Wright writes.....

[Willie Whizz]

On 06/02/2019 at 21:47, Doncaster Green said:

...

On the subject of model shops of the past, a couple of names from my very formative years (age 10-12) spring to mind.   Firstly, a wonderful toy shop in Lincoln called Bycroft's Emporium where I bought a Trix Britannia for 5 guineas, secondly a similar establishment on, I believe, Arkwright Street in Nottingham called Beecrofts (confusing) and, lastly, the model railway section upstairs at Redmayne and Todds, a sports shop, again on Arkwright Street ( if you were into cricket I believe they were the main agents for Gunn and Moore of Nottingham).    I suppose all three would be classed today as box shifters rather than old fashioned model shops but to a railway mad 10 year old they were heaven!

...

 

Blimey, doesn't this thread move fast, I need to start logging-in three times a day at least ...

 

Ah, Beecrofts ... of happy memory to anybody my age in Nottingham  ... though I seem to remember their main toy and model shop as on Drury Hill, a wonderful old street of Georgian shops close by the GCR/GN junction at Weekday Cross, whose loss to make room for the awful Broad Marsh Shopping Centre in the 1970s was one of the greatest acts of 20th Century architectural vandalism in that city, matched only perhaps by the demolition of Watson Fothergill's Black Boy Hotel  to make room for an entirely featureless Littlewoods store.

 

But Beecrofts also had a large stall in the old Central Market until it closed in the early 70s, which had a large glass cabinet containing beautifully-built and painted examples of just about every Airfix kit ever made up to that time - literally dozens and dozens of them, wonderful and inspirational - and all the current range of Dinky Toys.  My Mum went to the Market every Friday there, and what with the models and the Mushy Pea stall she must have spent a small fortune on me ...  Beecrofts did have a small range of model railway stuff in there too IIRC - mainly Hornby Dublo - but for some reason the thing that sticks in my mind is it was the only shop I ever personally saw that actually sold (or at least stocked!) the Hornby Acho range of Continental trains.

 

And then their poetic advertising slogan was:

 

     "When we were Boys

       We bought our toys

       From BEECROFT'S.

      Now we are Men

      - We'll go AGAIN!"

Edited February 7, 2019 by Willie Whizz

[Tony Wright]

10 hours ago, Northmoor said:

Well I've only watched the first 10 minutes so far and am struggling with adequate words to describe what I'm seeing.  Having the camera at a "realistic" height makes so much difference.  It could cruelly show up errors but (apart from the taxi tyres!) I can't spot any.

 

It's also a great advert for not bothering with DCC sound.  Much of the noise of a passing train isn't a hard-working locomotive, it's multiple wheels on rail, which the video captures very well.

 

Rob

That's very kind of you Rob,

 

The camera does pick up the occasional ride-height anomalies in the odd rakes, and the 'waddle' from time to time as locos cross pointwork (just like watching a real A1 take the flat crossing at Retford at speed!), but I'm generally pleased how well the whole scene has stood up to scrutiny. 

 

Thank you for the comment regarding DCC sound (or the lack of necessity of it). The passing trains on LB, to me, make a most-natural mechanical noise - certainly not the whirr-whirr of noisy electric motors/gears (which I won't tolerate) but the audible clatter of metal wheels on metal track. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Chamby]

9 hours ago, Northmoor said:

 

......It's also a great advert for not bothering with DCC sound.  Much of the noise of a passing train isn't a hard-working locomotive, it's multiple wheels on rail, which the video captures very well.

 

Rob

As a DCC sound user, (though a selective one)  I would agree that for a layout like LB, where trains are mostly passing by, DCC sound would add little to the proceedings for much of the activity, with the exception of the whistle/chime of approaching trains, and probably the Deltic.  Hearing the characteristic drone building up in the distance, before DP1 bursts onto the scene would certainly add something! 

 

Sound could also be selectively deployed for the pick-up goods and the stopping services, especially the whistle and chuffing when pulling away from the station.  With a little creativity, these effects could be achieved by means other than DCC, or else by using DCC chips and speakers under the baseboard to give appropriate realistic ‘sound bites’ at the key moments. 

 

Whether you you think it’s worth doing is down to personal taste, I guess.

 

Phil.

[Tony Wright]

10 hours ago, Anglian said:

 

 

Not a problem at all. My input has been immeasurably small!

But nonetheless much-appreciated, and, as such, should have been acknowledged.

 

Many thanks again,

 

Tony. 

[Clem]

9 hours ago, Willie Whizz said:

Blimey, doesn't this thread move fast, I need to start logging-in three times a day at least ...

 

Ah, Beecrofts ... of happy memory to anybody my age in Nottingham  ... though I seem to remember their main toy and model shop as on Drury Hill, a wonderful old street of Georgian shops close by the GCR/GN junction at Weekday Cross, whose loss to make room for the awful Broad Marsh Shopping Centre in the 1970s was one of the greatest acts of 20th Century architectural vandalism in that city, matched only perhaps by the demolition of Watson Fothergill's Black Boy Hotel  to make room for an entirely featureless Littlewoods store.

 

But Beecrofts also had a large stall in the old Central Market until it closed in the early 70s, which had a large glass cabinet containing beautifully-built and painted examples of just about every Airfix kit ever made up to that time - literally dozens and dozens of them, wonderful and inspirational - and all the current range of Dinky Toys.  My Mum went to the Market every Friday there, and what with the models and the Mushy Pea stall she must have spent a small fortune on me ...  Beecrofts did have a small range of model railway stuff in there too IIRC - mainly Hornby Dublo - but for some reason the thing that sticks in my mind is it was the only shop I ever personally saw that actually sold (or at least stocked!) the Hornby Acho range of Continental trains.

 

And then their poetic advertising slogan was:

 

     "When we were Boys

       We bought our toys

       From BEECROFT'S.

      Now we are Men

      - We'll go AGAIN!"

Yes that certainly brings it all back. I think all of those shops you mentioned were visited by me with the exception of Redmayne and Todd (now a cafe!) as I wasn't particularly sporty. Arkwright Street was a long road leading into Nottingham from the South with a wonderful collection of shops where you could get virtually anything. There was a shop called Keva's who bought and sold second hand and where I traded in much of my early model railway stuff for other model railway stuff. In that way I went through the Lone Star OOO baby deltic train-set  , a whole TT layout including Clan Line and a Britannia and all my Triang OO,  as I went through phases on the different gauges. I didn't part with my Hornby Dublo though. A little later in life I did much the same with my LPs at a shop called 'Selectadisc' also on Arkwright Street. The late 1960s architectural vandalism in Nottingham didn't stop at the 'Black Boy'.  Arkwright Street was wiped off the face of the map to be replaced by a 'modern' housing estate. ... And then there's Nottingham Victoria station. replaced by the biggest monstrosity of all... The Victoria Shopping Centre and flats, surely the most ugly thing you'll ever see. Talk about ripping the soul out of city. ... Ah but... Beecroft's on Drury Hill.... mmm

[Tony Wright]

1 minute ago, Chamby said:

As a DCC sound user, (though a selective one)  I would agree that for a layout like LB, where trains are mostly passing by, DCC sound would add little to the proceedings for much of the activity, with the exception of the whistle/chime of approaching trains, and probably the Deltic.  Hearing the characteristic drone building up in the distance, before DP1 bursts onto the scene would certainly add something! 

 

Sound could also be selectively deployed for the pick-up goods and the stopping services, especially the whistle and chuffing when pulling away from the station.  With a little creativity, these effects could be achieved by means other than DCC, or else by using DCC chips and speakers under the baseboard to give appropriate realistic ‘sound bites’ at the key moments. 

 

Whether you you think it’s worth doing is down to personal taste, I guess.

 

Phil.

Thanks Phil,

 

You mention Deltic in the presentation (and the production ones were just as wonderfully-noisy). 

 

Some years ago, a sound-fitted Deltic was tried on LB. Yes, LB (or at least one track) went DCC for a day! It was audibly very disappointing. By the time we'd wound it up to around a scale 100 mph, the mechanical noise of the loco itself, plus that of its all-metal train totally drowned out any characteristic Napier roar. 

 

One assumes that larger speakers can now be fitted.

 

As a last word on DCC sound (at least from me), does anyone else find the current plethora (and I'm using that word in its correct meaning) of DCC sound diesel depot layouts just a little bit 'irritating'? After an hour or so of sitting within clear hearing distance of them at shows, they do get on my nerves. A personal opinion, of course. Some of the modelling is excellent, though whether they'd 'work' in real practice (too cramped?) is a moot point. Some might well be realistic, but, would anyone particularly like to live next door to a real depot? 

 

Anyway, perhaps Clive Mortimer, who knows of such things, might comment. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Jamiel]

Hi Tony

The SLW Class 24 is worth hearing the sound on, I expect here are some others that use the same sound chip and speaker on as well, but that model really stands out to me.

Not a fan of having lots of sound locos all rattling away, but the odd one does add character in my opinion.

Jamie

Edited February 8, 2019 by Jamiel

[Chamby]

24 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

Thanks Phil,

 

You mention Deltic in the presentation (and the production ones were just as wonderfully-noisy). 

 

Some years ago, a sound-fitted Deltic was tried on LB. Yes, LB (or at least one track) went DCC for a day! It was audibly very disappointing. By the time we'd wound it up to around a scale 100 mph, the mechanical noise of the loco itself, plus that of its all-metal train totally drowned out any characteristic Napier roar. 

 

One assumes that larger speakers can now be fitted.

 

As a last word on DCC sound (at least from me), does anyone else find the current plethora (and I'm using that word in its correct meaning) of DCC sound diesel depot layouts just a little bit 'irritating'? After an hour or so of sitting within clear hearing distance of them at shows, they do get on my nerves. A personal opinion, of course. Some of the modelling is excellent, though whether they'd 'work' in real practice (too cramped?) is a moot point. Some might well be realistic, but, would anyone particularly like to live next door to a real depot? 

 

Anyway, perhaps Clive Mortimer, who knows of such things, might comment. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

There are some very nice deltic sound files around now, and some very effective speaker installations too.  But at high speed, the dominant sound close-up will still be the metal wheelsets clattering by.  Over distance though, in real life, the longer wavelength of the Napier drone travels much farther... not easy to replicate in model form.  Some things don’t scale down well!

 

I agree with you about diesel MPD layouts.  Diesel sounds are simpler to replicate than the subtleties of steam, and there is more room in the bodies to install bigger or multiple speakers.   MPD’s are popular because they provide a high density of slow moving traction in a modest space.  In an exhibition hall however it can (and usually does) become an overbearing cacophony for everyone else.  Operators tend to forget that pressing F1 turns the sound off, having multiple locomotives just sat idling endlessly is not a nice sound.

 

At home, I usually drive my sound fitted locomotives for a while but turn the sound off if running the train for any length of time on a continuous run.  Less is definitely more, sometimes!

 

Phil.

Edited February 8, 2019 by Chamby
Added a point.

[Re6/6]

16 minutes ago, Chamby said:

 In an exhibition hall however it can (and usually does) become an overbearing cacophony for everyone else.  Operators tend to forget that pressing F1 turns the sound off, having multiple locomotives just sat idling endlessly is not a nice sound.

35 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

As a last word on DCC sound (at least from me), does anyone else find the current plethora (and I'm using that word in its correct meaning) of DCC sound diesel depot layouts just a little bit 'irritating'? After an hour or so of sitting within clear hearing distance of them at shows, they do get on my nerves.

I do so agree. Since the coming of DCC sound, on a couple of occasions I've been unfortunately placed next to one of these layouts and they frankly drove me nuts! One show, a large national exhibition, I asked them to turn things down a bit to no avail, and was forced to complain to the show manager who 'ordered' them to turn it right down. They complied for a while then up went the sound again! What is it with these people?

[Tony Wright]

Firstly,

 

Many thanks for all the kind comments on the moving footage of Little Bytham.

 

Secondly,

 

The SE Finecast K3 mentioned recently is now complete and ready to despatch to Geoff Haynes for painting. 

 

Prior to delivery to its owner, I'll install the DCC decoder (ugh!), and he can then programme it to his satisfaction. At the moment it works perfectly, but I heartily dislike then altering wires, always risking the chance that what was once a 'perfect' runner is potentially compromised because of the need to install some electronic gadgetry. Believe me, it's happened - hasn't it Tom? 

 

Even though this must well be over the 500th loco I've built down the decades (still loads behind the likes of Mike Edge), I still get a real feeling of happiness when it's complete (even though, prior to a thorough wash, it's a bit scabby). It looks like what it should do and runs perfectly. I know it's not for all, and I appreciate this fact, but, to me, it sure beats just opening RTR boxes, no matter how pretty the contents inside might look.

 

 

The valve gear is simplified, of course, but reasonably representative. 

 

[Doncaster Green]

3 hours ago, Clem said:

Yes that certainly brings it all back. I think all of those shops you mentioned were visited by me with the exception of Redmayne and Todd (now a cafe!) as I wasn't particularly sporty. Arkwright Street was a long road leading into Nottingham from the South with a wonderful collection of shops where you could get virtually anything. There was a shop called Keva's who bought and sold second hand and where I traded in much of my early model railway stuff for other model railway stuff. In that way I went through the Lone Star OOO baby deltic train-set  , a whole TT layout including Clan Line and a Britannia and all my Triang OO,  as I went through phases on the different gauges. I didn't part with my Hornby Dublo though. A little later in life I did much the same with my LPs at a shop called 'Selectadisc' also on Arkwright Street. The late 1960s architectural vandalism in Nottingham didn't stop at the 'Black Boy'.  Arkwright Street was wiped off the face of the map to be replaced by a 'modern' housing estate. ... And then there's Nottingham Victoria station. replaced by the biggest monstrosity of all... The Victoria Shopping Centre and flats, surely the most ugly thing you'll ever see. Talk about ripping the soul out of city. ... Ah but... Beecroft's on Drury Hill.... mmm

My memories of old Nottingham are a bit hazy so I may well have Beecroft's location wrong.   I didn't live in the city but in a small town about 20 miles away and visits to the metropolis were about every 6 to 8 weeks accompanying 'Mother on a mission"!   At the time she was a secretary to our local Junior school and was usually headed to Sisson & Parker, who held the NCC contract for school stationery, to sample the goods and give them an order.   She later qualified as a lecturer in 'Office Skills' (shorthand and typing in those days) at Trent College before it was even Trent Poly let alone Nottingham Trent University.   I left the area to go to college before the real vandalism started and have only been back a couple of times in the last 50 years, although my brother still lives in the area and gives me chapter and verse on the latest (mis)developments.

 

Regards

 

John

 

[MEGair]

Tony, I was disappointed with the video. 

 

Prototypical running, with prototypical engines, trains, rolling stock in a real location, though in model form.  Then correct lamps, correct movements, working signals, figures to boot.  Only thing missing was that horse they would use to shunt wagons in the sidings.

 

Now that I got that out of the way, what's not to like.  I enjoyed your description and had to stop and go back over some footage just to take it in.

You may have covered this before Tony. What and how have you come up with the roster/timetable?  You mentioned 1958. Is it following a specific time/day or period?

 

I have both DC (100apx) and DCC (6) and agree that after 10-15 minutes I have had enough of the sound and turn it off.  The outside track is changed over by toggle switch. 

 

I have just returned from 3 hours of running trains to a timetable with bell codes and waybills, etc.  It is not prototypical, but gives a very good experience.  And yes I am a learner.  I am aiming to introduce a running sequence on my layout.  I have 17 trains. Coach sets are 8-9 and Freight ranges from 7 to 32 wagons.  So any thoughts and advice is welcome.

 

Mark

[Clive Mortimore]

3 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Thanks Phil,

 

You mention Deltic in the presentation (and the production ones were just as wonderfully-noisy). 

 

Some years ago, a sound-fitted Deltic was tried on LB. Yes, LB (or at least one track) went DCC for a day! It was audibly very disappointing. By the time we'd wound it up to around a scale 100 mph, the mechanical noise of the loco itself, plus that of its all-metal train totally drowned out any characteristic Napier roar. 

 

One assumes that larger speakers can now be fitted.

 

As a last word on DCC sound (at least from me), does anyone else find the current plethora (and I'm using that word in its correct meaning) of DCC sound diesel depot layouts just a little bit 'irritating'? After an hour or so of sitting within clear hearing distance of them at shows, they do get on my nerves. A personal opinion, of course. Some of the modelling is excellent, though whether they'd 'work' in real practice (too cramped?) is a moot point. Some might well be realistic, but, would anyone particularly like to live next door to a real depot? 

 

Anyway, perhaps Clive Mortimer, who knows of such things, might comment. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Hello Tony

 

As a builder of a few diesel depots and I experimented with sound before on-board sound was must have thing I am in your camp. I hate depots with that barrage of noise being fired at the audience. My views on diesel depot layouts are well known within DEMU. 

 

Most have unworkable track plans. Most are basically poor copies of the better ones without any research. I really like the Bachmann two road diesel shed. It is a composite of the two buildings found at Ebbw Junction and would be easy to convert to either one. It is a Western region design. So far I have not been aware of anyone building Ebbw Junction using the Bachmann building. I have seen models that reportedly are of a locomotive depot in Scotland with it plonked on.  To me that is as bad as a Gresley buffet car in the middle of an HST formation. I could go on for hours. Hopefully the On Shed bookzines by Alex (18B on here)  will help future depot modellers.

[Tony Wright]

1 hour ago, MEGair said:

Tony, I was disappointed with the video. 

 

Prototypical running, with prototypical engines, trains, rolling stock in a real location, though in model form.  Then correct lamps, correct movements, working signals, figures to boot.  Only thing missing was that horse they would use to shunt wagons in the sidings.

 

Now that I got that out of the way, what's not to like.  I enjoyed your description and had to stop and go back over some footage just to take it in.

You may have covered this before Tony. What and how have you come up with the roster/timetable?  You mentioned 1958. Is it following a specific time/day or period?

 

I have both DC (100apx) and DCC (6) and agree that after 10-15 minutes I have had enough of the sound and turn it off.  The outside track is changed over by toggle switch. 

 

I have just returned from 3 hours of running trains to a timetable with bell codes and waybills, etc.  It is not prototypical, but gives a very good experience.  And yes I am a learner.  I am aiming to introduce a running sequence on my layout.  I have 17 trains. Coach sets are 8-9 and Freight ranges from 7 to 32 wagons.  So any thoughts and advice is welcome.

 

Mark

Thank you Mark,

 

I chose the summer of 1958 for a variety of reasons. It was my own high-summer of trainspotting at Retford and Doncaster, during the August before I started senior school. LB Station was closed and demolished in the summer of 1959, and the M&GNR bit was closed and lifted by the spring of '59. 

 

I have the BR passenger TT from the summer of '58, the BR carriage working diagrams for the same period, and the appropriate WTTs. 

 

A sequence is run, consisting over over 65 train movements. Some trains have more than one movement - a pick-up, for instance, arrives, shunts and departs (three movements), whilst the through trains are just one. What I've done is 'select' the trains to make/run. For instance, the Down morning departures from Kings Cross to Edinburgh are represented by the Talisman and the Flying Scotsman. There is no Down Elizabethan - that's an Up working. There is no Up Morning Talisman, but I've modelled the afternoon one, and so on. 

 

I know some have a model of a rake and use it for both Up and Down workings (where there are two sets), but I think that's a bit 'daft'. For instance, dependent on the year, one of the Lizzie sets had a Gresley RF in it rather than the usual Thompson RF. And, what about the Queen of Scots? The Leeds-only pair of cars were almost always at the front of the train, Up or Down. No good then, just reversing the direction. 

 

Obviously, I can only produce a small selection of the actual trains, but, at least it's representative. What it has meant is lots and lots of kit-building over more than four decades! 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Edited February 8, 2019 by Tony Wright
to clarify a point

[APOLLO]

Back in 1992 on a VERY cold, cold day I was called out  early morning to the wonderfully named Slutchers Lane in Warrington (still a good spot for train pix). Alongside where I was called to was Arpley Loco stabling point with a dozen or so Class 20's etc merry whistling away, engines running to avoid freezing up / starting problems. This place is only a couple of hundred yards from town centre also.

 

Springs Branch was similarly noisy in winter, and there (still) are quite a few houses behind also. Nothing unprototypical about a lot of din around a diesel depot !!!!!!

 

Not a DCC user myself, and have to agree that anyone trying the above at an exhibition needs lynching !!!

 

I bought an almost new Atlas O scale six axle twin motor twin flywheel fitted SD40 a while ago (ebay bargain).  She is a very smooth  and almost silent runner but very powerful loco - couplings will break before she will stall.  As she makes hardly any noise when pulling hard it's nice to hear the clickety clack of the trains wheels though.

 

Brit15

 

 

Edited February 8, 2019 by APOLLO

[LNERandBR]

In my opinion, it's silly to have large numbers of sound fitted locos stood idalling. It makes it difficult to hear the one your actually moving.

 

Wherver possible with Deeping Lane I try to only have one loco atually 'running' at a time. There are one or two shuting movements where you do have to keep a couple running but thats only due to the locos in question only being stationary for a short period before moving again. Shutting down and starting up would therefore cause long pauses in movement.

 

I'm very picky, stabled locos must be shut down and sound must be turned off when a loco is in the Fiddle Yard. The same being true of all my layouts.

 

As for steam sound, its improving but I do find locos sound wrong at high speed. For slow speed like shunting sound adds an extra dimension. Although half the trouble is driving so engines coast instead of 'puffing to a stand' which is just plain wrong and something I really hate. Again, more recent sound projects are far better in this respect and easier to produce realistic coasting.

[jamie92208]

3 hours ago, APOLLO said:

Back in 1992 on a VERY cold, cold day I was called out  early morning to the wonderfully named Slutchers Lane in Warrington (still a good spot for train pix). Alongside where I was called to was Arpley Loco stabling point with a dozen or so Class 20's etc merry whistling away, engines running to avoid freezing up / starting problems. This place is only a couple of hundred yards from town centre also.

 

Springs Branch was similarly noisy in winter, and there (still) are quite a few houses behind also. Nothing unprototypical about a lot of din around a diesel depot !!!!!!

 

Not a DCC user myself, and have to agree that anyone trying the above at an exhibition needs lynching !!!

 

I bought an almost new Atlas O scale six axle twin motor twin flywheel fitted SD40 a while ago (ebay bargain).  She is a very smooth  and almost silent runner but very powerful loco - couplings will break before she will stall.  As she makes hardly any noise when pulling hard it's nice to hear the clickety clack of the trains wheels though.

 

Brit15

 

 

Knottingley had problems as, IIRC, the 56's weren't filled with anti freeze so over Christmas they were all left running and the residents of the Warwick estate complained.  (Personally anything could improve the environment that most had created for themselves).   The solution was to move all the locos to the siding that later became the National Power depot at the old Ferrybridge B site.   The long line of 56's looked and sounded quite good.  I always liked the sound of a 56 digging in to start a long MGR.   However I concur with all the comments above about DCC sound on depot layouts.  I went to a show at Bradford a few years ago and you could hear one such layout before you got into that particular hall.   I have had several owners tell me that they can't switch the sound off or turn it down.

 

Jamie

[Atso]

6 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Firstly,

 

Many thanks for all the kind comments on the moving footage of Little Bytham.

 

Secondly,

 

The SE Finecast K3 mentioned recently is now complete and ready to despatch to Geoff Haynes for painting. 

 

Prior to delivery to its owner, I'll install the DCC decoder (ugh!), and he can then programme it to his satisfaction. At the moment it works perfectly, but I heartily dislike then altering wires, always risking the chance that what was once a 'perfect' runner is potentially compromised because of the need to install some electronic gadgetry. Believe me, it's happened - hasn't it Tom? 

 

Even though this must well be over the 500th loco I've built down the decades (still loads behind the likes of Mike Edge), I still get a real feeling of happiness when it's complete (even though, prior to a thorough wash, it's a bit scabby). It looks like what it should do and runs perfectly. I know it's not for all, and I appreciate this fact, but, to me, it sure beats just opening RTR boxes, no matter how pretty the contents inside might look.

 

 

The valve gear is simplified, of course, but reasonably representative. 

 

 

What a lovely looking K3 Tony. I'm always amazed that, for a 'group standard' class of locomotive, just how many variations there were!

 

If I may be so bold, it appears that there might be a little swarf left over where you've drilled out the front lifting holes.

[grahame]

5 hours ago, Clive Mortimore said:

Hello Tony

 

As a builder of a few diesel depots and I experimented with sound before on-board sound was must have thing I am in your camp. I hate depots with that barrage of noise being fired at the audience. 

 

Yep, droning diesels on depot layouts is a no-no, but I also find the chuf-chuf chuffing on steam shed layouts is tiresome and so too the ding, ding, dinging of layouts featuring sound signalling. But worse is the clang, clang, cleaning of level crossings on American outline layouts, especially when they go off continuously and you are operating a layout close by. By far my worst model railway sound experience.

 

G

[60027Merlin]

Tony,

 

Having watched the video in two parts, yesterday and finishing off today, if asked by a non railway modeller as to what the hobby is about all I need to do now is refer them to have a look at this video on You Tube.

 

The layout has now come to life with all the recent details/buildings etc. added in the past year or so. It is now the “real McCoy” in miniature especially with the low angle camera views which remind me of the train spotting days when being so close to the action on the ECML.  

 

Great work by you and your friends.

 

With less layout work now required perhaps you will use this additional free time by building even more Gresley and Peppercorn pacifics to fill the gaps?

 

Eric

 

[Izzy]

I find with sound the problem is one of not being able to separate sound(s) by distance, as is usually the case in real life. So running just a single loco, steam or diesel, is okay and does add to the feeling of driving it, especially on a small layout like all mine have been, but while another ‘sounding’ at the same time is bearable, any more and for me it all becomes just intrusive  ‘white noise’, as if I am trying to listen to many records playing at the same time, which is of course exactly that......there is no distance separation to distinguish one from another, or mute one in relation to another.

 

A while ago I just stopped going to exhibitions because of the unending noise of multiple locos on multiple layouts which just seemed to pervade the shows. All I got was a headache.  Thankfully levels seem to have been toned down in more recent times. 

 

Izzy

[CF MRC]

On CF, we have a video of the Ladykillers out-takes playing at the Gasworks Tunnel end.   The sound produces some prototypical background fill in and, of course, the images are stunning. Thrumming, throbbing, whistling diesel depots are not my forte, but each to there own, especially if they keep the sound down. 

 

Tim

[CF MRC]

On CF, we have a video of the Ladykillers out-takes playing at the Gasworks Tunnel end.   The sound produces some prototypical background fill in and, of course, the images are stunning. Thrumming, throbbing, whistling diesel depots are not my forte, but each to there own, especially if they keep the sound down. 

 

Tim

[Blandford1969]

For steam sounds, and it is no criticism as most have not driven a steam engine there is not necessarily an understanding of when to use the different sounds. Take running round a train for example you would give probably a couple of 'chufs' as it were, then roll to your run round point, and then the same when running round steam is not on the whole time. However I'm sure many enjoy and never even notice.

[drmditch]

On 06/02/2019 at 15:45, Clem said:

That's right. To illustrate this, I'm just building a Parkside LNER cattle wagon. I think it's been a bit of controversial subject after Oxford Rail put out a 9 foot wheelbase version in BR colours when according to the writings of several people, none made it. But Peter Tatlow contradicts this in his set of books on LNER wagons stating that the 9 foot version did but also saying that no 10 foot wheelbase ones made it past 1947.  So who do you believe?

 In fact Steve Banks who has done a thorough article on them has suggested that Peter has now admitted that his data may have got a little mixed up and muddled on that particular wagon. But this illustrates your point.

BTW I'm modifying the kit giving the wagon a 10 foot wheelbase with AVB to run on my layout set BR early to mid 50s.  I'm looking at a picture of one the last survivors of this version in 1963 so I'm reasonably confident that it's correct.

If you look on my modelling thread on the LNER Forum, 'Make do and Mend', for the last four or so pages, you will see illustrated accounts of using the Parkside kit and the Oxford model to produce 10' wheelbase  versions, using information from Mr Banks' website. You will also see an ex-GN cattle wagon produced from the Parkside kit. I think there is a picture of that higher up in this thread as well. One experiment I have not yet done is to try to produce a 9' version with 'sag'. Might be difficult to make that convincing!

 

Since I model the pre-1948 LNER, I need LMS cattle vans as well, and am just finishing another one from the Parkside kit for Dia 1661. This is quite useful for producing variants. I seem to have been having a 'cattle wagon' phase for the last year or so!

 

Sorry for not including links/pictures. I'm writing this on my Android 'phone while experiencing a power cut, and will try to edit it later!

 

Re: Motor size and gearboxes. I have only made about a dozen locomotives, all of which have required reliable and slow running. All the dashing about with big wheels stuff gets left to re-worked RTR engines. (Shock horror!). As Tony says, the biggest motor that can be fitted is sensible. I always use a gearbox with the most reduction I can find and fit. Q6s,Q7s and even little old J21s and a J54 need good reliable power at low speed.

 

One day, when I grow up, I will have to build a 'big engine'. The way things are going it will probably have to be a V2.

 

The power has just come back on. Just time to paint the interior of a cattle wagon before bedtime. Painted to look like bare wood of course. Can't have cattle licking all that nasty lead paint!