Lynton & Barnstaple OO9 Loco from Heljan

[Edwardian]

They were originally supplied with an extension on the front of the cab which was removed as it trapped steam from the exhaust obscuring the drivers front windows the bunker was also boxed in then. These were removed in L& B days. Lew was a later build by the Southern Rly so can only carry SR livery and has a subtlety different cab with a flat back while the other three Taw, Exe & Yeo can carry either livery and the top of the cab back is stepped out.

The rtr models are fine as they stand and Heljan has sensibly modelled the later style do they can carry either livery. As I said earlier a new cab for the early L&B only livery is possible in the tooling

 

That is very helpful.  Thanks.

 

I am afraid that I do not own the Big Book on the L&B, or much else about the line, and, in the meantime, am dependent upon the knowledge and patience of others.  I still need to pin down the date, if only to avoid anachronisms, but your answer is a positive start to my consideration of the L&B as a subject.  

[PaulRhB]

The date in two of my books is 1913. The Lynton & Barnstaple Rly, Brown, Prideaux, Radcliffe & Rawstron lists removing the forward of the side windows, moving the roof back and enclosing the bunker. They also say that the rear bunker wasn't usually used for coal and the bunkers in the tanks were used instead which may be why they enclosed it for more cab room. They also removed the covers concealing the valve gear.

[Edwardian]

The date in two of my books is 1913. The Lynton & Barnstaple Rly, Brown, Prideaux, Radcliffe & Rawstron lists removing the forward of the side windows, moving the roof back and enclosing the bunker. They also say that the rear bunker wasn't usually used for coal and the bunkers in the tanks were used instead which may be why they enclosed it for more cab room. They also removed the covers concealing the valve gear.

 

Oh bless you and thank you for that.  That is everything I needed to know.

 

One of the periods that I have been focussing on is 1912-14, so this fits in nicely.  It means that I can accommodate the Heljan version on both a freelance layout and on any bit of the L&B I might tackle.  If I want to go earlier, it is good to know that the Backwoods cab may be available separately, so this is all good!

 

It also, of course, makes investing in some L&B literature in due course a much more likely and justifiable proposition!

[JaymzHatstand]

The Backwoods adaptor kit is designed to enable LEW to be built, which had a flat-backed cab as opposed to the early bunker and subsequent enclosed bunker shape. The enclosed bunker is the one offered by Heljan in the initial releases, the earlier cab style may well be a scratch build job.

 

The flat backed LEW cab is the same as fitted to LYD on the Ffestiniog as seen below when she was on station pilot duties a few years ago

 

 

Hopefully this can version will appear in the future as well, I could see an FfR shop limited edition of her in BR black as she was when running in!

 

Cheers

 

J

[dibber25]

There were no 'large' or 'small' cabs fitted to L&B locos. As delivered, the Manning Wardles had a 'canopy' arrangement over the front of the cab, the sides and roof being extended forward of the spectacle plate. This created a trap for smoke and steam which obscured forward vision. Page 73 of 'Portrait of the Lynton & Barnstaple' refers: "The cabs were altered, but with no great urgency and the last locomotive was modified in 1913." The modification simply cut away the overhanging roof and cab sides but made no difference to the size of the cab itself. All three locomotives would thus have run in L&B livery for at least ten years with the modified cabs, so the L&B livery application on the Heljan model is quite correct for the condition of the loco. If we're looking for detail differences, it will be interesting to see if Exe has the injector pipe raised away from the boiler. (CJL)

[mclong]

There were no 'large' or 'small' cabs fitted to L&B locos. As delivered, the Manning Wardles had a 'canopy' arrangement over the front of the cab, the sides and roof being extended forward of the spectacle plate. This created a trap for smoke and steam which obscured forward vision. Page 73 of 'Portrait of the Lynton & Barnstaple' refers: "The cabs were altered, but with no great urgency and the last locomotive was modified in 1913." The modification simply cut away the overhanging roof and cab sides but made no difference to the size of the cab itself. All three locomotives would thus have run in L&B livery for at least ten years with the modified cabs, so the L&B livery application on the Heljan model is quite correct for the condition of the loco. If we're looking for detail differences, it will be interesting to see if Exe has the injector pipe raised away from the boiler. (CJL)

The cabs were most definitely were extended at the rear . Look at any pre WW1 photo with original cab it finishes in front of the bunker,after modification the cab has been extended to the rear of the now unused bunker exactly as in post #229. Also post #219 has photos of large and small cabs and if you look at lower picture.you can just see the join where extended Edited July 23, 2016 by mclong

[dibber25]

The cabs were most definitely were extended at the rear . Look at any pre WW1 photo with original cab it finishes in front of the bunker,after modification the cab has been extended to the rear of the now unused bunker exactly as in post #229. Also post #219 has photos of large and small cabs and if you look at lower picture.you can just see the join where extended

Sorry, I hadn't ever thought of that as a 'large cab'. They took a bit off the front and added a bit to the back, enclosing the bunker. It didn't make any difference to the size of the cab, in terms of the space for the crew. The earlier comments about fitting large or small cabs made it sound as if the writer thought new cabs were fitted. (CJL)

[ndg910]

There is a brief reference on the Railway Modeller FB page that this months issue has news of the Heljan OO9 locos. My copy has not yet arrived so in the meantime could anyone be of assistance as there is nothing on Heljan's website or FB page. Thanks

[tractionman]

There is a brief reference on the Railway Modeller FB page that this months issue has news of the Heljan OO9 locos. My copy has not yet arrived so in the meantime could anyone be of assistance as there is nothing on Heljan's website or FB page. Thanks

Yes, on page 820 of the latest RM there is a short item on the L&B locos, stating news of the arrival of decorated samples of the loco plus the Peco open wagon

 

"A release date for the locomotive models is still to be confirmed" is what we're told...

 

cheers,

 

Keith

[ndg910]

Thanks Keith

 

Much appreciated.

[Stevelewis]

Hattons  Latest  info  re  delivery   it  was  Sept  -  Oct  now   November  -  December

 

I will have  to  call in  some  substitute motive  power  for  the  current   oo9 layout  under  construction!!

[roundhouse]

Looks like they will make a nice xmas present to myself

[PaulRhB]

Is it going to be finished by then Steve?

 

Oh gawd that's the same time as the Harz locos.

[Stevelewis]

Looks like they will make a nice xmas present to myself

 

What  year  though??

[Stevelewis]

Is it going to be finished by then Steve?

  Probably  have  lost  interest  and  started  on  something  else!!

 

Which  reminds  me  have  you  seen  any  ROCO  Bogie  coaches  ( Not  Jaffa  but    Brown  or  green livery) for  sale  anywhere?

[PaulRhB]

No trying not to get distracted with these MW's and HSB locos due

[tractionman]

I see there is a new 'news feature' on the Heljan model on the Hatton's web-site:

 

http://www.hattons.co.uk/NewsDetail.aspx?id=104

 

with links through to the individual models from there, with livery variation, price (£146), etc.

 

all the best,

 

Keith

[Captain Kernow]

These look absolutely superb.

 

I remember making up a batch of six of the whitemetal kits in the 1980s, while my friend Brian Clarke of Saltford Models made up six of his chassis kits to go with them. Brian then sold them via Saltford Models. Doing six of them in lined SR livery was a bit of a faff in the end, but they are a really attractive prototype.

 

I'm sure they used to run on the Somerset & Dorset.

[stewartingram]

These look absolutely superb.

 

I remember making up a batch of six of the whitemetal kits in the 1980s, while my friend Brian Clarke of Saltford Models made up six of his chassis kits to go with them. Brian then sold them via Saltford Models. Doing six of them in lined SR livery was a bit of a faff in the end, but they are a really attractive prototype.

 

I'm sure they used to run on the Somerset & Dorset.

I think you got that wrong, it was the M&GN.

 

Stewart

[Stevelewis]

MINIMUM  RADIUS!!??

 

Early in this  thread  we  discussed  the  proposed min  radius  for  the  2-6-2T

 

I had mentioned  this  as  some  ROCO  H0e locos   require  min radius  of around  10.5"   ( 0-8-0TT  &  the  1091   co co electric)

 

HATTONS  have   updated  their  home  page  with a  feature  on Prototype locos amongst  which is the L&B loco, also included  is  a  model  spec.  which  states  that  MIN  Radius  is  R2  10.24"  approx.   263mm.

 

This  clearly  contradicts the  early info  which  said   they  would  be OK  on R1  (9")

 

This  may  be  a  bit  of  a problem  for  those  using   Peco  curved   009 setrack!

 

I will  ask  Hattons.

[Stevelewis]

Hattons  definately  state  R2  is  the  minimum  radius!!

 

I bet  PECO  wont  be  too pleased?

[bertiedog]

With respect I think a £150 loco in 009 is best not compromised in design too much to suit very tight radius set track. 009 has used such tight curves and indeed many industrial lines have such curves or tighter, but the L&B did not, very much a mainline of narrow gauge, and deserves a layout on a slightly grander scale. I appreciate people will want to run these on existing layouts, but perhaps better to use larger radius track. 9 inch or thereabouts is very tight for the coaches as well.

We have not all got masses of space, but keeping to Peco's mainline radius points and flexi track would benefit even a modest size layout.

I am sure the loco will manage a bit tighter than quoted, but it is a long loco for 009, and limits have to be set somewhere before scale appearance in lost.

Hopefully these models will be the first of others to come which will lead to more scale layouts in future, but also I hope the smaller older style 009 remains popular as well. It is a classic scale for getting a lot in a little space, but perhaps moving away from set track curves.

Stephen

[Stevelewis]

I Have  spoken to  Peco today  and  they  advise  that  the  loco  will traverse  9"  rad  curves  but  it  is  much  happier  on larger  radius, also informed that  power pick up is  enabled  from the pony  wheels as well as the  drivers. It was  described to  me   by Peco  as a quite  heavy loco, plenty of metal parts!

[Stevelewis]

The  point  about  9" rad  curves  is  that   they  are  very  useful  to use  where  a  hidden  loop  or  return loop  is required,  not  so much  on  their  appearance on  the  visible  parts  of  a  layout

 

Talking   of  Main  Line  Narrow  gauge   curves,  heres  tight  for  you!!

[bertiedog]

I suspect from a quick test with a Backwoods chassis that any problem would come from the overhang of the couplings rather than inability to go around a really tight curve. It is a relatively small difference between 9 and 10.2, given the built in play of the wheelsets being based on N gauge.

Peco have indicated a move away from the tight curves with the mainline track and points, leaving the older items as a legacy product, as it really only suits small locos and 4 wheeled stock.

My own new L&B layout is not very big, the first board 7x1, but the curves match the real thing. It will be a loop line in the end, but using turning curves of at least 3 foot radius, and these out of sight.

So a good excuse for a new layout then?....and keep those very tight curves to industrial settings....there are legions of other lines, but the L&B had a special status as a rather more grand outfit, and needs a layout to suit.

 

Stephen.