RMweb Premium Michael Edge Posted August 4, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 4, 2021 Try grinding the rivet off, the heat generated often shifts the solder as well - but why is it soldered if it is riveted? One or the other surely. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium thegreenhowards Posted August 4, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 4, 2021 2 minutes ago, Michael Edge said: Try grinding the rivet off, the heat generated often shifts the solder as well - but why is it soldered if it is riveted? One or the other surely. Mike, The soldering was my attempt to add metal point rodding to the arms of the crank. Sorry, I didn’t explain very well. I can free the rivet up by applying heat but it seizes solid again as soon as it cools down. Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium t-b-g Posted August 4, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 4, 2021 4 minutes ago, thegreenhowards said: Mike, The soldering was my attempt to add metal point rodding to the arms of the crank. Sorry, I didn’t explain very well. I can free the rivet up by applying heat but it seizes solid again as soon as it cools down. Andy Do you have a solder removing vacuum pump? It won't be easy and it will seem as if you need three hands but if you heat the solder and remove as much as possible, you will reach the stage where there is only a tiny coating left. Then you can heat the solder one last time and wriggle the crank while the solder is still liquid and keep wriggling it until the solder cools and sets. Removing all the solder from the joint won't be easy so when you solder the rodding on, it may seize up again but it gives you a fighting chance. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Northroader Posted August 4, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 4, 2021 Put a length of copper wire with flexible strands touching it, and try and wick the solder up the wire. This should help ,to reduce the amount of solder in the joint, maybe enough to force the bits apart. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 15 hours ago, jamie92208 said: I know that GEM made a WM kit of that prototype. I almost got it to run but that was over 40 years ago. Jamie Wrong railway I'm afraid. GEM made a LNWR Webb 4' 6" 2-4-2T. Still available. http://lytchettmanor.co.uk.websitebuilder.prositehosting.co.uk/lytchett-manor/oo-gauge-loco-kits The model illustrated above is a Belpaire firebox version of the L&YR 2-4-2T with an extended bunker. Probably the NuCast kit. Jason 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium polybear Posted August 4, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 4, 2021 3 hours ago, Tony Wright said: Good morning Andy, I assume you used 145 solder (or even a higher melting point)? If so, flood the joints with flux and then apply low-melt solder, with the iron cranked right up. Everything will (or should) then come apart with ease. Afterwards, thoroughly clean-up, removing all traces of solder, then start again. Regards, Tony. Hi Tony, I've never heard of this before - does adding the low melt somehow "nobble" the 145 solder? Thanks. Kind Regards, Brian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Barry Ten Posted August 4, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 4, 2021 4 hours ago, polybear said: Hi Tony, I've never heard of this before - does adding the low melt somehow "nobble" the 145 solder? Thanks. Kind Regards, Brian I guess it's the old "adding impurities lowers the melting point" effect I vaguely remember from chemistry. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScRSG Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 2 hours ago, Barry Ten said: I guess it's the old "adding impurities lowers the melting point" effect I vaguely remember from chemistry. Not just a case of the "average" temperature of the mix? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Headstock Posted August 4, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted August 4, 2021 (edited) A quick 13 ton hopper update. Having fitted new axleboxes alongside the replacement buffers, I was able to prime the kits and I am now able to paint my way through the rake. The current run is the application of weathering. Once that is completed, I can start on the Gypsom load and fit the three link couplings. Based on photographs, I am able to incorporate a number of livery variations as well as axleboxes and wheel combinations. I think that it was well worth adding the extra strapping missing from the kit. Edited August 4, 2021 by Headstock add info. 29 16 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesse Sim Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 G’day all, I’m hoping if someone can help me out, as some of you know I am now building Woolmer Green, just south of Knebworth and I’m wondering if anyone lives around that area and can pay a visit for me? I need some measurements of one of the bridges that spans the railway line. I’m happy to pay for any fuel expenses or can build something in return, wagons are kind of my strong point at the moment. Sorry for Hijacking Tony. Appreciate any help. Jesse 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted August 5, 2021 Author Share Posted August 5, 2021 23 hours ago, thegreenhowards said: Thanks Tony, I probably didn’t explain myself properly. The crank comes preassembled from DCC concepts. I was soldering on the rodding to the crank ends. I used 145 I think although some were done with electrical solder because I forgot my 145 when I went to the club. By low melt, I assume you mean 70C or similar? Will this destroy the bond on the 145? As for why use working point rodding. I think the movement of the rodding will look good at an exhibition and the tactile feel for operating the points will give the operators another dimension. Or the alternative answer may be similar to the Everest answer - ‘because it’s there’. Andy Good morning Andy, Yes, 70 degree solder. Goodness knows which 'bastard' melting point the combination makes, but it's certainly lower than 145 (or electrical solder), and everything falls apart with ease when it's applied by the iron. How do I know this? Years and years of having to un-solder joints when I've got them wrong. Of course, as I alluded to, the unholy mix has to be completely removed from any components before re-soldering takes place. Regards, Tony. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted August 5, 2021 Author Share Posted August 5, 2021 21 hours ago, polybear said: Hi Tony, I've never heard of this before - does adding the low melt somehow "nobble" the 145 solder? Thanks. Kind Regards, Brian It does Brian, See post above, please. Regards, Tony. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted August 5, 2021 Author Share Posted August 5, 2021 14 hours ago, ScRSG said: Not just a case of the "average" temperature of the mix? Good morning Chas, I'm no chemist (nor physicist), but the eventual melting point of my 'fiendish' brew is considerably lower than the average of the various melting point solders. It's as if the low-melt become the dominant 'force' and the bits just fall apart with ease. I've used the combination dozens of times, even to the extent of dismantling a complete etched brass big tender body. Regards, Tony. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium St Enodoc Posted August 5, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 5, 2021 52 minutes ago, Tony Wright said: Good morning Chas, I'm no chemist (nor physicist), but the eventual melting point of my 'fiendish' brew is considerably lower than the average of the various melting point solders. It's as if the low-melt become the dominant 'force' and the bits just fall apart with ease. I've used the combination dozens of times, even to the extent of dismantling a complete etched brass big tender body. Regards, Tony. It's something to do with the "eutectic point" but don't ask me more than that - chemistry A Level was nearly 50 years ago. 1 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gr.king Posted August 5, 2021 Share Posted August 5, 2021 I may not have recalled the exact words, but I think Mr Rice's writings described the resultant combination of metals as something like "a b*stard alloy with zero joint forming ability". 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium t-b-g Posted August 5, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 5, 2021 I am no chemist either but I have a vague recollection, from "only" 45 years ago, of my Chemistry teacher (I was listening Mr. Shaw!) telling us that the reason you couldn't "unmix" an alloy was because the melting point of an alloy was always lower than that of the constituent metals. In my experience, it isn't so much to do with the melting point but more to do with the structure and strength of the mix of low and "normal" melt solders. They seem to form a very brittle material with virtually no mechanical strength and if you do mix the two, you end up with a very weak joint. So if you want a joint that breaks easily, it may well work introducing some low melt. Having said that, I often see people advocating tinning brass/nickel with high melting point solder before attaching whitemetal castings with low melt. Doesn't that introduce a risk of this weak alloy being created as part of the joint, unless your iron is small enough or set at a low enough temperature to not melt the tinning? 1 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted August 5, 2021 Author Share Posted August 5, 2021 Thanks for all the soldering comments. I think it's a case of whatever works for 'you'. Speaking of soldering, or, in fact, the opposite of it.................. The attractively-finished SEF A3 from the widow's collection was 'ruined' by the fitting of a banjo dome. Thus, no interest was generated in its being sold. What to do? Since even the interior of the body was painted, it was difficult to tell if 'detail' bits had been soldered in place or glued, including the dome (if I can get at the interior with an iron, I usually solder such items in place). I thus bit the bullet, grabbed the dome in the jaws of the Xurons, and twisted it. Success! The dome had only been superglued in place, so just came away with ease. The replacement streamlined dome is shown (it's got a bigger 'footprint', so will hide the exposed area with ease), as is the now-useless banjo one. It'll be going off to Geoff Haynes for him to spray the dome with as good a match of paint as he can; it'll then be epoxied back in place, any slight discrepancy in colours being disguised by light weathering. Then, we'll see...................... 19 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Tony Wright Posted August 5, 2021 Author Popular Post Share Posted August 5, 2021 Three friends came over yesterday to run LB, bringing with them a couple of interesting items........ A Nu-Cast ScR 4-4-0, built and painted by Ray Lightfoot. Another LB 'first'. Another 'first' (at least I think so) was this Bachmann Wickham Trolley. It makes an interesting size-comparison with Bytham's more-usual motive power. 29 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium St Enodoc Posted August 5, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 5, 2021 4 minutes ago, Tony Wright said: Another 'first' (at least I think so) was this Bachmann Wickham Trolley. It makes an interesting size-comparison with Bytham's more-usual motive power. Yes, but how fast did it go????? 1 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Chamby Posted August 5, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 5, 2021 2 hours ago, St Enodoc said: Yes, but how fast did it go????? Do you seriously expect it to pull the dynamometer car? 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold MikeParkin65 Posted August 5, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 5, 2021 3 hours ago, Tony Wright said: Three friends came over yesterday to run LB, bringing with them a couple of interesting items........ A Nu-Cast ScR 4-4-0, built and painted by Ray Lightfoot. Another LB 'first'. Love that Caledonian 4-4-0 - oozes character. 3 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted August 5, 2021 Author Share Posted August 5, 2021 1 hour ago, MikeParkin65 said: Love that Caledonian 4-4-0 - oozes character. Thanks for that, Mike, Ray Lightfoot, the builder, was an early contributor to BRM (I photographed much of what he did) and was most-accomplished at model-making. However, in more recent years he's been stricken with a dreadful illness, and I don't think he can make things any more. Regards, Tony. 10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted August 5, 2021 Author Share Posted August 5, 2021 5 hours ago, St Enodoc said: Yes, but how fast did it go????? Not very! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted August 5, 2021 Author Share Posted August 5, 2021 (edited) Of possible interest............. On Sunday, with friends over to run LB, the discussion of the too-red lining on Hornby's latest BR Thompson Pacifics came to the fore. I agree, it is too-red. However, under certain lighting conditions on the real thing.................................... With later, evening light, it can appear 'warmer'. Granted, there are the vagaries of emulsions (these are scanned from the original transparencies) and scanning, but......................... If nothing else, they show that the cab roofs were all-over black and (at least in the case of 60052; the last-surviving A3 in BR service) that valances could be part-black, not all-along green. They also show that the correct 'orange-green-black-green-orange' division of the lining is extremely difficult to distinguish. Who'd be a professional model painter? Please observe copyright restrictions on these images. Edited August 5, 2021 by Tony Wright to add something 11 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mark C Posted August 5, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 5, 2021 1 hour ago, Tony Wright said: Thanks for that, Mike, Ray Lightfoot, the builder, was an early contributor to BRM (I photographed much of what he did) and was most-accomplished at model-making. However, in more recent years he's been stricken with a dreadful illness, and I don't think he can make things any more. Regards, Tony. Back in the day I used to travel long distances just to see Ray's Gedney Drove and still have the magazine article featuring the layout from all those years ago. It was that that finally persuaded me to model the M&GN. Regards Mark 2 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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