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Wright writes.....


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I currently have the fun issue of working on 3 projects (for fun) my main railway and two small projects.

 

The amount I cannot get is very surprising.

 

Big layout

DMUs Had to build a GRCW 119, building a Swindon 120

Carriages need a few 2C got 4 so far

Wagons  OK

 

Small 3 counties area ex MR line in BR WR times

Locos of 4 wanted, 1 kit, 1 heavy kit bash, 2 expensive RTR, or a kit and a detail on old model

Carriages, need 3 types, kits of 2, 1 none but will ignore

Wagons OK as just a few vans

 

Small Cornish branch

Locos got them as 45xx

Carriages, building a couple of late non corridors from bits and a kit Sunshine.

Wagons, lot of Airfix based BUT need a scratch a common hopper

 

So I am having to scratch a DMU

Build a loco from various sources

Build 2 carriages from various sources

Build a few wagons of a common type with no kit or RTR

 

Looks like we will always need to make models.

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5 hours ago, sandra said:

Tony,

 

The Southern 4-6-0 is of course a Drummond T14 also known as a Paddlebox or rather strangely, a Double Breaster! Both these nicknames came about from the enormous splashers over the driving wheels of the original Drummond design. However they were rebuilt by both Urie and Maunsell to produce the locomotive which is the subject of the Nucast kit. They were the most successful of the Drummond 4-6-0s and they lasted for nearly 40 years. One was destroyed in the bombing of Nine Elms during the war.

 

I must say that purely on looks alone they are impressive machines and I do think there would be a market for a model of them for three did survive into BR days. Another consideration is that there is never likely to be an RTR model of one. The danger for a kit manufacturer is that they produce a kit and soon afterwards an RTR model is announced. I thing that is extremely unlikely with the T14.

 

Would I buy one? The answer is no because I already have an old Nucast one to build which I do at some point intend to get round to finishing. I do think one would look great running through Retford with, say, the down Talisman, or would that be sacrilege?

 

Sandra

'I do think one would look great running through Retford with, say, the down Talisman, or would that be sacrilege?'

 

It's now your trainset Sandra, so you can please yourself. It would be interesting to think what Roy would have made of it, however.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Edited by Tony Wright
typo error
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I have often found RTR manufacturers' choices of prototypes surprising.  Ignoring the faults with the models that we know now, what about the following?

  • Hornby Class 29; a very small class with a short life which only ran in in a limited area in Scotland.  At least if they'd made the Class 21 (before the rebuild), unsuccessful though they were, they had a slightly longer life and bigger geographical coverage.  
  • Lima (and now Bachmann) Class 117 DMU; these barely operated outside the Paddington suburban area for most of their working lives.  If they'd chosen the Class 116 - which admittedly had more variants - it could cover the Cardiff Valleys, the West Midlands and the Central Belt of Scotland.
  • Hornby introduced the LNER B17 long before anyone made a B1, a larger class with longer lives and wider operation.
  • Why did it take so long for the WD 2-8-0 to be introduced by Bachmann?  For years, it was runaway winner of the wish-lists, a very large class which apparently ran almost everywhere.
  • How long after Lima's erm, "model" of the GWR 94xx (good body, chassis best not mentioned in polite company), did Bachmann's appear?  This was a large class with wide geographical operation across the Western Region.
  • Are EMUs really such poor sellers, so manufacturers are reluctant to produce them?

Perhaps I've previously answered this question myself.  A lot of modellers are actually locomotive collectors and what they really want is a collection of varied locomotives, including all the rare cops of their youth.  They don't necessarily want to model a real railway on which 90% of the trains were the same, day after day.

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6 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Thanks for showing this,

 

It does seem to be a bargain. 

 

Off-hand, I don't know what the bogie wheelbase is on a Raven A2, but I imagine it'll be similar to an A3/A4, so a Comet bogie will probably do. 

 

The bogie wheels supplied in the DJH kit are the wrong type - having ten-spokes rather than the typical NER 12. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

According to RCTS Vol 2A, bogie wheelbase for the Raven A2 was 6'6". Gresley A1 and A3 was 6'3".

Doncaster seems to have preferred the smaller dimension, (Pacifics and B17 and even B1), and Darlington the larger (B16, D49)

 

I don't know whether 1mm will make much difference to you - especially when trying to get the 'bowling alley' to go round corners.

 

Do you know if the A2 kit is reasonably dimensionaly correct?

I still hanker after a Z(C7), but don't know whether to trust the DJH kit!

 

 

 

 

 

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53 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

'I do think one would look great running through Retford with, say, the down Talisman, or would that be sacrilege?'

 

It's now your trainset Sandra, so you can please yourself. It would be interesting to think what Roy would have made of it, however.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Tony,

 

Roy was always very supportive. He was quite happy for me to run my kit built H15, S15 and Merchant Navy on Retford. I think he was rather keen on the Southern for he urged me to bring a T9 along to run on Retford. He was, how can I put it, less tolerant of anything GWR. In fact he said the initials GWR stood for Gresley Was Right.

 

Sandra

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Evening Tony.

 

If you haven't already seen it, this looks like it's going to be quite a layout:

There was a piece in last month's BRM about the building of the station hotel but today's update is the first time I've seen the full length of the station.

 

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3 hours ago, drmditch said:

 

According to RCTS Vol 2A, bogie wheelbase for the Raven A2 was 6'6". Gresley A1 and A3 was 6'3".

Doncaster seems to have preferred the smaller dimension, (Pacifics and B17 and even B1), and Darlington the larger (B16, D49)

 

I don't know whether 1mm will make much difference to you - especially when trying to get the 'bowling alley' to go round corners.

 

Do you know if the A2 kit is reasonably dimensionaly correct?

I still hanker after a Z(C7), but don't know whether to trust the DJH kit!

 

 

 

 

 

I'm sure Comet will make a 6' 6" wheelbase bogie. Or, it wouldn't be difficult to scratch-build a bogie of such dimensions.

 

I built a DJH Raven A2 for a friend many years ago (which was destroyed after intruders broke into his home and threw his model collection against the wall!) and it seemed to be accurate enough. At least the mixture of parts fitted.

 

NER locos with outside cylinders in typical orientation are a nightmare to get round curves, even generous ones. The Pacific was no exception, and I found it wise (as with the B16/1s I've built) to make the chassis electrically-dead; at the same time carving off the insides of the cylinders.

 

The DJH Z (C7) kit dates from the firm's Banbury days and is a bit old-fashioned by today's standards, Never having built one, I cannot comment on how it goes together. I'm sure others will be able to advise.

 

Regards,

 

Tony.  

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1 hour ago, LNER4479 said:

Evening Tony.

 

If you haven't already seen it, this looks like it's going to be quite a layout:

There was a piece in last month's BRM about the building of the station hotel but today's update is the first time I've seen the full length of the station.

 

Thanks for that Graham,

 

It looks incredible. 

 

I wonder which period will be represented. There appears to be a BR A1 and a garter blue A4 in the shots.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

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19 minutes ago, andytrains said:

There is a DJH Edition Raven A2 on Ebay at the moment, built.

See:-  https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/284264953112?hash=item422f82f518:g:axkAAOSwELNgfnkM

 

Andy.

Thanks Andy,

 

The green on the A2 definitely looks odd.

 

I looked at the A1 as well; typical build problems - the firebox is level at the top and the cabsides have not been modified to produce the rake-in where they meet the eaves. The nameplates would appear to be those supplied by DJH - much too big!

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

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10 hours ago, sandra said:

I do think one would look great running through Retford with, say, the down Talisman, or would that be sacrilege?

 

 

Even on the Southern, and after two rebuilds the T14's were considered sluggish, and relegated to secondary passenger duties, so despite being an SR loco enthusiast I think one might have to suspend belief more than a little, to see a Paddlebox heading The Talisman! :o

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1 hour ago, Tony Wright said:

Thanks for that Graham,

 

It looks incredible. 

 

I wonder which period will be represented. There appears to be a BR A1 and a garter blue A4 in the shots.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

There are several mentions in the thread of ".....my customer.....".  Obviously someone with very deep pockets.....

A stunning layout already.

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6 hours ago, Northmoor said:
  • Hornby introduced the LNER B17 long before anyone made a B1, a larger class with longer lives and wider operation.

 

You're missing the very obvious commercial appeal of the B17. How many people are going to buy a model locomotive because it's named after their favourite South African quadruped?

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The B1 was already planned and was pretty close to release before Mainline was wound up. I think it was going to be the next locomotive model after the LMS 2P 4-4-0.

 

The Modified Hall was also from the same source. Both had their origins in Airfix I believe. Pat Hammond's book with the details are out of reach at the moment. But there was quite a list of projects that were pretty close to finishing and which later appeared from Dapol, Replica or Bachmann.

 

Found it. In the Airfix section with about a dozen other models.

 

LNER B1 Class Mayflower 1982

 

In the Replica section.

 

"This was in an advanced stage of tooling when Mainline production closed down. Hayes paid for the model to be completed."

 

First released 1987.

 

 

Jason

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1 hour ago, polybear said:

There are several mentions in the thread of ".....my customer.....".  Obviously someone with very deep pockets.....

A stunning layout already.

Indeed - but much better spent on something like this than setting up a European Super League?

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8 hours ago, polybear said:

 

 

There are several mentions in the thread of ".....my customer.....".  Obviously someone with very deep pockets.....

A stunning layout already.

To be fair to the 'customer', he is building the layout himself. He has commisioned the buildings, but boards, track etc he is building himself.

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13 minutes ago, Denbridge said:

To be fair to the 'customer', he is building the layout himself. He has commisioned the buildings, but boards, track etc he is building himself.

 

Indeed; few of us are competent at everything that the hobby calls for.

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10 hours ago, Tony Teague said:

 

Even on the Southern, and after two rebuilds the T14's were considered sluggish, and relegated to secondary passenger duties, so despite being an SR loco enthusiast I think one might have to suspend belief more than a little, to see a Paddlebox heading The Talisman! :o

Interesting, though, Tony. 

 

I saw 'The Talisman'(s) on many occasions, and it was always a Gresley A3, A4 or Peppercorn A1 on it (latterly a diesel flop in the form of an EE Type 4, but, eventually, and terrifically, a 'Deltic'). Being born just over a year before Nationalisation, I doubt if I'd have ever seen a T14, anywhere.

 

Requiring an average speed of around a mile a minute between the two capitals, any smaller 4-6-0 would have struggled, but the Bulleids would have romped away with the eight/nine car Talisman sets.

 

Regards,

 

Tony.  

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10 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

Even on the Southern, and after two rebuilds the T14's were considered sluggish

 

I've been looking for a picture of the one we run at Ormesby Hall, which is in original form and can't find one.   The Hall is still closed so I can't get in to take one of it.   I can confirm that the model performs just like the real thing - it's very heavy and has relatively little room for a motor so it's a battle to get anything beefy enough to move the loco into it, let alone pull any kind of decent train.   I think there have been three attempts at rebuilding the chassis, the last by Peter Simmerson which has been the most successful.  However any more than 4 or 5 carriages and it's down to walking pace all round the layout.

 

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45 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

Interesting, though, Tony. 

 

I saw 'The Talisman'(s) on many occasions, and it was always a Gresley A3, A4 or Peppercorn A1 on it (latterly a diesel flop in the form of an EE Type 4, but, eventually, and terrifically, a 'Deltic'). Being born just over a year before Nationalisation, I doubt if I'd have ever seen a T14, anywhere.

 

Requiring an average speed of around a mile a minute between the two capitals, any smaller 4-6-0 would have struggled, but the Bulleids would have romped away with the eight/nine car Talisman sets.

 

Regards,

 

Tony.  

Even the smaller sort, I'd think, which regularly worked 10+ on their home turf, though I always suspected that the "regular" MN substitutes came from an elite group. However, their lack of water scoops would have necessitated at least one water stop.

 

The load/speed should also have been within the abilities of a V2, if the coal capacity of the 6-wheel tender was considered adequate.

 

John

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6 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

 

Fortunately, and by his own admission, Norman cannot build locos. So, how did I 'pay' for these wonderful baseboards? Well, I bought the wood (not even Norman fells his own trees and puts them through his own sawmill), and built the following for him, among others, in exchange.....................................

 

What does all the above show? The benefits of working in a team I suppose, members of which can all contribute something (other than just money) to a project.

 

 

We are in total agreement; I could probably do all of those things if I tried, but undoubtedly, in a number of areas it would not be to the standard of others. On the money vs. bartering issue, I take perhaps a slightly different perspective, in that if one is time poor, because of working or other commitments, then excachanging one's (non-modelling) skills for money and using that to acquire help where one's own skills are lacking - or perhaps 'sub standard' - does not seem wrong or less good to me; indeed, that approach must keep a whole army of professional or semi-professional model builders in business! So there are areas where I will remain unashamedly a 'cheque book modeller'. :D

 

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