Sundeala boards

[kingfisher24]

im not entirely sure if this is the correct part of rmweb but here goes.

 

i have just completed the framework for my new layout and am looking for sundeala for the track-base as it is the best for noise reduction etc, does anybody know of a supplier in the edinburgh or east central scotland area who can supply sheets of sundeal as i do not fancy paying the postage for it from elsewhere, unless really necessary.

 

gary

[Ben Alder]

Sundeala is a set of built in problems- how do I know? It needs lots of bracing and responds alarmingly to any dampness- IIR it is basically compressed newsprint or something similar. The one top I used with this resembled a terrain map, and that was in a heated room. Why not use some of the denser poly insulation boards- they are far more stable.

[edcayton]

Be sat down when you get the price! My local model shop can get 4x2 sheets, the independent timber merchant can get 8x4 sheets, but says they don't get asked for it much these days so don't carry it in stock. He assumes that model railway builders are using other materials.

 

Ed sorry, meant to say in Stevenage, but I can't see why the same shouldn't apply where you are

[steve1]

I really wouldn't bother if I were you. Ben has given the reasons and I echo his thoughts; you are much better off using something else.

 

My recommendation is braced ply and use cork or foam for the trackbed. That way you will have a stable baseboard and quiet running.

 

steve

[Tim Chambers]

Yup, it's not the perfect foundation, heavy and expensive and can warp, but...the warping can be limited if the layout is located in a fairly "stable" environment(Heat and moisturewise) AND the board is primed as per instructions. Big advantage of course is that it takes track pins easily and cutting holes for point motors etc can be done with a Stanley knife.

[The Fatadder]

Have a look at the foam baseboards described

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/46161-knauf-pink-polyfoam-space-board-insulation-boards/page__st__100

 

and http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/blog/568/entry-5183-matford-new/#commentsStart

 

Basicly 50mm foam baseboard top, so you are getting the same advantages in noise deadening and easy to fit track pins, but more readily available and a lot more stable a materiel.

[Metr0Land]

Another vote against Sundeala here. Just thrown a couple of warped sheets in the skip.

[rodshaw]

Sundeala is available from some timber merchants as well as model shops, so you could try those.

 

But I can't comment on its suitability as I've never used it. Lately I've used 6mm birch ply topped with cork tiles.

[Wherry Lines]

I'm another who has moved away from Sundeala (for the reasons given by others). I did a direct comparison between Sundeala and 6mm ply with a cork trackbed and discovered very little different in noise.

[Coombe Barton]

Another "don't" for Sundaela. - From experience.

[davefrk]

Another "don't" for Sundaela. - From experience.

 

Oh Buxxer, I've just dug out my sheets of Sundeala from the loft, They would have been fastened to the baseboard frames last Wednesday night but we decided to drill and fit the dowels in the end pieces before we put the tops on. I was given the Sundeala about twenty years ago, it's been in the loft since, no warping or crumbling but you've all got me worried now.

Maybe 6mm ply would be better and, I've got plenty of cross bracing in the frames.

Edit:- I should have said it is the fiddleyard boards and would be flat, hopefully.

 

Dave Franks.

[ELTEL]

Used it once never again for all the reasons previously stated.

 

Product passed it sell by date as a material for baseboard construction.

 

Eltel

[Roddy Angus]

Gary

 

I've found that Sundela works well if glued to a thin ply wood base, abour 6 mm Made some up for my son's track about a year ago and it has not warped at all.

 

In Edinburgh, you can buy Sundela in 120 cm by 60 cm sheets from Harburn Hobbies in Leith Walk, or Elm Row in new money.

 

Roddy

[Sidecar Racer]

See the layout in my signature , bought second hand and uses Sundela .

 

The layout was built around the mid 80's , was removed from it's site probably about 4

years ago and stored for some time , then moved again and stored , then moved again

and stored , then moved again and the rebuild was started , I only found one noticable

warped spot .

 

So while it may not suit some peoples use I have to say it can be made to work .

[Scottish Modeller]

Oh Buxxer, I've just dug out my sheets of Sundeala from the loft, They would have been fastened to the baseboard frames last Wednesday night but we decided to drill and fit the dowels in the end pieces before we put the tops on. I was given the Sundeala about twenty years ago, it's been in the loft since, no warping or crumbling but you've all got me worried now.

Maybe 6mm ply would be better and, I've got plenty of cross bracing in the frames.

Edit:- I should have said it is the fiddleyard boards and would be flat, hopefully.

 

Dave Franks.

 

Hi Dave,

 

Sundeala from 20 years ago - what more can I say!

 

Anyway - Sundeala back then was a different beast to what it is now.

 

I have shelving for stock in the loft that was bought about that long ago and it's stayed stable despite 3 house moves in that time.

 

Some of the newer sundeala I bought about 4 years ago to extend the storage shelves has warped and resembles a view over sand dunes even though it's on the same framing as the old sundeala.

 

I think it's down to the modern bonding agent.

 

The new stuff smells different to the old stuff when cut.

 

Thanks

[Scottish Modeller]

im not entirely sure if this is the correct part of rmweb but here goes.

 

i have just completed the framework for my new layout and am looking for sundeala for the track-base as it is the best for noise reduction etc, does anybody know of a supplier in the edinburgh or east central scotland area who can supply sheets of sundeal as i do not fancy paying the postage for it from elsewhere, unless really necessary.

 

gary

Hi Gary,

 

Harburn Hobbies is the only stockist in the Edinburgh area.

 

Thanks

[90211]

Sundeala board comes in different grades.

 

Sundeala K board is an industry standard board and is widely used throughout the construction industry and is hardly 'past its sell by date'. It is eminently suitable for baseboard construction. It needs bracing at preferably 300mm centres but produces a strong and light baseboard.

 

It is readily available from good buiders merchants in 8' x 4' boards, just make sure you ask for Sundeala K board as other grades are made.

 

I have tried other types of material but now always use Sundeala K board.

 

When constructing a large layout in the USA for a client a couple of years ago, the client paid for the Sundeala to be shipped out to the states!

 

I am intrigued that people have encountered warping through damp but have to ask why you would build a model railway in damp conditions?

 

I would also urge caution regarding certain types of rigid foam boards as they are not always inert and can have a derimental effect on certain plastics.

[Metr0Land]

I am intrigued that people have encountered warping through damp but have to ask why you would build a model railway in damp conditions?

 

I can't speak for others but mine warped in perfectly dry conditions.

[ELTEL]

Sundeala board comes in different grades.

 

Sundeala K board is an industry standard board and is widely used throughout the construction industry and is hardly 'past its sell by date'. It is eminently suitable for baseboard construction. It needs bracing at preferably 300mm centres but produces a strong and light baseboard.

 

It is readily available from good buiders merchants in 8' x 4' boards, just make sure you ask for Sundeala K board as other grades are made.

 

I have tried other types of material but now always use Sundeala K board.

 

When constructing a large layout in the USA for a client a couple of years ago, the client paid for the Sundeala to be shipped out to the states!

 

I am intrigued that people have encountered warping through damp but have to ask why you would build a model railway in damp conditions?

 

I would also urge caution regarding certain types of rigid foam boards as they are not always inert and can have a derimental effect on certain plastics.

 

'past its sell by date'

 

1. I stand by my comment because of all the bracing required it makes baseboards very heavy.

2. The use of quality plywood is a much stronger and lighter option.

3. If it so good why do not all model shops stock it.

 

[Scottish Modeller]

I can't speak for others but mine warped in perfectly dry conditions.

 

Same here - New Sundeala warped withing 18 months of being fitted in a newly lined and floored dry loft...

 

Thanks

[edcayton]

3. If it so good why do not all model shops stock it.

 

I only found out by accident really that my local shop stocked it. I did not expect them to have any board-type materials in stock due to problems in handling and storage. I did not ask if they had any other materials available.

 

Ed

[Oldddudders]

I am intrigued that people have encountered warping through damp but have to ask why you would build a model railway in damp conditions?

Marie Antoinette ["let them eat cake!"] would be proud of you! People build layouts in all sorts of less-than-perfect locations because that's all that's on offer. Given the choice between a tiny temporary layout and something grander in poor circumstances, people make a choice!

[jcm@gwr]

I also agree with the general feeling about Sundela (but, I can't comment

on the 'K' spec board, as I hav'nt tried it).

On the other hand I prefer 6mm MDF as a baseboard surface, it has the

advantage over ply of no grain, is reasonably stable (esp. if sealed first)

but also quite easily bent (for the start of slight gradients, etc.)

Although I must confess my choice was biased by the acquisition of 10

sheets for nothing!

I have used both common methods of support, traditional 2 x 1 @ approx

1' centres and 6mm ply bonded. Both seem more than adequate for the

layouts, 1 fixed and 1 portable.

Jeff

[Butler Henderson]

Demolishing six boards with sundela as the surface, anyone know whch recycling skip it should go in or is it landfill?

[The Bigbee Line]

I've tried it. Expensive, uneven thickness, warps easily, etc.

 

My vote is for good quality ply or MDF. I was impressed by MDF. Like most sheets, store flat. I used 600 x 1200 x 9, with 50 x 25 PAR softwood round the edge. To save weight I fretted out the non track areas with a jig saw.

I fancy trying hardboard for a Freemo set up.

Back to the Sundela discussion. Not on my list of materials to use again.