Waverley West Posted July 2, 2013 Share Posted July 2, 2013 That's what I would be afraid of, Cav. I've never been convinced by patch painting before, so I will be very interested to see Lee's results. Cheers Dave Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RBE Posted July 2, 2013 Share Posted July 2, 2013 I suspect its down to painting style. I probably do lighter coats than Lee I dunno. What airbrush are you rocking Lee? Cav Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueeighties Posted July 2, 2013 Author Share Posted July 2, 2013 Will do, Lee. I find sometimes that too many varnish coats clogs the detail so anything that could reduce the number of coats I need is worth a try. Cheers, Dave Sounds like they are going on a bit heavy Dave. I have recently switched to Railmatch varnishes after various quality issues with Precision, I find it goes on superbly with a couple of lightish coats. Never had an issue with detailing getting too covered. Thats with quite a few coats too, 3 or 4 of primer, up to 4 for colour, couple of gloss varnish, then matt or satin, and finally weathering. I think it was Tim Shackleton who once scraped an accumulation of spraypaint off a heavily used area of his worbench....after about 5 Years. It wasn't even a mm thick. Paint coats are measured in micron thicknesses, maybes try thinning your mix a bit more? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueeighties Posted July 2, 2013 Author Share Posted July 2, 2013 That's what I would be afraid of, Cav. I've never been convinced by patch painting before, so I will be very interested to see Lee's results. Cheers Dave Everything pictured in a finished state on this thread has been varnished the 'patchy' way I am a perfectionist....if it resulted in a poor finish I wouldn't be able to live with it! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waverley West Posted July 2, 2013 Share Posted July 2, 2013 (edited) "Sounds like they are going on a bit heavy Dave. I have recently switched to Railmatch varnishes after various quality issues with Precision, I find it goes on superbly with a couple of lightish coats. Never had an issue with detailing getting too covered. Thats with quite a few coats too, 3 or 4 of primer, up to 4 for colour, couple of gloss varnish, then matt or satin, and finally weathering. I think it was Tim Shackleton who once scraped an accumulation of spraypaint off a heavily used area of his worbench....after about 5 Years. It wasn't even a mm thick. Paint coats are measured in micron thicknesses, maybes try thinning your mix a bit more?" Maybe Lee. I've been using Precision's readymixed airbrush varnishes for a while now and I find them pretty good most of the time, but maybe I could try Railmatch's versions. I use Railmatch generally otherwise, it's just so convenient to use Precision's readymixed ones, but maybe I shouldn't be so lazy. Edited July 2, 2013 by Waverley West Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueeighties Posted July 2, 2013 Author Share Posted July 2, 2013 I suspect its down to painting style. I probably do lighter coats than Lee I dunno. What airbrush are you rocking Lee? Cav I use.....an Iwata Eclipse CS. One of the best modelling tools I ever invested in. Used in combination with an Iwata compressor. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waverley West Posted July 2, 2013 Share Posted July 2, 2013 Everything pictured in a finished state on this thread has been varnished the 'patchy' way I am a perfectionist....if it resulted in a poor finish I wouldn't be able to live with it! From what I've seen of your work, Lee, I don't doubt that. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueeighties Posted July 2, 2013 Author Share Posted July 2, 2013 (edited) "Sounds like they are going on a bit heavy Dave. I have recently switched to Railmatch varnishes after various quality issues with Precision, I find it goes on superbly with a couple of lightish coats. Never had an issue with detailing getting too covered. Thats with quite a few coats too, 3 or 4 of primer, up to 4 for colour, couple of gloss varnish, then matt or satin, and finally weathering. I think it was Tim Shackleton who once scraped an accumulation of spraypaint off a heavily used area of his worbench....after about 5 Years. It wasn't even a mm thick. Paint coats are measured in micron thicknesses, maybes try thinning your mix a bit more?" Maybe Lee. I've been using Precision's readymixed airbrush varnishes for a while now and I find them pretty good most of the time, but maybe I could try Railmatch's versions. I use Railmatch generally otherwise, it's just so convenient to use Precision's readymixed ones, but maybe I shouldn't be so lazy. I started off with Precision, and still swear by the superb quality of finish, especially with their matt. But (I think documented earlier in the thread), completely out of the blue I started getting terrible quality issues, which resulted in a couple of ruined locos. The general conclusion of a lot of people was that the Precision ones tend to have a shorter shelf life for some reason. It must be damn short as I used that particular tin in less than a week and a half! I just can't justify the wasted time when it goes wrong like that now thus the switch to Railmatch. And it's worked perfectly so far........ P.S. I used the ready thinned ones too. Edited July 2, 2013 by blueeighties Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon020 Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 Day off today and spray bay prepped .... railmatch blue about to be mixed/thinned : time to paint my 47; wish me luck. Iwata Rev CR on standby! Jon 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueeighties Posted July 4, 2013 Author Share Posted July 4, 2013 Nice one Jon, I'm sure it will go fine. Look forward to seeing the results! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon020 Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 (edited) ... phew! 90 minutes of spraying (on-off) and my poor compressor is a little warm. Time for it to cool down. Very thin paint used and I don't know how many light coats, but it's done! Now it's over to mother nature to let it dry whilst it's sat in its drying box. Whilst wet, it looks ok. Opacity a little thin in a couple of spots on the roof, but I'm not worried about that as there will be some clag colour to add to that later on... but much of the rest of it looks ok and nicely slightly-shiny. Railmatch 207. That Tamiya spray stand is a gods-send.... makes it so much easier; previously I used a precision loco body clip/clamp thingy and you have to hold that... now I can spray with both hands - one to steady the other... which helps. Oops.... just went downstairs to find I left the lean-to conservatory door (where I do my spraying) open and now the dining room pongs a bit; good job the wife's out; time to open the windows. Not finishing yet... I'm going to weather my craven DMU now.... That was posted at 11:10 UPDATE 14:30: DMU weathering done (well, the airbrushing part anyway) and masking removed from 47. Minimal bleed through and it's looking ok... phew! I'll post a pic on here at some point. Thanks for the tips and guidance picked up from your thread and messages on here. No disasters this time! Jon Well, that's the day gone; time to pick up the kids from school, although perhaps I'll grab a quick bite for late-lunch first. Edited July 4, 2013 by Jon020 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon020 Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 To be honest, the finish on the 47 isn't fantastic, but it'll do. Once it's hardened I'll flatten it down a bit as it's still a bit uneven but should be ok given that this will be a gateshead machine and therefore it won't be the cleanest loco out there! The DMU still has more work to do but the intent was to give a clean but used appearance. The underframe and roof have been tacked with some dusting around the ends too... the sides will be given a light dirty wash but that can be done one evening and there's no rush. Jon 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueeighties Posted July 4, 2013 Author Share Posted July 4, 2013 Nice work! You were certainly right about dirty Gateshead locos...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
the penguin of doom Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 Nice work Jon. How do you, (and Lee), "flatten down"? It's a stage I dont generally bother with but probably should! Cheers. Sean. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueeighties Posted July 4, 2013 Author Share Posted July 4, 2013 Hi Sean. Matt varnish is my normal weapon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
the penguin of doom Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 Thanks Lee. I do normally apply varnish too, I thought Jon was alluding to some secret fine emry cloth or something to make it nice and smooth. I normally use satin from a Humbrol can as I'm not very adept with an air brush and find the finish with the can is usually acceptable, but would love to improve my work if I can. Cheers. Sean. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueeighties Posted July 4, 2013 Author Share Posted July 4, 2013 For some reason, varnishes are one of the trickiest stages of aircrushing to get right. It almost caused me to choose an alternative hobby on many an occasion! Practise, practise, practise, is the only way to master them. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon020 Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 If careful and once the paint is hard, a gentle application of Tee cut can work too; it's come to my rescue before. But yes, varnish afterwards. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin parks Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 Hi Lee, I have much less experience with an airbrush than either you or Jon, but seems that Humbrol gloss thinned with white spirit, tends to 'flatten' down to something akin to a satin finish if applied at low pressure and not too thin. I once used Railmatch BR blue and that was so thin that I tried a third coat too soon: The paint crazed in places, which is not desirable on the sides of a class 73. The job was rescued by sanding with 800 grade wet & dry carborundum paper, wetted with water. So that was literally flattening down the finish. It did leave a rather unintended but realistic look of paint that was wearing off through too many visits to the washing plant. All the best, Colin 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon020 Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 That's a good look if you can get it Colin. I used over a dozen thin coats on this one but allowing each to go off slightly before the next one went on... It's not perfect but it'll do. It's very shiny and I think that's worse at showing the imperfections; a little rubbing down and dulling too (matt varnish once the decals are on) will also help. No, I'm not good at this, but I'm trying. Most other bits I can do, I just need to get better at the painting lark. I did consider changing my plans and doing large logo just to save having to put so much blue on... but I think that it'll do. Jon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueeighties Posted July 5, 2013 Author Share Posted July 5, 2013 (edited) Good evening.How hot has it been today? Lovely. Apparantely hotter tomorrow Anyways, update time. The 2 09's have been transferred up and matt varnished, just added the bufferbeam detail. It never fails to amaze me just how well detailed these little shunters are after a close up scrutiny. 47430 has had the same varnish treatment, and weathering to finish. I do think these Heljans still scrub up rather well. The 87 has been weathered and had lights fitted. It's also had a Bachmann 85 Pantograph fitted. 09's to weather next. All the locos in the pictures were 'part gloss varnished' for those of us discussing it yesterday. They always finish off beautifully for me. Edited July 5, 2013 by blueeighties 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon020 Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 All look good Lee... yes, hot hot hot today.... hotter tomorrow with a day out at Bewl Lake planned - so no modelling, diesel galas of DEMUs to attend (rats!) but at least I'll save on petrol Really like the 09s .... Jon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueeighties Posted July 5, 2013 Author Share Posted July 5, 2013 Cheers Jon, just need to dirty them up now! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RBE Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Looking good Lee. Just a question. Did the 47 and 87 have black window surrounds in real life? It wasnt a typical feature of the livery. Most examples had executive dark grey around the windows. Cav Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueeighties Posted July 5, 2013 Author Share Posted July 5, 2013 Hi Cav. That's interesting....I thought they were always black. The pictures I had to work from were pretty poor so I just presumed. I'll have a leaf through some books. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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