Wright writes.....

[gordon s]

That's going to be one beautiful loco once finished. You make it look so effortless, but I guess that's what oodles of skill and years of experience brings you...

 

I saw you mention B1's earlier Tony, so I hope you don't mind me asking about a particular detail re the tender. I've searched Yeadons and the web for information, but drawn a blank, I have several Bachmann B1's and have started to try and get them to run well with mixed results, but I will get there or they will be consigned to the spares bin.

 

Having cut the plastic coal load away, there is a rectangular cut out on the tender plate just above the water scoop control that I'm guessing is a fire iron tunnel. All of the pics I've seen of B1's show the coal fully loaded right across the whole tender or a lower level below the sides, which of course hide such a tunnel. 

 

I'd like to model a half full tender, but have no idea what a coal tunnel would look like. I'm assuming a rectangular box with sloping surfaces so coal didn't stay on top. I'm guessing around 10' long. Does that sound right?

 

I wondered if anyone can throw some light on it for me.

 

Much appreciated.

[Tony Wright]

40 minutes ago, gordon s said:

That's going to be one beautiful loco once finished. You make it look so effortless, but I guess that's what oodles of skill and years of experience brings you...

 

I saw you mention B1's earlier Tony, so I hope you don't mind me asking about a particular detail re the tender. I've searched Yeadons and the web for information, but drawn a blank, I have several Bachmann B1's and have started to try and get them to run well with mixed results, but I will get there or they will be consigned to the spares bin.

 

Having cut the plastic coal load away, there is a rectangular cut out on the tender plate just above the water scoop control that I'm guessing is a fire iron tunnel. All of the pics I've seen of B1's show the coal fully loaded right across the whole tender or a lower level below the sides, which of course hide such a tunnel. 

 

I'd like to model a half full tender, but have no idea what a coal tunnel would look like. I'm assuming a rectangular box with sloping surfaces so coal didn't stay on top. I'm guessing around 10' long. Does that sound right?

 

I wondered if anyone can throw some light on it for me.

 

Much appreciated.

Thanks Gordon,

 

I think it's really oodles of years.

 

Bachmann B1 tenders (or Replica or Mainline); I change the wheels as a matter of course (Markits/Jackson). Most of the RTR wheels are awful. 

 

Regarding B1 tenders, I'll look through the pictures and see what I can find. I tend to fully-coal mine, so don't bother with a fire iron tunnel (even though I probably should).

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Tony Wright]

Bytham B1s?

 

Well, here's a selection................................

 

 

 

 

 

Despite it having a higher RA number than permitted, a B1 was used on the M&GN section for the last few months of the line's existence; this is it, 61159, of Boston shed. 

 

It's a modified/detailed/renumbered/weathered Replica body on Comet frames. I wouldn't even bother with using the split chassis originals. 

 

 

Another much-modified RTR B1 body on Comet frames. This one the work of Tony Geary. 

 

 

And two more, achieved by exactly the same means. I should think I'm getting quite experienced at this sort of thing. 

 

Seen in the last picture, 61028 (right) passes yet another of my B1 conversions.

 

 

And a closer view of 61022. The tender came from a Bachmann V2, and shouldn't carry the vacuum cylinder for a B1.

 

Tony Geary built the Thompson semi-corridor lavatory composite.

 

 

The 'worst' and the 'best', side by side?

 

To the left we have my Jamieson B1 from the time when my eyes were good, though my dictionary of profanity was only thin! DIBATAG certainly shows her age, but still runs well.

 

61175 on the pick-up is a modified Hornby RTR B1. I changed the bogie wheels (the originals are poor) and the chimney (equally poor as supplied), detailed it and renumbered it. Tom Foster weathered it; perfectly. 

 

 

And a three-quarter rear close-up of 61175. 

 

 

61175 waits for the road as yet another Replica/Comet conversion passes by, in the form of 61231 (off which the front LH side step seems to be missing!). This one was done by John Houlden and is ex-Gamston Bank. 

 

 

And 61208 heads south on a parly. This is built from a very old Nu-Cast kit. I pounded the original white metal chassis into a lump, to cut up and use as ballast (I shouldn't have bothered - it was a lump, anyway!). It runs on Comet frames. 

 

It'll probably surprise no one to learn that several of my B1s are shedded at Retford. 

 

I'll have a further rummage to see if I can find any more Bytham B1s. 

 

Last time we had different K3 models. How about more B1s? 

[RThompson]

Hello Tony,

 

the Mallard D16/3 chassis is a bizarre design but I went along with it on mine and means I was able to pack all of the boiler with lead.

 

The front bogie with beefed up bearings takes a lot of the locos weight.

 

I still need to add pick ups to its front bogie and glazing so this weeks job hopefully.

 

The Kitson A class 0-6-0ST is now almost finished.

 

The lining even after a coat of varnish shows signs of carrier film annoyingly and a piece has broken away and needs replacing.

 

I wont be weathering the loco as it will hide the lining but also, usually on industrial railways the crews kept their locos spotless usually depending where they worked.

 

 

 

[PMP]

5 minutes ago, RThompson said:

The lining even after a coat of varnish shows signs of carrier film annoyingly and a piece has broken away and needs replacing

If you have any access to Microscale Microsol it might get you out of a hole. Using a pin puncture the lifted transfer, and silvered sections many times. Once done apply Microsol with a brush and leave it for twelve hours or so. Microsol allows the decal to soften to conform to highly irregular surfaces, and this might work in your favour. If it partially works repeat the process, it may take a few goes to get all areas treated. Finish off with a gloss varnish, and then topcoat varnish/weathering of your choice. If it doesn’t work you won’t lose anything if you’re already looking at a reapplication of new decals/paint.

[gordon s]

Many thanks Tony. I've just seen that 31A has posted a pic of a Hornby B1 tender with the tunnel in place. If their homework was correct, then the pic is at least a starting point. Funny, a Hornby model would have been the last place I would have looked as every RTR model always seems to have a fully loaded tender.

 

If you happen to find a pic, then that will be great, but don't spend a lot of time looking as I also have a Hornby B1 tucked away somewhere, so I can get measurements etc from that.

 

Great to see so many B1's on LB...

 

They were almost nondescript to a young spotter compared to Pacifics, but I've learned to love them over the years.

[Tony Wright]

10 hours ago, RThompson said:

Hello Tony,

 

the Mallard D16/3 chassis is a bizarre design but I went along with it on mine and means I was able to pack all of the boiler with lead.

 

The front bogie with beefed up bearings takes a lot of the locos weight.

 

I still need to add pick ups to its front bogie and glazing so this weeks job hopefully.

 

The Kitson A class 0-6-0ST is now almost finished.

 

The lining even after a coat of varnish shows signs of carrier film annoyingly and a piece has broken away and needs replacing.

 

I wont be weathering the loco as it will hide the lining but also, usually on industrial railways the crews kept their locos spotless usually depending where they worked.

 

 

 

A lovely model, Robert,

 

Thanks for showing us.

 

The Blacksmiths version of the D16/3 chassis is different from the Mallard one. If my memory serves (and it serves me less-well as time goes by), the Mallard chassis pivoted at its centre in a really weird way. I managed to build it (35 years ago?), but gave it away to a friend (who's now died), and I've no idea what happened to it, though it did appear in print. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Tony Wright]

11 hours ago, gordon s said:

Many thanks Tony. I've just seen that 31A has posted a pic of a Hornby B1 tender with the tunnel in place. If their homework was correct, then the pic is at least a starting point. Funny, a Hornby model would have been the last place I would have looked as every RTR model always seems to have a fully loaded tender.

 

If you happen to find a pic, then that will be great, but don't spend a lot of time looking as I also have a Hornby B1 tucked away somewhere, so I can get measurements etc from that.

 

Great to see so many B1's on LB...

 

They were almost nondescript to a young spotter compared to Pacifics, but I've learned to love them over the years.

Good morning Gordon,

 

B1s were nondescript to me as well, especially at places like Retford, Doncaster, York and Darlington.

 

I've looked through several B1 pictures, but none (so far) shows the fire iron tunnel in the tender. 

 

In the course of preparing the writing of the 'book of' the class for Irwell, I've been sifting through numerous shots of B1s. These are, obviously, under copyright restrictions (please, all, observe these). I have notes, but many of them are not entirely comprehensive. I'd appreciate if those who might know will inform me on here.

 

For instance.....................

 

 

STEINBOK at Chester on an RCTS special. I watched this train enter the station from the east end, coming off the Manchester road. It then reversed and headed off towards Malpas on the long-closed line from Tattenhall Junction to Whitchurch. Does anyone know the date of this?

 

And where are the lamps? From memory, the loco came off the train (it's already in reverse gear), turned on the triangle, ran round the set (formed of ex-LMS carriages) and then departed eastwards. The fireman has yet to fix a light-engine lamp (though where will he place it?). Ah, those joys of prototype modelling.

 

One thing of interest is 61039's tender. Just visible, it's one of the rebuilds (from what?) with no flange at the base of the tank, apart from a small section at the front and rear. I've never seen this modelled. 

 

 

61131 on an another RCTS special at Nottingham Victoria, but exactly when? From the (apparent?) lack of lining, could they be Southern Region Mk.1s? 

 

 

And 61175 on an SLS special at Kensington Olympia; the early-'50s? And, is it ex-GWR stock? 

 

 

Despite their being only 5MT status, the ex-GC (and the ex-GE) regularly used B1s on named trains.

 

With articulated stock being mentioned recently, two B1-hauled five-sets (with a van) at Werrington Junction.

 

 

 

The second picture clearly shows the train swinging off towards Spalding, but what's the service I wonder? The artics are steel-sided BTK/TK pairings. 

 

Speaking of artics.......

 

 

Can anyone identify these, please? 

 

 

 

Finally, a B1 at Retford, one of the local 'Rockets'. Is it really nearly 65 years since I first stood here and watched this sort of thing? 

 

Many thanks in anticipation.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Edited April 21, 2020 by Tony Wright
to clarify a point

[petrovich]

On 18/04/2020 at 15:49, The Johnster said:

I am...

So am I.....

[thegreenhowards]

Tony,

 

Love the shots of the steel panelled twins. I think the train heading for Spalding will be an East Lincs stopping service. They were used extensively in these. I’m a bit surprised to see the Mk1 CK though. When the purpose built CKs were replaced,  I thought that they mainly used Thompson CKs with the twins on the East Lincs with Mk1s being used between Peterborough and King’s Cross.

 

I think the artic twin you wanted identified is a D.214 as built for services out of Marylebone in the late ‘30s. Where is the photo taken?

 

Andy

[Darryl Tooley]

Just now, Tony Wright said:

Can anyone identify these, please?

Looks to be a dia 214 non-corridor twin brake third/lavatory composite, built for the Marylebone suburban services, 1936-8.

 

D

[petrovich]

On 18/04/2020 at 10:41, Tony Wright said:

An interesting paradox, Gordon.

 

Although LB is essentially a layout which doesn't leave home, it should be able to be dismantled without wrecking everything. 

 

I'll explain. All the baseboards bolt together, but all the trackwork is continuous. For dismantling, every rail at a joint will need to be cut through. For this reason, some of the pointwork was moved slightly to avoid a joint going through the centre of a point. It will also mean every wire will need cutting, but they're colour-coded and numbered in the main. 

 

With regard to scenery, all that will be required is a sharp Stanly knife to cut through the cardboard lattice forming the foundation of the cuttings/embankments at the joints.

 

All the fiddle yard boards have substantial copper-clad PCB at their ends, to which the rails are soldered. Again, using a slitting disc in a mini-drill will achieve their being able to be taken apart. 

 

I'm not saying it'll be easy, but, with care, the layout should not be wrecked. Anyway, will I be bothered if it ever happens? I either won't be here, or so puddled as to not even care! 

 

I have had to assist in dismantling layouts, and, unfortunately, it does result in their destruction. I think one was holding up the shed in which it was built, and the track/ballast was fixed with Cascomite resin glue, which could not be shifted. 

 

It was sad that much of the late David Jenkinson's Kendal branch in O could not be saved when it was dismantled. Complex trackwork went right across several baseboard joints, resulting it its destruction on dismantling. 

 

My advice, for what it's worth, is to carry on regardless with what you're doing; and, though rather selfishly, leave the 'final solution' to others. Or, as I've suggested to Mo, at my demise, put an advert in the RM along these lines......'Complete (and accurate) model of Little Bytham Station and its environs, representing the summer of 1958. Fully-operational, with full documentation as to electrics/wiring. Included with the layout are nearly 200 kit-built locos (mainly professionally-built and mainly professionally-painted), over 250 carriages (some professionally-built and professionally-painted) and over 250 items of freight rolling stock, the majority kit-built. The whole layout is housed in a purpose-built structure, complete with metal bars on doors/windows and is alarmed. £800,000.00, which includes a free house!'

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Good morning Tony.

 

I would think having met you several times that your skills as a builder are of far more use than another layout. In the short time we have met at shows you have fixed / attended to many failed locomotives, you have built wagons, kindly let me suggest and interject on electrical faults with items, but most of all your introduction of children to the hobby and construction of items is second to none and a very valuable asset for any exhibition to have.

 

Regards

[chrisf]

Affirmative to GW stock at Olympia.

 

Chris

[great central]

Re the B1 shots. The one at Nottingham Victoria is, I suspect, one of the various specials run just before closure of the GC as a through route.

One of them used 61131 and 61173 double headed. These were two of the few remaining B1s in service but based around Wakefield I think, the LMR had quickly got rid of anything ex LNER as they took over the Nottingham area sheds.

[Clive Mortimore]

1 hour ago, Tony Wright said:

Speaking of artics.......

 

 

Can anyone identify these, please?

Many thanks in anticipation.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Hello Tony

 

I agree with Darryl, it is a dia 214 set. Thanks for the photo as I have started to build one from bits left over from other conversions using Hornby Railraod Gresley coaches. I also like the ride difference of the two bodies in the photo, so if mine don't match I have photographic proof they didn't need to.

 

Before anyone says "What would a Marylebone set be doing in Sheffield?" in the Harris brown book there is a photo of one at Manchester Victoria.

[Northmoor]

2 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

 

 

STEINBOK at Chester on an RCTS special. I watched this train enter the station from the east end, coming off the Manchester road. It then reversed and headed off towards Malpas on the long-closed line from Tattenhall Junction to Whitchurch. Does anyone know the date of this?

 

Finally, a B1 at Retford, one of the local 'Rockets'. Is it really nearly 65 years since I first stood here and watched this sort of thing? 

 

This last shot, Tony, that's one of your "Priestleys", isn't it?  Just  a pity you couldn't get all the signals in, but look at all the railway detail.....

 

The one at Chester is is 27/4/63, according to the RCTS Photographic Archive, which contains a photo taken by someone standing approximately 12" to the left of your shot:

https://rcts.zenfolio.com/steam-lner/b-4-6-0/b1/hB9352549#hb9352549

 

I can highly recommend the RCTS site for searches like this, indeed for all to join the society.  The better local branches have an excellent range of subjects at their meetings (although thy are obviously all suspended UFN).

 

Rob

Edited April 21, 2020 by Northmoor
Date error corrected

[LNER4479]

Six Bells junction has the Chester tour down as 27th April 1963:

http://www.sixbellsjunction.co.uk/60s/630427r2.html

 

As there is an image of a tour ticket bearing this date then that seems pretty likely - has there been some digit transposition in the RCTS records (27/4/63 --> 24/7/63?!)

Edited April 21, 2020 by LNER4479

[t-b-g]

2 minutes ago, Northmoor said:

This last shot, Tony, that's one of your "Priestleys", isn't it?  Just  a pity you couldn't get all the signals in, but look at all the railway detail.....

 

The one at Chester is is 24/7/63, according to the RCTS Photographic Archive, which contains a photo taken by someone standing approximately 12" to the left of your shot:

https://rcts.zenfolio.com/steam-lner/b-4-6-0/b1/hB9352549#hb9352549

 

I can highly recommend the RCTS site for searches like this, indeed for all to join the society.  The better local branches have an excellent range of subjects at their meetings (although thy are obviously all suspended UFN).

 

I think that taking Tony to task for missing out the tops of the signals is a bit harsh!

 

If Tony Wright took that, he would have been very likely at junior school! It is no later than 1957 with that lattice post signal there.You couldn't expect a "Priestley" from him at that age!

 

My guess is that it was taken by somebody else.

[Northmoor]

3 minutes ago, t-b-g said:

 

I think that taking Tony to task for missing out the tops of the signals is a bit harsh!

 

If Tony Wright took that, he would have been very likely at junior school! It is no later than 1957 with that lattice post signal there.You couldn't expect a "Priestley" from him at that age!

 

My guess is that it was taken by somebody else.

Yes sorry Tony, I didn't compute the "65 years" bit or that it wasn't your own photo.  Knowing the location the photographer couldn't have stood any further back anyway.

Still a nice image though, in fact it may be a Priestley, he took a lot around that area at that time and it may have been cropped.

[thegreenhowards]

I hope nobody minds if I change the subject back to one of this thread’s favourites....couplings.

 

I’ve been experimenting with 3 link and instanter couplings from James’ Trains and I think they’re excellent. They give 90% of the visual impact of real 3 links, but are much easier/ quicker to fit, cheaper and most importantly, do not create shunting problems. They simply clip into the NEM pocket on modern RTR stock. Such a pocket can also be retrofitted to older stock or kit built wagons. Here are some pictures of them in use on my stock. Firstly we have the instanter type.

 

Then the 3 link type, these have a ‘dog leg’ in them to raise the coupling from the NEM pocket to the height of the drawbar and have an, almost invisible, representation of a coupling hook at drawbar level. However they need the original coupling hook to be removed.

 

 

Here is a picture of what you get. Top is a straight instanter without the ‘dog leg’ and coupling hook. Then a 3 link and an instanter with the ‘dog leg’. The 3 links are available rigid (for shunting) or loose for trains which only need to go forward - e.g. a long mineral train.

 

 

I’d be interested in others views on them. In particular, I’m about to put in a bulk order to fit my long empty mineral rake and I’m dithering on whether to go with the ‘dog leg’ or not. I’m tempted to go with the straight coupling (as on the instanter fruit vans above) as it’s stronger (I have had some breakages with the dog leg) and easier to fit (no need to remove the existing coupling hook). What do people think of the visual impact of the two couplings above?

 

The couplings are described here if anyone is interested (no connection etc.......)

 

https://jamestrainparts.com/shop/couplings/oo-gauge-fixed-link-wagon-couplings/

 

Andy

 

[Tony Wright]

3 hours ago, thegreenhowards said:

Tony,

 

Love the shots of the steel panelled twins. I think the train heading for Spalding will be an East Lincs stopping service. They were used extensively in these. I’m a bit surprised to see the Mk1 CK though. When the purpose built CKs were replaced,  I thought that they mainly used Thompson CKs with the twins on the East Lincs with Mk1s being used between Peterborough and King’s Cross.

 

I think the artic twin you wanted identified is a D.214 as built for services out of Marylebone in the late ‘30s. Where is the photo taken?

 

Andy

Thanks Andy,

 

The shot is taken at Amersham.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Tony Wright]

2 hours ago, Northmoor said:

This last shot, Tony, that's one of your "Priestleys", isn't it?  Just  a pity you couldn't get all the signals in, but look at all the railway detail.....

 

The one at Chester is is 27/4/63, according to the RCTS Photographic Archive, which contains a photo taken by someone standing approximately 12" to the left of your shot:

https://rcts.zenfolio.com/steam-lner/b-4-6-0/b1/hB9352549#hb9352549

 

I can highly recommend the RCTS site for searches like this, indeed for all to join the society.  The better local branches have an excellent range of subjects at their meetings (although thy are obviously all suspended UFN).

 

Rob

Thanks Rob,

 

And thanks to all who've responded. What a rich source of information this thread is. 

 

'but look at all the railway detail.....'

 

Including a steel-sided Gresley twin BTK/TK in the siding.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

[Tony Wright]

1 hour ago, t-b-g said:

 

I think that taking Tony to task for missing out the tops of the signals is a bit harsh!

 

If Tony Wright took that, he would have been very likely at junior school! It is no later than 1957 with that lattice post signal there.You couldn't expect a "Priestley" from him at that age!

 

My guess is that it was taken by somebody else.

It was, Tony,

 

For me to have taken the picture (before the lattice Up starters were knocked over by a derailed van), at the very latest I'd be 11. I was taking (Brownie 127) pictures by then, but not as good as the one featured. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Tony Wright]

I did manage to get the top of the lattice signal in this Retford shot.

 

 

Mind you, I was 73 and a day when I took it!

 

And (just visible), there's a Gresley steel twin in the siding.......

 

 

[TrevorP1]

1 hour ago, thegreenhowards said:

I hope nobody minds if I change the subject back to one of this thread’s favourites....couplings.

 

 

I’d be interested in others views on them. In particular, I’m about to put in a bulk order to fit my long empty mineral rake and I’m dithering on whether to go with the ‘dog leg’ or not. I’m tempted to go with the straight coupling (as on the instanter fruit vans above) as it’s stronger (I have had some breakages with the dog leg) and easier to fit (no need to remove the existing coupling hook). What do people think of the visual impact of the two couplings above?

 

The couplings are described here if anyone is interested (no connection etc.......)

 

https://jamestrainparts.com/shop/couplings/oo-gauge-fixed-link-wagon-couplings/

 

Andy

 

 

I'm trialling these myself. Just like you I can't make my mind up which ones to go for. They certainly show promise for fixed rakes of stock.

 

I've also found the coaching stock 'bar couplings'  from the same source very useful.