Wright writes.....

[FarrMan]

1 hour ago, Tony Wright said:

Just an observation on this beautiful morning.

 

I know I'm often accused (with justification?) of tossing a metaphorical hand grenade into a metaphorical minefield, then observing the results. Could the following be an example?

 

I'll explain if I may? 

 

When I look at video clips on this site, there's always a further selection of (usually) related video content. Occasionally, I'll have a look at these where the subject matter is of particular interest. Some concern self-appointed critics commenting on products; a case in point being Hornby's latest A2/2 and A2/3 Thompson Pacifics. Now, although I must express an interest, I agree that manufacturing faults are not acceptable. However, some comments are akin to 'product assassination'! 

 

I respect the fact that everyone has an opinion, but in every case I've watched (not many, because I gave up), the layouts (if one can justify them with that description) on which the products are being criticised are absolute junk in my opinion. Hornby SetTrack laid (badly) on the floor or on carpet, dodgy curves, no attempt at realism, no ballasting and in all cases, trains running which show no observation of the prototype. They're the sort of creations I'd have been unhappy with as a raw beginner, still in short trousers and RTR-reliant. 

 

The 'bile' continues with severe criticisms of editors in some cases.

 

As I state (and have done on numerous occasions), if things are incorrect, poorly-assembled and need to be returned, these factors should be mentioned and attended to. But, some of the most-severe critics seem to be incapable of modelling to even the poorest standards. Yet, they appear to 'bite the hand that feeds them'. They (obviously?) can't do things properly themselves, so would appear to be entirely RTR-reliant. It's a wonder they have anything to run at all............

 

Just some thoughts. 

Tony

 

I think that it can be summed up as 'empty vessels make the most noise'. Now I had better shut up.

 

Lloyd

[LNER4479]

15 minutes ago, Chamby said:

I think we have to accept that people who consider themselves to be an authority on a subject, commonly demonstrate a disconnect with the level of modelling skill and/or expertise also on display.

Is that another way of saying: 'Indefatigable self-belief in their own ability despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary'

 

It is my view that Darwinism will always spawn folks of that genre ... as it will spawn folks of all the other genres out there. I guess we all have our faults...

 

Back to the modelling ...

[Tony Wright]

3 hours ago, FarrMan said:

Tony

 

I think that it can be summed up as 'empty vessels make the most noise'. Now I had better shut up.

 

Lloyd

I've clicked 'agree', but only to your first sentence.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Tony Wright]

4 hours ago, D.Platt said:

Morning Tony

You must have come across these people many times when you have been attending exhibitions , never happy till they find a fault with something ! 

A  “friend “ of mine and my brothers would look at one of our finished kit built locos till he found something to pass a negative comment on , never a complement ,  and yes he couldn’t two pieces of anything together.

So I guess it’s human nature that some people aren’t happy unless they are moaning , and the rest of us ! carry on doing what makes us happy.

 Dennis 

Good afternoon Dennis,

 

I think compliments should be complemented by criticism as well. By that, I mean 'constructive' criticism; something which has been aired many, many times before on here. 

 

As is known, I seek it out, and have been known to dish it out on occasions. In only one case (out of hundreds) has the subject of my 'criticism' given up. As I, too, have not given up when (quite correctly) my work has been 'criticised'. 

 

Where I take issue with the self-appointed (modern?) critics (as it would appear you do) is that they rarely show anyone what they've made, and I'm not surprised. It's rubbish!

 

Anyway, as Graham suggests - back to modelling. In my case that means getting all the necessary stuff together for building the forthcoming Nu-Cast Partners' K2 when it arrives. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony.  

Edited April 20, 2021 by Tony Wright
typo error

[Tony Teague]

Tony

I'd suggest that another element in what your seeing is that the rise of the interweb makes it possible for anyone to say anything and go unpunished in any way; if repeated in a pub or similar, some of it would earn a punch on the nose, but there is no equivalent on the web.

The underlying worry is that thise concern actually lack any social skills, relying instead on their ability as 'keyboard warriors', and sadly, they then attract sycophantic 'followers' around them who agree with, and believe in, every bit of tosh that they come out with.

I doubt that the inventor of the web intended it to be this way.

Tony

[Steven B]

2 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

I think compliments should be complemented by criticism as well. By that, I mean 'constructive' criticism; something which has been aired many, many times before on here. 

 

Agreed. My daughter's primary school have a good way of managing this (although no doubt many regular readers on this thread will bemoan it as namby-pamby modern teaching).

 

On each item of work they're assessing they aim to provide two positive bits of feedback together with one item that needs more work. Think along the lines of "you've done a good job with your soldering and quartering but you need to take more care over your preparing of the model before painting it". The encouragement ensures that they stay positive and engaged in what they're doing even if they're struggling.

 

Steven B.

 

[30368]

2 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Anyway, as Graham suggests - back to modelling. In my case that means getting all the necessary stuff together for building the forthcoming Nu-Cast Partners' K2 when it arrives. 

 

Afternoon Tony,

 

Thats good news - Nu-Cast Partners are doing a really good job for our hobby dusting down and updating the extensive Nu-Cast range. I have built their C2X 0-6-0 and am very happy with the results. I have built a London Road Models K2 (Scottish Cab Version) so I might have a go at one of these and build it with the GN cab.

 

This gives me another opportunity to ask  Nu-Cast Partners for the Drummond/Urie T14 4-6-0 kit to be made available but I understand it needs a lot of work.

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

[The Pilotman]

1 hour ago, Steven B said:

 

Agreed. My daughter's primary school have a good way of managing this (although no doubt many regular readers on this thread will bemoan it as namby-pamby modern teaching).

 

On each item of work they're assessing they aim to provide two positive bits of feedback together with one item that needs more work. Think along the lines of "you've done a good job with your soldering and quartering but you need to take more care over your preparing of the model before painting it". The encouragement ensures that they stay positive and engaged in what they're doing even if they're struggling.

 

Steven B.

 

I believe this is known in the trade as a s**t sandwich. Two positive “slices” either side of something less, er, palatable.

Edited April 20, 2021 by Western Aviator

[Tony Wright]

3 hours ago, 30368 said:

 

Afternoon Tony,

 

Thats good news - Nu-Cast Partners are doing a really good job for our hobby dusting down and updating the extensive Nu-Cast range. I have built their C2X 0-6-0 and am very happy with the results. I have built a London Road Models K2 (Scottish Cab Version) so I might have a go at one of these and build it with the GN cab.

 

This gives me another opportunity to ask  Nu-Cast Partners for the Drummond/Urie T14 4-6-0 kit to be made available but I understand it needs a lot of work.

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

Good evening Richard,

 

Thanks for your comments.

 

I must plead ignorance with regard to the Drummond/Urie T14 4-6-0 kit. Does anyone out there have a picture of a model of it.

 

With regard to the reintroduction of the ex-Nu-Cast range of loco kits, I've been in conversation with Dave Ellis on several occasions of late. He asks my advice (though I don't expect him to always take it - he shouldn't!) and I try to give him my honest opinion. Naturally, ex-LNER locos are the usual topic of conversation; hence the reintroduction of the K2.

 

Making new moulds for the kits shows a commitment to making them a success, as well as (in many cases) new, etched chassis. It would be commercial nonsense to revamp the likes of the B1, K1, Q6 and V2 because RTR equivalents are now in production. The G6 was mentioned, but there's an RTR one now on the horizon. The J6 was certainly a suggestion of mine, though the credit for its success must go to the partnership. 

 

I help (I hope) by giving more than just advice. I test build the first production kits, take step-by-step constructional shots and make notes with regard to the instructions. 

 

 

This was the first 'independent' build of the reintroduced J6.

 

 

I also built another one...................

 

 

And another one for one of Geoff Haynes' customers. Geoff painted this.

 

 

And, yet another....................  As well as at least a couple more. 

 

I'll test build the K2 when it arrives (hopefully soon) and present a full report. 

 

It's not just ex-LNER locos I help with.

 

 

This was the first independent build of the 16XX. I reviewed it and it went into the press - the RM I think. Of course, a forthcoming RTR example will probably dent sales of this. 

 

Unless these initiatives are supported by those who actually make locos, then we're (the generic 'we're') in danger of losing kits; overtaken by a tide of identical RTR motive power.

 

It's my privilege to be invited to assist in their production.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

[Theakerr]

Folks, should the cab numbers on a BR J6 be white or cream?  I have located 3 colour pictures and every one the numbers are white.  I have seen Two J6s on layouts with cream numbers - Tony despite looking at about 30 pages, I cannot find the pictures I know you posted of your J6.

Thks

Some things are hard to believe.  Tony, you have just posted the very pictures that I was looking for.  It does appear that your numbers are cream and it just so happens that I have some cream numbers.

Edited April 20, 2021 by Theakerr
ESP or mindreading

[Chas Levin]

On 19/04/2021 at 10:55, thegreenhowards said:

The second issue is with the cab roof. It came as a flat sheet including the sides and the instructions said to roll it round a 3/16” rod which I did. But I got the curve in slightly the wrong place and it was hard to get it to curve above the cab door recess. So after mucking around restraightening and persuading with pliers I have a cab which is (nearly) the right shape but with some horrid crease lines and plier marks in it as seen below.

 

 

I’m sure many people would say, bin it and start again. But that isn’t really an option as Graham Jones of NMRS was sadly a victim of Covid, so this kit is currently discontinued.

 

My inclination is to tin it with 145 solder and then use white metal solder to skim over the cab corners and file to shape. Does that sound like a reasonable idea and/or does anyone have a better suggestion?

 

Many thanks

 

Andy

 

 

Hello Andy, a bit late to the party on this one (apologies for disrupting the flow, just catching up) but I would like to offer a seconded recommendation for trying to push or smooth out the dents and marks, before you move on to soldering. You might find it's easier - and more successful - than you anticipate and if so, it might reduce the amount of soldering needed.

I've had to try this sort of remedial work before and I've had surprising success, using a curved burnishing tool like this one:

Gently does it of course - as has been recommended by others - and I spent some time experimenting with scrap brass and with different materials to rest the workpiece on (rubber mats, leather, an old mouse mat were all tried with varying success), but how well it works will depend on the thickness of brass and the depth of the dents.

Just a thought, hope it helps, best of luck

[thegreenhowards]

1 minute ago, Chas Levin said:

Hello Andy, a bit late to the party on this one (apologies for disrupting the flow, just catching up) but I would like to offer a seconded recommendation for trying to push or smooth out the dents and marks, before you move on to soldering. You might find it's easier - and more successful - than you anticipate and if so, it might reduce the amount of soldering needed.

I've had to try this sort of remedial work before and I've had surprising success, using a curved burnishing tool like this one:

Gently does it of course - as has been recommended by others - and I spent some time experimenting with scrap brass and with different materials to rest the workpiece on (rubber mats, leather, an old mouse mat were all tried with varying success), but how well it works will depend on the thickness of brass and the depth of the dents.

Just a thought, hope it helps, best of luck

Thanks for the suggestion but you are a bit late as I applied the solder this afternoon! I received a new 100W soldering iron today and wanted a job to test it on, this was ideal as the higher temperature solder really needed the extra power. It seems to have worked OK. I’ll post some photos in due course.

 

Andy

[30368]

1 hour ago, Tony Wright said:

I'll test build the K2 when it arrives (hopefully soon) and present a full report. 

 

I look forward to a picture or two of the K2 and thanks for the pictures of all the other test builds. I have always liked the look of the J6.

 

The original T14 kit appears occasionally for sale in part or unbuilt form but to date I am always too late to purchase. I have spoken to Dave Ellis too, and he suggests that the T14 moulds are too worn to produce anything that would meet current expectations so it would need significant re-engineering. Crowdfunding anyone? I would chip in for sure.

 

Sorry to attempt a Southern takover of a mainly LNER thread!

My C2X build of 2018.

 

Thanks for such a informative and inspirational thread Tony.

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

 

 

 

[Tony Teague]

1 hour ago, Tony Wright said:

I must plead ignorance with regard to the Drummond/Urie T14 4-6-0 kit. Does anyone out there have a picture of a model of it.

 

 

Always happy to oblige!

 

 

A rather dusty specimen, built for me from the original NuCast kit by Chris Phillips some years ago.

 

As has been said these kits are like hens teeth; I'd be very happy to have another but I have heard the comments from Dave Ellis before and so I am not optimistic.

 

Tony

[96701]

8 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Good evening Richard,

 

Thanks for your comments.

 

This was the first 'independent' build of the reintroduced J6.

 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

Shouldn't the trap on the siding be reverse?

[Tony Wright]

11 hours ago, Theakerr said:

Folks, should the cab numbers on a BR J6 be white or cream?  I have located 3 colour pictures and every one the numbers are white.  I have seen Two J6s on layouts with cream numbers - Tony despite looking at about 30 pages, I cannot find the pictures I know you posted of your J6.

Thks

Some things are hard to believe.  Tony, you have just posted the very pictures that I was looking for.  It does appear that your numbers are cream and it just so happens that I have some cream numbers.

I think cream is the correct colour for BR numbers. 

 

In some prototype colour images, they might well be 'washed-out' to white, and certainly, over time, they'd degrade to white.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Tony Wright]

2 hours ago, 96701 said:

Shouldn't the trap on the siding be reverse?

It should Phil,

 

When Norman Solomon was making all the Bytham scenic-side trackwork (using the prototype trackplan), both of us forgot to note the trap point protecting the Down slow/Down north lay-by. Thus, at the initial stage, it wasn't made. Norman made it retrospectively, but only as a dummy; only really noticed from angles such as the picture in question was taken from.

 

I live with it!

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Tony Wright]

9 hours ago, Tony Teague said:

 

Always happy to oblige!

 

 

A rather dusty specimen, built for me from the original NuCast kit by Chris Phillips some years ago.

 

As has been said these kits are like hens teeth; I'd be very happy to have another but I have heard the comments from Dave Ellis before and so I am not optimistic.

 

Tony

Though I can't speak for Dave Ellis, Tony,

 

I think the limiting factor is always the condition of the moulds. Many of the original Nu-Cast moulds must be shot by now, so a decision has to be made as to whether to produce new ones (and, in some cases, make new patterns). It's down to potential sales, of course, and, without being disparaging to the SR 4-6-0 which you've so kindly illustrated (is it an ex-'Paddlebox'?), and partly because of my suggestion, the K2 was chosen as the next in line. It does fit the criteria of pre-Grouping, 'Big Four' and BR, so it has a long lifetime and also a vast geographical spread - from East Anglia to the West Highlands. If it 'bombs', of course, you'll know who to blame! 

 

It does become more and more difficult for the kit manufacturers to make kits (locos, especially) which will sell in sufficient numbers to make them viable. I've heard tales of anything between 25 and 100 needing to be sold before a penny of profit is seen.

 

Many loco kits, of course, remain unmade, for decades. They live in dusty boxes on even more dusty shelves, only to blink in the light when their owners contemplate (yet again) making them, only to be put away again because their owners remember why they were 'abandoned' in the first place. Some are started (the reason for abandonment?) and others do get completed, but are still put away because they won't run. Many are of complex prototypes - the big, most-popular types, thus the most-difficult with all that whirling gear to make! Many are glued together, painted with tar and just plain rubbish. 

 

Though I don't do eBay (nor wish to), reports frequently tell of two extremes - excellent models going for a song, or bidding wars taking place resulting in vast sums being handed over for cr@p - 'Ebay madness' is it called? Some rarer kits (like the T14?) might command higher prices, particularly if unmade. In the past, I've seen tempting boxes on second-hand stands at shows containing (potentially) even more tempting contents, only to find the things made - usually very badly. I hope I've now learned to walk away, unless the price is ridiculously low. 

 

Speaking of rarer kits, a DJH Limited Edition Raven A2 has recently come my way. It's complete (with all wheels, though no motor) and totally unmade, thus undamaged. It's number 156 out of a total of 175, represents the first two and comes with the six-wheeled tender. Might I ask all out there, what kind of prices do these kits go for on eBay? I've contemplated making it and then selling it on (painted professionally, of course). It might be interesting....................

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Markeg]

The last one on Ebay went for 376 pounds.  It finished on the 15th of April.   No 98 of 175.

It was very well painted, just a few light touchups on the footplate was needed and it was missing the front bogie including wheels.

I would say it was a bit of a bargain, if they could get the front bogie.

 

[Jesse Sim]

38 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

. 

 

Speaking of rarer kits, a DJH Limited Edition Raven A2 has recently come my way. It's complete (with all wheels, though no motor) and totally unmade, thus undamaged. It's number 156 out of a total of 175, represents the first two and comes with the six-wheeled tender. Might I ask all out there, what kind of prices do these kits go for on eBay? I've contemplated making it and then selling it on (painted professionally, of course). It might be interesting....................

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

You have my undivided attention 

[Jon4470]

The last un-made A2 that I saw on EBay went for £265. It did not have any wheels included. This one was for one of the last three built and had the 8 wheel tender.

 

Jon

[Tony Wright]

1 hour ago, Markeg said:

The last one on Ebay went for 376 pounds.  It finished on the 15th of April.   No 98 of 175.

It was very well painted, just a few light touchups on the footplate was needed and it was missing the front bogie including wheels.

I would say it was a bit of a bargain, if they could get the front bogie.

 

Thanks for showing this,

 

It does seem to be a bargain. 

 

Off-hand, I don't know what the bogie wheelbase is on a Raven A2, but I imagine it'll be similar to an A3/A4, so a Comet bogie will probably do. 

 

The bogie wheels supplied in the DJH kit are the wrong type - having ten-spokes rather than the typical NER 12. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Tony Wright]

1 hour ago, Jesse Sim said:

You have my undivided attention 

But you've already got one.....................

[Tony Wright]

44 minutes ago, Jon4470 said:

The last un-made A2 that I saw on EBay went for £265. It did not have any wheels included. This one was for one of the last three built and had the 8 wheel tender.

 

Jon

Thanks John,

 

I've actually acquired an eight-wheeled LNER tender for this A2 as well, from SE Finecast (an A3, high-sided one). I've also acquired the correct bogie wheels as well. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Tony Teague]

1 hour ago, Tony Wright said:

 

I think the limiting factor is always the condition of the moulds. Many of the original Nu-Cast moulds must be shot by now, so a decision has to be made as to whether to produce new ones (and, in some cases, make new patterns). It's down to potential sales, of course, and, without being disparaging to the SR 4-6-0 which you've so kindly illustrated (is it an ex-'Paddlebox'?), and partly because of my suggestion, the K2 was chosen as the next in line. It does fit the criteria of pre-Grouping, 'Big Four' and BR, so it has a long lifetime and also a vast geographical spread - from East Anglia to the West Highlands. If it 'bombs', of course, you'll know who to blame! 

 

 

It was indeed a 'Paddlebox', named I believe after the original splashers which were removed by Maunsell in 1931 (they were built 1911).

 

I can see lots of reasons why a kit would not be worth producing; there were only 10 of these, they were heavily altered in the '30s', only 9 made it to BR days and of these only 3 received their BR numbers - so whilst they are perhaps charismatic, the appeal would be limited.

Edited April 21, 2021 by Tony Teague