Rugd1022 Posted February 14, 2013 Share Posted February 14, 2013 Maybe someone can advise me why a Peasant hitting a train causes a delay?. Surley the Trains comes out the better? Often seen birds hit car on the road with no ill consqeuences. If the driver didn't actually see what was hit he'd have to stop and report it anyway, and possibly carry out a search to verify what it was - there's always the possiblity it might have been a P/Way worker, trespasser etc, it can happen so quickly. Not pleasant when it happens to you - I can vouch for that! (It turned out to be a dog in my case). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Del Posted February 14, 2013 Share Posted February 14, 2013 Just a quick bit on the interview piece, this wasn't for Laxman's job but for a six-month secondment as a Station Controller. I know this, as the two younger lads who were in uniform are colleagues of mine, and the first one, with the blonde hair, was the successful candidate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted February 14, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 14, 2013 I'm not disputing a need for a break - I'm just disputing the apparent laissais faire attitude in returning to his train. I don't expect him to run and be out of breath, I would have expected hime to make some visible pace and attitude to the platform manager that he was at least trying to get the train out on time (or in a timely manner). I also question if it was indeed a break and not a late arrival for duty. To follow this with the union meeting in the pub did not present anything to help my opinion - just to say "we are a closed shop". I also must have missed the comment about he had only taken his allotted break, in which case with the train being over 1hr late also missed the poor management of driver resources (as presumably he would not have been scheduled to take on the train 1hr earlier - or was his break period in excess of 1hr). If one were to start explaining whatever the complexities are of East Coast's Driver diagramming procedures plus the way n which men and trains are/aren't stepped up in times of late running I suspect things might have gone way beyond the grasp of a presenter/interlocutor talking about a train 'running out of petrol' (and it would probably have bored most of the audience to tears as well). That is precisely one of the problems with something like this - glib 'surface level' stuff is usually not well explained (for good reasons very often) so misleading or incomplete impresssions can be created and viewers can get an inaccurate or incomplete idea. GNER had some fairly good - from a managerial viewpoint - traincrew conditions (perhaps they changed under 'East Coast' ownership) and other operators have their own agreements so it is a difficult area to deal with (and it could be bad enough dealing with such things for a living let alone trying to explain some of it). BTW - was the train ready? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted February 14, 2013 Share Posted February 14, 2013 Maybe someone can advise me why a Peasant hitting a train causes a delay?. Surley the Trains comes out the better? Often seen birds hit car on the road with no ill consqeuences. If it's the incident I think it was (and i'm convinced it is), the driver of 1A94 thought he'd hit a person - so emergency stop, emergency call and trains stopped in the area. Turned out it was a pheasent, but remember at 125mph even a bird is going to make a bit of a noise! So once it's confirmed what it was, back to normal running. But if it's the day in question, poor soul hit someone on his return journey and a late finish for all concerned. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stuartp Posted February 14, 2013 Share Posted February 14, 2013 If one were to start explaining whatever the complexities are of East Coast's Driver diagramming procedures plus the way n which men and trains are/aren't stepped up in times of late running I suspect things might have gone way beyond the grasp of a presenter/interlocutor talking about a train 'running out of petrol' (and it would probably have bored most of the audience to tears as well). That is precisely one of the problems with something like this - glib 'surface level' stuff is usually not well explained (for good reasons very often) so misleading or incomplete impresssions can be created and viewers can get an inaccurate or incomplete idea. GNER had some fairly good - from a managerial viewpoint - traincrew conditions (perhaps they changed under 'East Coast' ownership) and other operators have their own agreements so it is a difficult area to deal with (and it could be bad enough dealing with such things for a living let alone trying to explain some of it). BTW - was the train ready? From what I caught of Laxman's conversation on the radio he had drivers for two later departures but not the first one. The impression I got was that several delayed up services had arrived at once, presumably with drivers due or overdue for their PNB. In that case the later drivers would have finished their brew by the time they were due out, but the first driver hadn't. None of that was explained though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgeconna Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 If it's the incident I think it was (and i'm convinced it is), the driver of 1A94 thought he'd hit a person - so emergency stop, emergency call and trains stopped in the area. Turned out it was a pheasent, but remember at 125mph even a bird is going to make a bit of a noise! So once it's confirmed what it was, back to normal running. But if it's the day in question, poor soul hit someone on his return journey and a late finish for all concerned. Thanks for all the replies lads, Various reasons, Just bemused me when I heard Pheasant, As someone mentioned earlier the thought did occur was it a pheasant!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted February 15, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 15, 2013 Finally got round to watching it earlier tonight. Typical media hype picking out the parts when things went wrong. It quoted EC has having a 87% punctuality record. If 87% of the programme was about things going right, then it would've made for uninteresting viewing. The problems portrayed and the various scenarios/solutions/characters involved have been seen before on TV - anyone remember the TV series "Airline"? Respect to the guys on the frontline desk - it's not something I would like to do. Cheers, Mick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazza 50 015 Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 I watched this programme on TV with my eyes shut, fully expecting it to portray the railway in a negative light. The stationmaster`s comment about going into the complexities of the drivers diagramming procedures being very boring and very long winded were absolutely correct. As a Train Driver for East Coast based at Kings Cross i can confirm this to be very true. My findings about this programme after unfortunately watching it, was that it never set out to inform the public about how the increadibly complex railway operates, instead it just added more fuel to the railway critics who love to knock the hard work and dedication all railway staff put in on a regular bases. First of all i would like to add my explanation (hopfully without boring people to tears) on some of the incidents that was mentioned in the programme that was never fully explained which i feel should of been. Firstly, A train running out of fuel, In 14 years of being a driver at KX i have seen this happen twice. An HST being fulled the night before was believed to have had a full fuel tank, however due to a false reading on the automatic fuel pump this was far from the truth. The train entered service, and about 200 miles short of its destination was held (due to disruption) with engines running for about 5 hours. It was then sent on a lengthy diversion during which the unknown short filled tank run out of fuel and the power car shut down. The train continued on its journey on one power car, perfectly normal........However due to the train now running on only one power car (with just one fuel tank) the fuel remaining was not enough to get to the final destination and hence the fuel run out and the train became stranded ........... The second occasion was when a fuel pump filter became blocked in the front power car and it stopped fuel from flowing into the engine, resulting in an engine shut down. Due to a technical fault the rear power car was only operating at idle to provide electric train supply (E.T.S) which meant as soon as the front power car filter became blocked the train was a failure, unable to move under its own power, despite having plenty of fuel for its journey............. Both were due to very extreme conditions and any contingency plan could not be worked out for this happening in advance. Those pesky bird strikes................ Most of the time a bird strike will just leave a lovely red smear down the front of a train, or if the driver is lucky a big explosion of blood and guts on the windscreen............However sometimes the bird can hit the brake pipes on the front of the train (used for coupling up to other vehicles) and can damage the valve resulting in an air leak (brakes applying) and if the driver is unable to stop the leak and release the brakes, the train is a failure............ As for the driver having a relaxed approach to mobilising the very late running train, the driver London based and a very good mate of mine, should not of been working a passenger service departing London at that time of evening, those jobs are worked by Doncaster, Leeds or Newcastle based drivers, so he was either just starting a night shift, trip of empty coaches (ECS) to Bounds Green Depot and was seconded into working the train as soon as he booked on for duty or was at the very end of his shift, having completed his booked job and was just helping out to ease congestion at KX......................Impossible to say, either way he was helping out but was made to look bad and non caring..........He will get some stick from his work mates over this and we will not let him forget his unwanted 15 minutes of fame in a hurry................... Just to sum up, the programme never even tried to explain what happens and why and what is done by the staff, it is just a sad shame this opportunity was again wasted. Heres hoping the Sky documentary due to be filmed later this year on the East Coast will be better................. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pacific231G Posted February 15, 2013 Share Posted February 15, 2013 I watched it this evening and it just felt like the same programme I've seen many times before. The backgrounds change, airport, London Underground, prison, cathedral, you name it and some are mor einteresting than others but the programmes tend to be rather the same. I just think this particular routine "fly on the wall" format is very tired but for channel commissioners and programme makers they're a known, predictable and safe commodity. They can work, as IMHO with the two part Monsoon Railway documentary that ran a couple of years ago. In theory it was a similar format and the subject matter was, apart from being in a different country, almost identical but it had a narrative flow and somehow managed to take you more into the private world of the railway. Of course Gerry Troyna who directed it is in love with the subject and that's probably what really makes the difference. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon hudson Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 I enjoyed last nights programme.I certainly felt for a lot of the staff.I certainly couldn't put up with a lot of the public, the way they do.That stupid woman complaining about it being like a third world train and it wasn't safe.Well get off the bloody train then if you feel that way.I would have loved to have been the Phantom flan flinger straight into her moaning face splat!!.Still I suspect she was playing up to the cameras All in all I'm warming to the series I enjoyed last weeks episode as well. But I can't help feeling there are some idiots out there Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
br2975 Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 The 'fool' I would have liked a face to face with was the one who, after the signalling cable had been cut, and trains were being allowed to pass at walking pace commented "would trains be stopped in France if the signal cable was cut, would trains in Spain be stopped ?" . Or the other half-wit on his mobile, after a train struck a fallen tree twixt Reading and Basingstoke "there are two lines, I don't see why the don't let all the trains use the other line ?" . Brian R Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glorious NSE Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 Haven't watched this (3rd) one yet, but... "would trains be stopped in France if the signal cable was cut, would trains in Spain be stopped ?" Facepalm! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwin_m Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 Then again, the guy talking about single line working may have a point! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted February 27, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 27, 2013 Saw a bit of last night's - and very glad to see my old pal Norman doing his stuff at Twyford. If First stay on the franchise for long enough he is almost certain to get his 50 years in and he is the last working survivor of the original staff of the Henley branch as well as having a good railway pedigree as his dad was the PerWay Ganger at Henley. But from what I did see there was some of the uusual ignorance from the passengers (and SLW can be rather difficult on Reading - Basinsgstoke depending on which line is blocked). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold gwrrob Posted February 27, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 27, 2013 I was amazed how much lost property was stashed at Paddington.How do people manage to mislay some of this stuff I don't know.The girl said they had over 100 black bags. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 Then again, the guy talking about single line working may have a point!then he could have offered to lay it so the trains could change tracks ... I guess we have to remember that although the comment appears daft to some of us, most of the public do not understand the workings of a railway, let alone the complexities forced on it by modern rules and practices. still to watch last 2 episodes Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
APOLLO Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 I lost a White Nokia phone at Paddington the other week. Went to lost property - not there - hang on, I think it was a black one !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. The girl at lost property Paddington had em all sussed. Wife commented that most workers, engineers, track workers etc were getting old. Are they training enough new recruits ?. The railway industry will grow in the next few years, Over 200,000 proffesional engineers (not just Rail - all industries) will retire in the next 5 - 10 years. We have big problems looming. I noticed that the modern railway is very computer intensive, electronics everywhere especially trackside. Very technical these days - my brother worked a while with S&T at Wigan back in the 60's. Simple track circuits and jam-jar batteries back then, even on the WCML !!. All in all a good programme - though I'm glad I don't commute to London. I pity the poor sods, commuters AND staff. Brit15 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
edcayton Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 It must say something about my age, but I was astonished to see that they charge for lost property now. How long has this been the case? Ed Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jamie92208 Posted February 27, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 27, 2013 I've now watched all the first three and think that the series is getting better all the time. Last week i really felt for the BTP officer going to do the death warning to the mother of the poor kid who got killed. I did a few of those in my time as a bobby and can remember every one as if they were yesterday, not up to 40 years ago. The scale and complexity of the engineering is starting to become apparent and the dedication of the workforce is coming through in spades. I'm looking forward to the next episodes. Jamie Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Williams Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 It must say something about my age, but I was astonished to see that they charge for lost property now. How long has this been the case? Ed I thought exactly the same. Paying to get your own property back. I suppose they would waffle on about storage charges and having to pay staff etc. etc. The police don't charge for returning your lost property, as far as I am aware. If you lose something in a shop and it is handed in, you don't pay a handling fee to get it back, so why does the railway think it is different? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackRat Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 Good to see a blast from my past...........Robby Burns, the Engineer! Top bananananana !! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cary hill Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 Wasn't the lost property operation subcontracted out ? So I assume the operator might be expecting and entitled to an additional return. Whether it should be contracted out in the first place is another matter entirely. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Williams Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 Whether it should be contracted out in the first place is another matter entirely. Indeed. This is one of the problems with the entire system being carved up in a horizontal format. A regime develops where everything seems to be penalised financially, because all the various parts of the whole are striving to make a profit. I couldn't believe how much the penalty is per minute late, for train departures. Presumably, for arrivals as well. Ultimately, the passenger is the one who ends up paying. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stuartp Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 Lost property takes up an inordinate amount of admin time chasing around looking for things, especially if (for example) the one member of staff at a small station is doing it occasionally and having to remember/re-learn/fond out who to ring every time they need to track something down. Concentrating it in one place makes sense if only because the staff build up specialist knowledge and can therefore avoid wasting time on dead ends. There isn't a 'no cost' option, even just lobbing everything in a skip and telling people to take more care of their stuff next time costs money to have it taken away. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Williams Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 I accept that there is a degree of effort involved and, as such, a cost can always be attributed to effort. The issue is whether it is appropriate to charge and I don't believe that it is, especially as, in due course, I have no doubt that stuff not claimed after a set period is probably sold off, whereupon money is made from the sale. If I suggested to a supermarket that I receive a discount because I have taken the products of the shelf myself and therefore expended effort, they would probably think I was a product of 'care in the community'. Similarly, if I saw someone drop a wallet in the street and went after them but insisted they give me £5 before I returned it, or I found it in the street and, having found the owner's address, insisted he pay me a handling fee, I am quite sure I would be getting a knock on the door from the police. It is a question of 'doing the right thing'. Just because the organization is a commercial one, does not mean that a charge should be levied for every activity. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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