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East West rail, Bletchley to oxford line


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It was interesting to get the developers position and I can understand it now does make you wonder what the councils are up to though.I used to deliver to Didcot bomb squad and always had to park on a pit with lights in and then have the vehicle searched always pleseant blokes on the gate made the process okay.Good to hear about Gordon he always enjoyed his work and hope he enjoys his retirement if you see him give my regards tell him its Chris from the R&DMRC.

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Forgot to add about RAF Halton heard from a friend who works there ,everything is being sold, the house is to be sold as well probably turned into a hotel .When it closes there will nothing lift on site so it will be a blank canvas as far as development goes agree about whats going in the area re houses there will be total gridlock very quickly and that's not good still Happy Christmas everyone.

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I heard a comment but can't remember where, it was along the lines of people moving out of London and commuting in.

 

In London they were all in a block of flats occupying an area about 100'x100' but in the countryside the same people from the flats occupied an area of 4 acres with the high density building that takes place today, if it was the same density as the 1970's it would be 8 acres.  I remeber doing a back of the hand calc and it was about right.

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The money is in the land.

 

Sure there is profit in building but after you've paid for the land then achieved planning, paid your section 106 payment or Community infrastructure levy to the local authority before being allowed to start and then built the place there aren't the huge sums that people think there is. In this area which borders Bucks, working farmland achieves between £8,500-10,000 per acre. If it's designated for building then it rises to in excess of a £1,000,000 per acre. A typical site for sale near me is 2.4 acres and has permission for 24 houses, along with the houses come the service roads and infrastructure, the cost is £2.4 million which means every property has cost £115,000 before a spade goes in the ground.

 

Hi Dave.   Your post explains something I have seen both in Bedfordshire and Devon  This involves development planning applications submitted by remote companies, who employ specialist subcontractors to prepare the various accompanying documents and, if necessary, specialist counsel to argue their case.  If successful, the land - with its outline planning permission - is then sold on to another developer who will do the actual building.

 

i had wondered about the economics of this process but the figures you quote for lannd values suggest there is indeed a profitable market for companies specialising solely in obtaining planning permission.

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The penny dropped with me about fifteen years ago, when my mother-in-law and a friend, living in Ireland, bought a field for about ten grand, then built two large detached houses for about sixty grand apiece, doing the work partly themselves, and partly through small subcontractors ...... it was at that point that I realised that a house actually doesn't cost anything like the sale price ...... it's the land!

 

K

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The penny dropped with me about fifteen years ago, when my mother-in-law and a friend, living in Ireland, bought a field for about ten grand, then built two large detached houses for about sixty grand apiece, doing the work partly themselves, and partly through small subcontractors ...... it was at that point that I realised that a house actually doesn't cost anything like the sale price ...... it's the land!

 

K

 

Chap who's building a pair of bungalows on the enclosed plot of land which backs onto our property told me a while ago that his business partner spent about twenty years being hundreds of small strips of land in the surrounding villages nearby, he subsequently sold them when he was due to retire and spends his days giving it 'the full Ian Fleming' on a Carribean island. He started out buying small parcels of land in a little place called Milton Keynes, long before anyone had ever heard of it...!

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You do not normally even get to see a train at Claydon nowadays as those that run come from Aylesbury and terminate at Calvert. If you do get a train you can forget about it operating the track circuits as the rails are so rusty.

This was the last railtour to run to the end of the line, 14/12/13, can't remember the name, prior to the line being closed for the Chiltern upgrade work.

D1015 arrived from Oxford up to Claydon LNE junc, ran round and returned via Aylesbury, with a layover at Quainton.

Probably more than trebled the traffic down those country lanes on the day....

 

post-29514-0-83050600-1482528428_thumb.jpg

 

Dave

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The money is in the land.

 

Sure there is profit in building but after you've paid for the land then achieved planning, paid your section 106 payment or Community infrastructure levy to the local authority before being allowed to start and then built the place there aren't the huge sums that people think there is. In this area which borders Bucks, working farmland achieves between £8,500-10,000 per acre. If it's designated for building then it rises to in excess of a £1,000,000 per acre. A typical site for sale near me is 2.4 acres and has permission for 24 houses, along with the houses come the service roads and infrastructure, the cost is £2.4 million which means every property has cost £115,000 before a spade goes in the ground.

So when/how/where did it all go wrong?

When I was a lad they started to build New Towns at a density of 7-8 houses per acre. Rather more than before but still reasonable.

Then they sold the houses to the occupants at around X 2 annual income.

Now X4 national average income will not cover the cost of the land for a much smaller plot.

I could write God help the younger generation but that would be both political and religious, so I will just put Merry Christmas.

Bernard

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The money is in the land.

 

Sure there is profit in building but after you've paid for the land then achieved planning, paid your section 106 payment or Community infrastructure levy to the local authority before being allowed to start and then built the place there aren't the huge sums that people think there is. In this area which borders Bucks, working farmland achieves between £8,500-10,000 per acre. If it's designated for building then it rises to in excess of a £1,000,000 per acre. A typical site for sale near me is 2.4 acres and has permission for 24 houses, along with the houses come the service roads and infrastructure, the cost is £2.4 million which means every property has cost £115,000 before a spade goes in the ground.

The same applies elsewhere. About ten years ago, we bought a half-hectare of vines in Beaujolais. As we were outside the 'village envelope', to which new-build was restricted, it cost the princely sum of 1 Euro per square metre. Land within the village envelope, but without planning permission already granted, was ten times that, whilst those pieces of land with the equivalent of outline planning permission were in the region of 20 Euros/sq metre.

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The same applies elsewhere. About ten years ago, we bought a half-hectare of vines in Beaujolais. As we were outside the 'village envelope', to which new-build was restricted, it cost the princely sum of 1 Euro per square metre. Land within the village envelope, but without planning permission already granted, was ten times that, whilst those pieces of land with the equivalent of outline planning permission were in the region of 20 Euros/sq metre.

We think it's just here but none of this is unique to us or our time.

 

My own house which was built in 1893 increased in value by 40% over it's first 30 years then by 400% over the next 15 years with no changes to it that reflected the increase in value, the population in the area hadn't changed either. When it was built the land was about 10% of the eventual sale price (£550) if now the land would be 50-55% of the sale value.

 

As we are on the projected East West route I wonder what the future will bring.

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That's a great video, handy for a bit if pre road learning boning up as I need to learn that route, last time I did it was only as far as Oxford parkway and the station was just the foundations!

 

Certainly looks like they have spent the money down there though, lots of new bridges, lots of fencing etc

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Thanks to Dennis Lovett for some up to date pictures:
 

Having a few days off enabled me to head west from my home town towards Oxford. My first stop was at Islip where the challenge was to recreate the scene of 1989. This was my first since the station was totally rebuilt, the track doubled and a new up platform rebuilt to replace the long demolished one. About the only common denominator is the former LNWR Station Masters house which is visible on the right of both the old and new pictures. Parking the car at Oxford Parkway (£2 for 11 hours) I then took the train to Oxford and another back to Bicester Village before completing the journey back to Oxford Parkway.
 
Islip 29 Dec 16.jpg
 
Bicester Town has become Bicester Village to reflect its relationship with the adjacent retail complex which is full of designer brands and thousands of tourists. The multi-lingual train announcements give an idea of the clientele that Bicester Village attracts and there is a separate entrance / exit from the up platform to serve the village complex (picture attached). The new station is today much larger than its predecessors and is located further to the west. The former crossing keepers cottage is common to both pictures which indicate that the previous station was located beyond the current platform end where the fencing separates car park from railway.
 
Bicester Village entrance.jpg

Bicester Village 29 Dec 2016.jpg
 
One thing is obvious from this visit is that the rules and regulations relating to stations have changed considerably since the days of Network SouthEast. Just look at the amount of lighting to start with! No wonder new stations are costed in millions.
 
I was one of many who travelled on the last day of operation on 31st December 1967 and I look forward to the days when the full route from Bletchley to Oxford is once again open to passenger traffic.
 
Dennis Lovett

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Looks like our rail links will need to be upgraded rapidly the Marylebone line will need resignaling and electifrication plus the line to MK not sure about the Tring line .The new village will probably not be anywhere near the railway and bus links will be poor plus the development will not overly benefit the current town centre or us living here now.Hopefully consruction work will start soon on the project as we need it quickly.

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I managed a visit to Aristotle lane during my post Christmas trip to Oxford. I've put them in the Wolvercote thread, but thought I'd add them here as more relevant. The latest pictures are at https://www.flickr.com/photos/unravelled/sets/72157640351020075

The complete set are at https://www.flickr.com/photos/unravelled/albums/72157640353126193.

 

The part installed turnouts seem much smoother than the existing ladder. Is the plan to replace the existing pointwork when the down loop is commissioned?

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I managed a visit to Aristotle lane during my post Christmas trip to Oxford. I've put them in the Wolvercote thread, but thought I'd add them here as more relevant. The latest pictures are at https://www.flickr.com/photos/unravelled/sets/72157640351020075

The complete set are at https://www.flickr.com/photos/unravelled/albums/72157640353126193.

 

The part installed turnouts seem much smoother than the existing ladder. Is the plan to replace the existing pointwork when the down loop is commissioned?

 

I think it's all tied in with the (now delayed) resignalling and control changeover (to TVSCC) scheme.

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Aquired these from wifeys uncle when he passed away. Don't know what his interest was, but he had a collection around the GCR, Varsity Line, and also the March - Spalding line just after closure.

Here is Claydon LNE junction box and panel.

 

post-29514-0-55389600-1485206930_thumb.jpg

 

post-29514-0-23383800-1485206931_thumb.jpg

 

Dave

post-29514-0-55389600-1485206930_thumb.jpg

post-29514-0-23383800-1485206931_thumb.jpg

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Aquired these from wifeys uncle when he passed away. Don't know what his interest was, but he had a collection around the GCR, Varsity Line, and also the March - Spalding line just after closure.

 

Dave

They all sound pretty good to me. Can we see them? Especially the latter.

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Another aquired image, The Milton Keynes Shopper, 6th December 1986.

Did it actually start from Marylebone and call at Quainton Road?

 

post-29514-0-76764500-1485297061_thumb.jpg

 

Dave

Edited by Davexoc
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Before the views get totally obscured by this years growth, I thought I'd revisit a few places to see what is happening. Currently there seems to be surveying going on along the EWR line, but around Claydon LNE junction and Steeple Claydon, the roads and fields have been over-run by the ground works for the HS2 Infrastructure Maintenance Depot and what appears to be the laying of cables between there and East Claydon National Grid sub-station.

 

post-29514-0-86656400-1524173443_thumb.jpg

 

Calvert waste transfer, to be moved as where 66749 is will be HS2.

 

post-29514-0-31194800-1524173446_thumb.jpg

 

Calvert ground frame and run round, which will move around the bend to the old Claydon LNE junction.

 

post-29514-0-50642900-1524173448_thumb.jpg

 

Claydon LNE junction. To the right of the farm on the other side of the line is where major earthworks are going on for the IMD.

 

More to come heading east if anyone is interested.

 

Dave

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