Wright writes.....

[MJI]

Derby 114

 

DC Kits did them

Conversion kit from Silver Fox

Or convert from other models

[Tony Wright]

1 hour ago, St Enodoc said:

I'm sure the new owner will reveal himself/herself in due course but in the meantime, Tony, please pass on my good wishes and hopes that we will see more of Retford before too long.

Good afternoon John,

 

I'll certainly pass on all your best wishes, though the new owner has already looked at Wright Writes this morning. 

 

Mo and I are going up next week (Retford is vast enough for dozens to socially-distance) and I'll be helping in sorting out a few (minor) problems - a failed point blade or two, nothing more than that. In fact, despite the layout only having been run once in earnest since Roy's death, it appears to work very well (as expected, of course). 

 

I'll also be taking pictures (my intention is to visit at least a fortnight), recording further progress. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Edited July 24, 2020 by Tony Wright
I'd forgotten it was already after noon

[Tony Wright]

53 minutes ago, Clem said:

Good morning Tony,

I think the lightweights were around as early as 1955 and actually ran on the Derby line for trials.  It prompted me to get one in for conversion some years ago. But to be honest, I've got enough on doing steam (which is always going to come first with me, obviously) and I'm not sure when or if I'll get around to it. Clive made the point that there were Cravens  at Lincoln in 1958 but I must say that I never saw one in all my trips to Grantham in the late 50s/early 60s. It was always the class 114s.

If you did decide to build a DMU Tony, I'm sure it would be of top quality but, Deltics aside, I'm sure you're a 100% steam man (like me - with all respect to Clive and other diesel fans).

Good afternoon Clem,

 

Me build a top-quality DMU? I very much doubt it, both in terms of ability and, certainly, motivation. And, by meaning 'top-quality', it would have to be as good as any RTR equivalents. In that respect, I doubt if any modellers I know can build/paint DMUs (or EMUs) to a standard now achieved by the likes of Hornby and Bachmann. 

 

I recall Tony Geary sweating blood and anguish building an MTK Cravens unit, which ran on Stoke Summit. He made a magnificent job of it, but he'd be the first to admit it was more than beaten when the Bachmann one appeared. In fairness, even the Almighty would struggle to build an MTK kit!

 

You're right, Deltics apart (which are my favourite locos bar none), I'm a steam man. That said (and this must not go too far), I actually preferred the DMUs when travelling between Kiveton Park and Retford on trainspotting expeditions. I've no doubt mentioned it before, but those first mid-'50s trips were originally behind wheezing D11s (all non-cops) in carriages so filthy I cannot recall what colour they actually were. And, as for the interiors! Suddenly, behind the driver, in a shining DMU, what a wonderful panorama to behold. A view which enabled you to get the front number of a passing steam loco; impossible beforehand. The same was true on trips between Chester and Manchester on the CLC. 

 

I'll stick with my Cravens on LB, right or not (I can feel the anguish on the part of those who only follow the path of righteousness!), although a B12/3 and arcane carriages are occasionally substituted, representing earlier times

 

Regards,

 

Tony.   

[copleyhill007]

Excellent news regarding Retford.

[cctransuk]

2 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

 In fairness, even the Almighty would struggle to build an MTK kit!

 

..... and, in fairness to NNK (Phoenix) who now offer some MTK kits; MTK DMU kits were not that difficult to build; (for the Almighty, it would be a breeze).

 

I built an excellent Gloucester set way back in the 1970s, well before the advent of superglues - which nowadays make bonding the aluminium bodyshell to the cast whitemetal ends, etc. quite a simple task.

 

I know that it is 'fashionable' to 'knock' anything MTK, but quite a lot of those products were, and are, perfectly buildable; given application.

 

Such adverse comment should only be made on the basis of personal experience.

 

John Isherwood.

[great central]

56 minutes ago, MJI said:

Derby 114

 

DC Kits did them

Conversion kit from Silver Fox

Or convert from other models

 

Craftsman do/did etched sides to fit the Lima 117, I've done one, got another couple to do if I feel like it

[Chuffer Davies]

4 hours ago, Clem said:

Hi Doug. Cheers for that. Do they still do a 6'2" wheel?

Hi Clem,

I can confirm that unfortunately Ultrascale don’t do a suitable 6’ 2” wheel.  I needed some for my C1 chassis because in EM anything larger would not fit due to the limited clearance of the driven wheels of the prototype.  AG does a 6’ 2” LNER profile wheel. 
Regards,

Frank

[St Enodoc]

58 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

Good afternoon John,

 

I'll certainly pass on all your best wishes, though the new owner has already looked at Wright Writes this morning. 

 

Mo and I are going up next week (Retford is vast enough for dozens to socially-distance) and I'll be helping in sorting out a few (minor) problems - a failed point blade or two, nothing more than that. In fact, despite the layout only having been run once in earnest since Roy's death, it appears to work very well (as expected, of course). 

 

I'll also be taking pictures (my intention is to visit at least a fortnight), recording further progress. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Thanks Tony. It's been afternoon here for more than 10 hours...

[31A]

1 hour ago, Tony Wright said:

 

Me build a top-quality DMU? I very much doubt it, both in terms of ability and, certainly, motivation. And, by meaning 'top-quality', it would have to be as good as any RTR equivalents. In that respect, I doubt if any modellers I know can build/paint DMUs (or EMUs) to a standard now achieved by the likes of Hornby and Bachmann. 

 

 

I'm sure you could, Tony - you build lovely coaches as well as locomotives.  Just think of it as two coaches with a motor in the brake van!

 

[MJI]

1 hour ago, great central said:

 

Craftsman do/did etched sides to fit the Lima 117, I've done one, got another couple to do if I feel like it

 

Make one for Tony!

[Clem]

1 hour ago, Tony Wright said:

You're right, Deltics apart (which are my favourite locos bar none), I'm a steam man. That said (and this must not go too far), I actually preferred the DMUs when travelling between Kiveton Park and Retford on trainspotting expeditions. I've no doubt mentioned it before, but those first mid-'50s trips were originally behind wheezing D11s (all non-cops) in carriages so filthy I cannot recall what colour they actually were. And, as for the interiors! Suddenly, behind the driver, in a shining DMU, what a wonderful panorama to behold. A view which enabled you to get the front number of a passing steam loco; impossible beforehand. The same was true on trips between Chester and Manchester on the CLC. 

 

Yes. That's very true. I remember too, the advantages of travelling in a DMU whilst trainspotting. But if any type of DMU came close to being acceptable in circumstances other than the above, for me, it was the class 114s. If one appeared RTR I'd be tempted to get one, just for the nostalgia of those Nottingham Victoria (or London Road High Level) to Grantham trips which, after about 1962 were more often a 114 rather than steam.

[FarrMan]

55 minutes ago, Clem said:

Yes. That's very true. I remember too, the advantages of travelling in a DMU whilst trainspotting. But if any type of DMU came close to being acceptable in circumstances other than the above, for me, it was the class 114s. If one appeared RTR I'd be tempted to get one, just for the nostalgia of those Nottingham Victoria (or London Road High Level) to Grantham trips which, after about 1962 were more often a 114 rather than steam.

I agree with that from memory. It must have been about 1962 or 1963 that there was a sudden change from all steam between Grantham and Nottingham Victoria to all DMU class 114. The timetable was speeded up at the same time. When changing trains at Grantham, I only remember seeing Class 114's. Very rarely was there a different class of DMU. With our preference for steam, we always used to call DMU's 'bugcars' (two clearly separate parts - no reference to the one with a double g).

 

Lloyd

[Clem]

17 minutes ago, FarrMan said:

With our preference for steam, we always used to call DMU's 'bugcars' (two clearly separate parts - no reference to the one with a double g).

Hi Lloyd, 'Bug cars' ... definitely! .. or sometimes, just 'bugs'. The year or two before it was often an L1. I particularly remember that section from Bottesford to Allington when we always seemed to go like the clappers! It wasn't always an L1 though. I remember going for the short trip from High Level to Victoria behind 61821 and I even took a photo of it with my brownie 127. Unfortunately, that photo has been lost for all time, much to my regret.

[great central]

34 minutes ago, FarrMan said:

I agree with that from memory. It must have been about 1962 or 1963 that there was a sudden change from all steam between Grantham and Nottingham Victoria to all DMU class 114. The timetable was speeded up at the same time. When changing trains at Grantham, I only remember seeing Class 114's. Very rarely was there a different class of DMU. With our preference for steam, we always used to call DMU's 'bugcars' (two clearly separate parts - no reference to the one with a double g).

 

Lloyd

 

I still have my notebook somewhere reporting that all the spotters, me included, were rounded up and put on a unit back to Nottingham one day in, from memory, 1963.

As we left, Lord Faringdon, again very much from memory,  came hurtling through. The last time I saw an A4 working for BR.

It seems spotters were no longer welcome on the new dieselised railway.

[ROY@34F]

23 minutes ago, Clem said:

Hi Lloyd, 'Bug cars' ... definitely! .. or sometimes, just 'bugs'. The year or two before it was often an L1. I particularly remember that section from Bottesford to Allington when we always seemed to go like the clappers! It wasn't always an L1 though. I remember going for the short trip from High Level to Victoria behind 61821 and I even took a photo of it with my brownie 127. Unfortunately, that photo has been lost for all time, much to my regret.

Yes Clive , I think it was about the end 0f '62 when steam finished . I remember sometimes going to Derby and back with L1s or a B1 (luxury compared to the L1s) , but not one mention of Derby jobs in my 1963 diary (unfortunately the only diary I saved of my Grantham days , to my everlasting regret)

Regards, Roy.

[t-b-g]

28 minutes ago, great central said:

 

I still have my notebook somewhere reporting that all the spotters, me included, were rounded up and put on a unit back to Nottingham one day in, from memory, 1963.

As we left, Lord Faringdon, again very much from memory,  came hurtling through. The last time I saw an A4 working for BR.

It seems spotters were no longer welcome on the new dieselised railway.

 

I went all giddy when you said you had seen Lord Faringdon and then felt a bit deflated when I read on to see it was the later faux one, not the real one.

[Willie Whizz]

1 hour ago, FarrMan said:

I agree with that from memory. It must have been about 1962 or 1963 that there was a sudden change from all steam between Grantham and Nottingham Victoria to all DMU class 114. The timetable was speeded up at the same time. When changing trains at Grantham, I only remember seeing Class 114's. Very rarely was there a different class of DMU. With our preference for steam, we always used to call DMU's 'bugcars' (two clearly separate parts - no reference to the one with a double g).

 

Lloyd

 

Most of Colwick's L1s went at the very end of 1962, so it may well be that was the time the DMUs nominally took over.  Although my 11-year old self has a vague recollection that Ivatt 4MT tender locos could still be seen on those passenger services for a while after.  Certainly the end of the L1s was the "beginning of the end" as far as I was concerned, and within another year or so steam in Nottingham seemed to be the exception rather than the rule.  I'd give my eye teeth to see 67767 again ... 

[Headstock]

Funny, I have always seen the arrival of the L1's in the Nottingham area as the end of a golden age. Harbingers of death in locomotive form, portents of doom,  and mixers of cement.

[Tony Wright]

7 hours ago, cctransuk said:

 

..... and, in fairness to NNK (Phoenix) who now offer some MTK kits; MTK DMU kits were not that difficult to build; (for the Almighty, it would be a breeze).

 

I built an excellent Gloucester set way back in the 1970s, well before the advent of superglues - which nowadays make bonding the aluminium bodyshell to the cast whitemetal ends, etc. quite a simple task.

 

I know that it is 'fashionable' to 'knock' anything MTK, but quite a lot of those products were, and are, perfectly buildable; given application.

 

Such adverse comment should only be made on the basis of personal experience.

 

John Isherwood.

'Such adverse comment should only be made on the basis of personal experience.'

 

What kind of experience of MTK kits should I comment on, John, other than personal?

 

Have you ever tried to build an MTK BR Standard Five? It was months before I stopped twitching, even long after the refuse collectors had taken it away!  

 

I tried to build some MTK gangwayed Gresleys (which had a one piece bodyshell which included the roof). Did the cast metal ends fit? Never in a million years. The proportions were all wrong and the beading hopeless. 

 

I also tried to build one of the diesel loco kits, but I couldn't decide what it was meant to be.

 

If you want a second opinion on MTK's DMU kits, ask Tony Geary. 

 

Even the proprietor, the late Colin Massingham, branded his O Gauge range 'El Crappo', complete with a drawing of a defecating donkey. 

 

I believe the late Alastair Rolfe took on some of the range, and improved it beyond recognition in his 'No Nonsense' kits. These must be the ones now available from NNK (Phoenix).

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Clem]

1 hour ago, Headstock said:

Funny, I have always seen the arrival of the L1's in the Nottingham area as the end of a golden age. Harbingers of death in locomotive form, portents of doom,  and mixers of cement.

Evening Andrew.

Colwick had them from 1955. But yes, they only really grew in numbers after 1959. And I would always prefer to see an A5 or J6 on the locals, not to mention a J39 or a K2.

[Clem]

31 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

Have you ever tried to build an MTK BR Standard Five? It was months before I stopped twitching, even long after the refuse collectors had taken it away!  

I need an emoji that's 50% friendly/supportive and 50% funny.

[great central]

I built an MTK class 5, didn't turn out too bad to my eyes. Picked it up from York show club sales many, many years ago. There was also a DJH kit on the sales stand, but at over twice the price, to someone unemployed at the time it was way beyond my means.

[Headstock]

48 minutes ago, Clem said:

Evening Andrew.

Colwick had them from 1955. But yes, they only really grew in numbers after 1959. And I would always prefer to see an A5 or J6 on the locals, not to mention a J39 or a K2.

 

Evening Clem,

 

Quite nice looking engines the L1 but pretty lousy by all accounts. I remember an old pal of Frank Stratford saying that, 'they would have been half decent, if they put round wheels on them'. I think that Marylebone were quite pleased to get rid of them. It never bodes well, when you get the hand me down pants with a hole in the backside. I wonder what wonderful little critters got zapped when the L1's arrived, J5's, N5's, N7's?

 

The J11 did a lot of good work on passenger trains on the north south axis. The J6's and J5's seem to have been liked by the GC men, good steamers, not so good tender first in J39 weather. I'm still looking for that elusive picture of a J6 on passenger duties south of Leicester Central.

[cctransuk]

1 hour ago, Tony Wright said:

'Such adverse comment should only be made on the basis of personal experience.'

 

What kind of experience of MTK kits should I comment on, John, other than personal?

 

Have you ever tried to build an MTK BR Standard Five? It was months before I stopped twitching, even long after the refuse collectors had taken it away!  

 

I tried to build some MTK gangwayed Gresleys (which had a one piece bodyshell which included the roof). Did the cast metal ends fit? Never in a million years. The proportions were all wrong and the beading hopeless. 

 

I also tried to build one of the diesel loco kits, but I couldn't decide what it was meant to be.

 

If you want a second opinion on MTK's DMU kits, ask Tony Geary. 

 

Even the proprietor, the late Colin Massingham, branded his O Gauge range 'El Crappo', complete with a drawing of a defecating donkey. 

 

I believe the late Alastair Rolfe took on some of the range, and improved it beyond recognition in his 'No Nonsense' kits. These must be the ones now available from NNK (Phoenix).

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

All I can tell you is that my experience of building MTK DMUs and wagons was not in any way stressful - certainly no worse than building Keyser's kits - though a newer generation of modellers sees fit to tear apart the reputation of that excellent company too.

 

It is all to easy nowadays to judge kits from the past by today's standards. Unless you were there - as you and I were - it's impossible to remember how little there was apart from the very limited ranges of RTR. We were more than happy to get out the tools, fettle the components; tweak the motors and fill the gaps between the castings with car body filler or solder ........ and we were bl**dy proud of the results, too!

 

It would seem, from the above posting, that at least one customer managed to make something worthwhile from the MTK Standard Five kit. My model of the same loco was 'bashed' from a Hornby tender-drive Black Five chassis and boiler; Kitmaster/ Airfix Standard Mogul components and a cast whitemetal high-sided Standard tender body kit. Despite the questionable provenance, it won a trophy at that year's Cambridge model railway exhibition.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

[t-b-g]

A small amount of progress to report on Valour. Lots of little bits made and fitted to the smokebox and footplate.

 

Not much more to do now but as I get nearer to finishing it, I seem to go slower!

 

I haven't forgotten the top lamp iron. I have left it until last along with the very fine lubricator pipes on the footplate. After hat, plus a good clean up, we are nearly there.