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Tony Wright

Wright writes.....

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3 hours ago, 31A said:

B1 etc. tenders.

 

As the person who supplied the picture of the Hornby tenders in the Eastwood Town thread, I have an interest.  I don't believe Hornby would have got it wrong on a modern model.  The Bachmann B1 tender has a representation  of the entrance to the 'tunnel' on the front, again on the driver's side.  I have an Isinglass drawing of various LNER GS tenders, but can't find it at the moment.

 

Anyway, in the RCTS Green Book (Vol 2B) the tenders attached to B1s are described.  The first few (originally numbered 8301-10 and 1010/1) had 'a slot in the arch of the front plate at the fireman's side to take the fire irons', i.e. the fireirons went on top, similar to earlier LNER tenders.

 

Nos. 1012-37: "A large toolbox was provided above the coal gate, with a smaller one alongside it on the fireman's side.  On the opposite side was a tunnel for the fire irons .... ".

 

It then mentions that 1038/9 had second hand tenders.

 

Nos. 1040 onwards, i.e. the majority.  "The tenders were similar above the running plate to those attached to nos. 1012-1037 .... ".  It then goes on to describe various detail differences, none of which affect the fire irons.

 

It then describes that 61105/49/65 also had second hand tenders.

 

I'm sure I have read (but typically can't remember where) that the fire iron tunnel was deliberately put on the driver's side to make it easier for the fireman to get the tools in and out.  Never having been a fireman I can't really comment but would imagine if the tunnel / rack was on the fireman's side perhaps he would have to cross to the driver's side in order to swing them round onto a rack on his own side?  Also I think there might have been more risk of getting the fire irons outside the cab, 'out of gauge' and possibly with overhead electrification in mind, a tunnel would have meant less risk of catching the overhead wires?

 

 

 

It's not getting the fireirons out which is the problem - it's putting them away when the end is red hot.....

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Just checked the B1 drawing, fireiron tunnel is on the Driver's side.

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4 hours ago, Headstock said:

 

Good morning Mick,

 

I too used the old Blacksmith Thompson Deal van as a basis for a model some years ago. Like you I replaced the underframe with the MJT floorpan and also the other under gubbins. I  also used the MJT the roof, though I recall the latter was cut in half down the centreline and rejoined to get the correct width over the cornice, the deal vans were narrow beasties.

 

The change of underframe was rather appropriate on the model, as the real BG on which mine is based was original a Gresley teak BG. The body was destroyed by enemy action, at Marylebone during the war. The deal body was brand new, placed on the original underframe that was salvaged from the wreck.

 

Thompson Deal BG.jpg

Andrew,

 

My one, had a Vac formed Plastic roof in the box. It was the only roof I could find that actually fitted the ends, hence after a small  fight it surrendered and was fitted.

 

I would never have thought of cutting a MJT roof ( which I have in stock) in half etc , It does'nt sound a easy job to do, how do you fit the sides back together ?

 

thanks

 

Mick

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Posted (edited)
49 minutes ago, micklner said:

Andrew,

 

My one, had a Vac formed Plastic roof in the box. It was the only roof I could find that actually fitted the ends, hence after a small  fight it surrendered and was fitted.

 

I would never have thought of cutting a MJT roof ( which I have in stock) in half etc , It does'nt sound a easy job to do, how do you fit the sides back together ?

 

thanks

 

Mick

 

Afternoon Mick,

 

there is a rebate that runs the length of the underside of the MJT roof, this is to allow you to drill for the roof vents in a straight line. I just sawed the roof in two along the length of the rebate. I then filed back what was left of the rebate so that the two roof halves sat on each side of the body, with a gap between them. I joined the two sides together with 20 thou plasticard strips curved and superglued to the underside of the roof. The assemblage was fixed in place while the plasticard was fitted in place from below. Once I was happy, I glued some longitudinal strips into the gap from above and topped up with filler. Finally, when all was dry and cured, I filed and rubbed down the roof to a smooth finish and drilled out for the roof vents. Bobs your uncle, a perfect fit. The roof was finished flush with the ends and a separate end strip added and blended in with the roof.

 

My kit came with a bit of brass sheet, formed into a roof shape that didn't fit and certainly not of an LNER profile. I still have it, it may come in useful one day.

Edited by Headstock
clarification
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6 hours ago, 60027Merlin said:

Re the B1 fire irons storage tunnel, here is a photo at Haymarket in 1958 and if you can zoom in you will be able to see the part of the handle on the drivers side.

 

Please observe copyright restrictions as it is not my photo!

 

Eric

 

Just checked this on here and could not zoom in close enough however I have the photo on My Pictures in the Windows set up and it is better to zoom in there if anyone interested can copy it across.

My computer knowledge is pretty basic but hopefully this can be copied to Windows from here!

 

1037000030_61221HaymarketMPD1958.jpg.773f6ee38727b228c90b77912b820f35.jpg

Hi Eric

 

Lovely photo of the B1 at Haymarket, and some good detail behind the locomotive of the side walls to the two roads for the coaling tower wagons.

 

Thank you for posting it.

 

Regards

 

David

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Thought I would mention that  as the regular pilot loco operator on the 'B'mth West'  exhibition layout

the Preci Models DCC auto uncoupler has proved invaluable and very reliable in service -  it's usually

operator error when there is a cock up - Roger also has some passenger coach rakes fitted with the

James Trains straight bars. 

Would thoroughly recommend both, usual disclaimer applies.

Regards,keep safe everybody,

 

Chris Knight

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13 hours ago, St Enodoc said:

They don't look right to me at all, Trevor and Andy. They are very "chunky" and the Instanter loop is way too big in comparison to the other links and the drawhooks. Sorry.

Thanks for your honest appraisal - that’s what I was looking for. I certainly agree that the coupling hooks are too small and, on reflection, I can see that the instanter is too big. However, I think the 3 links, at least, are a big improvement on tension locks, so I will go for another batch of them on the basis that I’m never going to fit proposer 3 links to all my mineral wagons.

 

Andy

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The Handrail bend that is bent around the vertical pipe on the smokebox look's very neat ,And awkward. I would have had about 6 attempt's at that.

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48 minutes ago, dibateg said:

Its worth working from the GA  Jamie - that's what I did when I added Griffin motion to my JLTRT 4F. I recall it was a bloomin' fiddle though! As you can see, it's all a bit tight on the crank axle, so I thinned the webs down quite a lot.

DSCF3428.JPG.1e4035f98c2f2357005af41967d76f24.JPG
 

Regards

Tony

Thanks very much for the photo Tony, that looks lovely.   I will also thin the webs down as it is tight in 32FS.  However that photo is very very helpful.   What size are those bolts that hold the straps onto the con rods please. Also did you actually set it in gear so that the valves move.

 

Jamie

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Posted (edited)
15 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Well, the D16/3 is finished........................

 

1723187262_D16315.jpg.5076202955918eaab1b7570c8466c8a8.jpg

 

I plotted the positions of the handrails and vacuum ejector pipe, taking measurements with spring dividers, from the Little Engines drawing and photographs. 

 

Usually, cast metal boilers have dimples for handrail pillars, though they're often in the wrong place. 

 

344661103_D16316.jpg.faa676319c980e69b1b3257be7b446f8.jpg

 

I always find making the continuous handrail in a rising arc over the smokebox front a real fiddle. This was no exception!

 

1052821325_D16317.jpg.3e30a243f8fdf5950deecbc4aa514eeb.jpg

 

Just detailing to do now. The chimney and dome came from the Blacksmiths kit. I had three chimneys (two from the Blacksmith kit and one from the Little Engines one). None seemed dead right, and I've an idea that this one might be a trifle tall (though the other two looked too 'dumpy'). I'll live with it for a while before I paint it.

 

597348712_D16318.jpg.c1ae411f84949abaa381191624310eb8.jpg

 

Complete and ready for the paintshop (in unlined BR black). 

 

Much cleaning up will happen, though I doubt if it'll prevent my soldering still looking like a relief map of the moon! 

 

Though 'old-fashioned', the decorative valances give this loco an elegance; an elegance from a bygone time. 

 

I still have all the bits left to make another hybrid D16/3, but one without the valancing. 

 

Al in all about 20 hours' work, spread over three non-consecutive days (though the frames were made last week). 

 

The pile of kits left to build is still substantial!

Tony - the D16/3 looks excellent. Did you use Romford 27mm driving wheels as they didn't make 7ft diameter wheels if my memory serves me right?

 

I have a Crownline D16/3 to make one day. It will be the green 8900 Claud Hamilton (and I managed to resist buying the Hornby version of that, although I did buy a black one as it was such a good model). I have a set of Maygib 7ft diameter wheels for it,  although they are 22 spoke, which i'm not particularly looking forward to using! 

 

It seems the old Romford 27mm 20 spoke are probably the best fit but where to get them? They are also almost the perfect wheel for GC locos: B2, B3, D10, D11, so I could do with at least 5 axles worth if only I could get them.

 

I think you are correct about the chimney it does look too tall. A B1 chimney is the right one to use. I often end up using chimneys on kits I've sourced elsewhere because they are so important to get right.

 

Andrew

Edited by Woodcock29
Add comment re chimney, correct no!
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4 hours ago, Woodcock29 said:

Tony - the D16/3 looks excellent. Did you use Romford 27mm driving wheels as they didn't make 7ft diameter wheels if my memory serves me right?

 

I have a Crownline D16/3 to make one day. It will be the green 6900 Claud Hamilton (and I managed to resist buying the Hornby version of that, although I did buy a black one as it was such a good model). I have a set of Maygib 7ft diameter wheels for it,  although they are 22 spoke, which i'm not particularly looking forward to using! 

 

It seems the old Romford 27mm 20 spoke are probably the best fit but where to get them? They are also almost the perfect wheel for GC locos: B2, B3, D10, D11, so I could do with at least 5 axles worth if only I could get them.

 

I think you are correct about the chimney it does look too tall. A B1 chimney is the right one to use. I often end up using chimneys on kits I've sourced elsewhere because they are so important to get right.

 

Andrew

 

On my B3, I have used the wheels that Markits sell as LNER Pacific wheels. They are 20 spoke and about right size over the flange. Close enough not to worry me anyway! These were purchased direct from Markits a couple of months ago, new stock having arrived.

 

The D16 with the round top firebox and old footplate is an unusual beast! They remind me of some of the GWR 4-4-0 rebuilds, with features from different eras. I am not 100% sure about the cab roof on the model. It looks a little wide to me with too much overhang but it isn't a class I have studied in any depth and I may well be wrong.

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20 hours ago, St Enodoc said:

Yes Trevor, I do use the Bachmann pipes but I'm not too happy with them as they sometimes have a tendency to flex a bit or even pull out. In due course I'll probably replace them, either with Roco-style couplers or with solid bars.

 

I have settled on Kadee couplers for use within my coach rakes, but with the tails removed.  I find them reliable, unobtrusive and critically they still allow individual coaches to be simply lifted in or out of rakes in the fiddle yard as required.  

 

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Jamie - JLTRT 4F - the screws are steel, I think they are 14BA. I get mine from BA bolts:-

https://www.ba-bolts.co.uk/

The loco is set in gear, which is obviously set by the position of the weighshaft. You can just about see the valve spindles move when the loco is in motion...

DSCF3865.JPG.2f68c6166b6604cb48b4405531cb0cd4.JPG

 

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12 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

 

I always find making the continuous handrail in a rising arc over the smokebox front a real fiddle. 

 

 

 

Reassuring that it's not just me then!

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1 hour ago, t-b-g said:

 

I am not 100% sure about the cab roof on the model. It looks a little wide to me with too much overhang but it isn't a class I have studied in any depth and I may well be wrong.

 

If it is the cab roof from the Little Engines kit that could well be the case as the engines which retained the decorative valencing also retained the original narrower cab, whereas the ones with rebuilt foot plating were also given a wider cab, similar to a B12/3.  See difference between cab front and rear splashers (or lack of in this case).

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1 hour ago, Chamby said:

 

I have settled on Kadee couplers for use within my coach rakes, but with the tails removed.  I find them reliable, unobtrusive and critically they still allow individual coaches to be simply lifted in or out of rakes in the fiddle yard as required.  

 

Phil, with Bachmann Mk1s or other coaches with a cam-operated close-coupling system you need a rigid connection between the coaches, otherwise the cam mechanism doesn't work properly.

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1 hour ago, Tony Wright said:

a further mm might well have caused problems with clearances inside the splashers.

I've always used Romford wheels one size smaller than scale for exactly that reason. Prototype wheels would vary by at least that anyway between new and scrapping diameters.

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1 hour ago, 31A said:

 

If it is the cab roof from the Little Engines kit that could well be the case as the engines which retained the decorative valencing also retained the original narrower cab, whereas the ones with rebuilt foot plating were also given a wider cab, similar to a B12/3.  See difference between cab front and rear splashers (or lack of in this case).

 

That would account for it. It isn't easy to tell when model photos and prototype photos are not from the same angle. 

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