Wright writes.....

[Tony Wright]

10 hours ago, Barry Ten said:

I found building a plane to be a very "interesting" experience with regards to instructions. I got two huge sheets which had to be joined together to make a single scale plan, and then a set of typed instructions with no diagrams at all. Needless to say these instructions assumed a high degree of familiarity with regards to the naming of parts and materials.

 

 

However, gradually things began to make sense, helped by the fact that every piece that's glued to another is one less to puzzle over!

 

 

This week I've been doing some 1/8th scale scratchbuilding for the cockpit parts:

 

 

Sorry for the digression, but it's been illuminating to dip into a completely different constructional hobby and get a sense of how railway modelling must look from the "outside".

 

Al

 

 

Fascinating Al,

 

Thanks for showing us.

 

Your mention of 'naming of parts' brought back many happy memories.

 

When I did a paper round, a got a bob per day - six shillings a week (I didn't do the Sunday round). The newsagent's shop also sold Airfix kits. The cheapest was originally under two shillings, but then things like the fighter planes became two bob, in their neat polythene bags. Thus, at least a third of my paper round money each week went straight back to the shop. 

 

In building my Spitfire, Hurricane, ME 109 (yes, to be shot down!), etc, I didn't realise how much I was learning. Not only were the instructions clear, all the parts of the aircraft were named. It was also true with the warships, though the larger ones blew all my week's wages. Things like coning tower, bridge, rangefinders and so on became commonplace in my vocabulary. 

 

When my lads were much younger, I helped them build their first plastic kits. The kit ranges were far greater and more-sophisticated, but something seemed to have gone from the instructions. Instead of 'cement engine nacelle to front of fuselage', it was 'cement part four to part five'. The learning of parts' names seemed to get lost. 

 

As for metal loco kit instructions, in some cases the less said the better. Quirky diagrams, with serpentine arrows going hither and thither, plus writing I wouldn't have accepted from that ESN class of yore; yes, one built the things in spite of the instructions! Some are much better, of course, and I hope the ones I've written can be understood.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[grahame]

Just a few days ago (now many pages back) I posted a pic of two 3D printed N/2mm scale Ford Cargo trucks in primer paint. Since then I've got some top coat paint on one, along with flush glazing the windscreen and making a load for it. Although still unfinished it's getting there but perhaps it's now time to get some paint on the other one (the box van). Here's a pic of progress on the scaff truck (with my scratch-built body) so far:

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 17, 2021 by grahame

[jwealleans]

Look forward to seeing the 2mm piece of grubby rag dangling from the back of those scaffy poles.

[grahame]

Definitely. A bit of red rag hanging off the end of the poles is on my 'to do' list of details to add.

 

 

[Flying Pig]

29 minutes ago, grahame said:

Definitely. A bit of red rag hanging off the end of the poles is on my 'to do' list of details to add.

 

 

 

Safety is number one priority.

[PMP]

12 hours ago, Clive Mortimore said:

HI Paul

 

I am going to disagree about the Hornby Brush Type 2 being the best.

Feel free to disagree,  I’ve used Airfix and Lima too, my preference is for the contemporary Hornby model. I agree the body bands are a pita not being there for earlier models and the fan and opening doors I can happily do without. 
Re body bands a neat way of doing them is masking their position and then a couple of coats of car undercoat primer paint. Let it dry thoroughly, remove the masking and you have very gently raised bands in place. I’ve seen it done with microstrip too but my preference was using thick paint.

[Michael Edge]

15 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

I think I'd suggest taking John Isherwood's advice, Joseph, and move it on.

 

Judith Edge kits do go together very well, but I don't think they're for the inexperienced. That's not to say they're over-complicated, but I think (as with all complex, etched brass kits) that some measure of skill and know-how is required. From what you say, the instructions would assume that, especially with no exploded diagram (are you sure there isn't one?).

 

Apart from some rudimentary drawings, there's no exploded diagram in the LRM J3 kit I'm building. The side-elevation illustrating the prescribed method of fixing the motor is very useful for checking clearance and fit, but that's really all apart from a sketch of the frames, the brake rigging and the cab interior arrangement. There are a large number of pages of written instructions, which do assume some level of skill, and a list of the parts. This is OK, and it relates to the photocopies of the etches, where the parts are numbered on the fret. Except, in places, the photocopies are of little use since they're rather 'blanked-in'. As one cuts the parts out, the numbers (in the scrap parts of the fret) tend to get rather lost. 

 

Without appearing 'cocky', nothing of this matters to me, since I rarely read instructions and, anyway, the kit  is so well-produced that the build is really intuitive. That said, a full exploded diagram would have been useful. One is provided in the Gibson 'County' Tank kit. 

 

I know it's disappointing not to be able to build what you'd like, but if you don't have the skills yourself and the cost of having a pro' build it might be prohibitive, best cut your losses. 

 

Kind regards,

 

Tony.  

We don't provide exploded diagrams, what we do include (unlike almost every other kit manufacturer) is a complete drawing of the loco. This is a CAD drawing withall parts visible and printed at exact size - not a vague hand drawn diagram with unidentifiable blobby parts.

With regard to your "naming of parts" I do identify everything I can, as far as possible using correct railway terminology (there are a few parts in some kits which i don't know the function of, these are often described by shape) rather than modeller's terms. 

Two more important points; with one or two exceptions all the kits have part numbers on the etch, these numbers are listed and described. The written instructions are intentionally kept as short as possible in the hope that builders will actually read them.

The DE2 is a relatively easy kit to build with only four wheels, no jackshaft drive and very little forming to do.

We are always happy to help with advice in the event of any difficulties - Mr Marsh has not contacted us since buying the kit.

[grahame]

3 hours ago, Flying Pig said:

 

Safety is number one priority.

 

Perhaps a bit of Jenny Agutter's petticoat will suffice.

;-)

 

 

[Flying Pig]

10 minutes ago, grahame said:

 

Perhaps a bit of Jenny Agutter's petticoat will suffice.

;-)

 

 

 

For some reason I have the soundtrack of Carry On films running through my head.

[MJI]

Some advice please.

 

Just got a Comet GWR coach kit and I have a question.

 

I have done 2 Mousa sided carriages with hinge holes and used thin strip soldered in, looks fine.

 

Done BR vehicles, soldered on MJT BR hinges, looks fine.

 

Anyway no slots, nor holes. Could ruin sides doing these slots. What should I do to get decent looking hinges?

[The Fatadder]

12 minutes ago, MJI said:

Some advice please.

 

Just got a Comet GWR coach kit and I have a question.

 

I have done 2 Mousa sided carriages with hinge holes and used thin strip soldered in, looks fine.

 

Done BR vehicles, soldered on MJT BR hinges, looks fine.

 

Anyway no slots, nor holes. Could ruin sides doing these slots. What should I do to get decent looking hinges?

If there's one thing I hate about Comet kits it is the fact they dont etch holes for the hinges!  One of the most frustrating omissions, even more so than the ones where the side is etched too long!

 

I have tried 2 approaches and have a set of sides where the previous owner had used a third.

 

Drilling holes through the side, then soldering the hinge in place from behind, this was the approach I used on my first Comet build.  I think it would be fine with a flat etch but was a real pain trying not to damage the pre formed tumblehome.  I used the Comet hinges (which bizarrely they dont bother including when you buy a "full" coach kit.)   From memory the tail of the T shaped hinge fits in a round hole.  I think this was the approach I used on the H26 build.

 

The second approach was to fit using bits of Evergreen plastic strip glued into position after painting (as it made masking a lot easier)  I think this was the approach I used on the A20 build.   

 

Finally on the second hand kit for the A22 the original owner had soldered the hinges in place from the outside, it was beautifully done, but well and truly outside of my ability soldering.  I think if you have the soldering ability this is the way to go, if not I would go with the glue approach and accept at some point they may need replacing.   I will try and do some photos of the 3 different coaches this evening if I remember.  

 

 

I also did one coach using Southern Pride hinges without looking at a photo of the real thing, needless to say it looks completely wrong but would spoil the paint job if I tried to correct it...  (H33 build)

[31A]

18 minutes ago, MJI said:

Some advice please.

 

Just got a Comet GWR coach kit and I have a question.

 

I have done 2 Mousa sided carriages with hinge holes and used thin strip soldered in, looks fine.

 

Done BR vehicles, soldered on MJT BR hinges, looks fine.

 

Anyway no slots, nor holes. Could ruin sides doing these slots. What should I do to get decent looking hinges?

 

Where there's no other provision for hinges, I tend to use these ones from Dart Castings:

 

https://www.dartcastings.co.uk/mjt/3918.php

 

You need to drill a 0.5mm hole for each hinge which can be a bit of a chore (depending how many doors the coach has!) but at least the etched 'door lines' give you the vertical location, and it's easier than trying to make slots in the coach side.  The etch consists of sets of three hinges, two short and one long (for the lower one).  The tag on the end of each hinge is a snug fit into the 0.5mm hole - it will stay there by itself long enough for you to get the soldering iron onto the other side.  I've used these on several Comet coach sides.

 

[Barry Ten]

Like Rich I use Evergreen plastic glued in place to represent the hinges - the only difference is I do it at the bare brass stage.

 

[Taz]

I also drill .5mm holes and solder in the hinges (either Comet from their detailing etch or the Dart castings ones listed above - they are much the same)

 

 

i’m curious about the glued plastic strip option though. For those that have used it how do you rate it’s durability?

[Barry Ten]

55 minutes ago, Taz said:

 

 

i’m curious about the glued plastic strip option though. For those that have used it how do you rate it’s durability?

 

My experience is they're fine once the coach is primed and painted. But I handle my coaches carefully anyway. My feeling is that anything likely to knock the hinges off would probably damage the paint finish as a whole.

[Tony Wright]

More progress.....................

 

 

Various dodges/methods are frequently described on this thread - many thanks for the door hinges tips to all. 

 

The Gibson 'County' Tank's footplate valances are part of the main footplate etch, with half-etched lines (thankfully) provided on the underside. They have to be bent down, of course. How this could be done without bending bars, I have no idea..................

 

 

With the bars, the forming is a doddle.

 

This example will have the later, curved footplate at the front; hence the sections nibbled out.  

 

 

Edited February 17, 2021 by Tony Wright
typo error

[jwealleans]

2 hours ago, MJI said:

Anyway no slots, nor holes. Could ruin sides doing these slots. What should I do to get decent looking hinges?

 I've done a few Comet kits for myself and others and the best approach I've found is their detailing etch which contains a jig to drill all the holes in a straight line along the side of the vehicle and a collection of hinges to solder in.   Once you've used those up it's easy enough to make your own from waste etch.

Edited February 17, 2021 by jwealleans

[Tony Wright]

And, simultaneous progress on the LRM J3..............

 

 

This valances on this one are separate, and need to be carefully soldered in place. Everything fitting perfectly so far...................

 

I do like the look of the Markits drivers with stainless steel tyres. 

 

 

I've often commented on the running of kit-built locos where 'fully-tested' often means it'll negotiate a dead straight piece of Peco Streamline.

 

As mentioned, this J3 will have to go around 2' radius curves (fortunately, out of sight of the scenic sections) on the M&GN section of LB. I'll go no further with the construction until I'm happy that it'll do this. It does...................

 

I think this a basic principle in making model locos; making sure they'll negotiate the tightest curve on the layout they're to operate on. 

 

Making two (very different) locos together is rather good fun, though I must avoid getting parts mixed up! 

 

 

Edited February 17, 2021 by Tony Wright
to add something

[MJI]

Thanks all I think I will order the etch sometime.

 

Not going to start it anyway until the two Mousa sided Ts are complete and I have some of my DMUs out of the job list.

[Clearwater]

2 hours ago, Barry Ten said:

Like Rich I use Evergreen plastic glued in place to represent the hinges - the only difference is I do it at the bare brass stage.

 

 

 

Hi

Are my eyes deceiving me or have you replaced the stretcher? across the bottom of the w/m bogie with brass wire?  I've noticed on mine that it's quite a thin and easily distorted piece of metal...

Thanks

David

[Barry Ten]

2 hours ago, Clearwater said:

 

Hi

Are my eyes deceiving me or have you replaced the stretcher? across the bottom of the w/m bogie with brass wire?  I've noticed on mine that it's quite a thin and easily distorted piece of metal...

Thanks

David

 

Yes, I think I broke the castings on that coach.

[Barry Ten]

In case it's of interest, I found out what was wrong with my Britannia (see the recent discussion on Mazak rot).

 

It turned out it wasn't Mazak rot - phew!

 

I didn't think it could be split gears as the loco ran smoothly, but under any load the wheels stopped turning and the motor just whirred. Similarly, I could turn the wheels by hand. I stripped it down and found that there was a problem with the pair of intermediate gears which sit on the same shaft, in between the worm and the driving wheel gear. There was indeed a split, but the effect was to stop one of the gears gripping the splined shaft, so it couldn't transfer its rotation to the other gear. As an intermediate running repair I drilled through the faces of both gears and pinned them together with a bit of 0.45mm wire, secured with cyano. This stopped the wheels slipping under load, so now I've got a running Brit back again.

 

Al

Edited February 18, 2021 by Barry Ten
punctuation

[MikeParkin65]

13 minutes ago, Barry Ten said:

In case it's of interest, I found out what was wrong with my Britannia (see the recent discussion on Mazak rot).

 

It turned out it wasn't Mazak rot - phew!

 

I didn't think it could be split gears as the loco ran smoothly. but under any load the wheels stopped turning and the motor just whirred. Similarly, I could turn the wheels by hand. I stripped it down and found that there was a problem with the pair of intermediate gears which sit on the same shaft, in between the worm and the driving wheel gear. There was indeed a split, but the effect was to stop one of the gears gripping the splined shaft, so it couldn't transfer its rotation to the other gear, As an intermediate running repair I drilled through the faces of both gears and pinned them together with a bit of 0.45mm wire, secured with cyano. This stopped the wheels slipping under load, so now I've got a running Brit back again.

 

Al

Had an identical failure and fix (though I used a Peco track pin - it was the first thing that came to hand) with a Stanier tank. To be fair I’ve had a lot of rtr over the last 20 years but very few mechanical failures. All of which have been Hornby. 

[Denbridge]

6 hours ago, MJI said:

Some advice please.

 

Just got a Comet GWR coach kit and I have a question.

 

I have done 2 Mousa sided carriages with hinge holes and used thin strip soldered in, looks fine.

 

Done BR vehicles, soldered on MJT BR hinges, looks fine.

 

Anyway no slots, nor holes. Could ruin sides doing these slots. What should I do to get decent looking hinges?

Comet do etched hinges which fit into a small hole. No slot is required. Apologies. This was already, far better than me.

Edited February 17, 2021 by Denbridge
Apology

[96701]

Re Comet hinges, I had a load of handle etches, so I soldered them in with more sticking out from the lower tumblehome.Also used a bit of brass wire for the bump stops.