC, clearly he knows it whereas I don’t.

 

Good luck 

 

 

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"knows it" comes from helping someone with one about eight years ago, which meant reading the manual and faffing.

 

Hopefully there is someone around with more recent experience of connecting them to current systems. 

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Thanks all again and don't worry Iain I did notice your misinterpretation of my original post but being a 'newbie' I didn't want to immediately correct you. I do use a tethered remote with the ZTC 511 (a ZTC 622) at present but would not propose to use it with a Z21 when WIFI apps are better. Nigelcliffe makes 2 excellent suggestions - I do currently use a DPDT switch between the 511 and the track to solve the initiation voltage instability. Modern systems like the Z21 do not need this but I would have retained this anyway if still using the 511 - I would however have put it in the wrong place (between the Z21 and the track) but the correct place is between the 511 and the Z21 (thanks Nigelcliffe). I could also try using the 511 via the Lenz bus (X-bus I think), turning it to slave mode is easy enough and I must also remember to turn off the DC capabilities of the 511 - what other capabilities might this unlock?

 

Rod B

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When used in slave mode I don't recall it having ANY output .... But it was many years ago that I swapped from having the ztc511 as a master .... Then slave ... Then sold.

When it was the Master ... If stop was used from a multimaus, i had to go across to the 511 to clear it .... Which was plainly ridiculous as a way of working when with the multimaus family you can do anything from any handset.

Wiring diagrams for the ztc din connection have been published here before.

 

 

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Phil S, is this what you mean? (it is from NCE Corp)

 

589285081_DINtoRJ.PNG.40c9ca35823845f3f82574563c328e19.PNG

I couldn't find one specifically for ZTC but the above should be Lenz (and ZTC) compatible.

 

Rod B

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