coachmann Posted February 6, 2013 Share Posted February 6, 2013 Whitemetal prices being what they are at the moment, I have been very reluctant to have more bogies cast just for my few EM gauge customers. Enter Dapol LMS bogies! They're actually not bad for their age and the sideframes are wide enough to take EM and P4 gauge wheels. Here is a bogie as purchased..... First thing to do is remove the side bearers and collar on top of the stretcher and file it completely flush... I designed a brass top plate and asked Fozzy to add it to my next coach sheet for etching. However, if you are only converting a pair of bogies, then such an item could be fabricacted from a strip of 15 thou brass. Unless you use tension-lock couplings (Bachmann etc) the coupling mount is not necessary..... The brass strip was glued to the top of each bogie with Evostick. Also shown are the bogie stepboards, which again are etched but could be made from brass strip. I drill a slot undernieth the axlebox and melt these stepboards into the slot with a 25 watt soldering iron.... The bogies were first sprayed with Halfords No.8 etch primer. Two hours later they were given a spraycoat of matt black, then the Alan Gibson EM gauge wheels were sprung into the bogie..... An LMS D1755 corridor brake third fitted with these EM gauge bogies.... I hope this proves useful. (re-editted for spelling) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davefrk Posted February 7, 2013 Share Posted February 7, 2013 Hi Coach, I like your style, I've re-used these bogies too as I've got other things to do like building locos and a layout to finish but I did add pin point bearings to the bogies using that ingenius tool for drilling out the axleboxes. The coaches, now with brass sides, have a tendency to 'run away' there're so free running. All the best, Dave Franks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted February 19, 2013 Author Share Posted February 19, 2013 Moving on from the bogies, I have purchased some of the new Dapol completely-knocked-down corridor coaches for a shufty. One gets a bodyshell, interior partition with compartments, roof, floor, glazing thrips and a bag of parts for bogies and roof vents......Not bad for £10.00. This particular model is representative of of a Stanier brake third. The first type (D1851) had shallow sliding window vents, and the second type (D1852) had two sets of double doors. The Dapol model represents the third type (D1905) with deep sliding window vents. These are the component parts... When building this coach it is worth removing the right-hand handrail/water filler pipe from the brake end as it should not be there.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leopardml2341 Posted February 19, 2013 Share Posted February 19, 2013 Will be watching with interest - always wondered just 'how good' the Dapol (nee Airfix) offerings were - I guess this'll help me form a view. rgds Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Barry O Posted February 19, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 19, 2013 Larry the underframe needs a lot of work - but with all the etchings you have should be a doddle For the price these are great to fasten new sides to barry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BernardTPM Posted February 19, 2013 Share Posted February 19, 2013 I remember when these first came out they were quite a revelation, though the prismatic effect round the window glazing and the paint finish were never their best points. They were only two or three years after the Hornby "Staniers" in their pre-nat 57ft range but in terms of accuracy way ahead with nice features like separate rubber gangways, individually fitted shell vents and a reaslistic ride height. And the Composite was 60 foot, of course! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted February 20, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 20, 2013 Saw some of these at Warminster show on Saturday. Cracking value and, as such, well worth buying either to build as such or cannibalise. Well done, Dapol! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted February 20, 2013 Author Share Posted February 20, 2013 As Barry O pointed out, the chassis requires a little work. One side has the face of a batterybox but the 'back' of the batterybox is on 'tother side! The other side has a representation of a regulator box that should be surrounded by fresh air, but as mentioned above the back of the batterybox fills the gap..... Simple remedy is to make a verticle saw cut at green and a horizontal saw cut at blue to neatly remove the offending block... The block can then be glued in its correct position behind the batterybox.... I am pretty sure trussrod cross members and vacuum brake V hangers etc are avalable from 247 Models for folk wanting to detail the chassis further. It may be noticed the chassis has continuous stepboards as on non-corridor coaches. Their removal is not something I would tackle, so while £10.00 buys an okay model with Stanier appearance, using the parts to make a scale model is like gold plating a plastic spoon. For my own part, I intend only using the roof, interior and bogie mouldings to fit on a coach built from brass etchings with sides from Comet Models for the D1851 LMS brake third. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5 C Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 I've stockpiled a number of the Airfix versions, both brake and composite, from various swapmeets and second hand stalls with a view to converting and detailing, so I'm eagerley awaiting what magic Coachmann will work on these. Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted February 20, 2013 Author Share Posted February 20, 2013 The etched sides & droplights arrived this dinnertime. They come with a tumblehome ready formed but I just altered it slightly to suit me before taking photos.... After placing the etched sides on top of the Dapol coach it can be seen the passenger windows are spot on but that everything at the luggage end had to be re-spaced by the LMS in order to accomode two sets of double doors. The original shallow sliding vents can be compared with the type adopted in 1934.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
iak Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 Another essential thread from 'Coach..' methinks. Are these sides to overlay or replace? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted February 20, 2013 Author Share Posted February 20, 2013 IAK, The brass sides are to replace. First job was to fit the lower door hinges. I used to make slots for flat strip but found it quicker to drill a hole, solder .7mm wire into it then squash it flat with pliers.... Next the individual droplights were tacked in position then fully soldered. Then a strip of 2mm wide brass (I save strips of brass from etched sheets) was soldered edge-on along the top of each of the sides as a strengthener. This is necessary because the Dapol roof will play no part in preventing the sides from bowing in. Next the verticle handrails beside the guard and luggage doors were soldered in place. The protruding handrails inside the sides were ground off.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Barry O Posted February 20, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 20, 2013 Larry you can as you say get various bits from Gary at 247 including new battery and regulator parts as well as vac cylinders and etched Vs. Comet do them as well. Removing the truss rods and replacement by items wither brass or from Plastruct (they do an L section which is spot on for size makes it easier for those not happy with soldering to produce a better underframe. Have you tried the Bachmann LMS bogies? They aren't quite as flexible as the Dapol ones. Will get photos of my modified suburban chassis when I get my camera to work Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted February 20, 2013 Author Share Posted February 20, 2013 Larry you can as you say get various bits from Gary at 247 including new battery and regulator parts as well as vac cylinders and etched Vs. Comet do them as well. Removing the truss rods and replacement by items wither brass or from Plastruct (they do an L section which is spot on for size makes it easier for those not happy with soldering to produce a better underframe. Have you tried the Bachmann LMS bogies? They aren't quite as flexible as the Dapol ones. Will get photos of my modified suburban chassis when I get my camera to work Been using Bachmann bogies for years Barry. I don't think replacing Dapol trussrod with plastruct would bring any benefits....Etched brass one would though because of their strength. Below are shown the components etched brass parts that I will be using to build this coach..........Not much different from using Comet parts. The ends will be re-profiled to match the Dapol roof once the basic body 'box' has been assembled. I could have built the whole coach from my own etched parts with Comet sides and extruded roof, but the Dapol roof saves me messing around fitting those long water filler pipes and roof ribs, niether do i have to build an interior or solder bogie kits.... To be continued... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
iak Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 Thanks Coach I think a visit to Smithdown Rd beckons. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted February 21, 2013 Author Share Posted February 21, 2013 The Dapol roof was found to be bowed and would not sit down properly on top of the sides, so I soaked it in boiling water for a minute or two while pressing it down with something convenient in the centre of the roof. Job done. Because I was using the Dapol roof with moulded filler pipes to the toilet, i had not thought through how to 'extend' the pipes down the inner coach end. What I did was file two notches in line with the roof mouldings and solder a length of 'U' shaped wire on the back of te end. The pipes were then bend at right-angles with pliers and formed into curves. Two short handrail knobs from Comet were soldered into holes, the handrails fed through them and spot soldered. The surplus was clipped off. The coach is only for myself so I can live with this compromise. The coach would have been built yesterday had it used an extruded roof so there was time lost here.... The interior moulding had to have its corridor floor narrowed in order to fit inside this coach. A strip of 30 thou plastikard was glued under it so it would sit slightly higher.... Shown inside the coach. The spacer was necessary to correct the bow that had introduced itself on one of the sides during soldering! The built model with duckets and everything fitted. Louvers or hoods will be glued above the guards and luggage doors after painting in BR blood & custard is completed..... I ran out of time on this model and fitted Bachmann bogies in the end! Note the bogies at the guards end carried short stepboards each side. Torpedo roof vents are MJT by Dart Castings. Dynamo, vacuum cylinders and buffers are by Comet. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Barry O Posted February 21, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 21, 2013 Perhaps we could ask Dapol to do the roof and interiors as "spares" - if the roof can be kept flat then it would be easier than fiddling with an aluminium one? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted February 21, 2013 Author Share Posted February 21, 2013 Perhaps we could ask Dapol to do the roof and interiors as "spares" - if the roof can be kept flat then it would be easier than fiddling with an aluminium one? Maybe its me but I get on fine with extruded ali roofs and have my coaches designed to suit. The brake third is now painted and lined etc awaiting varnishing Friday. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Barry O Posted February 22, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 22, 2013 Maybe its me but I get on fine with extruded ali roofs and have my coaches designed to suit. The brake third is now painted and lined etc awaiting varnishing Friday. Larry So do I but they may be cheaper and easier to get hold of... Barry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted February 22, 2013 Author Share Posted February 22, 2013 Larry So do I but they may be cheaper and easier to get hold of... Barry I asked Dapol Dave about selling roofs separately but only if they had no vent holes. He never got back so I presume they are moulded with holes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted February 22, 2013 Author Share Posted February 22, 2013 Well, this chapter turned out to be anything-but making use of Dapol coach kits! I knew from the outset I couldnt use the body, as I prefer thin brass sides, but the suburban coach underframe wasn't any use to a Stanier corridor coach either. This is the coach nearing completion with the luggage floor and interior wall painted.... The interior was sprayed light wood colour and the third class seats picked out in Humbrol matt red..... The completed D1851 coach with Dapol roof and interior..... If upgrading the Dapol coach, I think the best improvement would be to build a new underframe either from plastikard or brass etchings. I also bought a couple of LMS corridor composites but I'll probably just make use of their interiors now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BernardTPM Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 The Composites should have the right underframe as they're 60 foot and Airfix didn't do a 60 foot non-corridor! Overall it seems you'd get more useable parts from the Airfix originals. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted February 22, 2013 Author Share Posted February 22, 2013 The Composites should have the right underframe as they're 60 foot and Airfix didn't do a 60 foot non-corridor! Overall it seems you'd get more useable parts from the Airfix originals. Hadn't thought of that. I've had a shufty in the bags and you're right, the chassis looks to be correct with stepboards only at the ends. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BernardTPM Posted February 23, 2013 Share Posted February 23, 2013 Result! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted February 23, 2013 Author Share Posted February 23, 2013 We are looking at a totally different animal with the Dapol LMS Stanier corridor composite coach, as it has a correct chassis with stepboards only under the end doors and a regulator box surrounded by fresh air as it should be. I loosely assembled one (but left out the glazing) and placed it on Bachmann bogies for the photos. Fair-do's, this coach supplies at a very fair price the missing LMS composite coach in the Hornby range. Dapol bogies leave the coach standing too high so some trimming of the centre bolster is required. However, as metal wheels would have to be purchased and the very ancient coupling replaced, it would make better use of money by fitting Bachmann bogies as shown below..... Parts required to upgrade the chassis are trussrod cross members, V hangers, cast vacuum cylinders and dinamo. The castings are by Comet Models..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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