LNER4479 Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, sandra said: After all I do need all the help I can get. Sandra Hi Sandra, It may only be a small contribution but this signal is next up on my workbench. Roy persuaded me to have a go at it following my one and only visit to the layout in so I intend to honour that commitment in his memory. I already have all the bits in stock. I might leave it up to someone else to install the operating mechanism, mind ... Edited October 29, 2020 by LNER4479 7 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium t-b-g Posted October 29, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 29, 2020 1 hour ago, sandra said: Tony, I’ve read this exchange with interest. I don’t think I bought Retford to enhance my own reputation, indeed that would be impossible for I don’t have any reputation. I was friend of Roys and I admired his work enormously, in fact when I first saw Retford I was quite overwhelmed and I bought it because of the real risk that his work would be destroyed. I have not previously been involved with an Eastern Region layout, indeed my own present layout is a model of Andover Junction which is joint SR/WR and thus I need a great deal of guidance when it comes to an Eastern Region model. For example I would never have known that the front number plate on the A4 was in the wrong place. I don’t think it in any way affects Roy’s memory to alter things which may be incorrect. In fact the layout cannot be preserved in aspic, it is unfinished and I would like it to be complete. I also want it to run properly and be maintained properly as a tribute to a great man. I am quite prepared to alter things which I don’t like or which I think could be done better or in a different way. after all to quote Roy “it’s my train-set” Roy was always reticent about exposing the railway to the public. I am quite happy for the railway to get more exposure. I consider myself lucky to own it and I want to share it with a wider audience even if that is only electronically. Tony W and Robert Carroll have been immensely helpful in giving me guidance about suitable locomotives and passenger stock and I would like their continued help with the railway. After all I do need all the help I can get. Sandra I will not rock the boat any more Sandra. I am sure you are in good hands with Tony and Robert. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 There is a sensitivity about taking on a layout as a 'second owner'. I understand it, having been in that position for almost a decade now albeit without having the added complication of the high profile nature of Retford. I've done a fair amount of work and upkeep to the layout since it came North, but I have always been careful to respect the original modellers' design and creation. Whether my input has been driven by a desire to improve accuracy or just through personal preference, anytime I've written about my progress I have been careful about how it may be read as a reflection on the (invariably high quality) original work. I can see how an occasional loose turn of phrase could have potential to ruffle feathers and I would hate to risk offending the original builders who I still count as distant friends. I'm sure everyone's intentions are good in respect of Retford and it will be marvellous to see it back in action if only via the web nowadays. It is good that the layout has a future, and I expect the desire to do justice to the previous work will push new contributors to also do their very best - a situation where everyone wins really. 4 3 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach bogie Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 I have been fortunate to visit Retford. I was at a show, with a group of friends where Roy was demonstrating. I spotted this and expressed my admiration for it, saying how well it suits BR green. Another of the group was less flattering and was at the receiving end of what Roy thought of his opinion. One of the group was a regular to Roy's, He was told to bring me but not him next time. Mike Wiltshire 8 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertcwp Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 28 minutes ago, Coach bogie said: I have been fortunate to visit Retford. I was at a show, with a group of friends where Roy was demonstrating. I spotted this and expressed my admiration for it, saying how well it suits BR green. Another of the group was less flattering and was at the receiving end of what Roy thought of his opinion. One of the group was a regular to Roy's, He was told to bring me but not him next time. Mike Wiltshire I recall seeing that engine on one of my visits. I don't know whose it was and I don't think it's there now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted October 29, 2020 Author Share Posted October 29, 2020 5 minutes ago, robertcwp said: I recall seeing that engine on one of my visits. I don't know whose it was and I don't think it's there now. I'm sure it's Roy's work, Robert. But, where is it now? I saw it on many occasions when I visited. Regards, Tony. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Tony Wright Posted October 29, 2020 Author Popular Post Share Posted October 29, 2020 How about a round of applause for excellent service? As I reported last week, I foolishly dropped my Kitmaster/Lima DELTIC which resulted in its complete destruction, at least with regards to the body. Many thanks for all the offers of help regarding spare Kitmaster/Dapol DELTIC bodies, but I'm too committed to other constructional projects to consider following the original path. So, after being helped on here where to look, today I took delivery of a Locomotion Ltd-edition one. I emailed Locomotion on Tuesday, and received the model this afternoon. There's more to it than that. Being naturally parsimonious, I enquired if there were any 'returns' for sale; and there were - ranging from damaged boxes to the odd bit missing. And, I got one for a much-reduced price. Here it is................ It was missing the odd lamp bracket, that's all! I replaced the top lamp bracket with a metal one, securely glued-in. This sort of thing is anathema to the collector (and, what's even worse, this one doesn't even have a certificate!), though I couldn't care less. In a way, the missing lamp bracket is a blessing in disguise, because one of this loco's jobs will be 'The White Rose', complete with stuck-on headboard. RTR plastic lamp brackets just give in when 'boards are stuck on and taken off! I've added the detail bits on the buffer beam, but only at this end - I made a S&W bar for the other end, moments after the supplied tension-locks went into the bin. I think this is a terrific model, way-eclipsing my 44 year old original. I had to adjust the tight back-to-backs on the outer axles (as I have to on Bachmann production Deltics), but it runs superbly. Just weathering now. Something else which will 'devalue' it...................... 32 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theakerr Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 When I supposedly worked for a living, as opposed to being retired, some of the best 'product' came out of the continuous incremental improvement process. Looking back it was interesting in how the 'originator' of the product viewed the improvement process. Some accepted it gladly and did not see it as a negative reflection on themselves or their Group. Some, and I am sad to say the majority, did not accept it well seeing it as critical, insulting and questioning of their knowledge as well as a loss of their I because they thought it meant sharing. Often they actively blocked potential improvements resulting in stagnation and frequently being by-passed. I don't see any Troll like comments on this thread and therefore see the comments about Retford, or any other layout for that matter, in a similar way - positive. 6 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete55 Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 1 hour ago, Tony Wright said: I'm sure it's Roy's work, Robert. But, where is it now? I saw it on many occasions when I visited. Regards, Tony. Good evening Tony, Mons Meg certainly was Roys work, although it originated from Chippy I believe, and passed to Roy when Chippy passed on. Roy completely re-worked it, Geoff lined and numbered it. If it is not there now, I could make an educated guess as to where it may have gone, but I think that would be a family matter. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted October 29, 2020 Author Share Posted October 29, 2020 1 hour ago, Theakerr said: When I supposedly worked for a living, as opposed to being retired, some of the best 'product' came out of the continuous incremental improvement process. Looking back it was interesting in how the 'originator' of the product viewed the improvement process. Some accepted it gladly and did not see it as a negative reflection on themselves or their Group. Some, and I am sad to say the majority, did not accept it well seeing it as critical, insulting and questioning of their knowledge as well as a loss of their I because they thought it meant sharing. Often they actively blocked potential improvements resulting in stagnation and frequently being by-passed. I don't see any Troll like comments on this thread and therefore see the comments about Retford, or any other layout for that matter, in a similar way - positive. I saw a similar thing in teaching from time to time. Some subordinates in a department were often more able than the heads, but it could cause friction. I hope I was never guilty of that. One young woman teacher in my department was brilliant, having far more exciting ideas than I ever had. Sadly, she moved on and was promoted to another school (not for her, but for me), such was her potential. One thing I did find taxing from time to time was educating kids of greater intelligence than mine (not an unusual occurrence). They might not have known as much but their capacity to learn was far greater. I was usually one lesson ahead of them! Regards, Tony. 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium St Enodoc Posted October 29, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 29, 2020 5 hours ago, LNER4479 said: I might leave it up to someone else to install the operating mechanism, mind ... Not Viessmann motors then? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertcwp Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 10 hours ago, St Enodoc said: Not Viessmann motors then? I did wonder if any of the signals on Retford had those but don't know enough about the subject. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Clanger Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 43 minutes ago, robertcwp said: I did wonder if any of the signals on Retford had those but don't know enough about the subject. No, all are powered by servos. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Clive Mortimore Posted October 30, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 30, 2020 12 hours ago, Tony Wright said: I saw a similar thing in teaching from time to time. Some subordinates in a department were often more able than the heads, but it could cause friction. I hope I was never guilty of that. One young woman teacher in my department was brilliant, having far more exciting ideas than I ever had. Sadly, she moved on and was promoted to another school (not for her, but for me), such was her potential. One thing I did find taxing from time to time was educating kids of greater intelligence than mine (not an unusual occurrence). They might not have known as much but their capacity to learn was far greater. I was usually one lesson ahead of them! Regards, Tony. Hello Tony It is frustrating the other way round when the person teaching is, thinking of a polite way of saying this, knowledgeable on what they are talking about but nothing else. This was quite common when I was in the army, sergeants don't like some know it all showing them up. 4 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted October 30, 2020 Author Share Posted October 30, 2020 38 minutes ago, Major Clanger said: No, all are powered by servos. By far the best way in my experience. The two servos which Tony Gee installed for the signals he made (completed what Mick Nicholson had started) for the M&GNR section of Little Bytham have performed faultlessly (which is more than can be said for the Viesmanns on the main line). It's a bit of a paradox with these signal motors. When they work, their operation is beautiful, but the failure rate is ridiculously high. I believe you no longer stock them because of that. Regards, Tony. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
great central Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 On 12/10/2020 at 13:21, great central said: Doesn't look like anything changed over the weekend, this is Lowdham box, well the last bits, a few minutes ago Update photo taken earlier, the box has gone....... But not far, if you look carefully it's been re-erected in the station 'garden'. 12 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium St Enodoc Posted October 30, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 30, 2020 12 hours ago, St Enodoc said: Not Viessmann motors then? 1 hour ago, robertcwp said: I did wonder if any of the signals on Retford had those but don't know enough about the subject. 58 minutes ago, Major Clanger said: No, all are powered by servos. For the avoidance of doubt, my tongue was definitely in my cheek, as @LNER4479 and our host will certainly have realised. For my part, I use memory wire but were I starting afresh then servos would be my choice too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNER4479 Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, St Enodoc said: For the avoidance of doubt, my tongue was definitely in my cheek, as @LNER4479 and our host will certainly have realised. Understood as such. Hills of the North Carlisle will be direct mechanical operation (easier to do with a permanent layout), with colour lights in the station itself, as it was in the 1950s. I will have a play one day with servos when the opportunity presents itself - but otherwise I understand mechanical things much better than electrical stuff! Edited October 30, 2020 by LNER4479 6 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dylan Sanderson Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 For those that are interested... Hornby have just released another update on the highly anticipated rebuilt W1s. Does anyone else think the lining on 60700 is too prominent? https://www.Hornby.com/uk-en/news/the-engine-shed/all-that-glitters-is-gold Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold MikeParkin65 Posted October 30, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 30, 2020 1 minute ago, Dylan Sanderson said: For those that are interested... Hornby have just released another update on the highly anticipated rebuilt W1s. Does anyone else think the lining on 60700 is too prominent? https://www.Hornby.com/uk-en/news/the-engine-shed/all-that-glitters-is-gold Seems to be the current Hornby way - same on 46211 and 46257. Agree its a bit too bright and tangerine. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dylan Sanderson Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 2 minutes ago, MikeParkin65 said: Seems to be the current Hornby way - same on 46211 and 46257. Agree its a bit too bright and tangerine. I'm sure it's nothing Tom Foster can't fix! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cctransuk Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 19 minutes ago, Dylan Sanderson said: For those that are interested... Hornby have just released another update on the highly anticipated rebuilt W1s. Does anyone else think the lining on 60700 is too prominent? https://www.Hornby.com/uk-en/news/the-engine-shed/all-that-glitters-is-gold It would seem to be a result of painting the whole cladding band bright orange; (and then, possibly, applying a virtually invisible black line down the centre - though I can't make it out in Hornby's images). That is NOT the way that the prototype was lined, and NOT the way that Hornby (and many other producers) have done it in the past. John Isherwood. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
micklner Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 Why do this forum in general always says the same old thing ?? The models are samples not the finished model . Comments, good or bad when they arrive !!!!! 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
grob1234 Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 Sorry to butt in, I know we have covered this before (most likely) What is the white residue you get on whitemetal after soldering? Is there a way to easily get rid of it prior to painting? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cctransuk Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 1 hour ago, micklner said: Why do this forum in general always says the same old thing ?? The models are samples not the finished model . Comments, good or bad when they arrive !!!!! The purpose of the samples is to identify errors in the livery applied - the over-prominent lining is such an error. ....... or we could just keep quiet now, and then moan when it's too late and the (flawed) models are on the model shop shelves. Which course of action would be more constructive? John Isherwood. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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