Wright writes.....

[stewartingram]

9 hours ago, PupCam said:

 

I might have to prefix "locomotive" with "diesel/electric" because I can't resolve the question is a Deltic better than an A4 in my mind, in much the same way that I can't resolve the question is the Supermarine Spitfire a more beautiful aeroplane than the Hawker Hunter so I dodge the question by prefixing aeroplane with propeller or jet as appropriate!

 

Maybe I'm just indecisive ....

 

Alan

In my mind, if it has a propeller it is a Spitfire. If it doesn't have a prop, it is Concorde.

Simples.

 

Stewart

[Bucoops]

12 minutes ago, stewartingram said:

In my mind, if it has a propeller it is a Spitfire. If it doesn't have a prop, it is Concorde.

Simples.

 

Stewart

 

Or a broken Spitfire?

[Tony Wright]

8 hours ago, 60526 said:

Tony, another early Deltic for you, no indication of the number but early 60's, approaching Wood Green on the down main, but what was 1C31? If you are at Stevenage over the weekend then hopefully I will see you there on Saturday, looks like we can get a direct train up from Brighton for the first time. Regards Charlie

 

Great shot Charlie!

 

'but what was 1C31?'

 

Definitely a secondary service, maybe a running-in turn, for the loco looks brand new. Robert Carroll is the man to ask. 

 

The loco? Obviously a racehorse (though not NIMBUS - no yellow end), so any of the others. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

[Chris Higgs]

On 07/05/2015 at 21:45, Tony Wright said:

 

 

Finally, to pick up on Ufford. I was commissioned to take pictures of this once Norman Solomon had converted it to P4 (adding two more junctions to boot!). Visually it was stunning (as it was as Dunwich), though the running was less than perfect (unlike Dunwich!). In my personal opinion, that was principally down to the locos, which, when I tried to move them into position for photography, did not behave as I would have expected 'professionally-built' locos to perform. 

 

I realise it is a bit(!) late to reply to this post, but I thought  you might all like to know what happened to Ufford, especially as if you believe what you read elsewhere on RMWeb that it was broken up (spoiler alert, it wasnt)

 

Well, it is alive and well and living in my loft. Where it has sat for quite a while due to my work and family commitments over the years giving me little time to work on or operate it. Now that semi-retirement has arrived , I plan on that changing. It still looks stunning (if a little dusty). Does it run? - well sort of. Run a diesel round it and it is clear there are very few issues with the track itself. Of the steam locos it came with about 50% operable to a reasonable standard, but a comprehensive  chassis rebuilding program is probably called for. Fortunately as I am into etching I will be able to create new frames to my own specification of sprung/CSB.

 

In the meantime I think it will be diesels. I am a great fan of Mostyn which I think shows how P4 can be, and my youthful memories are of BR Blue.  A backwater like the East Suffolk didn't really alter that much to preclude operating it as early 1970s, however it would be a bit boring operatiónally, so I think I will go with 1960., and all those early diesels Heljan and Dapol have provided us with. The stock I inherited is  centered around 1948-50, so there will need to be an influx of BR Mk1s, maroon Gresleys and some of the 51' Gresley corridor stock unique to the GE Section. The steam locos can come back in as and when they get upgraded, or replacements bought and converted to P4. There were no J17/J19/J20 0-6-0s in the roster so some kitbuilding to do as well. 

 

Top of the list is rebuilding the fiddle yard. The one I got it with is not the one Dunwich had and has a lot of relatively short roads but no capability to run long freights,. Its design also means one end of the layout had curves too sharp for P4 stock to reliably handle and were rebuilt with continuous checkrails in an attempt to solve it. I intend to go back to something with a more conventional spray of pointwork at each end giving long roads on which two short trains or one long one can sit.  Or perhaps something a bit more radical with metal strips instead of conventional trackwork,

 

DCC? Not as yet, but I expect that is the way I will go.

 

As a parting thought, there was discussion on here about preserving historic layouts. I have to say given that most are not built to last hundreds of years that is a it problematic, wasn't the final fate of Heckmondwike that its baseboards warped beyond  being recoverable? And where would these layouts live? Ufford is 12m by 4m when set up and I don't think there are that many people with that sort of space available. Which I think in the end was why I was the only one who decided to take it on. Michael Brooks retired down to the South Coast and certainly couldn't take it with him. And Ufford is just a tiddler compared to some layouts I could mention.

 

Chris Higgs

 

[Tony Wright]

I don't make New Year Resolutions.

 

However, I've decided to complete as many of the building projects hanging on from last year, before embarking on a load more (a few of which are on commission). 

 

Readers might recall my testing of new DJH gearboxes last year. To do so, I built (or built enough of) two locomotives to go 'outside them'. The big motor/gearbox combo went into a DJH A1 (which  I completed some time ago) and the smaller motor/gearbox went into a Nu-Cast K1. The latter then rather gathered dust, until yesterday, when I completed the bodywork........................

 

Just the motion and valve gear to complete. Not a bad kit for its age, and very strong. It'll be one of the few in the class which lost its electric lighting - something a bit different. 

 

 

I already have a Nu-Cast K1 running on Little Bytham. One built by John Houlden, acquired after he changed to O Gauge and Gamston Bank became a bonfire! 

 

I also have a DMR K1 which I built/painted, and Tom Foster weathered......

 

 

A very nice little model and one I'm quite pleased with.

 

Time was, of course, that if one wanted a K1 in 4mm then it would have to be built (I scratch-built one many years ago, which appeared on Fordley Park - I also scratch-built the K1/1). 

 

Not now, because there's Hornby's lovely RTR example.....

 

 

 

This is as good (if not better!) than anything I've built of the class. I've also seen examples heavily-discounted quite recently (suggesting over-production?). 

 

There is the odd issue, though.....

 

 

The wrong 'lean' on the return crank on the RH side.

 

 

 

No matter; easily-fixed, but should it be necessary? 

 

I detailed/improved/renumbered/weathered this example, writing about it in BRM. Why Ian Wilson's Pacific range of front numberplates aren't universally-known puzzles me. 

 

 

 

 

Do I still own it? Of course not. I didn't build it, so it never got used. I sold it on (to whom, I forget), and the new owner was very pleased. 

 

Which returns to my own, personal modelling philosophy and practice. Regarding locos, it doesn't matter how good (or better) anything RTR might be, now or in the future, I'm always going to build my own.

 

Which is what many on this thread do, anyway.....

 

 

 

 

Edited January 9, 2020 by Tony Wright
to clarify a point

[Clive Mortimore]

9 hours ago, Clive Mortimore said:

Hi Charlie

 

1C31, I don't have a working timetable for the early 60s but 1 was an express, C indicates the destination was somewhere between Hitchin and Grantham  and 31 would be the train number as each express had its own number.

 

29 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

Great shot Charlie!

 

'but what was 1C31?'

 

Definitely a secondary service, maybe a running-in turn, for the loco looks brand new. Robert Carroll is the man to ask. 

 

The loco? Obviously a racehorse (though not NIMBUS - no yellow end), so any of the others. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

Hello Tony

 

The earlier post was the best I could do without a working time table.

[Tony Wright]

19 minutes ago, Chris Higgs said:

 

I realise it is a bit(!) late to reply to this post, but I thought  you might all like to know what happened to Ufford, especially as if you believe what you read elsewhere on RMWeb that it was broken up (spoiler alert, it wasnt)

 

Well, it is alive and well and living in my loft. Where it has sat for quite a while due to my work and family commitments over the years giving me little time to work on or operate it. Now that semi-retirement has arrived , I plan on that changing. It still looks stunning (if a little dusty). Does it run? - well sort of. Run a diesel round it and it is clear there are very few issues with the track itself. Of the steam locos it came with about 50% operable to a reasonable standard, but a comprehensive  chassis rebuilding program is probably called for. Fortunately as I am into etching I will be able to create new frames to my own specification of sprung/CSB.

 

In the meantime I think it will be diesels. I am a great fan of Mostyn which I think shows how P4 can be, and my youthful memories are of BR Blue.  A backwater like the East Suffolk didn't really alter that much to preclude operating it as early 1970s, however it would be a bit boring operatiónally, so I think I will go with 1960., and all those early diesels Heljan and Dapol have provided us with. The stock I inherited is  centered around 1948-50, so there will need to be an influx of BR Mk1s, maroon Gresleys and some of the 51' Gresley corridor stock unique to the GE Section. The steam locos can come back in as and when they get upgraded, or replacements bought and converted to P4. There were no J17/J19/J20 0-6-0s in the roster so some kitbuilding to do as well. 

 

Top of the list is rebuilding the fiddle yard. The one I got it with is not the one Dunwich had and has a lot of relatively short roads but no capability to run long freights,. Its design also means one end of the layout had curves too sharp for P4 stock to reliably handle and were rebuilt with continuous checkrails in an attempt to solve it. I intend to go back to something with a more conventional spray of pointwork at each end giving long roads on which two short trains or one long one can sit.  Or perhaps something a bit more radical with metal strips instead of conventional trackwork,

 

DCC? Not as yet, but I expect that is the way I will go.

 

As a parting thought, there was discussion on here about preserving historic layouts. I have to say given that most are not built to last hundreds of years that is a it problematic, wasn't the final fate of Heckmondwike that its baseboards warped beyond  being recoverable? And where would these layouts live? Ufford is 12m by 4m when set up and I don't think there are that many people with that sort of space available. Which I think in the end was why I was the only one who decided to take it on. Michael Brooks retired down to the South Coast and certainly couldn't take it with him. And Ufford is just a tiddler compared to some layouts I could mention.

 

Chris Higgs

 

Thanks for letting us know, Chris,

 

The pictures I took of Ufford are somewhere in Warners' archive.

 

It still was visually-stunning, but (as I mentioned nearly five years ago!), the running was appalling. What was so disappointing to me was that as Dunwich (in EM) it ran perfectly. I won't repeat Roy Jackson's words about it! I know Michael was disappointed as well. 

 

I'm glad you've arrived at the same conclusion in that it was the locos which were at fault. Goodness knows what they must have cost, but I couldn't find one which ran to anything near the standard I insist upon - if at all. I know Norman Solomon wasn't too happy with the limitations imposed on relaying P4 track on an EM trackbed (though it seems to have been done OK on Ambergate), especially as more-complex arrangements were specified. 

 

I hope you derive a lot of pleasure from Ufford.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Chris Higgs]

6 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

The pictures I took of Ufford are somewhere in Warners' archive.

 

 

 

I have a CD from Michael which I think must be them. Are the ones on the Scalefour site from you?

 

https://www.scalefour.org/layouts/ufford.html

 

I notice that one of these has been chosen as the photo to headline the whole layout section.

 

Chris

[t-b-g]

37 minutes ago, Chris Higgs said:

 

I have a CD from Michael which I think must be them. Are the ones on the Scalefour site from you?

 

https://www.scalefour.org/layouts/ufford.html

 

I notice that one of these has been chosen as the photo to headline the whole layout section.

 

Chris

 

Many thanks Chris for he news of Dunwich/Ufford". I am in regular contact with the surviving original builders of the layout and every once in a while the discussion goes round to "I wonder what happened to it".

 

I will be seeing them soon and will pass on the good news that i is still around and is being brought back to working order.

 

It isn't easy taking on something that was designed and built by others and I, for one, understand and appreciate the work involved.

 

Tony Gee (currently looking after Buckingham). 

[Dunsignalling]

15 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Thanks for that, Charlie,

 

It must be the first few weeks of the loco's life, for it was named soon after. 

 

The greatest express passenger locomotive class to ever grace our rails? I think so.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Whilst many of us in the informed [?] enthusiast fraternity appreciate the Deltics as a high point in express locomotive history, I suspect the HST will dominate future reminiscences among the travelling public. Probably with justification.

 

John

 

 

Edited January 9, 2020 by Dunsignalling

[glo41f]

Chris

 

Thank you for the information on your layout "Ufford" (Dunwich). I am delighted that it still exists as to my way of thinking it was one of the best layouts both in its time and now. It encapsulated East Anglian atmosphere in a way that others have not succeeded in doing.  The pictures of the Brit especially bring it all back for me. You are indeed a fortunate chap to have this iconic layout.

 

A request please that you keep us Ufford Groupies updated with your efforts at restoration. 

 

(I have to say that had I owned the layout I would have kept it as an EM system. It looked and worked fine as such.)

 

Thank you so much for the update.

 

Martin Long

[polybear]

4 minutes ago, glo41f said:

(I have to say that had I owned the layout I would have kept it as an EM system. It looked and worked fine as such.)

 

Martin Long

 

A prime example of "If it's not busted, don't fix it......" if ever there was one....

[dcordingley]

20 hours ago, Clive Mortimore said:

Hello Tony

 

You will be casting your net far and wide looking for models to make that will not be seen on others layouts.

 

I love seeing models of overhead EMUs because the modeller has modelled them. OK there is a few very modern overhead EMUs but have you ever seen a LBSCR EMU. I have a wonderful book on the LBSCR OLE.

 

There is still a lot of "railway" that we as modellers can make for ourselves.

 

Hi Clive - here's one for you. 

 

I think there is little danger of any commercial RTR production of one of these units - a post-1953 Lancaster-Morecambe-Heysham 6.6kV 50 Hz overhead emu. I grew up in Lancaster and the prototypes (converted from ex-LNWR Earls Court-Willesden stock) could be seen from my bedroom window, shuttling backwards and forwards throughout the day. My model comprises 3D-printed bodyshells from Shapeways/Rue d'Etropal and underframes from various components - the driving trailer is mounted on a Replica powered coach chassis. Still work-in-progress, although the driving trailer has now emerged from the Wolverton Works paintshop. Once the unit is complete my thoughts will turn to suitable catenary...

 

David C.    

[Clive Mortimore]

9 minutes ago, dcordingley said:

 

Hi Clive - here's one for you. 

 

I think there is little danger of any commercial RTR production of one of these units - a post-1953 Lancaster-Morecambe-Heysham 6.6kV 50 Hz overhead emu. I grew up in Lancaster and the prototypes (converted from ex-LNWR Earls Court-Willesden stock) could be seen from my bedroom window, shuttling backwards and forwards throughout the day. My model comprises 3D-printed bodyshells from Shapeways/Rue d'Etropal and underframes from various components - the driving trailer is mounted on a Replica powered coach chassis. Still work-in-progress, although the driving trailer has now emerged from the Wolverton Works paintshop. Once the unit is complete my thoughts will turn to suitable catenary...

 

David C.    

Hi David

 

Very nice. I once had a plan to make a model of Scale Hall station, a nice modern station building with EMUs passing through, along with Black fives and Class 25s sharing the freight and Leeds traffic. A scale model of Scale Hall had a nice ring to it.

[Andy Reichert]

1 hour ago, dcordingley said:

 

Hi Clive - here's one for you. 

 

I think there is little danger of any commercial RTR production of one of these units - a post-1953 Lancaster-Morecambe-Heysham 6.6kV 50 Hz overhead emu. I grew up in Lancaster and the prototypes (converted from ex-LNWR Earls Court-Willesden stock) could be seen from my bedroom window, shuttling backwards and forwards throughout the day. My model comprises 3D-printed bodyshells from Shapeways/Rue d'Etropal and underframes from various components - the driving trailer is mounted on a Replica powered coach chassis. Still work-in-progress, although the driving trailer has now emerged from the Wolverton Works paintshop. Once the unit is complete my thoughts will turn to suitable catenary...

 

David C.    

 

 

I used to often accompany my Grandmother as far as Broad St. Station in the 50's, to see here safely on her way to visit her friend in Abbots Langley.  My vague pre-teen memories suggest the Oerlikon units were still in use there at that time and represented my (exciting) first experience of BR EMU's.

 

Thanks so much for posting the pictures. As a potential modeller of the London units myself, I was curious to see how well Shapeways' implementation actually achieved the level of detail shown in the catalog 3D drawings.

 

Andy

[Anglian]

16 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

That still sounds like trial by combat to me.

 

Possibly closer to 'ordeal by fire'?

[grahame]

2 hours ago, dcordingley said:

 

My model comprises 3D-printed bodyshells from Shapeways/Rue d'Etropal and underframes from various components - the driving trailer is mounted on a Replica powered coach chassis. Still work-in-progress, although the driving trailer has now emerged from the Wolverton Works paintshop. Once the unit is complete my thoughts will turn to suitable catenary...

 

 

Impressive. You've achieved a good finish on those 3D prints. Most of the ones I've had from Shapeways have been plagued with stratification layering which is obvious, especially in N/2mm.

 

And it's great to see some EMU modelling.

 

 

[Tony Wright]

7 hours ago, Chris Higgs said:

 

I have a CD from Michael which I think must be them. Are the ones on the Scalefour site from you?

 

https://www.scalefour.org/layouts/ufford.html

 

I notice that one of these has been chosen as the photo to headline the whole layout section.

 

Chris

Thanks Chris,

 

But no, not mine.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[dcordingley]

47 minutes ago, Andy Reichert said:

 

I used to often accompany my Grandmother as far as Broad St. Station in the 50's, to see here safely on her way to visit her friend in Abbots Langley.  My vague pre-teen memories suggest the Oerlikon units were still in use there at that time and represented my (exciting) first experience of BR EMU's.

 

Thanks so much for posting the pictures. As a potential modeller of the London units myself, I was curious to see how well Shapeways' implementation actually achieved the level of detail shown in the catalog 3D drawings.

 

Andy

Hi Andy

 

I'm pleased with the Shapeways body shells; with some detailing (separate roof vents, brass handrails) they scrub up pretty well. My only reservation is that the surface of the moulding is slightly coarse - I understand that this is a common feature of 3D printing, although no doubt the "layering" process will improve as the technology is refined. It is difficult to sand down the sides because of the panelling, but for layout vehicles (as opposed to showcase models) I think they're quite acceptable. 

 

Clive: Interesting - Scale Hall was my local station; my father took me on the first train in 1957. Not that I remember this, as I would have been 4 or 5 years old at the time. The station was probably the shortest-lived on BR, closing - with the demise of the electric service - in early 1966.  I think the Class 25s (or Sulzer Type 2s as we knew them at the time) probably arrived after this, although the Peaks certainly appeared on the Leeds-Morecambe passenger trains a little earlier. The station buildings at Scale Hall remained in place until the whole ex-Midland line through Lancaster Green Ayre closed completely around late 1967, when 9Fs, Black 5s and 8Fs together with the odd diesel, still handled the remaining Heysham oil trains - often steam/diesel double-headed.  

 

David       

[D.Platt]

Afternoon Tony

 

Nice to see the K1 , I have a nu-cast one I made years ago always liked the looks of them and had a lot of the class underlined,  but I only required one for my layout and resisted Hornby clearance sales, anyway back to the question I have for you, as you mentioned you built the K1 and A1 to test the djh new gearboxes and motors so after running them now for a few months how do you compare them price and performance wise against other makes that you have used ?

My wish list of things to build this year includes a djh 77xxx so thinking ahead motor/gearbox wise .

And thanks to everybody who make this such an interesting forum a belated happy New Year .

 Dennis 

[Tony Wright]

2 hours ago, D.Platt said:

Afternoon Tony

 

Nice to see the K1 , I have a nu-cast one I made years ago always liked the looks of them and had a lot of the class underlined,  but I only required one for my layout and resisted Hornby clearance sales, anyway back to the question I have for you, as you mentioned you built the K1 and A1 to test the djh new gearboxes and motors so after running them now for a few months how do you compare them price and performance wise against other makes that you have used ?

My wish list of things to build this year includes a djh 77xxx so thinking ahead motor/gearbox wise .

And thanks to everybody who make this such an interesting forum a belated happy New Year .

 Dennis 

Good evening Dennis,

 

The latest DJH gearboxes (two sizes, you need the smaller one for the 77XXX) are excellent. They come fully-assembled, and are as simple to drop into a set of frames as Portescaps used to be. They're also quieter than Portescaps and, in my experience, just as powerful. Because they're fully-assembled, they cost more than, say, an equivalent motor/gearbox combination from Comet/Branchlines/High Level/etc. All of those have to be put together by the kit-builder. I have used all three with splendid results, but care in assembly (like anything else) is needed to ensure they run really sweetly. 

 

One 'disadvantage' the DJH 'boxes have is their size, and lack of flexibility. They're less easily-hidden inside smaller prototypes, and they can't be articulated in the same way that some of the other 'boxes can. That said, I'll happily give them a thorough recommendation. But watch you don't lose the grubscrew! It's tiny. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[60526]

11 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Great shot Charlie!

 

'but what was 1C31?'

 

Definitely a secondary service, maybe a running-in turn, for the loco looks brand new. Robert Carroll is the man to ask. 

 

The loco? Obviously a racehorse (though not NIMBUS - no yellow end), so any of the others. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

Clive/Tony, thanks for the response, I can understand the 1 and 31, but having spotted on the southern ECML for a long time the C threw me. If it was Peterborough then this would have been B going into the 70's. I'll give you a couple more - 1A46

 

 

D1507 coming through the down loop platform at Wood Green 

 

 

1G60 with Falcon on the down main at New Southgate, I'd guess that it is the Sheffield Pullman. Now that's an interest coach on the up side.

 

 

4S04, D399 on the down slow through Wood Green

 

 

1L59, unknown 37 on the down fast at Wood Green

 

 

Terrible photos but every picture tells a story. The camera was a Kodax Brownie 127, not a box brownie as I originally thought.

 

And finally something without a head code, but the horse box behind is interesting, mind you Ally Pally did have a race course.

 

[Tony Wright]

8 hours ago, Dunsignalling said:

Whilst many of us in the informed [?] enthusiast fraternity appreciate the Deltics as a high point in express locomotive history, I suspect the HST will dominate future reminiscences among the travelling public. Probably with justification.

 

John

 

 

Thanks John,

 

There's no doubt that the HST has been the most-successful passenger-carrying set in our railways' long history. It deserves a very high spot in enthusiasts' affections, as well as those of the travelling public. 

 

It's just that (to me), the Deltics were so outstanding at the time of their introduction. They revolutionised a timetable in a way impossible with any other form of motive power on a non-electrified railway. For the first time, sustained 100 mph running was possible on the ECML. They looked fantastic, they sounded fantastic and they really went like stink.

 

Of course, the HSTs upped the speed by a further 25 mph, but they're not really 'locomotives' to me. They only work as part of a whole unit. It's been the general demise in locomotive-hauled passenger trains which has caused a diminishing of interest in railway enthusiasm in my opinion. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Tony Wright]

33 minutes ago, 60526 said:

Clive/Tony, thanks for the response, I can understand the 1 and 31, but having spotted on the southern ECML for a long time the C threw me. If it was Peterborough then this would have been B going into the 70's. I'll give you a couple more - 1A46

 

 

D1507 coming through the down loop platform at Wood Green 

 

 

1G60 with Falcon on the down main at New Southgate, I'd guess that it is the Sheffield Pullman. Now that's an interest coach on the up side.

 

 

4S04, D399 on the down slow through Wood Green

 

 

1L59, unknown 37 on the down fast at Wood Green

 

 

Terrible photos but every picture tells a story. The camera was a Kodax Brownie 127, not a box brownie as I originally thought.

 

And finally something without a head code, but the horse box behind is interesting, mind you Ally Pally did have a race course.

 

Great stuff again, Charlie,

 

IC was a train to Grantham from Kings Cross in 1961, and 1A46 was a late-evening service to Newcastle in the same year. 

 

I never saw steam at Wood Green, only getting down to the southern end of the ECML in the mid/late-'60s. Other than the motive power, it hadn't changed a bit..........................

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

For students of the study of arcane rolling stock, there is much of interest.

 

Please (all) observe copyright restrictions.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

Edited January 9, 2020 by Tony Wright
to clarify a point

[robertcwp]

13 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Great shot Charlie!

 

'but what was 1C31?'

 

Definitely a secondary service, maybe a running-in turn, for the loco looks brand new. Robert Carroll is the man to ask. 

 

The loco? Obviously a racehorse (though not NIMBUS - no yellow end), so any of the others. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

I can't find a 1C31. I don't have the WTTs for the early 1960s. I have copies of the GN carriage workings for winter 1961-2 which has the headcodes and it's not in there but I don't have summer 1961 or summer 1962. Winter 1960-61 does not include headcodes. As noted by Clive, C seems to have meant Peterborough or Grantham. Closest I could find was 1C41 which was the 10.25 am King's Cross-Peterborough.