Whats on your 2mm Work bench

[Coal Tank]

23 minutes ago, tapdieuk said:

Wagons, lots of them.....

 

Not the best shot, but the latest batch of coal wagons (3D printed Sithlord's files) all wheeled, buffers and painted. Some have couplings but I have used all the batch I made up.

 

 

SDJR wagons, the n gauge box van will be replaced at some point. The transfers are RailTec recent released set. 

They have stood up well to my mauling when applying them.

 

 

A crude close up, how do people like to pick ghe iron work out? 

 

Is it just a very small brush and a steady hand? 

 

 

 

 

Looking good 

[Coal Tank]

1 hour ago, Nick Mitchell said:

That's looking very nice.

What are your plans for the sawn-up Black 5 boiler/smokebox casting with this kit?

I've been looking at mine and wondering what the best way forward is. I don't think I could simply glue them together.

Hi Nick

   Thanks for the comment, I havent thought that far ahead yet, I Will be Looking at your Jubilee video's when I get to the chassis 

John 

[Caley Jim]

1 hour ago, tapdieuk said:

a very small brush and a steady hand? 

In a word, yep!

 

Jim

[Ian Smith]

8 minutes ago, Caley Jim said:

In a word, yep!

 

Jim

And good light and magnification 

(of course you will probably need to touch up the grey afterwards as well) 

Ian

[Sithlord75]

5 hours ago, tapdieuk said:

Wagons, lots of them.....

 

Not the best shot, but the latest batch of coal wagons (3D printed Sithlord's files) all wheeled, buffers and painted. Some have couplings but I have used all the batch I made up.

 

 

SDJR wagons, the n gauge box van will be replaced at some point. The transfers are RailTec recent released set. 

They have stood up well to my mauling when applying them.

 

 

A crude close up, how do people like to pick the iron work out? 

 

Is it just a very small brush and a steady hand? 

 

 

 

 

Very nice.  I tend to use a cocktail stick for doing the iron work.  It helps that I paint the base colour using Tamiya TS paints (so a synthetic lacquer) and then do the iron in acrylic.  If I make too much of a hash of the iron work, it is an easy process to remove the iron work paint with a wet cotton tip and have another go.

[queensquare]

5 hours ago, tapdieuk said:

 

A crude close up, how do people like to pick the iron work out? 

 

Is it just a very small brush and a steady hand? 

 

 

 

 

 

I use a Sharpie pen, much easier than a hairy stick!

 

Jerry

[nick_bastable]

I may be very wrong here but I thought strapping was only painted on outshopping for photographic reasons  

 

Nick B

[Sithlord75]

32 minutes ago, nick_bastable said:

I may be very wrong here but I thought strapping was only painted on outshopping for photographic reasons  

 

Nick B

Possibly - I know practically every RTR model of a PoW wagon has the strapping picked out, but since these models inevitably have been based on a photograph, usually a works one, then it follows the strapping is picked out and so it comes to pass.  I don't as a rule bother with the strapping on railway owned wagons but tend to on the PoWs.

[osbornsmodels]

  9 hours ago, Nick_Bastable said:

I may be very wrong here but I thought strapping was only painted on outshopping for photographic reasons  .

Probably and if it was a one off wagon they would not have repainted the strapping body colour as it entered traffic so it could be correct I guess. Most pictures of PO minerals showing working wagons do not have the strapping picked out and inside the body there are no straps to paint surely or have i got that wrong?

 

 

[Caley Jim]

27 minutes ago, osbornsmodels said:

 ..... and inside the body there are no straps to paint surely or have i got that wrong?

Inside the wagon were cast iron 'knees', bolted to the cross members of the underframe and to which the side planks were attached. The vertical outside 'strapping' was in fact washer plates to prevent the bolts holding the planks pulling through the wood. The knees, therefore, projected inside the planks and tapered towards the top. 

 

Chris Crofts had an excellent series in early MRJ's on wagon construction. 

 

Jim 

Edited July 27, 2021 by Caley Jim
Add 'vertical'

[Compound2632]

5 minutes ago, Caley Jim said:

The knees, therefore, projected inside the planks and tapered towards the top. 

 

A key structural member, without which the wagon would fall apart!

 

10 hours ago, nick_bastable said:

I may be very wrong here but I thought strapping was only painted on outshopping for photographic reasons  

 

And then overpainted before the wagon went into traffic? There are enough photos of PO wagon in traffic to show that black ironwork was the standard finish, irrespective of whether the wagon would be sitting for its portrait. I think that the ironwork was "japanned" (painted with a black lacquer) before being attached but I'm not at all clear on the sequence - whether the woodwork was painted before assembly too - seems unlikely. And why the railway companies by and large* preferred to paint their wagons a uniform colour, ironwork and all (except below solebar level, almost always black) is also a mystery to me.

 

Unpainted wood but black ironwork on the inside. 

 

*Highbridge works being one of the exceptions.

 

As to how to do it, in 4 mm scale I've tried painting the black ironwork first then running the body colour up to the edge, in the way often suggested for painting the cream panels of Great Western carriages.

[bill-lobb]

17 hours ago, queensquare said:

 

I use a Sharpie pen, much easier than a hairy stick!

 

Jerry

Good tip, Jerry. I just gave it a try. As far as inside straps are concerned, if I believe the RCH drawing in the Ince Wagonworks book there are more than outside. Each side of the corner plates have two internal washerplates corresponding to the two lines of bolts and a short horizontal one across the top - a bit like a tall thin Stonehenge. There were two of those assemblies for each cornerplate, plus the side knees and straps holding the door together.  That's just the drawing of course - I don't know how the wagons were actually built because not many photos show the insides.

I really shouldn't take photos of my models. That gap between the headstocks and solebars is worse than I thought.

 

Bill

 

[tapdieuk]

OK, so the S&DJR wagons were copied from a (Derby?) Works photos show in a write on on rmweb for 4mm wagons. 

 

The numbers on 3 of the wagons are made up. Does any have a list of the alloted S&DJR wagon numbers, Or is just a case of going though photos? 

 

So in service they would just be in grey overall? If worked hard maybe the metal work would be rusty/grime colour and the inside would have been left bare wood. Save for any left over cargo. 

 

With the PO wagons I do need to work on the base colours, a more blended look between the chassis and bodies. Weathering might help. Although It would be easier to recover components and start again.

 

The Jinty chassis is putting up a fight, get the spacers solder without delamination. Also the Simpson springs are getting in the way test fitting the axles and gear drive. 

 

[Compound2632]

1 hour ago, tapdieuk said:

OK, so the S&DJR wagons were copied from a (Derby?) Works photos show in a write on on rmweb for 4mm wagons. 

 

The numbers on 3 of the wagons are made up. Does any have a list of the alloted S&DJR wagon numbers, Or is just a case of going though photos? 

 

There is a book: R. Garner, The Somerset & Dorset Joint Railway Locomotive and Rolling Stock Registers 1886 – 1930 (The Somerset & Dorset Railway Trust, 2000). S&DJR goods stock (apart from service vehicles including brake vans) was divided between the LSWR and the Midland in 1914, presumably then ceasing to be Highbridge Works' responsibility for maintenance and gradually assuming the livery of whichever company each wagon had been assigned to. Reasonably complete information survives for those vehicles that passed to the LSWR and thence to the Southern, but any records of stock transferred to the Midland was lost long ago in one of the bouts of cultural vandalism to which Derby was prone.

 

The S&DJR equivalent of the standard Midland 5-plank 8 ton wagon* accounted for about half the stock. They occupied nearly all of the series 457-577, 732-990, 1075-1121, along with some other numbers. The 6-plank 10 ton wagons built at Derby in 1902 were 1122-1201.

 

Cattle wagons were 1-30 (although some of these numbers were taken by other types at various times), 407-456, 1222-1241 (built at Eastleigh). Meat Vans (of broadly LSWR type) 1202-1211; Road Vans 1003-1038 (Derby), 1045-1073 (S.J. Claye) with some older ones taking lower numbers.

 

There doesn't seem to be a block of 3-plank dropside numbers. Examples include 123, 181, 206, 212, 227, 316, 327, 351, 394-7 (?), 401-6 (?), 508, 620, 636, 645, 647, 654, 696/8, 709 (possibly others in this region), 816, 869. Many of these continued as S&DJR ballast wagons after 1914 (at least that's my interpretation of Garner's notes).

 

*It differed in several respects, operationally in not having bottom doors - it functioned as a merchandise wagon whereas the Midland ones were built for merchandise and mineral traffic.

 

2 hours ago, tapdieuk said:

So in service they would just be in grey overall?

 

Plenty of evidence for black ironwork in traffic. @phil_sutters has a gallery of photos (but that isn't quite it...). Many of these are officials but in quite a few wagons in black ironwork appear as extras in the background, rather than being the ex-works subject.

 

2 hours ago, tapdieuk said:

If worked hard maybe the metal work would be rusty/grime colour and the inside would have been left bare wood. Save for any left over cargo. 

 

Inside would be bare wood but remember we're talking pre-Great War here when standards of maintenance and scrupulousness in dealing with goods were at their height!

[A. Bastow]

Hi folks,

 

Had a parcel arrive today and I am rather excited! 
 

This is my first attempt at drawing something up for etching. I must give credit (and thanks) to Bob Jones, Nigel Hunt and Rich Brummitt who initially got me started with the whole process.

 

The etch contains two versions of the same L&Y coach, with different methods of achieving the details on the sides, basically to see which one builds/looks better. Then there are some L&Y bogies for the coaches, as well as some spare for some 3d printed bodies that I acquired back in winter. There is also a chassis for the 3d printed L&Y class 28 loco body I showcased some months ago. 
 

Plenty here to keep me busy for a few weeks now! 
 

I will obviously post progress on these as they develop!

[nebnoswal]

22 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

There is a book: R. Garner, The Somerset & Dorset Joint Railway Locomotive and Rolling Stock Registers 1886 – 1930 (The Somerset & Dorset Railway Trust, 2000). S&DJR goods stock (apart from service vehicles including brake vans) was divided between the LSWR and the Midland in 1914, presumably then ceasing to be Highbridge Works' responsibility for maintenance and gradually assuming the livery of whichever company each wagon had been assigned to. Reasonably complete information survives for those vehicles that passed to the LSWR and thence to the Southern, but any records of stock transferred to the Midland was lost long ago in one of the bouts of cultural vandalism to which Derby was prone.

 

Cattle wagons were 1-30 (although some of these numbers were taken by other types at various times), 407-456, 1222-1241 (built at Eastleigh). Meat Vans (of broadly LSWR type) 1202-1211; Road Vans 1003-1038 (Derby), 1045-1073 (S.J. Claye) with some older ones taking lower numbers.

 

 

 And this is what I like/love about this forum.  I've just about finished my 3D printed S+DJR cattle wagons and now need numbers for them.  As much as I would like to purchase The Somerset & Dorset Joint Railway Locomotive and Rolling Stock Registers 1886 – 1930, and its only 8 pounds, the postage to downunder of 21 pounds is the killer!  Just as I was about to the ask a question on numbers, it magically appears here.  Thank-you Stephen, much appreciated. 

[Compound2632]

19 minutes ago, nebnoswal said:

 And this is what I like/love about this forum.  I've just about finished my 3D printed S+DJR cattle wagons and now need numbers for them.  As much as I would like to purchase The Somerset & Dorset Joint Railway Locomotive and Rolling Stock Registers 1886 – 1930, and its only 8 pounds, the postage to downunder of 21 pounds is the killer!  Just as I was about to the ask a question on numbers, it magically appears here.  Thank-you Stephen, much appreciated. 

 

 

It seems that the cattle wagons Nos. 1222-1241, built at Eastleigh in 1902, were of LSWR design, becoming SR D1506 at grouping. The block Nos. 1-30 might all be of the standard Midland type per your kit, built between 1903 and 1912 according to Garner; they may all have gone to the LSWR in 1914, with 20 becoming SR stock, diagram D1505. However only Nos. 8, 9, an 12 are positively known from photos [G. Bixley et al., Southern Wagons Vol. 1: LSWR & S&DJR (OPC, 1984)].

 

In fact these Midland-type cattle wagons differ from the true Midland type in several respects, most noticeably in the arrangement of the planks: the Midland ones had four planks separated by gaps above and below, then two planks together up to the framing below the opening; the S&DJR ones had three planks with openings then three-and-a-half planks together - were the cattle of Somerset and Dorset more susceptible to draughts? Also, the Midland ones were 18'4" long inside, the extra 4" gave space for the moveable partition whils still giving the legal length for a "large" cattle wagon.

 

The block Nos. 407-456 is listed by Garner as built c. 1885; they presumably were the Midland's share of the cattle wagon fleet in 1914 as nothing else is recorded of them. However Bixley says "older cattle wagons were similar but had an inside length of 17'9"" (rather than 18'0" of the 1903-1912 wagons). If so, they would have been similar to Midland cattle wagons built up to 1885.

 

As a Midland enthusiast, I'm fascinated by the way in which Highbridge-built carriages and wagons differ in subtle ways from the Derby vehicles to which at first sight they are identical, often preserving features that had become outmoded at Derby.

[Sithlord75]

On 28/07/2021 at 07:42, Compound2632 said:

...but any records of stock transferred to the Midland was lost long ago in one of the bouts of cultural vandalism to which Derby was prone.

 

Bit harsh.  There is only so much room to keep stuff and if they don't need it why waste storage space on stuff which is mundane and of no use?  Easy to say cultural vandalism decades later when it would be lovely to have, but (with my history teacher hat on) how much of your life story has been chucked out over the years?  Did your parents keep every postcard, Christmas card, birthday card, school report?   Judging the decisions of the past based on the standards of today does neither those living then nor those living now justice.   I'll get off my soap box now. 

[Compound2632]

1 hour ago, Sithlord75 said:

Bit harsh.  There is only so much room to keep stuff and if they don't need it why waste storage space on stuff which is mundane and of no use?  Easy to say cultural vandalism decades later when it would be lovely to have, but (with my history teacher hat on) how much of your life story has been chucked out over the years?  Did your parents keep every postcard, Christmas card, birthday card, school report?   Judging the decisions of the past based on the standards of today does neither those living then nor those living now justice.   I'll get off my soap box now. 

 

Well, I used the expression "cultural vandalism" in retrospect. We've all thrown out things we've later regretted, I'm sure. But Derby seems to have been particularly prone to such weeding-out of redundant documents, going back to 1909 when Cecil Paget (whom I've never much cared for) had everything from Kirtley's time in the Locomotive Department destroyed. 

 

Keep that soap box. Not many survive, so it's become a valuable cultural artefact. Make sure you bequeath it to a good museum.

Edited July 29, 2021 by Compound2632

[Caley Jim]

On 27/07/2021 at 00:43, nick_bastable said:

I may be very wrong here but I thought strapping was only painted on outshopping for photographic reasons  

The July issue of the HMRS Journal has a short article by Keith Turton on the PO wagons of H E Bomford, Agricultural Merchants of Wixford, in the Vale of Evesham.  The accompanying photograph shows 5 of their (5 plank) wagons in service.  At least two appear to have a coal load and another two have containers in them.  The body colour is assumed to be grey, but all have black ironwork.

 

Jim

[Coal Tank]

The 8F cab, this kis is really nicely designed 

[Coal Tank]

Hi I have put the overlays on to the cab, the roof isnt fixed yet as there are some details to fit inside the cab 

John 

[richbrummitt]

On 29/07/2021 at 10:31, Sithlord75 said:

Did your parents keep every postcard, Christmas card, birthday card, school report?

It seems like they did; plus my school books since reception year, a full set of milk teeth, hospital bracelet, most toys… I honestly don’t know how strong the stuff holding up the ceiling is in their bungalow but it’s doing well: there must be more stuff in the attic than in the house. 
 

Now it’s up to me to do something with all this stuff I’ve had to be pretty brutal and my mundane life history has started to be, necessarily, discarded. 

 

I do get your point. 
 

Edited July 30, 2021 by richbrummitt

[Compound2632]

9 minutes ago, richbrummitt said:

Now it’s up to me to do something with all this stuff I’ve had to be pretty brutal and my mundane life history has started to be, necessarily, discarded. 

 

So, there are at least two people interested in the numbering of S&DJR wagons over a century after the fact. I put it to you, with the greatest respect (and knowing nothing of your fame in other fields of human endeavour), that fewer than two people will be interested in your secondary school essays on Macbeth a century hence... So I argue that the two cases are not comparable. 

[Coal Tank]

The reversing handle is fitted, before I fit the roof I would like to add the seating 

John