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Wright writes.....


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Re: Accuracy and research.

One of my current projects is a former NER Dia 85 six-wheeled Inspection Saloon, as drawn in NERA's 'Diagrams of Passenger Train Vehicles' Book No.2.

I have described this .....here... which also links into my modelling thread.

In the absence of more detail, I think I may have to make a 'reasonable guess' as to it's heating, lighting, and braking arrangements in the early 1930s.

 

I would be very grateful if any of the knowledgeable and competent modellers who read this thread could help!

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4 hours ago, Denbridge said:

With Grantham stock used to backdate LB to the 30's, how about reversing the flow. Grantham 1958 at somewhere like Warley would surely be a crowd pleaser. I'll grab my coat :D

You never know. Somebody with inside knowledge might comment on that in due course.

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19 hours ago, Jesse Sim said:

and lastly the team! Bit of a blurry photo as it’s a photo of a photo…. But you get the idea. 

AFD1911C-4926-41C2-9CED-DF667328DD0E.png.8448f9632141df0bfb2dea2ef8ac7b8c.png

 

It's nice to see Roy!   

 

Our paths met regularly; once a year at the CMRA exhibition at St Albans and then Stevenage and also at the SLS Barnet Branch meetings that he used to organise.       Both events now but a memory!

 

Tony, do pass on my regards to him when you next speak if you would be so kind.

 

Alan

 

 

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42 minutes ago, gr.king said:

 

 

I would however have to apply at least some of the lining, refit the handrails / pipes / rods / handles / backhead that I've temporarily removed to aid painting, screw it all together properly, add proper coal, highlight the "polished steel" smokebox door fittings with something better than coarse glittery silver metallic paint, and consider applying some insignia too...

 

STA71984.JPG.70145d14c8c86df7b72c666e59bf2f7d.JPG

 

Looking rather lovely. Is that what became a J7 under the LNER?

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7 hours ago, LNER4479 said:

Before we lose the thread on this lovely memory of (over) three years ago, can I crave your indulgence for the moment on one train in particular? Tony's photo above shows this train from the prototypical lineside viewpoint, but here it is on the set-up weekend two weeks earlier.

 

636374717_A1Leedstrain1_LR.JPG.f892ba75e14d9c75e17d260132e6c93d.JPG

One thing of course that we're not able to do routinely on Grantham is to run the trains in scale length formations - the layout would have to be twice as big to do that ... plus the extra stock building; there are limits! So the 'retro' weekend was an almost unique opportunity to set up something like this - the 'famous' (well, only if you're in to 1930s LNER) 10.10 Leeds departure from Kings Cross. All those classic pre-war King's Cross line ups naturally focus on the departure of the 10.0am 'Flying Scotsman' but there's always at least three other pacific hauled trains in the background. The 10.5am was the relief - inevitably known as the 'Junior Scotsman' - and the 10.10 was the Leeds service (some years it was 10.15, I believe). There was also a 10.20 Newcastle train. FOUR mainline express departures in 20 minutes! Classic pre-war railway operating - any goods traffic heading towards the notorious two track bottle neck at Hadley Wood (only eradicated in the mid-1950s) would be queued on the slows at Greenwood box to allow this 'wave' of expresses a clear path. We depict the 'backwash' of it all at Grantham some two hours later, with the Flying Scotsman, Junior Scotsman and the Leeds train following in quick (if we're slick!) succession.

 

Anyhow - at the retro weekend, we depicted the full formation as follows:

 

1238725801_Leedstrain1.jpg.bbe8013d4314d63ab7482ea5799b3277.jpg

At the head is the experimental cinema coach which was trialled on this service for a short time. Lovingly recreated by Roy Mears - I understand it has seats inside it!! There follows a classic three-coach through portion - BTK-TK-BCK - in this case to Harrogate

482514041_Leedstrain2.jpg.180d2bd6fe1b7922be4b8100fec1dd4b.jpg

Then the 'core' of the train, none other than the unique GNR quintuplet dining set. This was one half of its regular diagram; it returned on the evening businessman's express back to London.

 

1537372035_Leedstrain3.jpg.b3e4c92cbdeb1f20a9d6184713366c81.jpg

And then, just look at the coaches bringing up the rear? ANOTHER three-coach portion, this time a BFK-TK-BTK for Bradford (showing just how important a destination that was regarded as), the BG is also for Bradford, so these four would have been dropped off at Wakefield. And then, at the very rear, a BTK-BCK two coach portion for Hull, detached at Doncaster.

 

15 vehicles in all (ALL kit built - other than the leading vehicle, take a bow Jonathan I believe), remarkably TEN of them being brake vehicles (if you count the first vehicle as such). I love this sort of stuff and it was very satisfying to assemble such a train and run it on such a setting. What's more, my signature loco - LNER 4479 - nothing more than a detailed (me) and beautifully weathered (Tom F) Hornby product - actually managed to shift this lot reasonably competently, I seem to recall, Tony?

 

Thanks Graham,

 

I think I have other pictures of that train as well, as well as a few more from the weekend (I'll post them tomorrow). The Hornby A1 did take the load very well, with just a bit of slipping (prototypical?) to start with if I recall. 

 

It's amazing how the revisits have been so popular. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

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Thanks for the positive responses regarding the GNR 0-6-0 above. It is not one of the class that became LNER J7, although "Chuffer" has one of those. My loco is a 174 series, one of only six special larger goods engines that Stirling built to more cheaply replace Sturrock's controversial steam-tender 400 class and thus haul longer coal trains via the Lincolnshire loop. The plan did not succeed because insufficient allowance had been made for the havoc caused by long trains standing in Lincoln (presumably for water and examination?) with both level crossings in the city centre closed. Hence few of the locos were built and they were much more than was needed for most other work. Ivatt moved them onto heavy mineral work in the West Riding and they became the first GNR J4 class under Ivatt's 1900 classifications. All had gone by 1906, but the vacant J4 classification was later re-used by Gresley when he put 4' 8" boilers on the "standard" 0-6-0s, those becoming J3 on the LNER. Confused?

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3 hours ago, gr.king said:

 

 

I would however have to apply at least some of the lining, refit the handrails / pipes / rods / handles / backhead that I've temporarily removed to aid painting, screw it all together properly, add proper coal, highlight the "polished steel" smokebox door fittings with something better than coarse glittery silver metallic paint, and consider applying some insignia too...

 

STA71984.JPG.70145d14c8c86df7b72c666e59bf2f7d.JPG

Looking really good! I'm very interested in how you're doing the tender sides Graeme - it looks like you've painted in the dark green around the borders before doing any lining: is that the case? Is that because you want to do all the paining before the lining transfers?

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13 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

It's a wonderful idea Tony,

 

The period would have to be between 1911 (when the main line was quadrupled) and the Grouping of 1923 (or just after, because 'LNER' wasn't instantly universal), which includes WW1. Every signal (not just two, for 1938) would have to be replaced by somersaults, and one building would have to be removed, but that's all, really. If someone would like to offer all the necessary OO stock on loan for a weekend (a reasonable representation would do, not a complete substitution of 50-odd trains and more than 100 locos), then it's possible (providing Graham Nicholas would be prepared to make all those signals - the two he made for 1938 were later sold for CRUK).

 

Regards,

 

Tony.

Good evening Tony, I'll have a 00 GNR C2 fairly soon... though exactly what 'fairly' means in this context is open to debate at the moment! In the meantime, about a half-dozen assorted GNR and ECJS wagons and NPCS are standing by for the call... (small scale I think besides many others but the thought is there:)).

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2 hours ago, Chas Levin said:

Looking really good! I'm very interested in how you're doing the tender sides Graeme - it looks like you've painted in the dark green around the borders before doing any lining: is that the case? Is that because you want to do all the paining before the lining transfers?

You're right about the darker green borders already painted in. The plan is that the panel lining will be in transfer form, providing the sharpest possible boundaries. Plans don't always work out of course...

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I know many, including Tony, prefer to model British Railways days as that is what they remember - but the colours, even weathered, of pre-nationalisation are sublime. Even with boring companies like the LMS and Southern.

 

GWR has always been super dull green, brown and cream of course ;)

 

I shall now retreat :D

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39 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

 

It all ended up (on my part) as a bit of a farce. Setting the camera's delay on the shutter for too short a period resulted in this. Still, at least it shows my best side!

 

2144438658_Final02.jpg.7bcd54612a93369c687ba0ce21a05596.jpg

 

 

Oh yes, I can still hear the colourful words that came out after the flash went off! 

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1 minute ago, Jesse Sim said:

Oh yes, I can still hear the colourful words that came out after the flash went off! 

Indeed,

 

And, no, despite the photographic 'evidence', I have not wet myself (I thought you might have suggested that!). It's just a shadow effect.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

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Great idea about backdating to pre grouping, it would be wonderful to see.

 

One anachronism which would HAVE to change would be the mini-Tony on the platform end.

 

Rescanned in period dress, and one of these

 

image.png.cbe1fa4f9ad50529989e28c807a3b736.png

 

instead of the ultra modern camera he is holding.

 

Hat, coat and in a flash, I'm gone.

 

Regards

 

Ian

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46 minutes ago, Bucoops said:

GWR has always been super dull green, brown and cream of course ;)

 

I shall now retreat :D

Obviously a punctuation error so no need to retreat.  I’m sure you meant to type:

   GWR has always been super; dull green, brown and cream of course.

Regards,

Frank

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1 minute ago, grob1234 said:

As my chosen modelling period is represented in recent photographs, I cannot get enough of them.

 

Thank you for sharing, it looked like a fantastic weekend.

 

Glad to see you posting, Tom. As it happens I read your build thread on your Coronation set last night - I don't suppose you still have the photos as none of them are showing :(

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42 minutes ago, Bucoops said:

 

Glad to see you posting, Tom. As it happens I read your build thread on your Coronation set last night - I don't suppose you still have the photos as none of them are showing :(

 

Yes it was all to do with that photobucket thing. 

 

I have added a 'job lot' as I cant be bothered to insert them in the right place!

 

 

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1 hour ago, Bucoops said:

I know many, including Tony, prefer to model British Railways days as that is what they remember - but the colours, even weathered, of pre-nationalisation are sublime. Even with boring companies like the LMS and Southern.

 

GWR has always been super dull green, brown and cream of course ;)

 

I shall now retreat :D

 

I quite agree, the LNER colour schemes were wonderfully organic and naturalistic, even all the fog grey wagons, or should that be mist grey?

 

58 minutes ago, Chuffer Davies said:

Obviously a punctuation error so no need to retreat.  I’m sure you meant to type:

   GWR has always been super; dull green, brown and cream of course.

Regards,

Frank

 

GWR, the colour of a box of After eight mints.

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55 minutes ago, Headstock said:

 

I quite agree, the LNER colour schemes were wonderfully organic and naturalistic, even all the fog grey wagons, or should that be mist grey?

 

 

GWR, the colour of a box of After eight mints.

 

Oh gawd, not the foggy-misty debate - you're not my wife are you?

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1 hour ago, grob1234 said:

 

Yes it was all to do with that photobucket thing. 

 

I have added a 'job lot' as I cant be bothered to insert them in the right place!

 

 

 

Oh yes, forgot about that. Nope that's perfect, I couldn't expect you to go through and edit the lot back in :) very much appreciated and a reminder of just how good a job you did with it.

 

Ooh, appropriate for discussing LNER days - page 2509.

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